The Year of Lying Decadently

I’m afraid Krugman is right:

Back in 2000, George W. Bush made a discovery of enormous consequence: you could base a whole political campaign on claims that were flatly untrue, like the claim that your big tax cuts for the wealthy went to the middle class, or the claim that diverting Social Security funds into private accounts would strengthen the system’s finances, and reporting would never point this out. That’s when I formulated my doctrine that if Bush said the earth was flat, headlines would read Views Differ on Shape of Planet.

All indications are, however, that Campaign 2012 will make Campaign 2000 look like a model of truthfulness. And all indications are that the press won’t know what to do — or, worse, that they will know what to do, which is act as stenographers and refuse to tell readers and listeners when candidates lie. Because to do otherwise when the parties aren’t equally at fault — and they won’t be — would be “biased”.

This will be true even of those news organizations specifically charged with fact-checking. Yes, they’ll call out some lies — but they’ll also claim that some perfectly reasonable statements are lies, in order to keep their precious balance. This is already happening: as Igor Volsky points out, one of the finalists for Politifact’s Lie of the Year is a Democratic claim — that Republicans want to abolish Medicare — that happens to be entirely true.

The Politifact stuff really is amazing, especially for a group that normally does good work. Here’s what is happening:

America turns off the lights, goes to bed, leaving their Mercedes in the driveway. While we sleep, the Republicans sneak into the car, drive it off, and sell it, but they keep the Mercedes hood ornament. They then split the proceeds between their rich buddies, and go out and find a Ford Pinto up on cinderblocks in a field, with the grass growing through the floorboard. They place that in the driveway, cleverly glue the Mercedes ornament onto the front of the Pinto, and sneak off into the night. The next morning, America and Democrats are screaming- “What the hell happened to my car.” Republicans say- “What are you talking about, there is your Mercedes right there, we just modernized it and fixed it up a bit for long-term financial stability,” and point at the Pinto.

Then, the rocket scientists at Politifact drive by to take a non-partisan look at things, see the Mercedes symbol on the front of the car, and tell us all we’re lying about the Republicans stealing our Mercedes.

It’s crazy, really.

184 replies
  1. 1
    schrodinger's cat says:

    3 Questions:
    Why is the press/MSM/The Village so bad?
    Was it always so bad
    What can we do about it

  2. 2
    Special Patrol Group says:

    I’m afraid Krugman is right

    Yeah, well, that’s his move.

  3. 3
    BGinCHI says:

    You skipped a part:

    They then split the proceeds between their rich buddies, including the media, who wouldn’t risk having to send their kids to public school so they’ll do anything they have to in order to protect the status quo.

    Otherwise spot the fuck on.

  4. 4
    MattF says:

    But… it’s still going to be called “Medicare.”

  5. 5
    Corner Stone says:

    Why does anyone cite Politifact?

  6. 6
    BGinCHI says:

    @MattF: Now that I think about it, I’m surprised HowdyDoody Ryan didn’t call it “MercedesCare.”

  7. 7
    c u n d gulag says:

    They’d give Jerry Sandusky cover by stuffing toilet paper into a bra and put it on his 10 year-old boy rapee, and say that the girl led him on, and she deserved it.

    And I bet Sandusky looks at Newt Gingrich and wishes he’d become a Republican politician instead of an assistant football coach, because all he’d need to do to make this all go away is say that he talked to Jesus, and that he forgave him.

  8. 8
    Smiling Mortician says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:
    1. They – or at least their owners – are one-percenters.
    2. No.
    3. Sweet fuck-all, I’m afraid. They can’t be shamed, as far as I can tell.

  9. 9
    William Hurley says:

    It is vitally important to remember that, at this date, we’re only at the “waiting for the starting gun” part of the beginning of the beginning.

    Barry may well raise his $1 billion – but it will not be nearly enough.

    The big difference to look for between the respective candidates of the 2 major parties will be the amount of time spent fund-raising as well as the sums. I suspect that the GOP’s nominee will have to raise a goodly sum to convince the Villagers of his authenticity. However, as we’ve been witnessing in the GOP primaries, the cost to the GOP in cash terms has been low. Putting these two items together leads to the suspicion that fund raising itself will become a rhetorical weapon because the GOP’s candidate will rely, to a far greater extent than Obama, on outside groups in SuperPAC or other form to finance all manner of lie, distortion and fabrication – all while ensuring the “candidate” remains “unsoiled” by the dirty “talk” and the dirty “Wall St money”.

  10. 10
    Egg Berry says:

    Then, the rocket scientists at drive by to take a non-partisan look at things

    seems to need more words.

  11. 11
    Benjamin Franklin says:

    Back in 2000, George W. Bush made a discovery of enormous consequence: you could base a whole political campaign on …….flatlined Dems who swallowed the Shrub’s carp whole (in the name of bi-partisanship)”


  12. 12
    William Hurley says:

    @Special Patrol Group:

    Indeed, he endeavors to be accurate and truthful – verifiably so.

    If the truth is happy or scary then the truth is happy or scary.

  13. 13
    BGinCHI says:

    @Egg Berry: I think I got it:

    Then, the rocket scientists at and drive by truckers to take a non-partisan look at things and then go and get hammered at The Georgia Bar. Raven drives them all home.

  14. 14
    Calming Influence says:

    * You can’t find a job because of the millions of brown people streaming across our southern border every day.
    * Really really rich people create jobs.
    * All poor people are black, and they live in luxury on welfare and foodstamps.
    * “Foodstamps” are now credit cards that you can use to buy jewelry at Tiffany’s, or crack.
    * Voter fraud is a huge problem.
    * Barney Frank caused the housing bubble, and Obama caused the recession.
    * Newt Gingrich is an intellectual “ideas” guy.

    The entire Republican Platform is made from urban legends.

  15. 15
    General Stuck says:

    It’s crazy, really.

