Solely because I found it entertaining, Dave Weigel at Slate on “The Freedom to Call People ‘Terrorists‘”:
The founders are as venerated now as they’ve ever been, but for reasons that elude me, they’re remembered in a way-too-sanitized way. The founders were slashing, petty, mean slingers of insults. They spent far more time drafting angry letters and editorials than they did drafting the Constitution. They called each other bastards and octoroons. Aaron Burr killed Alexander Hamilton because he’d heard that Hamilton insulted him at a dinner. And so on.
__
I bring this up to discuss the stupid outrage over this reported exchange between Rep. Mike Doyle, D-Penn., and Joe Biden, during yesterday’s come-to-Satan budget pow-wow.“We have negotiated with terrorists,” an angry Doyle said, according to sources in the room. “This small group of terrorists have made it impossible to spend any money.”
__
Biden, driven by his Democratic allies’ misgivings about the debt-limit deal, responded: “They have acted like terrorists.”…
You know what? Stop whining. All (maybe) Biden and (definitely) other Democrats here did was lean on a cliche. The cliche is: “I will not negotiate with terrorists.” The point Democrats are/were making was that by refusing to back an increase of the debt limit unless certain conditions were met, Republicans were threatening to damage the nation’s credit rating or force a partial government shutdown. Which they were. Try and prove that wrong. You can’t, because it’s exactly what happened. No one had tried a move like this with the debt limit before. Republicans almost did in 1995, but they gave up, because the politics were rotten.
__
If you don’t want your opponent to label you a hostage-taker, here’s a idea: Don’t take hostages. You could argue that this fight was more like an intervention, or a trip to one of those “scared stright” camps, where there’s no ransom. But all of these situations involve the prospect of harm to a third party in exchange for concessions from a second party. And that’s not uncommon in politics. You guys are in politics. Don’t pretend you’re in mortal danger if someone uses a label you don’t like and you’re not next to your fainting couch.
Yutsano
The Founders were generally assholes. They still pretty much got things right.
You know the food is gonna be good when you haven’t cooked a thing and you house still smells fantastic. And I got the garbage out and the dishes washed. Also.
Fucen Pneumatic Fuck Wrench Tarmal
lets give a slow clap for my rep, mike doyle, he figured out a way to get his name in the paper. that is more than he usually does in two years. of course, one might wonder if that is a feature or a bug.
anyway, i would like to think of the founders as foul mouthed and quick with an insult, but that might be me, projecting as much of what i want them to have been as glenn beck and the other right wing tards. probably not, but it might be.
Ripley
Make Mitch Daniels stand up for Kortney enjoying her vegetables!
Treadstone
The Founding Fathers liked booze, hookers and killing Indians. Whatever. If you fuck with my VA benefits (or Social Security) I will fuck you up.
kthnxbai
burnspbesq
The truth hurts sometimes.
Yutsano
@burnspbesq: So do root canals. And lots of folks spend their lives avoiding both.
Bnut
@Yutsano and burnspbesq
Wtf are you actually arguing about?
Treadstone
@burnspbesq: The truth is that you can’t call white people terrorists. And you can’t… really, you can’t. You can only say that about dudes with funny hats yelling durka durka shooting AKs into the air. That’s just how it is.
I’d much prefer that, instead of bitching about how unfair it all is, folks would advocate for the Dems by calling it extortion. That’s a far more accurate description of what they’re doing and it doesn’t offend people’s sense of white supremecy. Just my $0.02.
Yutsano
@Bnut: I’m not arguing. I’m too fucking tired to argue about anything. It was kind of an affirmation if anything. My house still smells damn good though.
@Treadstone: Try harder. Your troll-fu needs much practice young Padawan.
Sly
They also scarcely agreed on much of anything, aside from two basic facts: That separation with England was necessary before anything else was worked out, and that the Articles of Confederation were woefully inadequate to address the pressing needs of the nation.
