Symptoms Of A Syndrome

On a day where President Obama spoke about Trayvon Martin’s murder and said the following:

“All of us have to do some soul searching to figure out how does something like this happen,” President Obama said Friday morning following a White House Rose Garden ceremony when asked about the 17-year-old’s death.

The president called the shooting a “tragedy” and says “every aspect” of the case should be investigated. Obama gave his condolences to the slain teenager’s parents and said if he had a son, “he’d look like Trayvon.”

We have this going on at a Rick Santorum event

At a shooting range in Louisiana on Friday, an onlooker encouraged Republican presidential candidate Rick Santorum to pretend the target he was firing at was President Barack Obama.

“Santorum is shooting a 1911 Colt,” Politico’s Juana Summers tweeted from the sheriff’s office shooting range in West Monroe. “Range master says ‘Well, it’s not your first rodeo.’ Someone here says ‘pretend its Obama.’”

…and this out of the mouth of Newt Gingrich….

In a radio interview on Thursday, Newt Gingrich returned to one of his favorite recent themes, what he calls the “elite media” and their conspiracy to aid and abet the Obama administration.

In an article at Huffington Post, the former Speaker of the House is quoted as saying to Sandy Rios of the American Family Association that the “elite media” are “in the tank for Obama” and will do everything they can to see him re-elected.

“It is just astonishing to me how pro-Obama they are,” he said, “Do you think you are going to see two pages on Obama’s Muslim friends? Or two pages on the degree to which Obama is consistently apologizing to Islam while attacking the Catholic church?”

…and I just shake my head.  I’m a black male who has survived to the ripe old age of 36 and is not incarcerated.  I’m an exception in this country, it seems.  I live in one of the 24 states that has a law that solely exists to justify the use of deadly force as the ultimate sanction against someone who is merely perceived to be a threat, without evidence, due process, or the right to face your accuser (because hey, you’re effing dead.)  The legislative need to create laws like this is a symptom of a much more awful syndrome, and in every case these laws were passed by “pro-life” Republicans led by the gun lobbyists.

These laws are designed to allow vigilantism, period.  It’s the worst impulse of the whole Glibertarian/Paulite/Somali Pirate anarcho-justice codified into “I get to decide who lives and who dies, and I reserve the right to exercise that impulse at any point.”  We’re all castles stomping around killing each other, and may the best, most heavily armed castle win.  And as far as Republicans are concerned, well that impulse extends to “We’ve decided that having a black President violates our right not to have one, so we’re going to do something about it from the ground up.”

Trayvon Martin’s awful, pointless murder is just a symptom of a much uglier sickness.

[UPDATENewt doubles down.

“What the president said, in a sense, is disgraceful,” Gingrich said on the Hannity Radio show. “It’s not a question of who that young man looked like. Any young American of any ethnic background should be safe, period. We should all be horrified no matter what the ethnic background.

“Is the president suggesting that if it had been a white who had been shot, that would be OK because it didn’t look like him. That’s just nonsense dividing this country up. It is a tragedy this young man was shot. It would have been a tragedy if he had been Puerto Rican or Cuban or if he had been white or if he had been Asian American of if he’d been a Native American. At some point, we ought to talk about being Americans. When things go wrong to an American, it is sad for all Americans. Trying to turn it into a racial issue is fundamentally wrong. I really find it appalling.”

Effing. Perfect.

130 replies
  1. 1
    Ben Franklin says:

    Zimmerman; Wannabe mall Cop

    Didn’t anyone ever talk to this loose-cannon?

    http://www.documentcloud.org/d.....story.html

  2. 2
    dmsilev says:

    Do you want to really really lose all faith in humanity? Go to the news website of your choice, go to the story about Obama’s comments on Trayvon’s death, and read the comments.

    Did you know that Obama’s comments were made purely out of a crass political desire to inject race into the issue? And further, did you know that since Obama hasn’t commented on every other murder that happened since he was sworn in, he’s the dirty racist?

    Well, now you know…

  3. 3
    Seebach says:

    Anonymous has leaked Zimmerman’s phone number and address. I dunno. It might be a little fun to see the vigilantism working in the other direction.

  4. 4
    Egg Berry says:

    Trayvon Martin’s awful, pointless murder is just a symptom of a much uglier sickness.

    Tribalism is worse than cancer.

  5. 5
    Judas Escargot says:

    These laws are designed to allow vigilantism, period. It’s the worst impulse of the whole Glibertarian/Paulite/Somali Pirate anarcho-justice codified into “I get to decide who lives and who dies, and I reserve the right to exercise that impulse at any point.”

    Libertarianism is the Politics of the Playpen.

  6. 6
    Foobar says:

    You forgot to mention…

    1) the “Dont re-nig” bumpersticker dealeo
    2) the conservative ‘think tank’ obama chicken pic
    3) Hoodies kill (t/m Giraldo)

    Its been a busy week

  7. 7
    AA+ Bonds says:

    “It is just astonishing to me how pro-Obama they are,” he said, “Do you think you are going to see two pages on Obama’s Muslim friends? Or two pages on the degree to which Obama is consistently apologizing to Islam while attacking the Catholic church?”

    DE E E E E ESPERA A A A A TE

  8. 8
    AA+ Bonds says:

    YOU GUYS! ISLAM AND SHIT! REMEMBER THE GROUND ZERO MOSQUE? WHY DONT YOU LOVE MEEEEEEEEEE

  9. 9
    MattR says:

    I’m gonna combine two comments I made on the previous thread.

