Your Master Class In Mansplaining

Here are the only things you really need to know about last night’s debate.  One, it’s more than likely the last one for the Republicans.  Two, they did this:

On Wednesday, contraception became the latest topic to raise the ire of conservative debate goers.

During a CNN-sponsored Republican presidential debate in Arizona, the crowd booed wildly at the mention of birth control.

Newt Gingrich then lied about President Obama “supporting infanticide”, Mittens then lied about the President’s “assault on religious freedom”, Santorum then lied about the “pill being dangerous”, and Ron Paul noted that as a doctor, if only women had morals, we wouldn’t need contraception at all.

The sound you heard during that roughly 8 minute segment of the debate was every female swing voter laughing and walking away from the Republicans for a very, very long time.

Conservative pundits sympathetic to Romney have been making the case this week that, whatever Santorum’s conservative merits, he drags the whole party down with his extreme rhetoric. They got plenty of evidence for their case on Wednesday after the GOP received a question on whether they support birth control. Gingrich and Romney practically fell over themselves to condemn moderator John King for daring to even bring it up, insisting that it was an irrelevant distraction from the important issues of the day and their only concerns with contraception were really about religious freedom.

Then came Rick Santorum, who completely deflated their case. He enthusiastically responded to a question about contraception with a lengthy (and seemingly unrelated) sermon about the over-sexualization of teenagers.

“What we’re seeing is a problem in our culture with respect the children being raised by children, children being raised out of wedlock, and the impact on society economically, the impact on society with respect to drug use and a host of other things, when children have children,” he said. “And so, yes, I was talking about these very serious issues.”

Pretty soon the entire podium was following his lead, joining in with their own denunciations of teenage pregnancy and calling for more abstinence programs.

These guys are toast.  Their party is toast.  Their ideas are toast.  The fact they spent a good 10+ minutes mansplaining how the spawn of Lilith  should really just epoxy their legs shut in a debate where the word “jobs” was completely absent showed just how out of touch these fools really are.

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105 replies
  1. 1
    jibeaux says:

    I’ve said it before, but if male politicians spend the next 40 years in mortal fear of pissing off American women and whispering “remember 2012” to each other, it’s all to the good as far as I’m concerned.

  2. 2
    MariedeGournay says:

    Mmmmm, toast. And they’re all little insecure Adams: can’t stand a woman on top.

  3. 3
    capt says:

    “These guys are toast. Their party is toast. Their ideas are toast.”

    From your keyboard to the great spaghetti monster’s ears. :)

  4. 4
    Steve says:

    It’s funny how they think they can say “the issue is religious freedom, not birth control” and everyone will just ignore the fact that they’re talking about the “religious freedom” to deny access to birth control.

    It’s like people who say the Civil War was about states’ rights, not slavery. Okay, the states’ rights to do what, exactly? Oh, to permit slavery. Hmm.

  5. 5
    cathyx says:

    When the crowd booed, were they booing the fact that they don’t like contraception, or were they booing the candidates’ stance on contraception?

  6. 6
    Democratic Nihilist, Keeper Of Party Purity says:

    I’d be laughing, but for no other reason than the color of the President’s skin, this nation may well follow Rick Santorum off the cliff.

    I’d like to think “their party is toast”, but that’s what I thought when Reagan was elected. It’s what I thought when H.W. dragged us into the Gulf War. It’s what I thought when Gingrich shut down the government. It’s what I thought when the House decided to impeach Clinton. It’s what I thought for almost every minute of W’s entire eight years in office.

    Yet here we are. And the GOP is not yet toast.

  7. 7
    amk says:

    @cathyx: whatdayathink?

    When the crowd booed, were they booing the fact that they don’t like contraception, or were they booing the candidates’ stance on contraception?

  8. 8
    Lee says:

    If we had a functional Democratic party, we would have nothing but political ads that are clips from the debates playing all the way up until the election.

    But as it stands we’ll get political ads that are the equivalent of ‘icanhascheezburger’ with a couple of Tunch pictures thrown in as substance.

  9. 9
    atlliberal says:

    Do these people realize that if they really were to convince women to stop having sex, then the only people who will be having sex are men? Hmm….

  10. 10
    cathyx says:

    @amk: Well, since the post is about the unpopularity of the anti-contraception stance, I would say that. But this is a republican debate filled with wackos in the audience, so therefore I would say the opposite. So that is why I am asking the question.