This is what so galling about the musings of Brooks and people like him; they sanctify the framers (and non-framers of the era) and impute them with an ageless wisdom, just to apply that same sanctity to their own poorly constructed arguments. But musing on things like what Alexander Hamilton might think of things like the current tax code or the debt ceiling has two fundamental problems:
1) Alexander Hamilton has been dead for 200 years, so its kind of hard to divine what he might think about anything beyond his own immediate culture, which is about as alien to us (if not much moreso) as the culture of Medieval Europe was alien to him.
2) Related to the first; even if we could divine such information… who gives a fucking rat’s ass what he might think? He’s been dead for 200 years!
Bnut
@Yutsano
Moi Aussi. Except my house smells like shit since my dog has canine papilloma. I would LOL, but it really does smell like ass.
Yutsano
@Bnut: Cook a batch of gyros. Even before you throw it in the oven your house smells like the main market in Athens.
Poor puppeh. I guess the only fix is to wait it out n’est ce pas?
Bnut
You would think you can wait it out. It’s what all the vets and websites say. It’s been almost 5 months. It’s supposed to just go away. I’ve had vets give 2 different meds, had his warts crushed to spread antibodies. The next step is laser surgery to remove them, which will not cure it, just give some respite, but I sure as hell can’t afford it. It’s literally sea enenomie things growing in his mouth. It’s heartbreaking. The vet here in Nashville is talking experimental surgery at Mississippi State. At least it’s not painful to him.
Treadstone
@Sly: The industrial revolution rendered anything anyone ever thought about economics before moot. What makes economic sense in an agrarian society doesn’t make sense in an industrialized one.
Using concepts Hamilton might have championed makes as much sense as an NFL coach deciding to run the Split T because some legendary coach liked to use it in the 1930’s. Things change, and strategies have to adapt to those changes.
Yutsano
@Bnut: A vet school can be a really good call. They’ll often work for pretty cheap, plus they are good at working on some of the more exotic conditions that make most vets clueless. My parents often hitch up the horses and drag them to where I went to college for that exact reason. It’s not a bad idea honestly.
Treadstone
Do we all recognize that it would have been impossible for the US to wage war in Europe and the Pacific during WWII if there had been a balenced budget amendment? Can you imagine FDR having to go through the process of repealing such an amendment just to secure the necessary funding to start building an army and navy to win the war? The Battle of Midway might have been lost because of a constitutional debt ceiling.
Worst. Idea. Ever.
John Puma
You can vaguely see the sensitivity. Using “communist” as epithet confers a sort of compliment, since it refers to a system, which, in less that three decades, transformed a virtual medieval society into a industrial, military, scientific and political equal to the “exceptional” USA.
Terrorism is simply the excuse to destroy what remains of the validity of the American experiment in self-governance.
Bnut
@Yutsano
I’m considering it. I was a vet tech in Alabama when in school, and Miss, St. does a good job. It’s just ANOTHER thing, vous savez?
Treadstone
@Yutsano: I was being serious in a trollish way. The obsession with pointing out that people are racist seems like a waste of time to me.
People are racist dicks. So what. When Americans call someone a terrorist they’re really saying that the subject is a crazy arab/muslim. But then people in the arab world say alot of nasty things about Jews and vice versa. From my perspective when liberals call right wingers terrorists they’re trying to be cute and ironic. Cute and ironic is a big hit on the blogs, but it doesn’t win elections or persuade alot of voters.
Loviatar
Two golden oldies for the Obots
Two Video Clips That Will Make Obama Supporters Cry
.
Hilliary Clinton: better Democrat and more prepared to be president and govern.
.
Just because you can win elections doesn’t mean you’re prepared to be president and govern. The republicans prove that every time they are elected, Obama has proved that democrats can be just as bad at governing as a republican.
Yutsano
@Loviatar: PUMAZ 4EVAH!! Get over yourself. SHE. LOST.
@Bnut: Je comprende. Et maintenant je fait couver. Bon nuit.