    Yes it is, and been getting crazier each new day. But if I didn’t believe there was a failsafe point to where even the dimmest lazy voter would start to get it, I wouldn’t bother to write my thoughts on a blog.

    The internet is new, and folks are just now starting to understand its potential power for social and political change. We have already seen it harnessed in other parts of the world in more desperate straights than are we, yet.

    I think that will eventially trump and to a large degree supplant the fantasist press as they drift further into a hyper competitive lala land. Next to politicians, and the government, the press occupies the basement of public opinion already. That didn’t used to be the case for any of those things. It is a sign that folks aren’t completely apathetic morons out there in the countryside. Except the 27 percenters, of course, that are often louder than their numbers.

  16. 16
    smintheus says:

    Republicans could just toss an old tractor tire in the driveway with masking tape slapped on in the shape of an ‘M’ and Politifact would pretend that it’s a Mercedes.

  17. 17
    Calming Influence says:

    Remind me to never use asterisks for bullet points. FYWP.

  18. 18
    kdaug says:

    Minor quibble:

    This will not be a fun year.

    To some, there is a perverse pleasure in seeing how deep the anvil sinks.

    For those anticipating a Mayan Calendar/Armageddon/Collapse of America, they believe they’re sitting at the pond’s edge.

    They don’t see the rising of the water. And they don’t know they’re tied to the anvil.

  19. 19
    jl says:

    Nice try, Cole, but you can’t fool me.

    The discerning eye can spot the glibertarian GOP mole in every Cole post, ever single one.

    Note that in Cole’s allegory, the Pinto can’t blow up and burn down the house.

    Do you see how Cole sugarcoats the truth? Shame shame shame.

    Release the Tunch!

    BTW, Tunch or Rosie pics might make up for this latest outrage from Cole.

  20. 20
    Calming Influence says:

    The 31 percenters piss loudly on the 27 percenters.

  21. 21
    BGinCHI says:

    @Calming Influence: I thought it looked really professional.

  22. 22
    RSA says:

    Politifacts writes,

    Democrats, including Obama, have said the plan would end Medicare “as we know it,” a critical qualifier. But the 30-second ad from the DCCC makes a sweeping claim without that important qualifier.

    This is weaseling to an amazing degree. I’m reminded of a bit from Firesign Theater:

    Hugh: You and the viewers will be interested in noting that the world ended!
    Patty: As we know it, Hugh.
    Hugh: Darn tootin’.

  23. 23
    cathyx says:

    Well, at least the Steelers won today, and that’s what is really important.

  24. 24
    Benjamin Franklin says:

    Bush; January 20, 2001

    ” As I begin, I thank President Clinton for his service to our nation.
    And I thank Vice President Gore for a contest conducted with spirit and ended with grace.”

    He forgot to thank Joe Lieberman.

  25. 25
    Calming Influence says:

    @BGinCHI: Remind me from here on out to always use asterisks for bullet points. IHEARTWP

  26. 26
    MattF says:

    @cathyx: …and the Redskins gave up three touchdowns in three minutes. And, needless to say, lost.

  27. 27
    Corner Stone says:

    Hmmm, the year 2000 and 2004…

  28. 28
    forked tongue says:

    If anyone cares, you can go to Politifact and vote in their poll for Lie of the Year. I voted for “Other” and wrote in “‘Democrats’ charge that Republicans voted to end Medicare is a lie’–Politifact”

  29. 29
    andrewsomething says:

    The next morning, America and Democrats are screaming- “What the hell happened to my car.” Republicans say- “What are you talking about, there is your Mercedes right there, we just modernized it and fixed it up a bit for long-term financial stability,” and point at the Pinto.

    You missed one thing. They’d also point out that Democrats screaming about the Pinto is evidence that Democrats are against everything that the Mercedes represented.

  30. 30
    Raven says:

    @BGinCHI: “down the Atlanta highwaaaaaay, lookin for that love getaway”

  31. 31
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Calming Influence:

    The entire Republican Platform is made from urban legends.

    Let us hope Snopes is a Democrat.

  32. 32
    Yutsano says:

    @MattF: The G men are doing not too terribly against the Pack. Fascinating Captain.

  33. 33
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Calming Influence:



  34. 34
    Zach says:

    “especially for a group that normally does good work”

    Politifact’s been making these errors since day zero. They’re usually not quite so bad with respect to calling facts truth and vice versa, but the degree of severity they attach to lies or half-truths coming from the right or the left is invariably skewed. Misstatements without any ill intent are pants-on-fire if they come from a Democrat. For comparison, I’ll Google two random, pervasive, poisonous lies on the right and see what Politifact has to say:
    1. “51 percent of federal tax filers paid zero federal income tax.” TRUE. The article doesn’t even mention the payroll tax.
    2. Margaret Sanger orchestrated black genocide. PANTS ON FIRE. Well, that’s good, but it isn’t necessary to invent some false equivalence with this: “Sanger failed to rise above the ethnic and racial paternalism of her time.” She had a complicated history, but this isn’t a good summary of it. Most would probably agree that advocating birth control over forced sterilization and trusting that women would make the best decisions for themselves and their families did quite a lot in that respect.

  35. 35
    General Stuck says:

    Nice thread title

  36. 36
    andrewsomething says:

    Wow, I just clicked through to the whole list of PolitiFact finalists. It really is kind of unbelievable.

    Nit-picking the use of the word “unprecedented” by Obama in one press conference vs. Romney’s repeated bs about Obama “apologizing for America.”

    Congressional Republicans have introduced dozens of bills on social issues and other topics, but “zero on job creation.” — Facebook posts

    Ya, Facebook posts is a nominee. After nit-picking the source, they finish up with “Republicans argue that tax cuts and budget cutting will help the economy prosper.”

  37. 37
    eemom says:

    @William Hurley:

    hey, asshole, stop calling the President “Barry.”

    It reminds people of Maureen Dowd…..which in return reminds people that as bad as Maureen Dowd sucks, she’s capable of sucking on substance without mangling the English language into a tortured mess of pretentious incoherence along the way, which is more than one can say for you.