  11. 11
    Skippy-san says:

    Don’t count your chickens-or your votes before the election. Its still a long haul before election day, and your baseline GOP voter is SO PISSED OFF AT OBAMA, that they would vote for Satan himself if it would get the black man out of the White House.

    Also, don’t underestimate the ability of some foreign policy crisis ( a distinct possibility this summer) being hi-jacked to portray Obama as hating: Israel, our allies, America, Apple Pie, and Chevorlet.

    We are where we are because our electorate is ill informed. If we had a literate electorate-Fox News would be bankrupt. Sadly they are not.

  12. 12
    Lee says:

    @amk: That is actually a fair question. Based on the past behavior of the audience during the debates, it is pretty safe to say they were booing the fact they don’t like contraception.

  13. 13
    MattF says:

    “Audience booing birth control” is just… astounding. Where did Mitt find these people? In underground bunkers?

  14. 14
    Palli says:

    WOW
    The republicans are betting on their election fraud techniques to keep the party viable but they don’t want the presidency this round.
    (Some may even know there is no future for America if they win the presidency and remain in control of the Congress. But those that do have no heart/brain capacity to process that knowledge or they wouldn’t stay republican.)
    They are laying an outlandish foundation for ruining a second term: declare anything President Obama will do in his second term is an anti-American assault on freedom. (They think they can continue to prevent him from governing as an American liberal Democratic president.)
    will it work or can we change Congress by electing enough Progressives to push hard enough so the Liberal Democratic majority will fight with guts.

  15. 15
    c u n d gulag says:

    I didn’t watch, did they say they supported the “Dick’s for Dildo’s,” penetrating the ladeez vagineez, legislation in Ol’ Virginee?

  16. 16
    PigInZen says:

    I think they just realize how extensive “pussy power” could be. Just imagine – women go on strike sexually and in the process toss a monkey wrench into the entire system of power structure in the US. The only way to avoid this is to keep women sexually subservient.

    I for one thank these brave men for helping us avoid such a calamity.

  17. 17
    comrade scott's agenda of rage says:

    @Democratic Nihilist, Keeper Of Party Purity:

    I’d like to think “their party is toast”, but that’s what I thought when Reagan was elected. It’s what I thought when H.W. dragged us into the Gulf War. It’s what I thought when Gingrich shut down the government. It’s what I thought when the House decided to impeach Clinton. It’s what I thought for almost every minute of W’s entire eight years in office. Yet here we are. And the GOP is not yet toast.

    This. Sheesh, how many times do we also say “any presidential candidate with an “R” after his name is automatically gonna get 50 million votes”?

    They’re not toast and they’re not gonna be toast while they control the judiciary and the state and local gubmints where they can work hard to suppress voting and still win elections on the margins. It’s all Atwater/Rovian operations, nothing’s changed except the renewed emphasis on voter suppression and winning state and local races.

  18. 18
    ericblair says:

    @atlliberal:

    Do these people realize that if they really were to convince women to stop having sex, then the only people who will be having sex are men? Hmm….

    I hate to overthink this crap, but I don’t think they really want that. They want to make sure sluts are around, but that they are properly punished and shamed, and completely differentiated from the Madonnas, who they’ll go courtin’ after they sober up. (Not that Madonna. Definitely slut.)

    If you really start peeling the onion on some Santorum-esque Catholics, they don’t want to get rid of the poor, either. The poor, or rather The Poor, will always be with us, so we can do some token good works on them in order to punch our Heaven ticket. Actually raising them permanently out of poverty isn’t part of the plan.

  19. 19
    Chyron HR says:

    No, no, the crowd was saying BOO-irth control.

  20. 20
    Democratic Nihilist, Keeper Of Party Purity says:

    will it work or can we change Congress by electing enough Progressives to push hard enough so the Liberal Democratic majority will fight with guts.

    @Palli: We’ve just managed to get every Blue Dog out of Congress. They have been replaced with Republicans. Please explain to me a viable path of electing progressive politicians in such races and furthermore, getting them elected in 2012.

    Short of genocide, I don’t think it’s going to happen.

    I do agree with you that the GOP absolutely does not want the presidency this election.

  21. 21
    PigInZen says:

    @cathyx:

    I think they were booing the moderator even daring to ask the question, not the fact that they dislike contraception nor the potential answers the candidates were going to give.

    It’s all about not wanting to air the dirtiest of dirty party laundry.

  22. 22
    cmorenc says:

    I too think Obama will in the end wind up winning the general election by a comfortable margin. NEVERTHELESS, the progressive community had better be prepared for a few “Tower of Terror” ride type moments over the summer and fall where the momentary tide seemingly makes Obama’s prospects seem frighteningly fragile (e.g. a week when he’s momentarily behind three to five points in some polls).