Treadstone
@John Puma: However, when I was a kid growing up in the 80’s, communists were people you were supposed to kill. They were the enemy. There are lots of folks on left leaning blogs that actually qualify as communists. Your own comment seems to show at least some appreciation if not overt support for communism. But what if someone angrily yelled “communist” at you. Now they’re saying you’re a dirty commie and you should be killed by Chuck Norris in a bad 80’s action flick or something.
Calling these GOP congressmen set on forcing default “terrorists” is really saying that they’re crazy arabs and Seal Team VI should terminate their command with extreme prejudice. That’s gonna offend a whole lot of registered voters in this country. That’s why extortion is a much better word. It perfectly describes what they’re doing and they don’t get to play the victim.
The downside is you fail to cleverly expose the hypocrisy of anti-muslim sentiment/racism in the US. But what the fuck good would that do anyway?
JGabriel
This is nicely ironic, given how many of the same Republicans bitching about being called terrorists now are the same assholes who spent years calling Democrats traitors — and still do it!
.
Treadstone
@Loviatar: Y’all get a do over in 2016. Pissing off half the party between now and then is not a good strategy.
MikeJ
Yutsy, I expected you be jumping up and down, shrieking with joy, not sitting at home cooking and cleaning. 3,000 dawgs landed in Seattle today with the bonnie Dick.
Loviatar
@21 – Yutsano:
Keep chanting that as Obama leads us into a Lost Decade and a double dip recession.
You’ll still be mumbling it when you hit 67 and not able to retire as Obama has raised the Social Security retirement age. You’ll still be mumbling it when you can’t afford healthcare because the cost will continue to skyrocket because Obama didn’t fight for competitive pressure on the Insurance companies. You’ll still be mumbling when your kids are locked into some low paying job servicing the wealthy because Obama didn’t fight to raise taxes in order to provide them with opportunity to do better.
Keep chanting that Obot, you say it like its an insult. I’ll wear it with pride, yeah we lost, but at least we have the knowledge that our choice for president won’t go down in history as the incompetent president who oversaw Americas slide into Banana Democracy. We may be a footnote, but you’ll be he whole damm page on that shit stain.
Clap harder, reality is calling and you have to drown it out
Treadstone
@Loviatar: You didn’t say Dear Leader even once. Disappointed.
Loviatar
@24 – Treadstone:
what makes you think I give damm about these asshole. i want them to return to the republican party from whence they came.
Go back assholes and take back your party from the Insane Clown Posse that now owns it. You fostered them when they were a means to power and now they’ve shown how crazy they really are, you’ve come over to the Democratic party to fuck that over also.
Our Democratic system of government works when there are two parties; one with a center left orientation with a left wing and one with a center right orientation with a right wing. By having that you have an incentive to compromise for better governing as both sides are trying to capture the middle.
It does not work when there are two parties; one with a far right orientation and an insane right wing and one with a center right orientation. By having that there is no incentive to compromise for better governing as both sides are trying to capture the same right side of the populace.
Go home former Republicans, we need you to take back your party. The US can not be governed with the current party orientations.
JGabriel
Treadstone:
No, we’re trying to emphasize how many are likely to die, or have their health impacted, or become impoverished, from Republican policies — to emphasize that GOP demands lead to the kind of large scale suffering associated with other similar terrorists.
Treadstone:
Yes, that’s exactly what I mean. Just as GOPer’s meant that anyone sane enough to object to the Iraq war should be executed when they called us “traitors”.
Good. GOP policies offend me no less, and probably more.
.
John Puma
@Treadstone 22
What would I do if someone called me a communist? I’d say: “Thanks for the compliment because communism, in less that three decades, transformed a virtual medieval society into a industrial, military, scientific and political equal to the ‘exceptional’ USA.”
I said neither that the teabaggers 1) are not terrorists 2) nor that they should be allowed to escape the fate we spend to eradicate other terrorists.
I simply said that the worst name they can think of to call ME is a relative compliment.
boss bitch
@Loviatar:
Yes, I was crying for joy when he won the nomination AND the presidency.
Treadstone
@Loviatar: US political ideology is 35-40% conservative, 15-20% liberal and 40-50% moderate. These numbers have been static since scientific polling began over 60 years ago.