  38. 38
    RossInDetroit says:

    You think it’s bad now? Well it is but I predict with confidence that it’s just going to get worse.
    Are voters going to get any smarter? The MSM any harder working or more honest? They won’t, and our political system will suffer further.
    Stuck notes that the Interwebs are a medium for spreading fact and truth and they might save us. They also spread lies equally well and could be our downfall.

  39. 39
    The Snarxist Formerly Known As Kryptik says:

    This is only tangentally related (if only because it still relates to the strange alternate universe we live in called America).

    Salon had an article about the supposed elitism of bike riders in the US and how the perception of them was as not only super smug but somehow inherently more dangerous (like the NYPost just this Sept. calling them “Weaponized Toys”). And one comment on the story stood out, along the lines of “Only in America could bike riding be turned into the height of elitism”. Not an exact quote, but the general thought stuck with me.

  40. 40
    Benjamin Franklin says:

    LIES are the topic, right? Elliot Spitzer on the $7 Trillion fraud. (world’s longest url)

    “Imagine you walked into a bank, applied for a personal line of credit, and filled out all the paperwork claiming to have no debts and an income of $200,000 per year. The bank, based on these representations, extended you the line of credit. Then, three years later, after fighting disclosure all the way, you were forced by a court to tell the truth: At the time you made the statements to the bank, you actually were unemployed, you had a $1 million mortgage on your house on which you had failed to make payments for six months, and you hadn’t paid even the minimum on your credit-card bills for three months. Do you think the bank would just say: Never mind, don’t worry about it? Of course not. Whether or not you had paid back the personal line of credit, three FBI agents would be at your door within hours.

  41. 41
    FlipYrWhig says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    Was it always so bad

    Nope. It got bad because media outlets decided it was important to make a buttload of profit, and alienating conservatives would lose customers and advertisers. As the base of customers and advertisers has continued to deteriorate, media outlets are even more loath to offend anyone, so they pursue (1) cheap nonsense like Missing White Women and What’s Trending On Twitter, (2) both-sides-do-it-ism that avoids calling out Republican bullshit as bullshit, so that Republicans can’t complain about bias.

    I realize this is nothing new, just the Eric Alterman “working the refs” theory plus the standard news-as-profitable twist. Put them together and it explains everything despicable about the contemporary news media.

    On the positive side, once the legacy audience of The News (old white people with money who believe what they watch on TV) dies off, the whole thing is going to fall apart, potentially making way for something better in its place. It can’t happen soon enough.

  42. 42
    Raven says:

    @The Snarxist Formerly Known As Kryptik: What kinda bikes you talkin bout Willis?

  43. 43
    BGinCHI says:

    @The Snarxist Formerly Known As Kryptik: I’m a pretty serious cyclist, and this reminds me of when some fat asshole on the road yells at 10 or 12 of us when we’re riding comfortably along. Often this person comes to a stop light and we catch them and they NEVER roll down their window or look over.

    The upshot of this is also that a couple guys on road bikes could seriously kick the shit out of some loudmouth or three but don’t. You can call it “elitism” but I call it restraint.

  44. 44
    Raven says:

    @BGinCHI: Oh, that kind of bike.

  45. 45
    khead says:

    Some people say that’s not really a Pinto in your driveway.

  46. 46
    Raven says:

    @BGinCHI: This site has great pics from The Bike Riders, mostly shots of motorcycles in the Chicago area in the mid-60’s (when I got my first bike). The author makes the point that people that rode motorcycles were not called “bikers” until it started in LA in the 70′.

  47. 47
    BGinCHI says:

    @Raven: I was talking bicycles, of course, but I did grow up in a rural midwestern motorcycle culture. Those pics are great.

    I think one of them is a 60s Hodaka Wombat. I had one as a kid around 1980. Not sure what year it was….big ass chrome gas tank.

  48. 48
    Rosali says:

    “Premium support” is not a voucher.
    The republicans have introduced job-creating bills but the Democrats won’t vote for them.
    Republicans are in favor of up or down votes in Congress.

  49. 49
    JCT says:

    @khead: Or hey, wait a minute. Did YOU buy that bike with FOOD STAMPS?

  50. 50
    The Snarxist Formerly Known As Kryptik says:


    I will attest that there are plenty of biker assholes around, and I’ve been nearly clipped by more than a couple, but I am more piss scared of cars still than I will ever be of bikers even going the wrong way up a bike lane or whatnot. I have a kick scooter myself (due to higher convenience and lower maintenance costs), and while I’ve worried about bikers both on foot and on my scooter, I’m still much more piss scared about a taxi or a UPS truck veering into the bike lane on me for a drop off, or the buses churning along closer to me.

    Yes, there are plenty elitist and/or dangerous idiots on bikes. But show me one of those, and I can show you 10 fuckers in an SUV hugging the lines and sneering at plebe pedestrians passing in front of him while he waits on a light he couldn’t speed past.

    Again, it’s amazing how bikes can be singled out as singularly elitist and dangerous and the height of waste.

  51. 51
    Raven says:

    @BGinCHI: Yea, I remember them. I got a Honda 150 Dream in the summer of 66 right before I went in the Army. (that’s not the bike but it was the same color and everything). My old man, always the realist, said “you’ll probably only kill yourself and one other person with that”!

  52. 52
    RossInDetroit says:

    I started riding in ’80 on a ’73 Honda CL350. Many motorcycles later I have a Guzzi in the garage that I’m too afraid of traffic to take out.

    One of my childhood bicycle riding friends was killed years later by a car while biking home from work to his wife & 2 kids. The driver was a RN, drunk at 8:00 pm behind the wheel. Hit and run, but they caught her.

    Roads scare me. I take that shit very seriously.

  53. 53
    BGinCHI says:

    @Rosali: Are you just typing that off the Fox web site?

