I Take the Cue from Certain People I Know

Mark Thompson over at The League of Ordinary Gentlemen completely and utterly demolishes the idea that there’s anything to the Pigford story being pushed by Andrew Breitbart and the National Review, and being facilitated by the sloppy, intellectually lazy work of Conor Friedersdorf. Conor himself shows up in the comments to regret his error, and to express hurt feelings over DougJ calling him a “useful idiot” in an earlier comment. Here’s the nut of Conor’s response:

I am at least glad that I blogged about this issue because a lot of folks who were wrong in the same way I was now have the benefit of understanding this controversy better.

Conor also points to this addendum to the original Pigford post, where he prints without comment the letters of three readers and links to some other commentary on his post.

I don’t know if Conor is being sly or whether he is really this obtuse. The point of Mark’s rather scathing post, the posts here from me, DougJ and John, and the reader emails Conor reprints is that there is no Pigford “controversy”. It is a lie generated by Breitbart and advanced by the National Review, born of a desire to stir up white resentment over the completely legitimate litigation of a national discrimination embarrassment and tragedy. The fact that Conor is apparently oblivious to his role pushing that lie forward into the mainstream media makes me think “useful idiot” is being a bit kind.






118 replies
  1. 1
  2. 2

    …and to express hurt feelings over DougJ calling him a “useful idiot” in an earlier comment.

    Then he’ll understand my hurt feelings at being stuck with the wreckage the legions of useful idiots have wrought on our political system and our national discourse through this kind of blatant, lazy bullshit.

  3. 3
    matoko_chan says:

    what dont you unnerstand about this mistermix?
    there are only two kinds of people on the right anymore.
    Stupid or dishonest….otherwise they would switch.
    Conor will do absolutely anything in the interest of preserving “divided” government.
    And that means thoughtfully pull things out of his ass while giving as much cover to Brietbart as he can.
    Alls fair in love and war, and this is war for them.
    They know about the demographic timer and Salam-Douthat stratification on cognitive ability. They believe they are ENTITLED to make shit up because they are disadvantaged.
    Why is Breibart so angry, do you think? Its because he knows blacks will never vote republican and he can’t make them. And if the GOP is branded as racist, then browns wont vote republican. And neither will youth….because racists arent cool. Racism is embedded so deep in the conservative base it cannot be switched off.
    They know they are going to lose post the demographic timer because youth and minorities wont vote for them. And they think that is UNFAIR.
    Brietbart tells NAACP chief to go to hell.

  4. 4
    brantl says:

    Why would conor be any brighter today than he’s been the rest of his life? Doesn’t figure.

  5. 5
    kay says:

    The National Review have been pushing reparations. Andrew Breitbart showed his hand yesterday when he did a 180 from his previous statement and announced Pigford was “back-door” reparations.

    It’s blatantly and disgustingly race-based, it’s a coordinated attack, and the single reason they’re doing it is Obama and Holder are black.

    Obama’s been defending on charges that he seeks reparations for slavery his entire national career. That’s why they’re doing this. It isn’t about Pickford. It’s about convincing their mouth-breathing base that Obama is taking their money.

  6. 6
    Davis X. Machina says:

    I don’t know if Conor is being sly or whether he is really this obtuse career–conscious.

    Fixed on edit.

  7. 7
    El Cid says:

    Yes, I may have been wrong in citing the importance of an essay on how we never made it to the Moon, and that it was all filmed on a Los Angeles movie soundstage.

    But those who pointed out that the original article and my interpretation of its value were wrong, the responses were very helpful to those thinking wrongly like me.

  8. 8
    aimai says:

    @El Cid:

    My favorite comment ever.

    aimai

  9. 9
    Nicole says:

    Your response to Conor’s grousing about DougJ hurting his fee-fees was a thing of beauty, mistermix.

  10. 10

    Shorter Conor: Even my fuck ups are brilliant!

    Dickhead.

    I must say again that it is interesting that Pigford gets the fReichtards all riled up, even though the Cobell water rights settlement was much larger ($3.4 b). Not that I want those assholes to start harassing Native Americans, but it proves their “concern” is something other than fiscally driven.

  11. 11
    El Cid says:

    @aimai: Wow, thank you. Now I have only to hear the same from all the other users of the internet, and my victory will be complete.

  12. 12
    matoko_chan says:

    and thompson and EDK and the rest ARE ALL THE SAME.
    this is just like Obamas birth certificate or Obama is a muslim or AGW. conservative mythology that will never die.
    its called catalepsis and it can take 10k repititions to unlearn a falsehood.
    you keep trying to find some common ground– the common ground is that EDK and the LoOGies are going to slop you with some ditch liquor about how they think Brietbart and Limabaugh are bad dudes too while stubbornly insisting there are still “good” conservative ideas.
    Conservatism is dead. there are no good ideas left….it has EMPIRICALLY failed utterly, but in the Holy Name of Divided Government those fuckers keep right on pretending, and slide out from under anyones demands that they stand and deliver….like mine.
    Just look at Thompsons apes discussing philosophy conservatives discussing science thread on creationism and AGW.
    They are not like us, or they would have switched to the Left by now.
    They just exploit your pathetic wistful desire for them to be like us.