    Now that I have been reminded of this Eminem video from 2004, I think it would be cool to see him involved in the tribute to Trayvon Martin that the Miami Heat are planning for this evening’s game in Detroit. Here is the group photo the Heat took wearing hoodies earlier today.

  10. 10
    Catsy says:

    @Seebach: No good can come of that.

    Zimmerman may be a murdering racist piece of shit and a waste of oxygen, but I guarantee you that if some vigilante offs him–especially if the vigilante is black–it could be like lighting a match in a room full of flammable gas.

    The only way we get to the other side of this and learn the right lessons from it as a society is for Zimmerman to be prosecuted for the murder he committed.

  11. 11
    AA+ Bonds says:

    Well libertarianism is just the application of narcissism to fascism so

    And of course what that means is that the imminent threat of Ron Paulers is that of manic or psychotic lone wolf murderers instead of any sort of ‘movement’

    A bigger and better fascist is going to have to come along before all those stoned pasty dudes can pull it together and start erecting camps

  12. 12
    SmallAxe says:

    Zandar you must not own any hoodies. To add to the shit pile, POS M. Boyle over at D-bag fucker Carlson’s Daily Caller tied Obama’s speach on Trayvon to the New Black Panther Party of course, “Following demands by the New Black Panthers and others on scene in Sanford, Fla. that the White House get involved, Obama jumped into the fight” A-Holes all of them.

  13. 13
    Schlemizel says:

    I have 0 faith in my fellow Americans. I am honestly stunned that there have not been attempts on our Presidents life. Hell there were at least half a dozen on Clinton and he (with apologies to Ms. Angelou) was white.

    I thank Pasta every day that the worst instincts of these scum sucking morons have not over ruled their diminished capacity. The constant hinting and suggestions and ‘sly’ jokes about shooting him really could enable some of these sick fucks, it has to stop.

  14. 14
    Seebach says:

    @Catsy: But then the Stand Your Ground law stays in place. Would be much more just for Zimmerman to be waxed because he was a “threat” to someone else.

    No. He probably has to be killed legally in order for people to get that the law is the problem.

    We’re always about avoiding the true consequences of what the right wing causes. And so thus lessons are never learned. Give them what they want for once, and maybe they’ll understand.

  15. 15
    PeakVT says:

    @Seebach: No, it wouldn’t. Turning Zimmerman into a victim is about the last thing anyone should do in relation to the matter.

  16. 16
    AA+ Bonds says:

    I would like to stand my ground on George Zimmerman’s severed bleeding balls

  17. 17
    JPL says:

    @SmallAxe: all the candidates have weighed in so it’s interesting that they are choosing to
    spend energy on the President.

    btw…MattR highlighted the Miami Heats response which was posting a picture of the team wearing hoodies.

  18. 18
    amk says:

    why am I not surprised that huffcrap gave noot a platform to spew his venomous lies ? fuck arianna, the faux progressive.

  19. 19
  20. 20
    AA+ Bonds says:

    Arianna Huffington, another person who should have things chopped off

  21. 21

    @Catsy:

    Sounds like the Police might want to lock him up for his own protection.

  22. 22
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @amk:

    why am I not surprised that huffcrap gave noot a platform to spew his venomous lies ? fuck arianna, the faux progressive.

    No real surprise, they’ve been pals since they tried to stop the Red Clinton Murder Conspiracy

    That any liberals accepted her for even a moment as one of them shows they need to get their damn heads in the game

  23. 23
    Knockabout says:

    You know what I’m sick of? Your heavy-handed preachy nonsense that always comes back to Obama and racism. Not everything is another sign that all Americans who aren’t you are racists.

    It’s every single post with you. Everyone who disagrees with Obama is really a closet racist with you, and that includes everyone on the Left, too.

    Don’t you get tired of beating up fellow progressives over not being sufficiently deferential to Obama? And then you’re the first to accuse people of purity crusades?

    You’re black. We get it. It’s not like you and ABL ever let anyone forget that fact. It does not mean that people who have legitimate policy differences with Obama are racists.

    Also, this President is already doing exactly what you accuse Zimmerman and the Repubs of doing and that is arbitrarily deciding who lives and who dies without due process or evidence. People who are furious over this law should be the first people demanding Obama answer for killing U.S. citizens.

    Except admitting that fact would be racist right?

  24. 24
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @Litlebritdifrnt:

    Sounds like the Police might want to lock him up for his own protection.

    Which is literally what they should have done that night anyway for exactly that reason if for no other

  25. 25
    Ben Franklin says:

    @Seebach:

    Give them what they want for once, and maybe they’ll understand.

    I doubt you’d want sole responsibility for the aftermath.

  26. 26
    jl says:

    @PeakVT:

    Agreed, seeing a little vigilantism, (and even the vigilantism already done in releasing the personal info) would NOT be OK.

    That is the whole point of behind objecting to the ‘shoot a man and walk’ self defense laws.

  27. 27
    Violet says:

    Just heard the audio on NPR of the woman saying “pretend it’s Obama” about the target. They said the Secret Service was investigating it. I sure hope so.