  54. 54
    The Snarxist Formerly Known As Kryptik says:


    Which is why they’ve locked down the Senate with record numbers of filibusters, right? Damn those Democrats hating up-or-down votes enough to let cloture slip by like that, the cretins.

  55. 55
  56. 56
    Rosali says:

    More lies
    Eliminating the inheritance “death” tax will help save small mom and pop businesses.

  57. 57
    BGinCHI says:

    @RossInDetroit: You want to sell it?

  58. 58
    The Snarxist Formerly Known As Kryptik says:


    There are reasons why I am thankful to live in an area where car ownership really is an optional thing.

  59. 59
    Mike in NC says:

    Campaign 2012 will make Campaign 2000 look like a model of truthfulness.

    Many readers of Sunday newspapers were presented today with the always cringeworthy “Parade” magazine offering a cover story on Willard & Ann Romney, AKA Real Americans, wherein Mitt sits down and lies extravagantly to Village stenographer and all-around weasel David Gergen about every topic under the sun, including some amazing bullshit about how it was his wife who convinced him to run for president.

    Expect to see much more of this swill served up by the MSM in the coming months.

  60. 60
    AA+ Bonds says:

    You know any day now I’m waiting for a coalition of American bishops to announce they’re refusing Newt Gingrich the Eucharist for going directly against Church doctrine on child labor, just like they interfered illegally with the 2004 Presidential election


  61. 61
    burnspbesq says:


    Is that all you have? Take that week stuff on down the road.

  62. 62
    BGinCHI says:

    @Rosali: Come on, Doug, this is more transparent than yesterday.

  63. 63
    Raven says:

    @RossInDetroit: Fuckin A. My last bike was that Honda 450 Guzzi knockoff with the semi-horizontal head and a shaft drive. I rode it all summer and the day the UGA students came back I sold it. I did rent a Harley Softail in Wisconsin last summer and drove the hell out of it for a day.

  64. 64
    AA+ Bonds says:

    @forked tongue:

    If anyone cares, you can go to Politifact and vote in their poll for Lie of the Year. I voted for “Other” and wrote in “’Democrats’ charge that Republicans voted to end Medicare is a lie’—Politifact”

    Everyone on this thread will immediately do this if they give a shit about anything. If they don’t, they prefer Republicans in 2012.

  65. 65
    burnspbesq says:

    @AA+ Bonds:

    Silly and fact-free. Care to go for the trifecta?

    ETA: Congratulations! Sanctimonious gives you the trifecta.

  66. 66
    RossInDetroit says:


    You want to sell it?

    No, but my wife does. ’76 V1000 Convert ‘automatic’. The weird one the CHP used. Great town bike. I once rode a whole summer with my leg in a cast. People do NOT want to see a motorcycle in a handicapper spot, tag or not.

  67. 67
    scav says:

    Poor old trolls — harder and harder to out-crazy the actual candidates anymore.

  68. 68
    Rosali says:

    This is a post about LIES, isn’t it?

  69. 69
    RossInDetroit says:


    CX500, right? Water cooled V-Twin with shaft drive. The Silver Wing version of tha twas a pretty choice solo tourer.
    I had an ’84 Nighthawk S.

  70. 70
    AA+ Bonds says:


    I’m assuming you’re mistakenly replying to another comment, I mean, you might have turned pro-Gingrich but I doubt it

  71. 71
    Raven says:

    @RossInDetroit: Nice lookin sled according to the google. Is your red?

  72. 72
    BGinCHI says:

    @RossInDetroit: A boy can try.

    We’re about to have a baby, so I should probably stand pat with the dangerous habits I already have….

  73. 73
    BGinCHI says:

    @Rosali: And it drew a GOP troll like young buck to a t-bone.

  74. 74
    Raven says:

    @RossInDetroit: Yea, I guess it was a 500. I sold it to a buddy who had never ridden before. He drove it from Georgia all through Mexico touring Mexican baseball stadiums!

  75. 75
    AA+ Bonds says:

    Once again, go to and vote for “Other” and enter the text

    ’Democrats’ charge that Republicans voted to end Medicare is a lie’—Politifact”

    as per forked tongue‘s suggestion

  76. 76
    RossInDetroit says:


    Mine is ‘silver’ (grey). The paintwork is nice but don’t trust Italian chrome from the ’70s. Borranni wheels, though. Brakes take Popeye forearms, but there’s a ‘linked’ brake pedal that operates the back and one front disk. It’s a weird rig all around.
    The ‘auto trans is just the thing for traffic.

  77. 77
    BGinCHI says:

    @RossInDetroit: The S had a great whispery shaft drive. I drove my buddy’s for a summer and it was sweet. But not nearly as fast as my ’84 Ninja 900. I should never have sold that bike.

  78. 78
    Litlebritdifrnt says:

    @The Snarxist Formerly Known As Kryptik: I was watching an episode of Top Gear today where Stephen Fry was the “Star in a reasonably priced car” he said he used to ride a motorcycle until he was in an Emergency Room in the UK one day and heard motorcycle riders refered to as “organ donors”. One doctor was discussing a lady in the operating room being prepped for cataract surgery. He described the procedure and said they would remove the old cataracts and then replace them with nice new lenses from a donor. “Unfortunately” he said “we don’t have any new lenses right now but its raining today so it won’t be long”.

  79. 79
    Raven says:

    @BGinCHI: My Yamaha RD 350 could burn!

  80. 80
    Rosali says:

    @BGinCHI: Who’s the troll?

  81. 81
    RossInDetroit says:

    Here’s my bike, basically. I added a Plexifairing removable windshield so I could smoke while riding.

  82. 82
    Raven says:

    @RossInDetroit: Sounds sweet!

  83. 83
    Raven says:

    @Litlebritdifrnt: That’s why I never wore a helmet when I didn’t have to. After breaking my back and spending a year in a full body cast I didn’t want my body dead and my head alive.

  84. 84
    RossInDetroit says:


    I should never have sold that bike.