  13. 13
    Cat Lady says:

    I wish it were possible to shove all of those smarmy pixels in his “mea culpa” up his clenched ass. What a fucking pearl clutching wanker. I’ll be curious to see if he responds to your comment mistermix. I know if I were him, I wouldn’t have been able to sleep last night knowing that however I responded I’d confirm my stupidity or venality.

  14. 14
    matoko_chan says:

    @El Cid: excellent. im so glad i didnt drop safe on you t’other day when you were bloviating about the MB.

  15. 15
    matoko_chan says:

    @Cat Lady: but they are all the same.
    EDK=Conor=McMegan=Douchebag=Thompson=Manzi=Pollack=Sully
    they are isomorphic and interchangeable.

  16. 16
    Elia says:

    Well, I asked his boss, Mr. Sullivan (who responded to an angry email of mine with talk of reassuring markets and America not being like Greece), how he could possibly think the same kind of neoliberal approach that got us into this mess was the solution — in response to his post about Obama supposedly considering me a “sucker — and I didn’t get a respnse; I think obtuseness or a stubborn refusal to change one’s “first principles” is kind of a requirement for Daily Dishing.

    Young Conor’s just dancin’ with the one that brought him here.

  17. 17
    kay says:

    I think what’s different about the current conservatives and last year’s model is how they’re willing to go after ordinary people to reach a political aim. The Pigford claimants, to reach Obama, the ACORN workers, to defund voter registration, Planned Parenthood workers to go after abortion. They’re stacking up civilian “casualties” here.
    The collateral damage doesn’t matter, in service to the cause.

  18. 18
    Keith G says:

    How is that post racial America thingy working out?

    Sadly, this seems to be a specialized mutation of the the larger “makers/takers” stupidity. To wit…There are two groups of undeserving leeches trying to attach to one of our government’s teats, 1) A group of Black farmers who might have been harmed, but just should have been better competitors, 2) A groups of Black blatant scammers.

    Its a win/win. The die has already been cast. Just like Muslim Obama, a group of oppressed Black farmers have now and forever been labeled as larcenous schemers.

  19. 19
    El Cid says:

    @matoko_chan: I didn’t bloviate about the Muslim Brotherhood. I didn’t deal with the subject matter. You were replying to arguments I never made, because the voices screaming in your head insisted that you do so. That’s what I pointed out. I’m sure it’s the same with passers-by and people in the mall, suffering your random vocabulary-based denunciations.

    Also, Protestants rock. We are genetically superior. That’s why we won the Crusades. Well, we weren’t Protestants yet, but evolution made it inevitable. When we finally evolved, we conquered most of the populated planet. We are so awesome. In your face, Islamo-tards.

  20. 20
    Dennis SGMM says:

    “I may not be right, sir, but I’m never wrong, sir!”

  21. 21
    Comrade Javamanphil says:

    @kay: Michael Schiavo. The Frost family and their countertops. Ward Churchill. Ever was it thus.

  22. 22
    mistermix says:

    @matoko_chan: Thompson’s piece on the League was intelligent, tough and well-researched. Your attack, on the other hand, was tired, dull, uninformed, tedious and stupid. I know you’re constitutionally unable to halt the stream of watery diarrhea that your keyboard emits, but goddam it is getting old.

  23. 23
    matoko_chan says:

    @kay: this is exactly true.
    they will do anything, no matter how vile, if it advances their cause.
    i was still a TAS commenter when Breitbart’s doctored ACORN viddie came out,
    Conor ate it up.

  24. 24
    El Cid says:

    @Comrade Javamanphil: I’m not sure Ward Churchill is an “ordinary person”, given his history of using his faked Indian ancestry to become a widely read author and prominent speaker.

    I think in Churchill’s case it’s the targeting of academics with whom the right disagrees, just like the pro-militarists-on-Israel target any academic who express the side of the Arabs of the same region. So recently with Rashid Khalidi. Or Frances Fox Piven. And in doing so make these figures out to be the leaders of the Democratic Party. In the case of each, the Democratic Party, especially in the last generation and a half, the charge is most absurd because the party leadership would have nothing to do with any of these figures.

  25. 25
    kay says:

    @Comrade Javamanphil:

    Obama and Holder can certainly handle it, but how do they justify smearing 22,000 black farmers?
    They’re speaking truth to power, but the targets aren’t powerful. Come on. New Jersey teachers in a bar? Brave, brave warriors, these.
    Although I do think they seriously underestimated Shirley Sherrod :)

  26. 26
    aimai says:

    @Comrade Javamanphil:

    Yes. And what was the imaginary black “welfare queen” and the “young bucks and their t bone steaks” but going after ordinary people to get at an entire class of people? Just because the people you pillory and savage are fictional doesn’t mean your blows don’t fall on real people or that real people aren’t your goal. This has been the modus operandi of conservatives–and, to be fair, any activist political group–since the beginning of time.

    aimai

  27. 27
    matoko_chan says:

    @El Cid: but now we are seeing the twilight of the anglo-saxons. Derbyshires “ice people”. You had a good run, and its ending. In the new arms race of human capital anglosaxons are global paupers.
    Protestantism has a strong anti-intellectual component. thass a fact jack.
    @mistermix: Thompson’s piece was a im-just-like-you headfake…or did you mean the apes discussing philosophy/conservatives discussing science piece?
    Prove me wrong then.
    Bring it. Get EDK to talk about Salam-Douthat stratification and its effect on academe.
    im not holding my breath.
    they wont talk about anything important–they cant.
    alsotoo….your insult lexicon is impoverished. ditch liquor was elegant and succcint

  28. 28
    JD Rhoades says:

    This graf struck me:

    Sixth, nowhere in Conor’s post or Breitbart’s original reporting is there a mention of the fact that just because a claim is made does not mean it will be granted; instead, both seem to believe that claims will be rubber stamped once made. But to the contrary, 30% of claims that were made under Pigford I were ultimately denied, and there’s no reason to believe that the rate will be any lower under Pigford II; this is an abnormally high rate of denial for a class action settlement, suggesting that the USDA is in fact reviewing claims quite carefully.

    This habit of deliberately conflating “claims filed” with “claims granted” is a well-worn tactic of the so-called tort reformers who love to trot out examples of “outrageous” or “frivolous” lawsuits that were filed (A burglar tripped and fell and sued the landowner! A guy used a lawnmower to clip hedges and sued when it cut him!), while never following up with what happened the first time a motion to dismiss was filed.

  29. 29
    Comrade Javamanphil says:

    @El Cid: I don’t disagree. Just another example of taking the larger group and finding the outlier data point to smear it. (As pointed out by kay and aimai in the subsequent posts.) I certainly don’t defend Ward Churchill, just noticing the pattern. Being a conservative means either mistaking the anecdote as data or intentionally lying that the anecdote is the data.

    Edited so my parenthetical comment actually made sense.)

  30. 30
    kay says:

    @aimai:

    I think it’s more effective with faces and names and specifics. Newsmax had this: “Obama gives 1.25 billion reparations to black farmers”
    That’s directed to their rural base. I like that “gives”, too.
    That term, reparations, comes up again and again on Pigford. No one calls the damages the Wal Mart employees were seeking “reparations” although they were suing on discrimination.

  31. 31
    jazzgurl says:

    Conor is a pompous arrogant ‘little-minded’fellah. He has irritated me enormously with his blogs since Andrew was sick. I couldn’t wait for Andrew to return ,but then he went extreme on PBO’s budget hailing some GOP hack and having the nerve to call PBO coward and lacking leadership. I was so disgusted I simply hustled out of that site fast.
    I had to wonder if he called him all those names when healthcare and DADT was passed. Just askin’!

  32. 32
    Ash Can says:

    @mistermix:

    Thompson’s piece on the League was intelligent, tough and well-researched.

    This, and it bears highlighting and repeating. I know we’ve had fun here on occasion kicking LoOG around, but credit rightfully belongs where credit is due, and it’s great to see people stepping up to the plate on this issue, regardless of who the writer is or which blog it is. Kudos to Thompson.

  33. 33
    kay says:

    @JD Rhoades:

    this is an abnormally high rate of denial for a class action settlement, suggesting that the USDA is in fact reviewing claims quite carefully.

    That’s what I wondered, how it compared to other class actions.
    Any person approaching this honestly would have asked that question. It’s obvious.

  34. 34
    geg6 says:

    @Ash Can:

    I can only say “THIS” to what you said.

    And can I just give mistermix a shoutout for his reply to Conor’s whinging about DougJ being mean to him? Useful idiot, indeed. In fact, that’s being kind, IMHO.

  35. 35
    matoko_chan says:

    @El Cid: oh pardon…i thought you were bloviating. my bad. please correct my flawed analysis.
    matoko_chan – February 12, 2011 | 4:13 am · Link

    @El Cid: one point where you are WRONG is that Gaza will stay “locked up”. I betcha the border is going porous right NAOW. the MB doesnt recognize Israel, and considers the Blockade illegal….and the powerless hyperpower is not going to be able to threaten to cut off aid unless Egypt takes a knee, like that fucking WEC retard George Bush did over Hamas.
    I think you’re wrong about the rest of it too.
    Most egyptians just fucking hate Israel and who could blame them? Every Egyptian family has lost loved ones to wars with Israel.

    For three decades, Mubarak has maintained a steadfast alliance with the United States (lubricated by about $1.5 billion in annual aid) and presided over a cold-but-durable peace with Israel. Yet, Egyptian public opinion is overwhelmingly hostile toward both countries. In Pew’s 2010 global survey, just 17 percent of Egyptians expressed a favorable view of the United States; that tied with Pakistan and Turkey for the lowest rating the U.S. received in any of the 21 countries tested. Nearly three-fourths of Egyptians said they opposed U.S. antiterrorism efforts, and four-fifths wanted the U.S. to withdraw from Afghanistan.
    Egyptian attitudes toward Israel are even chillier, despite the landmark 1979 peace treaty. In a 2007 Pew survey, a stunning 80 percent of Egyptians said that the needs of the Palestinian people could never be met as long as Israel exists; just 18 percent said that the two societies could coexist fairly. That was far more pessimistic than the results in Turkey and Lebanon—and essentially no different than the attitude among the Palestinians themselves. “Of all the countries in the Middle East,” Walker says, “the population of Egypt is the most hostile to Israel.”

    why are you softpedalling this shit, el Campeador? are you a fifth columnist for the pre-tribs?