  28. 28
    AA+ Bonds says:

    Okay so Knockabout is here and the thread is about to end so what does everyone want on their burgers

  29. 29

    I live in one of the 24 states that has a law that solely exists to justify the use of deadly force as the ultimate sanction against someone who is merely perceived to be a threat, without evidence, due process, or the right to face your accuser (because hey, you’re effing dead.)

    Whatever the ultimate cause of that sickness, it has taken a number of twists and turns including a bloody civil war. To capture it in a term, it would simply be “white supremacy” that is woven firmly into our national fabric, from day one.

    The ranks of this disease, do not include all white people, but a majority, imo, unfortunately, and the current panic causing acute relapse was brought on by a President Obama. That added onto an already festering rage for mostly ideological reasons from people resistant to change and progress human societies are socially evolving toward, whether they want to or not. At least under functioning democracies.

    With few options to opt out of the rainbow country we are, short of all out rebellion and civil war, these people are making “nests” in any number of states vulnerable to a sort of legalized sedition and secession. Building, or trying to build legal firewalls to create 10th amendment havens to practice their own self governance, or whatever you would call it.

    The only question is will the supreme court also, this time, be in on the effort, to make legal pathways to their desired existence of white enclaves, with any colored folks around knowing their place.

  30. 30
    JPL says:

    How about a boycott to the Gunshine state? Do you really want to spend your vacation cash in that state. I live in GA and we have the stand your ground law also but it hasn’t been abused yet.

  31. 31
    Violet says:

    @Litlebritdifrnt:

    Sounds like the Police might want to lock him up for his own protection.

    I heard on the news this morning that Zimmerman is in hiding and that the school he attends and his employer (I think) have told him not to show up because he would be a big distraction and require way too much security and potentially endanger the other students/workers.

  32. 32

    @Catsy:

    No good can come of that.
    __
    Zimmerman may be a murdering racist piece of shit and a waste of oxygen, but I guarantee you that if some vigilante offs him—especially if the vigilante is black—it could be like lighting a match in a room full of flammable gas.

    The worst part is that it wouldn’t even be a thing to worry about if they had just ARRESTED THIS ASSHOLE IN THE FIRST PLACE.

  33. 33

    @dmsilev:

    Do you want to really really lose all faith in humanity? Go to the news website of your choice, go to the story about Obama’s comments on Trayvon’s death, and read the comments.

    FTFY.

  34. 34
    Satanicpanic says:

    Here we go again. Before the thread goes to the crapper I gotta agree with everyone who said Obama’s comment was really touching.

  35. 35
    ThatLeftTurnInABQ says:

    I had an idea the other night about how Florida students could protest re: the murder of Trayvon Martin, in a way that might help get thru to the otherwise clueless adults in their families that this issue impacts teens generally, and to personalize that problem. It is probably a really stupid idea, but I’ll throw it out for the commentariat to chew on. What if:

    We organize a day of protest for later this spring, called Dead Ground Standing. On that day, students all over the state show up to school with pre-printed T-shirts that say:

    Bang! Bang! I’m dead.
    Please call [— — —-] to notify my family that I was another victim of Florida Dead Ground Standing.
    Please call 1-800-###-#### (the Florida Legislature) to report that a crime has been committed.

    The [— — —-] is a box where the student can write in their own phone# with a sharpie pen. The 1-800 number is whatever number would be best chosen to focus phone calls regarding this issue into the Florida legislature.

    On the day of Dead Ground Standing, the participants take these shirts to school, put them on, and then lay down on the ground as if they were dead bodies, or in other words stage a mass die-in.

  36. 36
    AA+ Bonds says:

    Maybe George Zimmerman is in hiding in like five pieces in the trunk of some FBI agents

  37. 37
    KG says:

    there is nothing wrong with the use of proportional force in defense of self or others. and from what i’ve read, that’s what the “stand your ground” laws typically provide for. the problem here isn’t necessarily the law – for fuck’s sake, the author of the law has said it wasn’t meant to apply to cases like this – it’s that Zimmerman allegedly decided to go suburban commando and that the police just said “fuck it” when confronted with a killing.

    it’s a tragedy that this kid died, and from everything i’ve read, it sounds like manslaughter at the very least and possibly first degree murder. but by attacking a law regarding self-defense rather than the specific actions of Zimmerman and the inaction of the police, i think most of you are playing into the right’s hands. focus on the facts here, the law is ancillary at this point.

    all that said, i think these stand your ground laws are fairly stupid and it shouldn’t be an affirmative defense (there’s another thing that should be pointed out, it’s an affirmative defense in court, not a license to go shooting people) if there is a reasonable opportunity to escape the threat of great bodily harm.

  38. 38

    @AA+ Bonds:
    Lettuce, tomato, onion, cheese. NO PICKLE! :)

  39. 39
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @KG:

    there’s another thing that should be pointed out, it’s an affirmative defense in court, not a license to go shooting people

    That’s the one I’ve been unloading on assholes, that the law doesn’t actually allow cops to do what the cops did that night, I usually LOL a little too at how stupid the person is for thinking that

  40. 40
    Svensker says:

    @Seebach:

    No. That is terrible. Shame on Anonymous.

  41. 41
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @ThatLeftTurnInABQ:

    Under current Supreme Court decisions those students would all be disciplined severely with no recourse whatsoever

    I agree that they should do it anyway but good luck convincing a bunch of students in Florida who want to go to college to do something that all of them know they’ll have to explain to every admissions department

  42. 42
    Dan says:

    Knockabout is totally not a racist. At all. Really.