    Folks, we CANNOT be overconfident about this. That’s the one way we can lose to these dangerously insane jackasses.

  23. 23
    Chris says:

    @ericblair:

    I hate to overthink this crap, but I don’t think they really want that. They want to make sure sluts are around, but that they are properly punished and shamed, and completely differentiated from the Madonnas, who they’ll go courtin’ after they sober up. (Not that Madonna. Definitely slut.)

    QFT.

    The poor, or rather The Poor, will always be with us, so we can do some token good works on them in order to punch our Heaven ticket.

    And they also need them around for someone to feel better than.

  24. 24
    Steve says:

    @cathyx: The serious answer is that they were booing the media for asking about birth control, because they believe the Republicans when they say “we don’t want to keep talking about birth control, it’s just that the media keeps asking us!”

  25. 25
    The Snarxist Formerly Known as Kryptik says:

    @Democratic Nihilist, Keeper Of Party Purity:
    @Skippy-san:
    @comrade scott’s agenda of rage:

    This, this, and this.

    Honestly, at this point, I’m not sure if they’re really gunning hard for the presidential race anymore, but as said before, there’s still a pretty ugly hard floor for support any GOP candidate will get, simply because EVUL LIBRULLLLLSS!!

    And even if the anti-woman stuff polls awfully, I’m not sure they actually CARE it polls awfully now. They just want to get it through NOW, codify it, and rely on the wonders of blatant obstructionism to make sure it stays on the books for at least a decade or so, after which the short-term memory of the electorate will probably think the GOP is the most absolute peachy keenest thing ever because they promise a new boom and to protect us from the evils of rampant, exotic soshulisms.

  26. 26
    cathyx says:

    Maybe they were booing sex.

  27. 27
    Comrade Javamanphil says:

    The number of independent voters watching last night’s debate = 0. This only hurts the GOP if the Dems make sure it does.

  28. 28
    Redshift says:

    @PigInZen: Having seen the clip, I honestly think (as you said) they were booing the moderator for bringing it up, and framing the question as being about birth control (what it really is) rather than their preferred spin (“religious freedom”). But perception is reality, and I’m certainly going to do my best to perpetuate the perception that “booing birth control” was the appalling “audience moment” from this debate.

  29. 29
    Mark S. says:

    Newt really said Obama supports infanticide? Where are our guardians of civil discourse on that one?

  30. 30
    Redshift says:

    @cmorenc:

    Folks, we CANNOT be overconfident about this. That’s the one way we can lose to these dangerously insane jackasses.

    Can we just all agree that when we say they’re lunatics who are alienating everyone but the 27 percenters, it means we’re going to win if we all work hard and get the job done, not “it’s in the bag, everybody go home”? We do all know that, right?

  31. 31
    redshirt says:

    And yet for all this burnt toast, 42-49% of the electorate will vote for whatever joke the Reupkes put up there. Your American Democracy in action folks!

  32. 32
    cmorenc says:

    @Skippy-san:

    Don’t count your chickens-or your votes before the election. Its still a long haul before election day, and your baseline GOP voter is SO PISSED OFF AT OBAMA, that they would vote for Satan himself if it would get the black man out of the White House. Also, don’t underestimate the ability of some foreign policy crisis ( a distinct possibility this summer) being hi-jacked to portray Obama as hating: Israel, our allies, America, Apple Pie, and Chevorlet.

    Distraction WILL be the core strategy of the GOP fall presidential campaign. You can already see it in two places: gas prices and Iran. Look for the candidate’s campaign team to pick whichever two or three similar shiny objects work best in the context of events to such all the oxygen away from everything else, and stay away from discussions about the radioactive crap that came up during the primary campaign as if it didn’t exist. For example: contraception issue, what contraception issue, there was never any contraception issue, we were simply concerned about not forcing things on people against their religious conscience, and that’s all we need say about that. But if we don’t have a President capable of taking on Iran before it has the bomb, we’re toast.

  33. 33
    Democratic Nihilist, Keeper Of Party Purity says:

    Newt really said Obama supports infanticide? Where are our guardians of civil discourse on that one?

    @Mark S.: Rating it “mostly true”.

  34. 34
    Rafer Janders says:

    @Skippy-san:

    Don’t count your chickens-or your votes before the election. Its still a long haul before election day, and your baseline GOP voter is SO PISSED OFF AT OBAMA, that they would vote for Satan himself if it would get the black man out of the White House.