  36. 36
    Silver Owl says:

    “useful idiot” is being a bit kind

    That made me laugh. Thanks.

  37. 37
    matoko_chan says:

    why dont you ban me mistermix? that is what EDK and McMegan did.
    you can show solidarity with your homies.

  38. 38
    RalfW says:

    Conor also points to this addendum to the original Pigford post, where he prints without comment the letters of three readers and links to some other commentary on his post.
    __
    I don’t know if Conor is being sly or whether he is really this obtuse.

    Regular readers of Andrew’s blog will know that this is the house style. If Andrew (or in this case his surrogate) comes up wrong, the way Andrew deals with it since he doesn’t allow comments is to publish a few choice take-downs.

    I don’t find it obtuse. I think it’s responsive.

    Now, back to our regular program of calling Connor a dork, because that hasn’t changed.

  39. 39
    J.A.F. Rusty Shackleford says:

    The title is a Morrissey lyric/song. Do I win a prize?

  40. 40
    kdaug says:

    @matoko_chan:

    ditch liquor was elegant and succcint

    See now, generally, when people self-critique their own posts, they’re striving to make themselves more clear, or to expand on their meaning.

    Not to pat themselves on the back with misspelled compliments.

    Cudlips.

    (And for the record, I renounce the Mongol Hordes, Lyme disease, and dandruff).

  41. 41
    EconWatcher says:

    People like Conor are uncomfortable with liberalism based on the image they’ve created in their minds, so they’re in constant search for honest and sane conservatives to lead the way. They can’t wrap their heads around the fact that honest and sane conservatives are now at the center of the Democratic party.

    Look at the recent decision of the Obama administration to wind down Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. This is a major retreat from a policy going back to the New Deal (which I happen to agree with, YMMV). The admin looked at the hard facts and concluded that the policy as it has been was unsustainable, so they’re going to gradually lessen government involvement in the mortgage market. This is what honest and sane conservatism looks like (as opposed to standing on a street corner and shouting about ACORN conspiracies). But it doesn’t fit Conor’s preconceptions, so he goes looking for love in all the wrong places.

  42. 42

    Is M_C just trolling LOOG threads generally naow? I can haz cudlip stratification, kthanxbai!

  43. 43
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @arguingwithsignposts: m_c has a couple of hobbyhorses and, by god, she is going to ride them.

  44. 44
    polyorchnid octopunch says:

    @matoko_chan: I live in Canada; I’m an anglo-saxon Canadian. Total wasp by background. There’s lots of ways you can describe us, but “global paupers” isn’t one of them. We have a tremendous amount of capital, human and physical. The only problem we have is that we’re using it really badly right now, some for very bad ends. This is what I want to stop.

    But global paupers? No way.

  45. 45
    Ash Can says:

    @kay:

    I think what’s different about the current conservatives and last year’s model is how they’re willing to go after ordinary people to reach a political aim.

    With the added benefit of causing further division among the populace at large. By doing this, they’re not just holding up a prominent figure for derision and worse, they’re holding up people’s fellow citizens, community members, neighbors. They’re urging, and causing, ordinary people in all walks of life to view other people in their lives with suspicion and distaste. This would be an insidious tactic even in the case of a legitimate complaint, but as we all know, these people don’t have a very close relationship with legitimate issues. The evil and depravity of this approach cannot be understated.

  46. 46

    @kay: You are right, but as long as a Democrat is the President, they’ll make up some excuse. And likely just as ugly as this accusation of racism. It’s what Breitfart and company do.

  47. 47
    birthmarker says:

    @El Cid: I’ve always found the Ward Churchill meme particularly ludicrous, for the reasons you state so well. Who amongst average Americans would even know who he is?

    @kay: “Back door reparations.” I think we have a new winner! Short, pithy, most people will know what it means or can be easily educated. Fits in with the meme of hard working white people being taken advantage of by the Kenyan usurper.

    I’ve wondered what the new rallying cry would be. Social*ist is so last decade.

  48. 48
    Fuck U II: The Duckening says:

    Just accept that the subtext to every mytako-chin post is ‘reaction formation‘ and move along.

  49. 49
    martha says:

    @mistermix: A retort of beauty, that! Now I’m ready to face the day…

  50. 50
    Woodrowfan says:

    I hereby denounce Stalin, Lenin, Castro and Mao.

    there, I got THAT out of the way for today, so now I can complain about conservatives.

    Someone needs to remind Conor that “teaching the controversy” doesn’t really work when one side (his) is lying…

  51. 51
    Trinity says:

    @El Cid: Brilliant.

  52. 52
    kay says:

    @Ash Can:

    They’re urging, and causing, ordinary people in all walks of life to view other people in their lives with suspicion and distaste.