  43. 43

    @Knockabout:

    Wow, that’s some primo grade emoprog butthurt. There was no mention in Zanders post, about racism from the left, though it does exist, but is much less virulent than the right wing kind. You sound an awful lot like the meat eaters in Freeperville, hollering racist at anyone who points real racism out. Ever heard of Weasel Zippers?, you’d fit right in over there.

  44. 44
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @Svensker:

    Shame on Anonymous.

    This is like saying “shame on Kilroy” I hope you know

  45. 45
    amorphous says:

    What is it going to take to have someone hold people like Newt responsible? Santorum has Secret Service protection now, right? I hope they whisked that fine gentleman away to a not so nice place very quickly.

  46. 46
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @General Stuck (Bravo Nope Zero):

    Wow, that’s some primo grade emoprog butthurt.

    Is this how y’all hang onto this election-losing phrase, by waking up every day forgetting what it’s called when someone comes into a thread trying to piss you off regardless of their beliefs

  47. 47
    amk says:

    @Knockabout: firebaggers/pl mob/emoprogs/poutragers ===> That way

  48. 48
    Chris says:

    These laws are designed to allow vigilantism, period. It’s the worst impulse of the whole Glibertarian/Paulite/Somali Pirate anarcho-justice codified into “I get to decide who lives and who dies, and I reserve the right to exercise that impulse at any point.” We’re all castles stomping around killing each other, and may the best, most heavily armed castle win.

    In other words, the exact thing that government – at its most basic, most minimalist – was created to prevent.

    At its inception, government is basically just an armed racket with no competitors – key word no competitors. “Monopoly on the legitimate use of force” doesn’t come from a belief that government is inherently wise or good: it’s because it’s better for everyone to be living under one armed racket than to have ten or twelve armed rackets out there shooting it out with each other every day (see also Somalia, Afghanistan, or just any neighborhood in the West where gangs or Mafia families predominate).

    Take us back to the Middle Ages, hell! These guys want to take us back to the caveman days!

  49. 49
    Origuy says:

    Santorum’s comment was surprisingly measured and rational; Romney’s was typically milquetoast. Gingrich is increasingly unimportant; he’ll get a speaking slot at the convention sometime in the afternoon and end his career as a Fox talking head. Still haven’t heard anything from Ron Paul. Is that because he hasn’t said anything or because none of the media have bothered to report it?

  50. 50
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @amorphous:

    I hope they whisked that fine gentleman away to a not so nice place very quickly.

    They walk a fine line and I don’t believe that guy crossed it

  51. 51
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @amk:

    See my post to Stuck and see me SMH

  52. 52
    ShadeTail says:

    I (a white person) was on the sidewalk outside my place a couple hours ago, and a trio of black teens were walking toward me. My first thought on seeing them was, “They might be scared of me, and it would be perfectly understandable.”

    Mind you, I live in an incredibly low crime area in California. And yet, Treyvon Martin has still made me even more aware of this than I had been (and believe me, I hadn’t been naive even before this).

  53. 53
    ThatLeftTurnInABQ says:

    @AA+ Bonds:

    Yeah, I’m afraid you are right, we are really talking about civil disobediance levels of protest here, given that SCOTUS has already ruled that “we can’t have nice things because shuddup that’s why”. Sigh.

  54. 54
    Ben Franklin says:

    @AA+ Bonds:

    It’s the Zimmerman complex. They don’t understand; a comment ignored is a commentator getting snored.

  55. 55
    Martin says:

    @Knockabout: Hit a little too close to home, did he?

  56. 56
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @Origuy:

    Still haven’t heard anything from Ron Paul. Is that because he hasn’t said anything or because none of the media have bothered to report it?

    AFAIK he has not and I watch dailypaul.com like a hawk; my guess is that he is delicately crafting something to simultaneously please the rabid cop haters, the rabid pro-vigilantists and the rabid racists in his crew

  57. 57

    @AA+ Bonds:

    Is this how y’all hang onto this election-losing phrase,

    LOL, maybe an election for King of the Netroots, otherwise there aren’t enough emoprogs to form a good flash mob.

    by waking up every day forgetting what it’s called when someone comes into a thread trying to piss you off regardless of their beliefs

    Pissed off? clowns from the left are funny, especially their fat red noses and frizzy orange hair. I just mock them, and let gawd sort it out.

  58. 58
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    The range moment shows what Santorum sucks as a leader just as badly as Mittins. Santorum is running on the Christian morality ticket. He should have blasted those people for being wishing the death of another. Instead he wussed out, small wonder his name is shit and he will never win.

  59. 59
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @Martin:

    Oh yeah I bet Knockabout totally wrote that post because of a real genuine emotional reaction to the FP

    Jesus I would like to let the man work but this is pathetic, you want a better class of troll you need to be smarter vics

  60. 60
    Mike in NC says:

    Santorum is shooting a 1911 Colt

    Little Ricky probably never used a firearm before in his entire freakin’ life. But he’s gotta act the part to appeal to the 27%ers.

  61. 61
    scav says:

    @AA+ Bonds: Blue cheese today, thanks. Apparently Opining While Black is a new offence.