If you believe there was ever a party made up entirely of left leaning voters, you’re living in a fantasy world. FDR’s coalition was famously dependent on southern bigots living in abject poverty. Once they got electricity and the blacks got civil rights they were gone with the wind.
For the record, I cast my first vote ever in 1992 at the age of 18, and the first hole I punched was for William Jefferson Clinton. Also, I’m not flaming you. I find your POV fascinating. Flawed, but fascinating. I think you’re trying to blame Obama (or some other outside force) for the failure of liberals to establish a truly left wing government in the US. But I think the real reason is that it’s just not possible to do so with this electorate. The US just isn’t Sweden, and it never will be.
Lysana
@Treadstone:
I just called armed Irish Republicans terrorists not two days ago even though I agree with them that Northern Ireland should’ve been kept as part of the Republic instead of gerrymandered off during the formation of the Irish Free State. Terrorism = violent rebellion against an established government by a non-governmental force. Period. Our Founding Fathers were terrorists and terrorist sympathizers. And you are a sad and strange little man.
Loviatar
@32 – Treadstone:
I guess reading comprehension is a problem for Obots.
Treadstone
@John Puma: Dude I’m pretty sure I could call you worse than a communist. Pedophile would be worse. Serial Killer also works. OK that’s two words, but whatever.
My argument is that it’s bad politics for the VP to go around calling GOP pols terrorists. And it is. That is all.
Treadstone
@Loviatar: No. That isn’t mathematically possible. There aren’t enough center-left or raving left voters to get to 51% in the US. Never were, never will be. The only way you get socialism is if there’s a depression. And then that’s just economic policies. People will still love Jesus as much as ever, at least for the forseeable future. Now I’m kind of flaming you a little, because you’re silly.
Treadstone
@Lysana: I’m 5’10” first off. And my whole point is what the word means to the average person on the street, not what the dictionary says. Politics is all about emotion. You’re insult reveals this. That was an emotional response. And that’s how politics mostly works, people vote their emotions. When people hear terrorist, most of them think crazy arab. I’m not saying that that is logical or accurate. It’s certainly racist. But that’s how people think, even if they don’t like to admit it.
The VP shouldn’t have used that word for the same reason GOP pols shouldn’t talk about tar babies when criticizing the first black president in US history. You can try and rationalize all day long that you’re not saying what people think you’re saying, but the emotional response is all that matters. Bill Clinton probably would have handled this mess better, I’ll concede that. It’s not like I love Obama or whatever people think. But no way would the Big Dog have called anyone in Congress a terrorist.
And if you think people in Belfast will ever consent to being ruled by people in Dublin you’re, um… probably mistaken.
James E. Powell
The Democrats should only use words and phrases that the Republicans approve of and the Republicans can use whatever language they like, including racist stuff like ‘tar baby.’ The corporate press/media will enforce these rules by promoting every Republican hissy fit over Democratic meanies while completely ignoring things like Dick Cheney telling a senator to go fuck himself.
That’s what we’ve been doing for the last twenty years or so. And it’s working out great, right?
Treadstone
@James E. Powell: Sigh. It’s like people bitching about the Yankees having a big payroll. Just accept that you live in the world that you live in instead of wasting your time trying to show off how clever and righteous you are.
But hey, I can’t talk shit. I’m wasting my time trying to debate with a bunch of angry hippies when I could be listening to the early 80’s REM albums that just came in the mail. I’m the fool here.
P.S. Over 90% of black voters vote for Democrats. So I really don’t think the GOP is getting away with anything. Being dicks to black people hasn’t really helped them that much.
Loviatar
Its funny I used to be considered a centrist Democrat. I used to be the one accused of selling out to the Republicans.
My how times have changed since we got the influx of Bush Democrats (Republicans who fled their party due to GWB).
Now I’m an angry hippie or whats the new insult, oh yeah, a FIREBAGGER.
Odie Hugh Manatee
@Luvapuma:
Ahh, you’re one of those people…
Duly noted and dismissed.