    I have 2 in that category: ’75 Triumph Bonneville 5-speed and the ’85 CB700SC Nighthawk S.

  85. 85
    Svensker says:


    Really? That is an interesting assertion. Do you have anything to back it up?

  86. 86
    Raven says:

    @RossInDetroit: I was right!

  87. 87
    BGinCHI says:

    @Raven: I had one of those!

    2 stroke screamer.

    (The motor, not me.)

  88. 88
    chopper says:


    rode an old lambretta from VA to santa monica as part of a long road race. was fun until my friend on his 60’s model got hit by a semi. another broad in the race got run off the road into a guard rail.

    riding is fun in theory but i always have white knuckles when i’m done.

  89. 89
    Raven says:

    @Rosali: Go the fuck away.

  90. 90
    BGinCHI says:

    @Rosali: Who?

    Meet me at camera 3.

  91. 91
    Raven says:

    @BGinCHI: Truly was.

  92. 92
    khead says:

    “Premium support” is not a voucher.
    The republicans have introduced job-creating bills but the Democrats won’t vote for them.
    Republicans are in favor of up or down votes in Congress.

    Views differ on Medicare, job bills and Congress.

  93. 93
    RossInDetroit says:

    If I had to pick one weird bike to own it would be one of the 3-cyl 2-stroke Suzuki Water Buffalo tourers. Just so odd and strange.
    And a CBX. And a Hesketh. That’s three. Oh, and a Rokon Ranger 2-wheel-drive.

  94. 94
    BGinCHI says:

    @RossInDetroit: What’s the curb weight on that? 4000 lbs?

  95. 95
    BGinCHI says:

    @Raven: Light too. No idea why they even made that bike.

    True story: traded a ’76 Trans Am for it.

    Wow, was I a fucking hick. My students would never believe any of this.

  96. 96
    khead says:

    F’in Packers just turned this day into a complete beatdown for me.

    On a day like today, I wish views could differ when it comes to the scoreboard.

  97. 97
  98. 98
    Rosali says:

    People who don’t understand that I’m presenting GOP lies are stupid. Do I need to put fancy lines or asterisk bullet points on the LIES in order for you to understand?

  99. 99
    andrewsomething says:

    Am I missing something? It seems to me that Rosali is saying that these GOP talking points are lies not repeating them.

  100. 100
    RossInDetroit says:


    What’s the curb weight on that? 4000 lbs?

    Dry weight as shown is around 500 lbs or a bit less. Guzzis are not heavyweights.

  101. 101
  102. 102
    Raven says:

    Amazing win by the Pack.

  103. 103
    khead says:


    In my defense, I missed #56…. maybe need to check the snark/troll meter too.

  104. 104
    Jenny says:

    ’Democrats’ charge that Republicans voted to end Medicare is a lie’—Politifact”

    My God. Even Newt Gingrich, himself, said the Ryan plan was “radical right wing social engineering”.

  105. 105
    RossInDetroit says:

    I my wife wins the Lotto I’ll put up a pole barn and mess around restoring old bikes. I’ve always wanted to see what the insides of a Velocette Thruxton Venom looked like.
    The outside is pretty nifty.

  106. 106
    The Fat Kate Middleton says:

    @Rosali: Well, that’s the way I understood it, but I’m one of the slower learners around here. After the response to your comments, thought I must be seriously missing something. And … may be still (shrugs).

  107. 107
    Suffern ACE says:

    @Raven: It would be a big lie to say that I never doubted the outcome, but then both sides do it.

  108. 108
    Shalimar says:

    @BGinCHI: You misread her. She was saying those republican claims were outright lies.

  109. 109
    MikeJ says:


    Let us hope Snopes is a Democrat.

    You mean your brain dead relatives haven’t told you yet that Snopes is funded by George Soros? The mentally ill people I know have talked about nothing else for months.

  110. 110
    SuzieC says:

    @AA+ Bonds: Did just that.

  111. 111
    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q) says:

    @Rosali: That’s what I thought, honestly. But the people who read it otherwise are smart folks whose opinions I value, so I was confused.

  112. 112
    boss bitch says:

    Politifact has a reader’s choice poll for the biggest lie of the year and also a comment box where you can tell them what you think of their tactics.

  113. 113
    henqiguai says:

    @AA+ Bonds (#70):

    I’m assuming you’re mistakenly replying to another comment, I mean, you might have turned pro-Gingrich but I doubt it

    No. I seem to recall some fairly intense, um, debates wherein burnspbesq took a very, very strong defensive position with regards to the Catholic Church. I suspect that is the trigger. That’s generally when I scroll on by, because the rest of the time, even when he’s being just routinely scathing, his comments are often a good read.

  114. 114
    FlipYrWhig says:

    I think I saw a version of the original Rosali post without that last line, “lies.” That would explain some of the confusion.

  115. 115
    Suffern ACE says:

    @MikeJ: I hear the the Republicans are planning to replace foodstamps with direct assistance comprised of New York alligator meat and sasquatch steaks.

  116. 116
    Alex says:

    Supposing that sheep’s tail was a leg, how many legs would it have?

    Abraham Lincoln says four, Politfact says five.

    Opinions differ.

  117. 117
    FlipYrWhig says:

    @Suffern ACE: Also those dogs from Mexico that turn out to be giant rats. Cafe Urban Legend has an extensive menu. The chef has a hook for a hand, but don’t let that bother you. Discount on all orders that come from INSIDE THE HOUSE!

  118. 118

    Along these lines, NewsCorp has launched a gay wedding magazine in New York.

    Hope no one tells the AFA or Maggie Gallagher!

  119. 119
    bin Lurkin' says:

    @Raven: I had a 75 RD350 and a 72 R5 which was an RD without the disk front and reed valves. With chambers, some porting, two car coils for the ignition, Koni shocks and Dunlop TT100 tyres the RD was a smoking, cackling, shrieking, wheelstanding handful of corner carving fun.