  62. 62
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @General Stuck (Bravo Nope Zero):

    Yeah stick it to this guy who is totally 100% all your FDL jack off dreams come to life, he’s completely for real and you look great by doing what you’re doing

  63. 63
    Mnemosyne says:

    @KG:

    I think you may need to re-read the law — there’s a specific provision in there saying that a person who is arrested and uses this as a defense can sue the police department for arresting him.

    When this law is being used as a defense after a gang killing, I think you can make an affirmative case that it is a bad law. It may not be what the writer of the law intended to write, but that’s how it’s being interpreted by the courts in Florida.

    And, by the way, it’s not just a gun issue. People have successfully avoided prosecution after stabbing someone to death and claiming that they were in fear of their lives.

  64. 64
    Chris says:

    @Schlemizel:

    I have 0 faith in my fellow Americans.

    It’s a depressing feeling, isn’t it?

    I am honestly stunned that there have not been attempts on our Presidents life.

    Oh, I’m sure there have been, they’ve just probably been stopped in the early stages. The Secret Service takes its job seriously and it’s gotten pretty good at it, actually. But death threats to the White House went up several hundred percent after the January 2009 inauguration.

    The bleak question is whether he’ll be able to make it to the end of his term without a “lucky” shot getting through.

  65. 65
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @ThatLeftTurnInABQ:

    Yeah it’s really :(

    The other factor is the absolutely intense pressure on kids to look competitive for college in an economy where a high school diploma means nothing to anyone anymore

  66. 66
    Mnemosyne says:

    @AA+ Bonds:

    Oh yeah I bet Knockabout totally wrote that post because of a real genuine emotional reaction to the FP

    You may have missed it, but apparently Knockabout has an off-line grudge against Zandar from when they both worked at the same employer. So, yes, he is actually real (or, at least, he was — it’s always possible that one of our more annoying spoofers got hold of the nym and is using it like someone did to a Breitbartlet the other day).

  67. 67
    DFH no.6 says:

    @Knockabout:

    You know what I’m sick of? Your heavy-handed preachy nonsense

    Yeah, racism is just a minor note in the rightwing opposition to Obama. Hardly worth mentioning, let alone being all heavy-handed with that shit all the goddamn time.

    In Bizarro World.

    Here in the actually existing real world, however…

    Ah, fuck it.

    You know what? Just go fuck yourself, ya clueless asshole.

  68. 68
    MattR says:

    @AA+ Bonds:

    Under current Supreme Court decisions those students would all be disciplined severely with no recourse whatsoever

    I know it is a nitpick, but I think the correct phrase is “those students could all be disciplined”

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: The consensus from reporters at the range was that there was no way Santorum could’ve heard what the woman screamed based on where he was and the fact he was wearing ear protection. He did call the comment “horrible” when told about it. (EDIT: There are plenty of reasons why Santorum is a despicable human, but I don’t think this is one of them)

  69. 69

    @AA+ Bonds:

    Yeah stick it to this guy who is totally 100% all your FDL jack off dreams come to life, he’s completely for real and you look great by doing what you’re doing

    He’s no more or less real than you are Obi Wan, the question is how you are looking, by defending a completely moronic post from the knockabout? Trying to bash a BJ front pager with made up butthurt about the post being about “teh left”, when it wasn’t.

  70. 70
    AA+ Bonds says:

    Next y’all are going to tell me you don’t know why Veritas is named “Veritas”

    S, S, SMH

  71. 71
    PeakVT says:

    @jl: I’m also worried about the practical effect. I think it’s much more likely that we’ll eventually overturn the laws if there’s never any confusion about who is the victim. As soon as there is an appearance of confusion anyone on the fence can just throw up their hands and walk away.

  72. 72
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @General Stuck (Bravo Nope Zero):

    Uhhhh I am exactly like Knockabout, that would be the point, I just have a different angle. Have, had, whatever, I deserve the shit I get from the hard workers on here for going native

    You make me want to flip back and when I am being so nice to everyone on here nowadays

  73. 73
    catclub says:

    commneting to get rid of the mobile site. it is still not fixed

  74. 74

    @AA+ Bonds:

    Next y’all are going to tell me you don’t know why Veritas is named “Veritas”

    Nah, next we are going to tell you to stop being an idiot.

  75. 75
    AA+ Bonds says:

    TEH EMOPROG. IT BUTTHURTS MY MADDOWCATS, CAN I HAZ HAMSHERTUBE?

  76. 76
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @General Stuck (Bravo Nope Zero):

    I sincerely believe that you don’t “get” Knockabout, you’ve convinced me, Ego te absolvo my son. Go in peace.

  77. 77

    @AA+ Bonds:

    You make me want to flip back and when I am being so nice to everyone on here nowadays

    I want you to ignore me as I ignore you, and the whiny shit you post here. It’s the new Stuck, blog and let blog, unless someone says something really asinine, like knockabout, then you.

  78. 78
    Paula says:

    Yeah, Zandar, stop being Black and and caring about Black people shit, it’s totally annoying.

  79. 79

    @AA+ Bonds:

    I get knockabout, having a grudge against Zander, but I don’t have anymore insight into the character beyond what it writes. And neither do you.

  80. 80
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @KG: Ordinary self-defense covers that. However, ordinary self-defense also requires that the person being attacked get out of the situation if safely possible. Stand your ground laws take that requirement away.