    Good point. Absolutely true. I wonder, though, how many people are like me. Because my gut is to identify with the target. I was completely sympathetic to the ACORN workers who were being secretly filmed at work, not in a “they got caught!” way but in a “how many low-level people are they secretly filming at work?” way. I mean, Jesus. The teachers weren’t even at work.

  53. 53
    JGabriel says:

    mistermix:

    The fact that Conor is apparently oblivious to his role pushing that lie forward into the mainstream media makes me think “useful idiot” is being a bit kind.

    I wouldn’t go that far. Calling someone like Beck, Hannity, or Limbaugh a useful idiot would be kind, since they are obviously wilful liars.

    In Conor’s case, it’s merely accurate.

    .

  54. 54
    kay says:

    @birthmarker:

    Google “National Review” and “Obama reparations”

  55. 55
    Fuck U II: The Duckening says:

    I would say that we should start calling her ‘Tanya’, but that would be a slight against spoiled little rich girls.

  56. 56
    Steeplejack says:

    Finally identified the image I get in my head when reading Matoko_chan.

    (DougJ, Cole and unidentified female in the background.)

  57. 57
    Woodrowfan says:

    But to the contrary, 30% of claims that were made under Pigford I were ultimately denied, and there’s no reason to believe that the rate will be any lower under Pigford II; this is an abnormally high rate of denial for a class action settlement, suggesting that the USDA is in fact reviewing claims quite carefully.

    what is the “normal” rate anyway??

  58. 58
    matoko_chan says:

    @J.A.F. Rusty Shackleford: i allus liked the warlock pinchers better……how about….
    Morrisey Mistermix Rides a Cockhorse
    @polyorchnid octopunch: im talking sheer numbahs, dude…the amount of human capital in the anglosaxon protestant demographic is miniscule….paupers.
    do the maffs

  59. 59
    matoko_chan says:

    @Steeplejack: unidentified female is asiangrrlmn.
    the demon hentai grin is a dead giveaway.

  60. 60
    Ash Can says:

    @kay: If the whole world were like you, it’d be a far better place. :) But I’d like to think that there are more people who identify with the hoodwinked that way. (And naturally, in my previous post, I made that common but obvious mistake — my last sentence should of course read “overstated,” not “understated.”)

  61. 61
    birthmarker says:

    @kay: I don’t waste my beautiful mind on such activities!

  62. 62
    Steeplejack says:

    @matoko_chan:

    Heh. Touché.

  63. 63
    Ash Can says:

    @JGabriel: Willful liars aren’t useful idiots, they’re perpetrators. The useful idiots are the ones who accept their lies as facts, without question, and repeat them.

  64. 64
    matoko_chan says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: well im banned at LoOG, so i can only troll their threads here.
    Please note, EDK has never retracted his fetus=slave meme.
    they dont retract.
    also note, mistermix is trying to rehabilitate LoOG in general and Thompson in particular after they showed their ass so exquisitely on the apes discussing philosophy/conservatives discussing science thread.
    i wonder if the Master Troll took any heat over that.
    :)

  65. 65
    kay says:

    @Ash Can:

    I think a lot of people are like that. Because teachers are paid by the state doesn’t mean “we” own their every waking moment.
    It’s creepy to follow ordinary people around, filming them, on some gut-level. Ugh. The thought of Breibart in his basement viewing and editing that tape of Sherrod’s speech. It’s malicious and disturbing.

  66. 66
    Lee Stranahan says:

    Conor (and hence Mark) make zero mention of my 2+ month work on the Pigford story, nor do they make any reference to 16+ hours of first hand audio and video material we have.

    They have the case completely wrong. They are actually backing the (racist) USDA against the black farmers.

    If anyone has questions, please feel free to contact me.

  67. 67
    Roger Moore says:

    @JD Rhoades:

    the so-called tort reformers who love to trot out examples of “outrageous” or “frivolous” lawsuits that were filed (A burglar tripped and fell and sued the landowner! A guy used a lawnmower to clip hedges and sued when it cut him!), while never following up with what happened the first time a motion to dismiss was filed.

    It turns out that often they can’t follow up to see what happened the first time a motion to dismiss was filed because the “case” was fictitious to start with. It’s a perfect example of just how bad the whole tort reform movement is. When your best argument relies on completely made up shit to prove its point, this is a sign that you are arguing the wrong side. Of course that never stopped the Libertarian Rand worshipers, but there you go.

  68. 68
    Alwhite says:

    TNC put up a comment that he would have to read Poor Conor’s post & I was amazed that, by and large, the commenters did not rip the posting apart. The dipshit himself even appears for a few feeble attempts at self-justification and people are way too nice to him.

    I am coming to the conclusion that by being nice & not calling a liar a liar we are encouraging his behavior. That is at the base of all the bullshit at Atlantic – we assume we are dealing with reasonable people who will, once shown they are wrong, correct themselves. But they never do. Its just one long case of ‘gastritis’ over there for most of them. Long past time to stop being polite.