    So, baseline GOP voters will vote for the GOP. And this is different from every other year how?

  35. 35
    jibeaux says:

    @Redshift: I think that’s right, but honestly I don’t think it makes it loads better that they’re booing the idea of addressing the topic. I mean, Obama quietly got insurers to pay for birth control without copays under the ACA following the recommendation of the physician advisors. If that “makes” the Republicans hold hearings without any women, start talking about how birth control is “not ok”, discuss the aspirin-between-the-legs method, advocate transvaginal probes, propose legislation that would let employers dictate what medical coverage they’re comfortable with, and pontificate on how you shouldn’t have to pay for birth control if you run a Taco Bell either, then the man is playing 13 dimensional chess. Occam’s razor suggests the reason they’re making a BFD out of birth control because they have BF issues with birth control.

  36. 36
    Steve says:

    @Comrade Javamanphil: That’s not true at all.

  37. 37
    Rosalita says:

    @cathyx:

    When the crowd booed, were they booing the fact that they don’t like contraception, or were they booing the candidates’ stance on contraception?

    That’s what I’d like to know. My first impression was that the audience didn’t want it up for discussion. Which pissed me off. It’s a valid issue.

  38. 38
    Zandar says:

    Pretty sure they were booing John king bringing it up.

  39. 39
    Citizen_X says:

    whatever Santorum’s conservative merits, he drags the whole party down with his extreme rhetoric.

    GO, RIH! GO, RIH! GO, RIH! GO, RIH!

  40. 40
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    So if teenage girls shouldn’t have sex and have kids, what does the good Mr Santorum think about the virgin Mary?

  41. 41
    redshirt says:

    @cmorenc: Distraction is always their strategy. Distraction has to be their strategy because if they came right out and were honest, that 42-49% of the vote would reduce down to it’s pure 27% and even they (still!) have a glimmer of intelligence enough to know that ain’t gonna let them gut this country and bleed it dry.

  42. 42
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @Steve:

    It’s funny how they think they can say “the issue is religious freedom, not birth control” and everyone will just ignore the fact that they’re talking about the “religious freedom” to deny access to birth control.

    And were is their religious freedom to enslave blacks or persecute atheists? Catholic bullshit like “freedom of religion doesn’t mean freedom from religion”

  43. 43
    Redshift says:

    @cmorenc:

    You can already see it in two places: gas prices and Iran.

    Which should be hilarious, considering that bombing Iran would send gas prices through the roof. Unfortunately, we don’t have political media or an electorate that’s capable of recognizing how delusional that combination is.

  44. 44
    brantl says:

    I think we can call this evolution in action, which happens, which they also don’t believe in. This stuff needs to be brought up in the general, repeatedly.

  45. 45
    The Snarxist Formerly Known as Kryptik says:

    @Redshift:

    If we did, we wouldn’t be having this discussion, because the GOP wouldn’t even be an afterthought. But we live with the discourse we have, and the lunatics it enables time and time again. :/

  46. 46
    Paul in KY says:

    @Democratic Nihilist, Keeper Of Party Purity: I thought GWB was toast (1 term loser) until the morning of Sep 11th.

    Rot in Hell Osama bin Laden.

  47. 47

    AS a friend noted on another forum, in response to all the slut shaming and punishing legislation:

    If some of these people like sexual submissiveness, if they are consenting adults-enjoy. Let’s not pretend that it’s religious or moral or “family values”. It’s just fairly vanilla fetishism, cloaked in religious claptrap. The men are so insecure about it, they need religious rationalization to validate their sexual proclivities.

  48. 48
    Paul in KY says:

    @Mark S.: Didn’t ya know? In addition to being an Islamofacist, Commie, Kenyan, Atheist, the President & Michelle also worship Baal-Marduk.

  49. 49

    Yes, this was the audience booing John King for bringing up another issue that makes Republicans look bad. Shame on him for bringing up issues that make Republicans look bad! This is a GOP debate and they should be allowed to avoid topics that make them look bad!

  50. 50
    Paul in KY says:

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: Sex with humans is bad for a teenagers. Sex with space dieties is OK.

  51. 51
    OzoneR says:

    @Redshift:

    Can we just all agree that when we say they’re lunatics who are alienating everyone but the 27 percenters, it means we’re going to win if we all work hard and get the job done, not “it’s in the bag, everybody go home”? We do all know that, right?

    If that’s true, then they’re not lunatics who are alienating everyone but the 27 percenters. If that were true, we could just waltz into the election.