  81. 81
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @MattR:

    The consensus from reporters at the range was that there was no way Santorum could’ve heard what the woman screamed based on where he was and the fact he was wearing ear protection. He did call the comment “horrible” when told about it. (EDIT: There are plenty of reasons why Santorum is a despicable human, but I don’t think this is one of them)

    Again this shows why he sucks as a politician. If he had made a big deal about it he would show his morality isn’t a speech, he follows it even when it’s not convenient. That Holier Than Thou game he is playing means he can never slip or he’s just another hypocrite.

    This is just like Romney echo stech things, a moment that perfectly defines the man’s failings.

  82. 82
    Knockabout says:

    Am I wrong? What’s the difference between Trayvon Martin being killed by George Zimmerman and al Alwaki being killed by Obama? Was that racism too? Was Obama’s justification for doing so any better than Zimmerman? Please answer the question any of you.

  83. 83
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @AA+ Bonds: As do you by doing what you are doing. As do I by doing what I’m doing. As does the person who criticizes me for doing this for doing what she’s doing. And so on until we disappear up our own asses.

  84. 84
    gbear says:

    @KG:

    Zimmerman allegedly decided to go suburban commando and that the police just said “fuck it” when confronted with a killing.

    But the cops saying ‘fuck it’ is a built-in feature of the law. If an arrest and investigation are made but the result is that the shooter is cleared under the law, the shooter can sue the cops. This isn’t the only case where the cops have said ‘fuck it’. A teen bystander to a gang battle was killed but, given that both gangs were ‘holding their ground’, no charges were filed and everyone went free. (I’ll go look for the link)

  85. 85
    gbear says:

    @Mike in NC:

    Little Ricky probably never used a firearm before in his entire freakin’ life. But he’s gotta act the part to appeal to the 27%ers.

    The thing that I noticed about Ricky’s target practice is that he wasn’t shooting at a bullseye – he was shooting at a human silhouette. Nice optics when combined with the ‘Obama’ remark.

  86. 86
    chrome agnomen says:

    @Mike in NC:

    cause we know rih never uses protection.

  87. 87
    CarolDuhart2 says:

    @Litlebritdifrnt: I’m surprised they haven’t. True, everybody’s staying calm, and nobody is asking for more than him being arrested, but still, emotions are running high. It wouldn’t take much for some lone deranged character to do something. So I’m surprised that he isn’t in some sort of police custody or protection for his own good. Yes, it’s his own fault, but still….

    And everybody’s looking for him-press, protestors, who knows. At least in protection, he could talk to the press and issue statements (with the help of his lawyer) without inadvertently causing problems with neighbors.

  88. 88
    Warren Terra says:

    Oh. My. Effing. Tapdancing. God. The. Update.

    Where the fncking hell did Gingrich get the idea that Obama said anything like:

    Is the president suggesting that if it had been a white who had been shot, that would be OK because it didn’t look like him. That’s just nonsense dividing this country up.

    This is sick, sick stuff. An innocent comment about how this appalling murder has hit the President close to home is being twisted to insinuate – hell, to assert – that Obama is some sort of vile racist, indifferent to the fates of everyone who isn’t Black.

    I’ve enjoyed laughing at Newt’s antics, and at the inability of Willard Romney to clearly outdistance these clowns. But this is just too much. Newt needs to apologize, tout suite, and his fellow Republicans and any media outlet that would have him on have to be asked about this horrible outburst.

  89. 89
    CarolDuhart2 says:

    @Knockabout: al Alawaki was training and referring people to be trained bombers. The Christmas would-be bomber is his handiwork. He also counseled the FT. Bragg shooter as well to do what he did. He was actively recruiting terrorists and enabling them to do terror.

    And he was in a place where the local police could do nothing and would dare do nothing-the nation of Yemen is embattled, and the leader is engaged in a civil war. While Yemen has courts and convicted him in absentia, they were unable to arrest him and try him in their courts, let alone bring or send him to the United States for trial. So instead of sending commandos to pick him up, which would have probably killed many more civilians and aggravated the Yemeni Civil war further, they used drones instead.

    The point is that he was an imminent danger in a place where there was simply no other mechsaha
    to keep him from endangering others.

  90. 90
    Sly says:

    @Knockabout:

    What’s the difference between Trayvon Martin being killed by George Zimmerman and al Alwaki being killed by Obama?

    You mean apart from the latter deserving it?

  91. 91
    Egg Berry says:

    @Knockabout:

    Am I wrong?

    Yes.

    Next question.

  92. 92
    MattMinus says:

    @Violet:

    Really? Do we need to make sure that the cops hassle our political enemies for the crime of making bad jokes? Does anyone really think this woman was actually planning some sort of attempt and just happened to blurt it out in the form of a joke at a media event?

  93. 93
    CarolDuhart2 says:

    Thanks everybody for those retorts. Al-Alawaki was actively formenting violence against the United States in a place where normal judicial and police efforts were simply non-existent. Nobody could arrest him, let alone try him, and extradition was simply out of the question.

    From his “safe” harbor he could connect would-be jihadis with bomb makers, even have the bomb makers living nearby. He could receive terrorists, equip them with bombs, and send them on their way seemingly secure from all harm.

    So that’s where the drones came in.

  94. 94
    ShadeTail says:

    @Knockabout:

    Am I wrong?

    Yup.