    Strangely enough I still have a CX500, it now has 140,000 miles on it and still runs well. The CX engine is an odd beast, single cam in block with pushrods but highly oversquare and four valves per cylinder.

    Motus is a new American made sport touring bike that’s going to be hitting the showrooms soon, sort of like a Guzzi with half of an aluminum Chevy small block instead of a twin.

  120. 120
    bin Lurkin' says:

    A Motus video.

    And here’s the Motus engine on a dyno.

  121. 121
    RossInDetroit says:

    I saw one of these Morgan trikes coming out of the dealership on the way to work last week. Looks like one of the best ways to have fun with a 120 CID air cooled S&S V Twin.

  122. 122
    Bullsmith says:

    That WaPo chat recently where Paul Kane pretty much flatly said fact checking was opinon while taking dictation of flat out lies and printing them without comment was the very definition of reporting pretty nicely summed up the abject failure of the fifth estate in our time. It does, however, explain how even the ‘fact checkers’ and ombudspeople have become nothing more than he-said,she-said enablers of untruths. I’m not shocked that Politifact nomitated anyone who points out that sending you a cheque to pass on to an insurance company that will happily let you die is not in any way shape or form “medicare” is a lie-of-the-year candidate. That they decided to let people vote on what the lie of the year is, regardless of whether or not it’s even a lie, however, seems to be them pretty openly abandoning the field. “We report. You decide.” Some fact checking.

  123. 123
    RossInDetroit says:

    @bin Lurkin’:

    Strangely enough I still have a CX500, it now has 140,000 miles on it and still runs well. The CX engine is an odd beast, single cam in block with pushrods but highly oversquare and four valves per cylinder.

    I once had a Yamaha Vision, a water cooled longitudinal 550CC 90 degree V-twin ‘standard’ bike. 4 overhead cams and 4 valves/cylinder. The next year they doubled it and it became the V-Max V-4 engine. The only new bike I ever bought and the only one I ever totaled. The memory of Orthopedic surgeons with furrowed brows strongly informs my choice of vehicles these days.

  124. 124
  125. 125
    BGinCHI says:

    @Shalimar: OK, well then apologies.

    But fer chrissakes, make a post clear please. A few drinks and it all starts to make sense, but it’s early.

  126. 126
    Bullsmith says:

    Rosali said

    ‘Republicans have presented jobs bills and the Dems won’t vote for them’ and ‘Republicans are for up or down votes.’

    Her point was to refute LIES, but with wonderfully blathering know-nothingness, Rosalie herself brings some aaa-grade lies of her own to the table. Republicans have obstructed jobs and fair votes with equal fervor. That’s really not a fact in dispute to anyone who cares about, you know, facts.

  127. 127
    Comrade Mary says:

    This thread turned into the Tower of Babel with people deeply, profoundly and repeatedly misunderstanding each other.

    I’d rather hear Cohen’s version.

  128. 128
    Quincy says:

    The other appalling aspect of Politifact’s lie of the year contest is the abdication of the impartial service they are ostensibly trying to provide. Opening lie of the year up to a survey let’s the people who authored the lies decide which lie is worst. A Roveian figure could easily pay trolls to repeatedly enter the survey and vote for one of the Democratic statements as lie of the year. Then when that statement is chosen, all of the news outlets will report it as the “lie of the year” and that will be that. Then talking heads can say the medicare statement was less truthful than Kyl’s admittedly “not intended to be factual” statement about Planned Parenthood and they’ll have Politifact’s official stamp of approval. All because a supposed fact checking organization decided the best way to check facts is with a survey.

  129. 129
    realbtl says:


    Hell, here I thought I was the only person in the US to buy a Vision. Mine had the full frame-mount fairing which I think made all of the difference in the world as far as looks. Great little bike except for its hunger for stators about every 12k miles. Had to replace mine twice.

  130. 130
    wilfred says:

    “Back in 2000, George W. Bush made a discovery of enormous consequence: you could base a whole political campaign on claims that were flatly untrue”

    Hell, you could base a whole fucking war and the deaths of hundred of thousands of people on claims that were flatly untrue. And you know what? You could count on the participation of both political parties for making that war possible and keeping it funded long after it was proven to be a lie.

    And you know what else? Nothing would ever happen. Move on, I say. Look to the future.

  131. 131
    Odie Hugh Manatee says:

    America turns off the lights, goes to bed, leaving their Mercedes in the driveway. While we sleep, the Republicans sneak into the car, drive it off, and sell it, but they keep the Mercedes hood ornament. They then split the proceeds between their rich buddies, and go out and find a Ford Pinto up on cinderblocks in a field, with the grass growing through the floorboard. They place that in the driveway, cleverly glue carefully balance the Mercedes ornament onto the front of the Pinto (which falls over shortly afterward), and sneak off into the night. The next morning, America and Democrats are screaming- “What the hell happened to my car.” Republicans say- “What are you talking about, there is your Mercedes right there, we just modernized it and fixed it up a bit for long-term financial stability,” and point at the Pinto. Then they notice that the hood ornament has fallen over, point at it and declaim

    Slightly improved. ;)

    What a work of word art John. Kudos.

  132. 132
    Comrade Mary says:

    @Quincy: It looks as if they’re using poll results for Reader’s Choice award, while still choosing their own winner. It does muddy the waters, though.

  133. 133
    smintheus says:

    @RossInDetroit: The Guzzis of my youth were made for driving in city traffic.

    ETA: As you later say.

  134. 134
    RossInDetroit says:


    Mine was 2 years old when I bought it still in the crate at a $1000 discount. The faired ones were sweet. After that went sideways through a corn field, then off to become used parts I bought the Honda 700 Nighthawk S. More bike, and better in just about every way except uniqueness. I had the ’75 Bonneville in there somewhere as well.

    But I’m older and more protective of my bones and soft tissues these days so I stick to 4 wheels.