  52. 52
    J.D. Rhoades says:

    @Steve:

    Asking about birth control interferes with their favorite bait and switch: they get into office convincing independents and moderates they’re for jobs, low taxes and less government, then immediately forget all that the moment they’re sworn in and start trying to ban abortion, birth control, and gay people. Santorum’s failing because he won’t keep his mouth shut about it.

  53. 53
    redshirt says:

    @J.D. Rhoades: Don’t forget also too: Spending like drunken sailors.

    I still stand in awe of their propagandistic powers that they can convince a not small percent of the population that the Repuke party is the party of “Fiscal responsibility” when any casual perusal of the data since St. Ronnie shows this to be the complete opposite.

    Facts! Who needs ’em?!

  54. 54
    28 Percent says:

    @amk: They were booing the mentioning of it. The base knows that the topic is an embarrassment to the party, even if the candidates don’t.

  55. 55
    Deb T says:

    Teen age pregnancy has decreased substantially over the last few years. Maybe we should thank Bill Clinton?

  56. 56
    Mark S. says:

    @Paul in KY:

    Oh, so it is a religious freedom issue after all.

  57. 57
    virginia says:

    As someone who wishes for a second Obama term, I hope these knaves and jackasses continue with their cynical retro-idiocy 24/7. These boys got nothing, nothing, and they bloody well know it. Shameless and shameful. We’ve gone from the Tea Party to the Aspirin Assembly. They manage the double feat of all down to the bone demagogues — to be both unbelievable in their venality and mendacity and yet,somehow, wiltingly, to be completely predictable. Shitheads.

  58. 58
    Steve says:

    @J.D. Rhoades: I thought their favorite bait and switch was campaigning on divisive issues like gay marriage, and then pivoting once in office to cutting taxes for the rich and gutting the social safety net.

  59. 59
    chopper says:

    @Chyron HR:

    win. pure win.

    seriously, all these debates have been is a free source of ad copy for the president. this shit is why everybody talks about incumbents having the upper hand.

  60. 60
    JD Rhoades says:

    @Steve:

    That’s the primaries, when they’re cozied up with the true believers. In the general, watch them try and downplay the hell out of it.

  61. 61
    Culture of Truth says:

    all these debates have been is a free source of ad copy for the president. this shit is why everybody talks about incumbents having the upper hand

    Yes, but if they spent their hours and hours of free air time attacking the President and not each other, it might not seem that way.

  62. 62
    ericblair says:

    @chopper:

    seriously, all these debates have been is a free source of ad copy for the president.

    Which brings up the question of why these loons decided to schedule eleventy-zillion debates this season anyway. The only reason I can think of is that they decided in 2008 (against all evidence) that Obama was a shitty debater who could only read a Teleprompter, and therefore they’ll show him and have a hundred debates. So there. Would be nicely ironic if true.

  63. 63
    Paul in KY says:

    @Mark S.: Who are you? Frank Luntz ;-)

  64. 64
    dianne says:

    The tribe mentality won’t allow them to vote for anyone but Republicans even if it means Medicare going to a voucher system and Social Security being cut to bare bones. The social pressure put on them is so strong that they would lose family, friends, fellow chuch members if they were to ever come out as Dems. I guess they could sneak the occasional Dem vote in without anyone being aware but they would probably feel so guilty that they would be confessing in church the next day. Their political party is what they are before anything else no matter how dopey their candidates are.

  65. 65
    matryoshka says:

    I agree with comrade scott and others on this. If they are toast, how have we veered into conversations about availability of birth control?

    Here’s what the stated Republican/Christian Right agenda is as stated in many places (not ranked, just numbered as individual items):

    1. Get rid of all trade unions and regulation on business.
    2. Outlaw abortion.
    3. End availability of contraception.
    4. Strip civil rights (at very least) of gays & lesbians.
    5. Destroy public schools or make them adhere to Christian theology.
    6. End any separation between church and state and move toward theocracy.

    As you look around your own town or city, do you see evidence of any of these efforts? If so, they are not toast. One of the biggest problems we liberals have is that we are too passive in the face of these affronts. We believe good sense will prevail or that we’ll somehow have a constructive dialogue with these people at our own peril. I’m not at all hysterical as I say this, and I hope it doesn’t come across that way, but Christians and Democrats who don’t like the agenda above better come out swinging this year.

  66. 66
    Frank VanderShoot says:

    Frank VanderSloot is a fascist pig, churning money from his supplement-based swindle (Melaleuca) into anti-gay bigotry, mainly through supporting Mitt Romney.