    SATSQ

  95. 95
    CarolDuhart2 says:

    @Warren Terra: One consolation I have is that neither will ever have the power to be more than the jackasses they already are and that the racist bilge they spew is to an older and older audience who will pass away none too soon.

    But it says something about the Republican Party Decay that this is what has risen to the top now. There are simply no more Eisenhowers or even Nixons. One reason is that the Presidential monopoly the Bush Familia has had for the last two decades has probably discouraged excellence in itself. Why try to be Presidential when there’s no real chance to be President? Instead the lesson was to lose gracefully to whatever Bush Family spawn would claim the nomination: 1988, 1992, 2000, 2004. Only Jeb Bush’s reluctance, and Big Brother’s unpopularity, perhaps other issues kept him from running in 2008 and 2012. So actually thinking about the Presidency as a real position has been lost to the Republican Party, and the sense of having to be Presidential as well.

    So they feel freed to insult wide swaths of the American public because they don’t feel they need to win, or if they actually win, to govern.

  96. 96
    scav says:

    Does Knockabout think we’ve really entrusted the nuclear codes to a national instead of neighborhood volunteer vigilante?

  97. 97

    @Knockabout: I forget that Zandar is black all the time. It’s a little harder with ABL, given, well, Angry Black Lady and all. Of course it could be because it isn’t important to me – what they have to say is why I read the posts.

    I’ve yet to recall Zandar suggesting that anyone who disagrees with the President is racist. Perhaps you’re engaging in a bit of projection, no?

  98. 98
    Paula says:

    @Knockabout:

    Fine.

    If you had made a comment about how the United States government’s foreign policy in general and the GWOT in particular has been based on Othered views of the Middle East and driven by the need to engage the American public in this war by painting the enemy as inhuman and therefore not deserving of rights — then, sure, you would have had a real argument to make.

    But you didn’t. You wrote about how Zandar was talking too much about being Black and how Obama being Black as well meant that he was being shielded from criticism.

  99. 99
    b-psycho says:

    @Chris:

    At its inception, government is basically just an armed racket with no competitors – key word no competitors. “Monopoly on the legitimate use of force” doesn’t come from a belief that government is inherently wise or good: it’s because it’s better for everyone to be living under one armed racket than to have ten or twelve armed rackets out there shooting it out with each other every day (see also Somalia, Afghanistan, or just any neighborhood in the West where gangs or Mafia families predominate).

    …shouldn’t the goal be then to live under ZERO armed rackets? After all, one armed racket is still an armed racket, on top of which the monopoly lets them do whatever the fuck they want with no effective response to abuse.

  100. 100
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Knockabout:

    What’s the difference between Trayvon Martin being killed by George Zimmerman and al Alwaki being killed by Obama?

    Dude, if you see no difference between a teenager walking down the street with a packet of Skittles and a can of iced tea and a grown-ass adult living in an al-Qaeda encampment, I’m calling head injury. You sound like the man who mistook his wife for a hat.

  101. 101
    b-psycho says:

    @Mnemosyne: True. The later attack afterward killing his 16 year old son makes a better comparison.

  102. 102
    Billy Rae Valentine says:

    @Knockabout:

    you said obama is killing u.s. citizens. who are those citizens he is killing without due process? i’m aware of al-alwaki(sp?) but is there anyone else?

  103. 103
    MattMinus says:

    @b-psycho:

    And without an armed racket people have exactly what incentive to follow the rules and play nice?

  104. 104
    Chris says:

    @b-psycho:

    Sure it should be. And over the centuries we’ve done a lot to improve governments: given them other duties to perform, placed restrictions on them, increased accountability through things like elections and checks-and-balances. And we should definitely keep doing more of that, which has always been a key objective of liberal movements.

    I’m just commenting on how far back these guys want to take us. They’re not interested in even the most basic function of government anymore.

  105. 105
    KG says:

    hadn’t seen the immunity stuff before. yeah, that is definitely a problem, though it also looks like there is a section that says if you start the confrontation you don’t have the protections, and since we have 911 recordings where he’s specifically told not to go after the kid, I don’t see how he’s going to be immune.

    As for regular self-defense laws requiring retreat, I don’t know that it makes much of a difference. It definitely shouldn’t in this case.

  106. 106
    Zandar says:

    @Knockabout:

    Am I wrong? What’s the difference between Trayvon Martin being killed by George Zimmerman and al Alwaki being killed by Obama? Was that racism too? Was Obama’s justification for doing so any better than Zimmerman? Please answer the question any of you.

    In order:

    1) Yes. See 2).

    2) Anwar al-Awlaki was a terrorist. I am unaware that there was evidence that Trayvon Martin was a terrorist or that President Obama declared Trayvon Martin as such.

    3) No. See 2).

    4) Infinitely so, see 2).

    5) No problem, see 2).

  107. 107
    b-psycho says:

    @MattMinus: There’s still the matter of, if there is to be one armed racket, how you make them follow the rules and play nice.

  108. 108
    Knockabout says:

    Okay then Zandar tell me Obama is any better than Zimmerman for killing Awlaki’s son. Please, I cannot wait to hear how honorable Dear Leader is so great for saying “Oh well collateral damage is unavoidable” but Treyvon Martin is a subject of national protests. Where’s your damn outrage on that innocent boy’s death, or do you enjoy your hypocrisy…

  109. 109
    cmm says:

    For the record, I read this site almost every day and this post was the first time I realized Zandar was black, because it is the first specific mention of it. And I am embarrassed again to realize that my default mode is to assume white unless/until specifically shown otherwise.