Treadstone
@Loviatar: You’re calling me a Bush Democrat. Dude, this is self parody. If I’m dinging you for descending into self parody, you’ve got a problem. Seriously, I’m worried about you dude.
Yevgraf
Loviator’s 2000 vote for Nader was his crowning political glory. Don’t know if he was around to help primary Carter with the unelectable Ted, but I’d like to think he would have been enthusiastically on board for that, as well.
Oh, for those emoprogs who say “but I lived in a state that was completely decided already, and wanted to make a statement”, ask yourselves if Our Conservative SCOTUS would have thrown the election to Bush if the popular vote win for Gore was about 2 million higher. I say no, they’d have been scared to.
Loviatar
@43 – Yevgraf:
Never voted for Nader. I supported and voted for Al Gore.
.
Who did you vote for? George W. Bush
Loviatar
@42 – Treadstone:
Since you seem to be an Obot who can string two thoughts together, even though you still have a problem with reading comprehension, I have a couple of questions for you.
.
– Do you think the Democratic party has moved rightward since the election of George W. Bush?
.
– If so, what do you ascertain as the reason for the rightward shift?
Comrade Scrutinizer
@Sly:
Or, to paraphrase pTerry: “What would Alexander Hamilton say?”
“Why is it so dark in here?”
@Loviatar:
Grow the fuck up. Demographics are what they are. I’m so far to the left I’m pretty much off the map here, but we have to deal with what we have. I’ll grant you that our current choice seems to be what used to be called moderate/liberal Republican (Lowell Weicker comes to mind) and the ICP, but it’s still a choice. Moving the electorate from where we are to where I’d like to see it be isn’t going to happen in a lifetime or two, barring some enormous catastrophe, and even then, all bets are off as to which way it would move.
Incremental change is all we’re ever likely to see. We can still make choices that (hopefully) move us toward the Sockulist/Communist/Marxist/DFH heaven on earth. That choice today is away from the ICP. We’ll never see the SCMDHoE, but we don’t have to awaken The Old Ones, either.
in the meantime, stop with the PUMA drama queen schtick. It only makes you look silly.
Kirbster
I agree that “extortionist” is probably more accurate than “terrorist,” but why is it news anyway? It was a private off the record meeting. Now if someone on the House floor got up to make a speech and referred to another member as a “terrorist” or a “lying rat-bastard” instead of “my esteemed colleague from across the aisle,” that might be cause for complaint. Personally, I think Biden and Doyle should counter-whine about “political correctness” run amok.
bemused
Speaking of terrorists, I turn on the tv and first person I see on msnbc is that freak Pat Buchanan. He has dropped several racist bombs in the last two weeks. Why wouldn’t he feel comfortable doing that when he is still welcomed with open arms by the media. I have a feeling he is very close to slipping up and saying something so vile that even media won’t be able to ignore it, although it would probably just result in a short vacation for Pat and they’d save his cot for him.
Interesting how Buchanan and other rightwingers complain about other cultures not assimilating here and in Europe when they can’t assimilate into the 21st century, let alone the 20th century.
geg6
Well, based on my own long experience as a textbook liberal and very active Dem, I’d say the rightward tilt toward center-right in my party began with Bill Clinton and his posse of “New Democrats”. You know, the ones that passed DOMA, DADT, and who hated them some Glass-Steagel. Hilary’s husband. Maybe you remember him.
Loviatar
@46 – Comrade Scrutinizer:
Again with the insults.
So according to you the reason the Democratic party has moved to the right is due to demographics, more babies born to Republicans.
The capture of the party leadership by the corporatist crowd the moderate/liberal Republican type has little or nothing to do with the shift.
The failure to differentiate the party from a tepid (moderate/liberal) form of Republicanism has nothing to do with the failure to garner new left leaning members, thereby shifting the party to the right.
The influx of moderate/liberal Republican who are horrified by the ISP (even through they fostered their creation) control of the Republican party has nothing to do with the shift.
.