  67. 67
  68. 68
    Rawk Chawk says:

    These guys are toast. Their party is toast. Their ideas are toast.

    Zandar, I know it pleases you to say these kinds of things, but never forget this is an American electorate that gave GWB enough votes TWICE to steal the presidency (with the hapless Dems going along of course).

    This is a profoundly stupid country. If Obama wins, he will be fighting for it right down to the line.

  69. 69
    dww44 says:

    @cathyx: Based on the prior 19 debates, methinks it was the former and not the latter.

  70. 70
    matryoshka says:

    @cathyx: Maybe they were booing sex.

    I would boo Republican sex, too.

  71. 71
    patrick II says:

    @PigInZen:
    I agree. In a previous debate the booed the moderator for asking Newt about “open marriage”. The republican crowd doesn’t like questions any more difficult than “what do you read”.

  72. 72
    virginia says:

    Like many, I’m pessimistic, or realistic, about the overall smarts of the overall electorate — and after 2000 and 2008 especially will never not be bracing myself each and every election night, but these dingdongs have made a fatal strategic error in thinking that all their racist, homophobic BS can continue to be successfully parlayed into the matter of birth control and reproductive rights. This outrages not only those of us who are women but I would imagine a fairly large number of men out there. Is it really smart in a country already struggling–finding it hard to go to the movies, go out to dinner, have the occasional vacation–save money for anything at all if one is lucky enough to even have a steady job — Is it really smart to double down on the stupidity and cluelessness and start wanting to fuck around with the population’s ability to screw in peace? This kind of insanity appeals to the Opus Dei crowd and the rest of the nutty fundamentalist crews but, really, seriously?, where do they think they are going with this? Straight off the cliff and into the arms of Cotton Mather.

  73. 73
    gex says:

    @atlliberal: That’s why they’ve tried in several places to redefine rape. They still hate teh ghey. And they hate women enjoying sex. They’ve found a solution: the “boys will be boys” rule of law and morality.

  74. 74
    wrb says:

    I want a choice position under the Amalgamated Faiths of the New American Counter Reformation so I’ve been studying for a Hippie Spotter, Second Class certificate. I was allowed to skip the third class test on account of having attended more than 100 Dead concerts.
    However I’m thinking Slut Improvement is a more promising field. I’m thinking of spanker as an entry position and then working my way in.

  75. 75
    magurakurin says:

    @Paul in KY: The fact that OBL IS rotting in Hell right now, pretty much is the reason why Obama will be president in January 2013 and not any of these poor excuses for rodeo clowns coming up to bat for the GOP

  76. 76
    gex says:

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: They’ve more or less convinced us they have the right to rape children. We can’t really hold them to account, and the public doesn’t seem to be demanding that. If we’ve granted them that, I don’t see why we wouldn’t let them boss us around in every other arena too.

  77. 77
    matryoshka says:

    @virginia: The economic difficulty we find ourselves in is the perfect setting for fascists. Hard times make easy answers look good, and prescribed “morality” is always only black and white. It’s safe to say that close to 45% of the country will find themselves voting R to “save the babies” so they can feel empowered in the face of their own powerlessness.

  78. 78
    Origuy says:

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    So if teenage girls shouldn’t have sex and have kids, what does the good Mr Santorum think about the virgin Mary?

    IOKIYYHWH

  79. 79
    Suffern ACE says:

    @matryoshka: You know, I know people don’t like to talk about these times, but it’s not 2008 any longer. Or 2009. If the country goes to the fascists over 8.0% unemployment and stagnant wages and rising gas prices, we would have gotten there sooner or later anyway. That would be a pretty good sign that all of our institutions are very weak if they can’t withstand six months of economic “oh my GOD!” collapse followed by a few years of economic stagnation.

  80. 80
    opie_jeanne says:

    Did one of them actually say this?

    “To see the evils of contraception, one need look no further than the tragedy of unwed teen pregnancy”

    And if so, which one? I didn’t have access to the debate last night, and I haven’t been able to find this on any of the excerpts.

  81. 81
    Suffern ACE says:

    @opie_jeanne: Santorum. Asked about contraception (which I believe he said in one of the debates that states should be allowed to ban), he just changed the topic to teenaged pregnancy to explain why he was opposed to relatively unrestricted access to it.

  82. 82
    wrb says:

    @Suffern ACE:

    That would be a pretty good sign that all of our institutions are very weak if they can’t withstand six months of economic “oh my GOD!” collapse followed by a few years of economic stagnation.