  69. 69
    matoko_chan says:

    @kdaug: but the Golden Horde was pure awesomesauce.
    you should read at stephenson’s latest project, his interactive novel site, the Mongoliad.

  70. 70
    matoko_chan says:

    @Alwhite: this.
    im fucking sick of politesse.
    and those glibertarian fucktards just exploit it to slop the masses with more conservative ditch liquor.
    and Cole and mistermix are so desperate to find some sanity on the right they fall for it every time.
    sukkahs.

  71. 71
    Roger Moore says:

    @Steeplejack:

    (DougJ, Cole and unidentified female AsiangrlMN in the background.)

    FTFY

  72. 72
    JGabriel says:

    @Ash Can:

    Willful liars aren’t useful idiots, they’re perpetrators. The useful idiots are the ones who accept their lies as facts, without question, and repeat them.

    Yes, exactly. Which is why it would be kind to call a wilful liar merely a useful idiot, while it’s accurate to say of Conor.

    To say it’s “kind” to call Conor a useful idiot is to imply that he’s worse than an idiot, which I think, in this instance, is inaccurate.

    .

  73. 73
    Joseph Nobles says:

    Hey, Lee Stranahan, Breitbart’s latest “progressive” flunkie, has shown up at the League, yammering on about his 14+ hours of video. Good times.

  74. 74
    Ailuridae says:

    @kay:

    I’m assuming “last year’s model” isn’t literal here, right?

  75. 75
    matoko_chan says:

    @Alwhite: TNC has been infected with the politesse corruption….. Weigel and Douthat are his “friends” and he admires their “work”.

  76. 76
    mistermix says:

    @Lee Stranahan: Here’s a question – why are you shilling for an obvious liar like Andrew Breitbart?

  77. 77
    kay says:

    @Ailuridae:

    No, it’s not. I just went and looked at TLOOG. They’re now claiming they seek the truth only to compensate what they’re calling “real” black farmers. The fake black farmers got money that was intended for the real black farmers.

    This was actually a civil rights issue, for conservatives :)

    It’s evolving. The story keeps changing.

  78. 78
    matoko_chan says:

    @Lee Stranahan: lol you got the signal.
    you and Breitbart cant make the blackfolk vote republican and you cant turn off the racism in the base after 50 years of race baiting.
    this is all you need to know about Stranahan and Brietbart.
    annnnd the demographic timer goes tick…tick….tick……
    muhahahaha

  79. 79
    Joseph Nobles says:

    @Joseph Nobles: Oh, look, he’s here as well, LOL.

  80. 80
    Ailuridae says:

    @kay:

    That save me from mentioning Graeme Frost.

    I ask this because of a pretty simple observation I have made over the years – nearly all libertarians initial entry into the field is based pretty obviously around racial resentment. If people are surprised that Conor’s immediate instinct was to take the Pigford bait they need to understand that libertarianism not only programs him to do that, but the roots of why he is a libertarian are also there.

  81. 81
    Elvis Elvisberg says:

    @Lee Stranahan:

    Conor (and hence Mark) make zero mention of my 2+ month work on the Pigford story, nor do they make any reference to 16+ hours of first hand audio and video material we have.

    Presumably it smells of rich mahogany.

    Are you arguing that fraudulent claims are submitted, or that they are accepted by the court? What are the denial rates of the claims in these cases? How does that compare to other similar cases?

  82. 82
    IM says:

    @Lee Stranahan:

    Pigford I was in 1997. Thirteen years ago, and now you suddenly develop an interest in discrimination against black farmers. Funny.

    And stop you handwaving at your “hours” of video and audio material (no documents?) If you have a case, make your case. Put up or shut up.

  83. 83
    Ailuridae says:

    @Alwhite:

    I am coming to the conclusion that by being nice & not calling a liar a liar we are encouraging his behavior. That is at the base of all the bullshit at Atlantic – we assume we are dealing with reasonable people who will, once shown they are wrong, correct themselves. But they never do. Its just one long case of ‘gastritis’ over there for most of them. Long past time to stop being polite.

    A skeptical eye would point out that this is no different than what BJ readers deal with in relation to Kain’s posts.

    BJ front pagers can mock McMegan all they want but they post alongside and XY McMegan who never corrects himself and has the same corporatist instincts.

  84. 84
    IM says:

    And if the standard was that low, why were 30% of claim rejected?

  85. 85
    Ash Can says:

    @JGabriel: I getcha. Good point.

  86. 86
    Ailuridae says:

    @mistermix:

    Here’s a question – why are you shilling for an obvious liar like Andrew Breitbart?

    Because he, too, is a useful idiot.

  87. 87
    mistermix says:

    @Lee Stranahan: Lee, I asked you a bunch of questions over at LoOG, and you ducked them all. And, no, 14 hours of video is not a response. Make your case or STFU.

  88. 88
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    ‘Libertarian’ is as much a marketing term as the name of a certain German political party founded in the 1920’s which came to power in 1933 was.

    It’s really about neo-feudalism. Its followers imagine that they will be the new feudal lords of a new order.

  89. 89
    rdldot says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: I don’t think that’s their ultimate goal, but it is the ultimate result.