Ok you hear that liberals/progressives, get out there and fuck everything that moves, according to Comrade Scrutinize we have to change the demographics. If it stops for any reason fuck it, if slows down fuck it, if it even gives you the once over with its eyes fuck it. We must do our duty to save the country from the Republicans.
Loviatar
@49 – geg6:
Ahh, but at least he was competent.
Yevgraf
@geg6:
And that was the response to the accurate reading of where they thought the public was. The man’s instincts were correct, however, he was a plurality president, elected first due to the teatard campaign of Ross Perot.
I’ve been reading David Brock’s “The Republican Noise Machine”, and his descriptions of the 30 year long propaganda effort. It has been remarkably effective – the Reagan hagiography, the barrage of suliminal and overt messaging – it moved the public and made truly liberal governance impossible across large swaths of the country, particularly in the heavily tax subsidized exurban sprawlsvilles that wind up over represented in Congress and state legislatures.
A Humble Lurker
@Loviatar:
That’s why his health care bill was passed, right? And Obama’s wasn’t, right?
And before you go on about how bad Obama’s bill is, it’s still more than Clinton ever got done, good, bad, or ugly. And he was the one who had to undo Clinton’s DADT policy. Which he did.
Loviatar
@53 – A Humble Lurker:
I’ve asked this question before in relation to the Financial Reg. bill:
.
– Which is better a bad bill or no bill?
you have your answer, I have mine.
Yevgraf
And right now, Morning Joke is describing GWB as a Keynesian, and how the decade of Keynesian economics proves that Keynesian economics doesn’t work.
Pat Buchanan agrees with him.
Jado
“Stop whining”??
May as well ask me to stop BREATHING.
After all, this is the internet. Sheesh.
Brian R.
@Yevgraf:
Yes, because when I think of Keynesian, I think “the administration that passed the first and third biggest tax cuts in American history.”
dpCap
@Yutsano:
The founders were assholes, true, but Ben Franklin was fucking awesome.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fart_Proudly
John Puma
@A Humble Lurker: Don’t forget DOMA.
It is faint praise to have about the only demonstrably positive achievements of the new, young, eloquent Democratic president to be the undoing of a SMALL fraction of the policy blunders of our last new, young, eloquent Democratic president.
Belafon (formerly anonevent)
@Loviatar: Some day, Loviator, you might make it to the big leagues and qualify for FIREBAGGER. For now, you’re just minor league.
The most annoying thing about what you have been saying is your living in a fantasy world. It made a lot of sense for Clinton to be willing to shut down the government because it wasn’t going to cause a collapse of the global economy. Obama isn’t afforded that luxury. Heck, if GM had of collapsed during Clinton’s term, it would have been OK to let it fold. It just couldn’t happen now.
Kane
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/political-animal/2011_08/negotiating_with_terrorists031247.php
It was the Republicans who first started comparing themselves to terrorists.
Suffern ACE
@Loviatar: –
Neither Fin Reg nor ACA are bad bills. Fin Reg is a weak bill. ACA is a much stronger bill and solves more problems than it creates. But if you expect that President Clinton wouldn’t have also produced weak bills that disappoint you and didn’t sufficiently break the backs of your adversaries, you haven’t been paying attention to her, her public statements, or her actual voting record, and what the Democrats in general have been up to for the past 20 years.
boss bitch
Jesus Christ! Did someone just argue that Clinton was competent at passing bills that contributed to the shit pile we’re in?
honus
@Loviatar: Not a recent development. Hell, it was in about 1961 when Peter Cook and Dudley Moore did that bit explaining American politics: “I America, you have the republican Party, which is the equivalent of our Conservative Party, and then you have the Democratic Party, which is the equivalent of our Conservative Party”
Sly
@Loviatar:
The party as a whole? Not according to Pew Research. The ratio of self-indentified conservatives, moderates, and liberals has remained more or less constant over the past ten years.
Have the elected officials of the party moved to the right? Well, the House Progressive Caucus constituted about 27% of the House Democratic Caucus in 2000. After 2008, it constituted about 33%. After 2010, in which the Blue Dog Caucus was eviscerated, the House Progressive Caucus jumped to over 40% of the House Democratic Caucus. So in terms of the elected leadership, the Democratic Party has moved to the left over the past decade; gradually, for the most part, with a dramatic increase in the past election.