    It varies regionally. Here it continues to get worse. Fascism doesn’t seem that unlikely.

  83. 83

    @cathyx: They were booing because they perceived it as a “gotcha” question. The eeeevil librul media is trying to trap us on birth control! You have to understand that the GOP media machine is openly denying that the Party is in any way responsible for this sudden attention on contraception. It’s simply the latest eeevil librul conspiramacy! They’re making it up! And why didn’t you ask the Democrats in 2008 about birth control, Mr Librul Media Moderator?

    It’s a combination of fear & loathing, deep paranoia, self-righteousness, and persecution complex. The rubes in the crowd have been trained to respond on cue, just like baby seals. Orwell wrote a few words on this subject.

    And while it’s fun to crack jokes at the 27% crowd, this is the 27% that actually bothers to show up. When 50% of the voters can’t be bothered to even pay attention, that base is large enough to swing elections. Remember that Simpson’s episode when Bart ran for class president? Yeah, kinda like that. One for Martin, Two for Martin.

  84. 84
    opie_jeanne says:

    @Mark S.: And what was Mitt talking about, regarding the supremes voting against him 9-0, for trying to determine something something about who is the leader of a religious institution?

    What the …..?

  85. 85
    opie_jeanne says:

    @Suffern ACE: Thank you. I assumed that was the answer, but I wouldn’t have put it past Newt or Ron.

  86. 86
    IrishGirl says:

    @cathyx: Well from an AZ perspective it was both. They didn’t want the candidates to talk about birth control because they are against it and that isn’t going to fly well with swing voters and they know it.

    What everybody seems to be forgetting is that Mesa, AZ is brimming over with Mormons. And they are simply rabid for Romney and they’re very sophisticated politically. So while they don’t support Santorum (which was apparent the way they booed many of his answers even though they might agree with him philosophically) because they wanted their man Mitt to win the debate.

    In AZ there are four types of GOP voters: 1) old “get off my lawn” man/woman 2) militia gun nut types 3) college age libertarians and 4) Mormons regardless of age. The old ones are used to voting GOP BUT they are terrified that they’re going to lose entitlements so they will vote for the more moderate Republican, which seems to be Mitt. 2 and 3 will ALWAYS vote for Ron Paul, I call these types “Paulettes” (TM). And # 4 will always vote for the Mormon and if there isn’t one, they would then vote for the most fiscally and socially conservative candidate. So they would go for Santorum if Mitt wasn’t in it. None of the other candidates ever had a chance in this debate because of the voter breakdown…it’s that simple.

  87. 87
    opie_jeanne says:

    @opie_jeanne: I meant that to say, voted against Obama 9-0.

  88. 88
    cmorenc says:

    @IrishGirl:

    In AZ there are four types of GOP voters: 1) old “get off my lawn” man/woman 2) militia gun nut types 3) college age libertarians and 4) Mormons regardless of age….None of the other candidates (than Mitt or RonP) ever had a chance in this debate because of the voter breakdown…it’s that simple.

    I’m surprised there aren’t enough of a fifth type of GOP voter who would naturally be inclined toward Newt Gingrich: complete assholes.

  89. 89
    Paul in KY says:

    @magurakurin: That is great! Wish he’d been rotting in Hell about 10 years ago, but Boy Blunder was scared that we might actually capture him & have him spill the beans on how entangled the Bushes were with the House of Saud (IMO).

    Plus, they probably wanted him as a macguffin to scare the rubes with.

  90. 90
    Chris T. says:

    @patrick II: “what do you read” is still way too difficult. The Republican crowd wants questions like: “Obama: is he a terrorist, or a baby-killer?” and “America is great, so how will you make it greater?”

  91. 91
    Ajay says:

    These guys are toast. Their party is toast. Their ideas are toast.

    I think you are wrong. You are talking about conservatives/retards here. This is red meat for them. They want to control everything about everybody. It also excites the loony base. If these guys and an average American were capable of learning, we wouldnt have had 2010 wave and have the same guys in congress who gave us the mess earlier.

  92. 92

    @Redshift:

    Can we just all agree that when we say they’re lunatics who are alienating everyone but the 27 percenters, it means we’re going to win if we all work hard and get the job done, not “it’s in the bag, everybody go home”? We do all know that, right?

    This cannot be repeated enough.

  93. 93
    Yutsano says:

    @Chris T.: Debate in the style of Pakled. I’m ready for my ticket off this rock now.