  90. 90
    Ash Can says:

    @Lee Stranahan: Unlike, evidently, some of your other audiences, we aren’t brain-dead here, unfortunately for you. Based on your positively stellar performance over at LoOG backpedaling, smokescreening, and moving the goalposts all over hell, you’ll understand why we’ll tell you here that you’re full of shit and not worth wasting our time on, and that’s putting it mildly. And everyone else here, that part where he invites us to ask questions? Don’t bother; he won’t answer them. He can’t.

  91. 91
    Ailuridae says:

    @mistermix:

    Now imagine how those of us feel who have tried to engage Kain on his factual inaccuracies over the last six months feel.

  92. 92
    db says:

    This whole smackdown is another demonstration that a useless idiot is preferable to a useful idiot.

  93. 93
    Sebastian Dangerfield says:

    Well, I got my vaccinations up to date and took a little dip in Stranahan’s fetid waters. Even sampled some of the videos on offer. Not first-hand, not evidence, unless you count some guy saying that some unidentified people are doing bad things.

    As for the “we’re fighting for the real black farmers” horseshit, just don a pith helmet with a mosquito net and head into the comments to see that that’s clearly not the message beaming out to the base. A representative entry follows:

    I’m just glad I never have to feel sorry for another Black Person over that whole Slavery thing.
    They have all been paid, we (the White Race and Black Race) are even.
    The Money saved on Affirmative Action alone, because there is no need for Affirmative Action now, will pay the Taxpayers back in a few years time.

  94. 94
    Ash Can says:

    @Sebastian Dangerfield: Thank you for braving the cesspool and reporting back. I’d love to see the Sherrod suit take Breitbart’s despicable ass to the cleaners and hang it way out to dry for all the world to see — not that he or his simpering minions will learn anything from it, but as an example to everyone else, illustrating that in a just and civilized society there are consequences to be paid for fucking people over.

  95. 95
    Cat Lady says:

    @Sebastian Dangerfield:

    Who could’ve predicted that a Breitbart collaborator would be a lying fuckstick?

  96. 96
    rikryah says:

    they don’t have a problem that these farmers, proved in a court of law, the systemic financial discrimination and blatant racism of the USDA. to them, that’s irrelevant. and that that discrimination had consequences against the Black farmers, many of whom lost their farms as a result of said discrimination.

    of course it is, because even after Black folks prove what we already know, it’s in our imaginations.

  97. 97
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Cat Lady:

    Condi Rice never would have seen that coming, for sure.

  98. 98
    birthmarker says:

    @Ash Can: I hope Sherrod has never spit on her cat or kicked her dog. I am the ultimate CT who is not above thinking there could be a setup going on. Just in time for the 2012 elections.

  99. 99
    elm says:

    In Conor’s defense:


    Why would only an unreasonable person trust one’s ideological compatriots (whom you know to have expended far more effort into understanding a given issue than you have) more than one trusts a group of self-appointed experts whom one has never encountered and who you know to have a vastly different set of priorities than you?

    Just because all the facts are easily available and all point against Conor’s case doesn’t make Conor unreasonable, does it?

    What if Conor’s father worked in a “sufficiently intellectually rigorous” field and told him that all the Pigford claimants were fraudulent, strapping young buck welfare queens? Wouldn’t that be enough reason to dismiss the actual evidence?

  100. 100
    Another Commenter at Balloon Juice (fka Bella Q) says:

    @Joseph Nobles: Not only that, but here too. Lucky us.

  101. 101
    Joseph Nobles says:

    @Another Commenter at Balloon Juice (fka Bella Q): He wasn’t here for very long. Lucky us.

  102. 102
    Another Commenter at Balloon Juice (fka Bella Q) says:

    @Sebastian Dangerfield: You’re a brave brave man. Thanks for the report. I don’t have the shots, or the patience. Oh, but I’d love to read the depositions in the Breitbart defamation action. (Who am I kidding? I’d pay to take a deposition in it)

  103. 103
    Ash Can says:

    @Joseph Nobles: I think he just did a hit-and-run here because he knew he’d have to go crawling all over his basement office floor collecting all his teeth if he stuck around here. You all did an admirable job on him at LoOG, and I was surprised he stuck around there as long as he did. It’s obvious that he (and shitwits like him) travel in sycophantic circles; he was utterly unable to even begin to defend his bullshit. He invites questions, twice, then falls off his tricycle at the first one. Beautiful. And typical.

  104. 104
    Howlin Wolfe says:

    @matoko_chan: Mokato-chan robot? Loggorhoea machina!!

  105. 105
    asiangrrlMN says:

    This was an excellent post by Thompson. And, a good thread. Until Jason pulled out the “We are utterly civilized” policy and made a gratuitous slam on BJ. Still. Point is well taken.

    As for Stranahan, I have to say that if a project you’re doing involves working with Breitbart, yur doin’ it RONG!” And, how embarrassing for you that you can’t even defend yourself against the simplest questioning.

    @Roger Moore: Ha! I wish I were that cute and sassy.

    @matko_chan: You made me laugh for once. Good on you!

    @Steeplejack: See what you started with the Cowboy BeBop?