  135. 135
    RossInDetroit says:


    The Guzzis of my youth were made for driving in city traffic.

    Mine has a 2-range manual gearbox and a torque converter. In practice you just select high or low and leave it there. Not clutching and shifting makes traffic work much less of a chore. But it’s slow for a liter-class machine.

  136. 136

    It’s quite elementary; things that come from the mouths of the Republicans ARE NOT intended to be factual statements.

    ETA: Mark Twain got it wrong. It isn’t statistics, it is journalism.

  137. 137
    Rosali says:

    Look, here, you stupid motherfucker. This is a post about GOP lies and I posted some additional GOP lies on this snarky website. Some of you, lacking reading comprehension skills or a snark-o-meter, attacked me without fully understanding my post. I thought I clarified that I was being snarky (although the explanation should not have been necessary on BJ) but you stupid leftier-than-thou fucks still feel a need to continue this. Fuck you and your deficient reading comprehension skills. That’s not my problem.

  138. 138
    Odie Hugh Manatee says:


    That “Barry” bit is a nervous tic, a tell, that every racist Republican and PUMA utters, sooner or later, in a Tourette’s-like fashion.

    I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that Hurdy-Gurdy is a regular at HillaryIs44 and myiq2xu’s Clownface GoatBoy’s shit hole.

  139. 139
    Raven says:

    @Rosali: You’re problem is you sweetie. No body gives a shit.

  140. 140
    BGinCHI says:

    @Raven: And…..scene.

  141. 141
    Bullsmith says:


    Sorry Rosalie, I took your first post as pure sarcastic snark, but then was confused by some of the follow up posting and mistakenly took you seriously. Not a rare mistake around here, but one I try avoid and deeply regret. Heartfelt apologies.

  142. 142
    Rosali says:

    Apparently, you gave a shit at #89. Get back to me when you can write coherent sentences.

  143. 143
    Quincy says:

    @Comrade Mary

    Thanks. I suppose I too should check facts before attacking fact checkers. That’s slightly embarrassing.

  144. 144
    amk says:

    Nice analogy, John. Fucking spot on.

  145. 145
    Rosali says:

    Apology accepted and I apologize to you for being harsh when I was upset at other posters.

  146. 146
    Odie Hugh Manatee says:


    I added a Vetter Windjammer IV to mine (1980 Yamaha XS850 SG (Special)) so I can smoke, install a cig lighter, gauges and an amp with four speakers.

    Gotta have the creature comforts, such as they are. They make the long distance rides a bit nicer. :)

  147. 147
    smintheus says:

    @Rosali: It seemed perfectly obvious to me what you were saying. Sorry people were snotty towards you.

  148. 148
    kay says:

    Well, I think we have to look for those lies that were, eventually, after great effort and a lot of pain, dislodged.

    I don’t think anyone really believes lowering tax rates for rich people “creates jobs” anymore, and that lie was repeated like it was completely self-evident, my entire life.

    “Greatest health care system in the world” has taken a real beating, too.

    It won’t help us in the short run, but it does seem as if it’s POSSIBLE for facts to outlast the liars, if not sprint past them.

  149. 149
    Odie Hugh Manatee says:


    I had a YZ360 in the late 70’s, (1973, the first year of the monoshock) and that bike was deadly (fun!) to ride. Gobs of power (and even more after the piston and ports were cut and polished) and a blast to ride off road. That thing could climb trees, as they say.

    One odd bike I had was the one before that, a 1968 Kawasaki C2TR 120 Roadrunner. Four speed full-shift trans (no internal stop), which made for some adventure if you forgot which gear you were in and changed two in the wrong direction (fourth to first) at an inopportune time. It had a two-speed transfer case, which made for great blasts down the pavement to the next stretch of dirt. Combine that with the rotary trans, once you learn what not to do with it, and it was a great off road bike (with the right tires, it was sold as a street bike capable of off road use). It’s small size allowed me to get into places my buds couldn’t, and rock climbing was really fun to do with it.

  150. 150
    kay says:

    Too, I think it’s embarrassing for journalists that we have Politifact at all.

    Why was there a need for such a thing?

    We really needed a whole news category that has designations like “pants on fire”?

    One would think they’d catch those big ones going by. They needed a back-up?

  151. 151
    smintheus says:

    @kay: Exactly the problem. Stenographers treat “Joker said ‘X'” as a fact to report, when what they should really be reporting is “Joker told the following lie: ‘X'”.

  152. 152
    RossInDetroit says:


    We really needed a whole news category that has designations like “pants on fire”? One would think they’d catch those big ones going by.

    Playing the cynic here, identifying the truth is merely an occasional unintentional byproduct of the media generating attention for advertisers. Truth, lies, it all serves their purposes equally so why bother to sort it out?

  153. 153
    JWL says:

    “Impeachment is off the table”. Nancy Pelosi, December 2006

    Few questioned why, especially congressional democrats. And they fucked up by not doing so.

  154. 154
    Brother Shotgun of Sweet Reason says:

    @cathyx: And the Ravens won today, and that was even more important. Beating the Browns, too.

    Who, I might add, got to keep their name, trophies, and legacy when they were relocated, unlike the Mayflower Colts.

  155. 155

    @Odie Hugh Manatee: Exactly. People can call Obama, “Barry,” if they like in my book, but if they do it just signals to me that they hate him or at the very least have zero respect for the man. Which is fine. I called Bush, “shrub,” all the time because I hated him and had zero respect for him. However, since I rather do respect Obama I stop reading any post as soon as I see “Barry.” So, if the poster’s intent is to change my opinion it is a failed tactic. If the intent is just to disrespect the man, well, I suppose that is their choice.

  156. 156
    Xenos says:

    @JWL: As far as impeachment is concerned, if Pelosi had allowed it to go forward in the House committee, what would have been the practical effect? Most of her work was wasted in the end, but it was not an unreasonable approach. I am more interested in impeaching Clarence Thomas at this point…

  157. 157
    Brother Shotgun of Sweet Reason says:

    @Raven: Nice pics. Triumphs and BSAs. The good ol’ days, when you’d see a bike and it wasn’t always a Harley.