  94. 94
    Keith G says:

    Zandar, I am afraid that these guys will be toast (discredited and gone) only if only if our side continually and aggressively reminds everyone what these men and their supporters have said and done. Our side (from the top down) do not do this, so well consistently let the other side up off the mat.

  95. 95
    Brachiator says:

    These guys are toast. Their party is toast. Their ideas are toast. The fact they spent a good 10+ minutes mansplaining how the spawn of Lilith should really just epoxy their legs shut in a debate where the word “jobs” was completely absent showed just how out of touch these fools really are.

    And yet, the Republicans keep doubling down on this, the core of their supporters applaud them, and even Republican women seem ruffled, but still largely supportive of these efforts to crush women’s reproductive rights.

    It’s also illuminating to see conservative commentators jumping on the anti birth control band wagon.

    Brent Bozell, political activist and founder and president of the right-leaning Media Research Center, intends to alter the employee insurance plan at MRC so it will no longer offer “contraceptive, sterilization and abortifacient services,” according to a staff-wide email Bozell sent, obtained by The Jane Dough.
    __
    In the wake of President Barack Obama’s recent healthcare mandate proposal, Bozell sent a memo to staffers stating that he was “horrified” to learn that his organization’s insurance policy, which is BlueCross, covers abortion services

    Although Bozell claims that he is not going to jump into anyone’s personal business, he still expects them to do the right thing and not use the contraceptive methods that he thinks are sinful.

  96. 96
    Skippy-san says:

    @Rafer Janders: Because I think there are more idiots out there than you realize. And less sensible people than we think there are.

  97. 97
    Skippy the Wondermule says:

    Yes, this is paranoid but the world has gone nuts, folks

    We are forgetting how powerful are the financial forces lined up against Obama. If a candidate cannot defeat him, a bullet will.

    Or, all it really takes is one redneck, a bottle of whiskey and Fox News.

  98. 98
    chopper says:

    @Chris T.:

    “looks like we got ourselves a reader!”

  99. 99
    Rafer Janders says:

    @Skippy-san:

    Oh no. I think there are very, very many idiots out there. But no more or less now than there are every year.

  100. 100
    slightly-peeved says:

    The greatest trick the GOP ever pulled was to convince people it was a smart thing to not vote.

    People sometimes say that the problem with compulsory voting is that you get people who have no idea voting. I’d point to the US as an example of a country where people who have no idea are more motivated to vote than the people who have a clue.

    The GOP won’t just go away. You need to get out the vote and drive them away. And what they are giving you in these debates are a set of reasons why no woman, or anyone who knows a woman, or anyone born of a woman (so not Mitt, then) should get out and vote this November.

  101. 101
    Jesse says:

    @virginia: I’m of two minds about this. I think that indeed many people are turned off (if not repulsed) by the strident rejection of contraception issues that they had though to be a long settled issue.

    On the other hand, I think that there are a lot of people who will gladly look the other way, or even spout the same extremist crap themselves—no matter what they themselves may think—for the simple reason (mentioned in this thread and many other threads) that this is the flag that the ‘home team’ is waving.

    The second alternative is sad, I know. But, honestly, looking at the crap that keeps coming up in these debates, and the audience reactions to it, I’m inclined to favor it.

  102. 102
    Palli says:

    @Democratic Nihilist, Keeper Of Party Purity:
    I’m not sure either but without the Wellstones, the Dems will only be better than the republicans.
    One thing for sure, we have to talk politics on a basic, personal, level with everyone-everywhere. We have to use names when we talk about birth control, names when we talk about wealth irresponsibility.
    We have to compare the actions of elected officials to commonplace activities where conduct like theirs would not be tolerated. The recall of Walker and cohorts in Wisconsin is a good model: the people there are making politics personal.

  103. 103
    Palli says:

    @Paul in KY: Election Fraud by Sec of State Kenneth Blackwell. planes fall from the sky

  104. 104
    Palli says:

    @Rawk Chawk: Once again the 2004 election was won through fraud, not accurate vote counting. Until we face the fragility of our election process, un-indicted political republicans can win or lose how ever they want. The American vote is not sacred it is fodder for the machinations of the unethical among us.

  105. 105
    fuckwit says:

    @jibeaux: Right. It’s 1-dimensional chess.

    When you are fighting against assholes, all you need to do is provide them plenty of opportunity to do what they do best: be assholes.

    It’s very clever, but it’s not at all complicated.

    This is not Obama’s idea, nor is it new. It was invented by Mohandas Ghandi and popularized in the USA by one Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King.

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