  106. 106
    matoko_chan says:

    @Ailuridae:

    A skeptical eye would point out that this is no different than what BJ readers deal with in relation to Kain’s posts.
    BJ front pagers can mock McMegan all they want but they post alongside an XY McMegan who never corrects himself and has the same corporatist instincts.

    Yup.
    And DougJ trolled the shit out of LoOG on their “science” posts, and totally set them up with his “questions”.
    Now mistermix is trying to rehabilitate the loogies.
    im not falling for it, mistermix.
    and no one else should either.

  107. 107
    matoko_chan says:

    @mistermix: you still dont get it dumbass.
    they are all the same.
    EDK, Conor, Douchebag, Breitbart, Sully, McMegan ARE THE SAME IDEOLOGY WITH DIFFERENT HAIR.
    and you’re a dumb cudlip that falls for their shit everytime.

  108. 108
    El Cid says:

    @matoko_chan: You are insane. You never fucking know how to tell the difference between what someone else writes and the purple flashes you see in your eyes in the dark.

    I did not address any of the topics you challenge me on, except for my prediction that Gaza would remain a hell-hole. Disagree, but that’s certainly something which would be revealed only in time, and would be possible to analyze if the new government of Egypt lends to the likelihood of significantly changed Gaza policy.

    On everything else, like normal, you have no fucking clue what I said, you have no fucking interest in dealing with shit that I wrote, and you think that your hallucinations suddenly become relevant if you use the name “Campeador”.

    On the other hand, the Crusades were awesome. We definitely should have killed more Muslims, because they are genetically inferior. If only I could have been with my namesake as he stabbed his sword over and over and over again into the Moors’ tender skins, and washed myself in the blood of the dead infidels. I wish I could have been there laughing when the Muslims fled Granada.

    The Muslim Brotherhood has never existed and is just made up by Islamists who enjoy wearing pink underwear. Anyone who denies this is on the side of the homophobes, and you will lose this battle too.

    And why won’t you acknowledge the nation of Cameroon’s name? What, you want to keep them in pre-independence Bila Matoko?

    No, you run like a coward when I point out your hatred for Cameroon, eh “Matoko”? When will you have the courage to admit you are no different than the Protestant British and Catholic French who took Cameroon from the Germans but kept it from the oppressed?

    Why do you serve imperialism? Scared to answer? Eh, “Matoko”?

  109. 109
    D. says:

    @arguingwithsignposts:
    The farmer is NEAR!

    LMBAOOOOO!!

  110. 110
    brantl says:

    @matoko_chan: Go piss yourself, it would be truth in advertising. Good lord.

  111. 111
    brantl says:

    @JGabriel:

    The fact that Conor is apparently oblivious to his role pushing that lie forward into the mainstream media makes me think “useful idiot” is being a bit kind.

    It also pre-supposes that they are useful, which can’t be substantiated.

  112. 112
    dollared says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: Ooh! Ooh! Colin Powell neither. But I think Clarence Thomas does get it. He’s in too deep for deniability.

  113. 113
    matoko_chan says:

    @El Cid: lawl….which part of this are you denying?

    Gaza, unless some Egyptian policy changes, will stay locked up and maybe occasionally get blowed up again.

    ummm….the MB does not recognize Israel, and considers the Blockade illegal. As do the egyptian people.
    In Pew’s 2010 global survey, just 17 percent of Egyptians expressed a favorable view of the United States; that tied with Pakistan and Turkey for the lowest rating the U.S. received in any of the 21 countries tested. Nearly three-fourths of Egyptians said they opposed U.S. antiterrorism efforts, and four-fifths wanted the U.S. to withdraw from Afghanistan.
    In a 2007 Pew survey, a stunning 80 percent of Egyptians said that the needs of the Palestinian people could never be met as long as Israel exists; just 18 percent said that the two societies could coexist fairly.

    i think you are just another old garden variety islamophobe. and i think it bugs the everliving crap out of you when i assert that the protestant tradition of anti-intellectualism is contributing to the stratification of cognitive ability on the Right.

    On the other hand, the Crusades were awesome. We definitely should have killed more Muslims, because they are genetically inferior. If only I could have been with my namesake as he stabbed his sword over and over and over again into the Moors’ tender skins, and washed myself in the blood of the dead infidels. I wish I could have been there laughing when the Muslims fled Granada.

    __
    if i was black, and your namesake was Nathan Bedford Forrest would you say the same sort of thing?
    Protestantism is anti-intellectual.

  114. 114
    matoko_chan says:

    @brantl: dont adhom me, refute me.
    betcha you cant.
    :)

  115. 115
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @matoko_chan: Blue trees furiously slumber.

  116. 116
    Steeplejack says:

    @asiangrrlMN:

    Hey, two people–including Matoko_chan herself–identified the woman in the picture as “AsiangrrlMN.” You famous! You pretty and people like you.

  117. 117
    asiangrrlMN says:

    @Steeplejack: Heh. Except, I look NOTHING like that!

  118. 118
    matoko_chan says:

    @Steeplejack: no, i dentified her by the slanty eyes and the demon-hentai grin.

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