  158. 158
    Brother Shotgun of Sweet Reason says:

    @RossInDetroit: I rode my Triumph Tiger Cub (200 cc single) with a broken right wrist. Swapped the throttle and brake to the left handle, and the clutch to the right, ’cause then I didn’t have to twist the broken wrist to operate it. Took a little getting used to.

  159. 159
    Odie Hugh Manatee says:


    What’s really funny to see is someone like Hurdy-Gurdy write these wordy posts, as if they are attempting to argue a legit position to gain converts, and then blow it all off by throwing in “Barry” to prove how seriously they should be taken.

    Which is not at all.

  160. 160
    El Cid says:

    I am offended by the suggestion that any of these people are consciously lying, when incompetence and peer pressure would be a much more soothing explanation for their actions.

  161. 161
    Neo says:

    Perhaps, Newt should consult with former Enron consultant and Nobel Prize for Economics winner, Paul Krugman, to see how he managed to argue away any damage from a former employer who went “financially unstable.”

  162. 162
    William Hurley says:


    My my! Touchy.

    Tell ya’ what, I’ll let Barry address himself to me if he has an issue with me referring to him, on occasion, by his nickname.

    Until then, get over yourself.

  163. 163
    William Hurley says:


    Interesting. You complain about my choice of proper noun to refer to the President while you, yourself, choose to use his last name sans title.

    Why do you choose a disrespectful usage? Is there something you want to get off of your chest?

  164. 164
    amk says:

    @William Hurley:

    address himself to me

    fecking idjit, aren’t ya ?

  165. 165
    William Hurley says:

    @Odie Hugh Manatee:

    Poor mini-minded odie. You blend reactionary defensiveness and paranoia well. Do you always projectile psychoanalyze those whose arguments you can’t comprehend?

  166. 166
    William Hurley says:


    Speak for yourself.

    If defensive mini-minded o-bots feel compelled to speak for the President then I reserve the right to hear from him instead of his self-appointed, anonymous sycophants.


  167. 167
    Yutsano says:

    @William Hurley: You’ve been all about the ad hominem lately. But hey ratfuckers gotta keep fucking.

  168. 168
    amk says:

    @William Hurley: fecking idjit, it is then. Thanks for confirming it.

  169. 169
    William Hurley says:


    As usual Y, you’re compulsion to waste electronic ink knows no bounds.

    Pardon me for replying to your fellow mini-minds in kind. I wouldn’t want my message and its meaning or intent to fall on uncomprehending ears as a result of having over-estimated their obviously marginal abilities.

    You know, its very much like your own experience of being over-matched and befuddled by elementary concepts and basics facts.

  170. 170
    William Hurley says:


    I guess it’s a disease you low-wattage o-bots are saddled with; projectile psychoanalyzing that is.

  171. 171
    Kane says:

    It’s not just Politifact. Writing about Mitt Romney’s first television ad which purposely intends to deceive voters, concluded that is a matter of opinion if the ad is deceitful and dishonest, and they will leave that for their readers to determine.

    This from an organization that claims to be “a nonpartisan, nonprofit consumer advocate for voters that aims to reduce the level of deception and confusion in U.S. politics.”

  172. 172
    Yutsano says:

    @William Hurley: You do realize no one is keeping you here and it’s a big Internet. You don’t have to mingle with us small-minded little people if your grandiose magnificence is not appreciated.

  173. 173
    amk says:

    @William Hurley: hey idjit of a kid, when you are in a hole, stop fucking digging.

  174. 174
    FlipYrWhig says:

    @William Hurley: Hurley’s Syndrome: cerebral hemorrhoids.

  175. 175
    Brother Shotgun of Sweet Reason says:

    @amk: Thanks for that. I forget how much I love the word “fecking” until I see it. Much much better than the alternatives “freaking” “farking” etc. I must make a note to use it more often.

  176. 176
    dead existentialist says:

    The online world is a strange and wonderful place . . . full of freaks with crazy convictions who would never talk to another human being like they do here for fear of being justifiably punched in the face.

    Carry on.

  177. 177
    Mnemosyne says:


    Because we would have been so much better off letting Dick Cheney have free reign as president from 2006 to 2008?

  178. 178
    Mnemosyne says:

    @William Hurley:

    You tell ’em, Billy.

  179. 179
    Yutsano says:

    @Mnemosyne: I do seriously less than three you. :)

  180. 180

    […] John Cole responds: Here’s what is happening: […]

  181. 181

    @William Hurley: You’re a fucking douche bag. I didn’t complain about proper title. The president, whoever he or she may be, is routinely referred to by their last name in discussion. It is a common and accepted practice and there is no insult or praise inherent in doing such. No one but a person who dislikes the current president refers to him as “Barry.” You’re a dickhead, mate. Fuck you very much and have a nice day.

  182. 182
    Snowball says:


    That WaPo chat recently where Paul Kane pretty much flatly said fact checking was opinon while taking dictation of flat out lies and printing them without comment was the very definition of reporting…

    To me this is an incredibly appalling statement. If this was even remotely true, why is the media such as the Post spending big money on reporters when they simply could pay peanuts to true stenographers for doing the same damn job?
    And since their job, according to Kane, is to be stenographers, why not hire stenographers then?

    This goes back to the earth is flat argument. According to Kane, the role of the media, would be to report Mr A says the earth is flat, while Mr B disagrees. Nothing less, nothing more.

    And this of course is absurd. Mr Kane helps explain why our media is so pathetic and why we as a result have a populace that is confused politically.

  183. 183
    Paul in KY says:

    The Mercedes/Pinto analogy was pure gold.

  184. 184

    […] living in an age where truth is declared a lie in the name of false equivalence by a site called “Politifact“, political operatives […]

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