  110. 110
    Lynn Dee says:

    I love what Obama said. I found it deeply personal, moving and thoughtful.

  111. 111
    honus says:

    @AA+ Bonds: The Florida law defines “prosecution” as “arrest” so, yes, the law does allow the police to do what they did, i. e. not arrest Zimmerman. In fact it requires this.
    signed,
    Somebody who reads laws for a living.

  112. 112
    ShadeTail says:

    @Knockabout:

    Translation: “Now that my earlier bullshit pitch has been knocked out of the park by the bat of kick-ass, I’ll move the goalposts and put words in Obama’s mouth in a desperate attempt to appear ethical and relevant.”

  113. 113
    Lynn Dee says:

    @Knockabout: The death of a child is always a tragedy. But where is this hypocrisy you’re seeing? Did Obama stalk 
    Awlaki’s son because he thought he looked suspicious? Did Obama appoint himself neighborhood 
    watchman and phone 911 to describe Awlaki’s son as he walked down the street with a snack item?

    You would do better to compare the death of Awlaki’s son to all the deaths of innocents in all the wars since time began.

  114. 114
    Knockabout says:

    Still waiting.

    How is Obama killing al-Awlaki’s son any different. The problem is it’s not. Obama supporters are hypocrites so spare me your convenient outrage Zandar. You are an embarrassment and once again you’ve LOST.

  115. 115
    Billy Rae Valentine says:

    @Knockabout:

    i’m still waiting, too. i asked you a straightforward question and you didn’t bother to answer.

    i’d answer your latest question but i’m not informed well enough to do so.

  116. 116
    honus says:

    @Knockabout: Why do trolls always make a point of repeatedly demanding a response to a rhetorical question, as if that were somehow significant?

  117. 117
    Schlemizel says:

    @a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q):
    Some jerkoff here made a skivie comment about Zander last week in a thread and I had to ask, I honestly had no idea Zander was black. ABL won’t let you ever forget it and thats fine for her I guess but you that other clown really had to reach a loooong way to suggest Zander is always harping on race

  118. 118
    Jamie says:

    @Catsy:

    Some reporter with balls needs to ask the Newtiepie if he thinks minorities in dangerous gated communities like this one should pack heat. To defend themselves against, ah, overly enthusiastic neighborhood watchmen.

  119. 119
    AxelFoley says:

    @Knockabout: Please fuck the fuck off.

  120. 120
    Corner Stone says:

    @honus: This may be the most hilariously self unaware comment. Ever.
    Or genius.
    No. No, certainly unaware.
    But fucking funny.

  121. 121
    Corner Stone says:

    @AxelFoley: You’re on BP meds, right? For fucks sake I hope you’re on BP meds.

  122. 122
    Corner Stone says:

    @AxelFoley: I love you too damn much!
    /The Abyss

  123. 123
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Knockabout:

    Ah, the dragging sound of moving the goalposts. When kids were killed at David Koresh’s compound, were the police solely to blame, or was part of the blame because their parents had put them in a dangerous situation?

    Please explain why you believe al-Awlaki thought that his son would be perfectly safe living in an al-Qaeda encampment in Yemen in the same way that Trayvon Martin’s father thought his son would be perfectly safe living in a gated community in suburban Florida.

  124. 124

    Newt Gingrich will improve the world when his corpulence finally overcomes his savage and maniacal self-regard and deprives us permanently of his company. The media will keen and wail as they did over the corpse of Richard Nixon, but I won’t mourn.

    It will be a challenge to my temperament to remain silent and reserved in the face of a strong impulse to celebrate.

  125. 125
    Corner Stone says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    Please explain why you believe al-Awlaki thought that his son would be perfectly safe living in an al-Qaeda encampment in Yemen in the same way that Trayvon Martin’s father thought his son would be perfectly safe living in a gated community in suburban Florida.

    Wait…what?

  126. 126
    Corner Stone says:

    @Mnemosyne: God damn but you are one sick fucking fuck.

  127. 127
    Ruckus says:

    @lovable liberal:
    I wouldn’t cross the street to piss on newt if he was on fire but I might be swayed to fly cross country to piss on his grave. First Class even.

  128. 128
    A Humble Lurker says:

    @Corner Stone:
    It’s just projection city around here today.

  129. 129

    […] looking at this Photoshop image, perhaps Newt Gingrich wants to explain what it is about President Obama’s comments that were so racial…? Oh wait, nevermind he can’t — because he’s an asshole who panders to the lowest […]

  130. 130
    sparrow says:

    I have been reading this blog for all of 2 days, so stats may not be significant, but it didn’t occur to me that the author was any particular color – even a vague curiosity did not crop up. So, “never letting people forget” seems a bit exaggerated.

    I think any links between Trayvon Martin and Al-Awlaki are tenuous at best, but let me just say as a total outsider to whatever’s going on in this fight, that the whole killing American citizens without due process thing is NOT minor, and in a sane world it would never happen. Maybe I’m craaaazy libahrul or something, but I’m surprised to see so many people defending it. (Also, it would have resulted in my dumping Obama for a more left candidate. Of course in reality I live in fear of supreme court decisions so I’ll just tuck my tail and vote Obama because he’s not, I donno, batshit insane.)

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