In terms of Presidents? There’s no objective metric that will tell you whether Barack Obama is to the left or to the right of any Democratic President in the modern political era (Roosevelt onward). Mostly what you get are the personal preferences of individuals who highlight what they liked and whitewash what they didn’t.
So, no, the Democratic Party has not moved to the right.
Suffern ACE
@boss bitch: The hypothetical President H. Clinton, who, esteemed by her party and feared by her enemies, would have negotiated grand Keynesian spending programs as a true liberal protector.
kay
@Yevgraf:
Bigotry is an opinion, and it’s an opinion shared by a certain segment of MSNBC viewers. Therefore it’s valid, and worthy of promotion. Pat Buchanan is their spokesman. A certain segment of viewers are also pathological liars, hence the relentless promotion of Sarah Palin.
To make editorial decisions would be elitist, really.
Paul in KY
I just wish we wouldn’t apologize. I think the word was fine, given the context. We are stereotyped as the weenie party anyway. So we use some charged language (that sums the other side up pretty well) & then we have to apologize. Plays right in to that stereotype.
grandpajohn
@Treadstone:
Sure you can, you just got to be sure that they are democrats and then it will be OK.
Remember how many times we were publicly on TVcalled Traitors and treasonous asshole because we didn’t swallow Bushs manufactured crap during the runup to and the invasion of IRAQ and called them out on their proven lies?
Any of you ever get an apology for that
grandpajohn
@Treadstone:
And i want to commend you on the good job you are doing in convincing the rest of us of that fact
grandpajohn
@Kirbster:
Or during a national televised speech called the POTUS a liar.
but then I am sure that got apologized for, OH wait it didn’t?
Mnemosyne
@Loviatar:
I love when people use the opinions of conservatives like Weigel to claim that they’re leftier than the rest of us.
You did know that Weigel is a conservative, right? But I guess it’s okay for you to unthinkingly accept conservative propaganda as long as it lets you bash Obama.
Yutsano
@Mnemosyne: A funny thing happened on the way to the Purity Pony Fair…
Stillwater
@Mnemosyne: But I guess it’s okay for you to unthinkingly accept conservative propaganda as long as it lets you bash Obama.
That’s right, and a good point. You don’t want to bash Democrats as a whole, cuz that’s too diffused to actually vent any anger, and you don’t want to bash Democratic voters for electing these POS in the first place because the voters didn’t sell anyone out. But you also don’t want to admit that sometimes shitty legislation is all you can get enacted given a divided caucus and an opposition party, and you don’t want to admit that Obama’s hands are tied for the most part in that process anyway.
So yeah, use whatever tools you have to bash Obama. It’s the Right Thing To Do!
JMS
Obama is fine with shooting pirates, OBL and with killing flies–he’s perfectly cold-blooded that way. And if you look at his record on what he has done where he doesn’t need congressional approval–it’s completely middle of the road Democratic policy-wise–we just don’t know as much about it because it doesn’t get flogged in the press. So, I really don’t believe he’s some kind of closet Republican.
If anyone has a legitimate gripe, it’s perhaps that he ought to be more single mindedly taking down Republicans the way he did OBL–not negotiating. What the political equivalent of sending out the SEALs to kill someone is, I’m not sure, though. Any ideas?
jl
Well, John Adams publicly called Alexander Hamilton a would be murderous Napoleon. And Hamilton publicly called Adams insane.
So, the holy Founders wanted it this way. QED.
Mike G
Good article on the King Stupid of teabaggery —
http://tinyurl.com/3uyucjm
TenguPhule
Fixed that for you.
And yes, we badly need it at this point.
TenguPhule
Carbomb from the CIA framed on a third party.
Kills two birds, one stone.
kd bart
“What the political equivalent of sending out the SEALs to kill someone is, I’m not sure, though. Any ideas?”
Perhaps, it involves the bully pulpit?