Free Speech, But Not Without Consequences

This is the statement of Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik that Jon Kyl can’t abide. Kyl thinks that his statement was “inappropriate for a law enforcement briefing”.

Dupnik made no direct connection between hateful rhetoric and the shooter. But he did reference the climate of hatred that’s been stirred up in Arizona. The broken windows, the death threats and all the other awful stuff that happens in this environment of hate takes time away from more productive law enforcement work. And, even though this particular unstable individual may have been influenced by his own brain chemistry more than any other factor, there are many other unstable individuals who may act against those who they’re told are less than human. So, it’s completely appropriate for Dupnik to speak to the climate of hatred in Arizona, and his eloquence during this clearly emotional, off-the-cuff statement is remarkable.






209 replies
  1. 1
    sloan says:

    Gabby Giffords had her office trashed after the health care vote and Democrat Raul Grijalva in the next district received death threats and his office windows were shot out. A protester was arrested when he dropped his loaded weapon at a Giffords event last year.

    Tea Partiers openly carried weapons at events with the President. Republican Sharon angle demanded “second amendment solutions”. Sarah Palin literally put Gifford in her cross-hairs (and colored 3 resigning Dems blood red). The “tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants” quote was often found at Tea Party rallies. Her Republican opponent invited conservatives to play with M-16s at an anti-Gifford fundraiser at a shooting range.

    Tea Partiers openly threatened violence against Democrats: We came unarmed (this time)

    Everyone remembers this and knows that it happened. We all lived through it and watched it happen in real time. Republicans can’t wish away our memories by raging at liberals or blaming Obama.

  2. 2
    El Cid says:

    The Tea Party is tired of all this complete repression of them by the horrible left by violence clearly committed by a leftist.

    TPN founder Judson Phillips, in an article linked off the e-mail “The shooting of Gabrielle Giffords and the left’s attack on the Tea Party movement,” described the shooter as “a leftist lunatic” and Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik as a “leftist sheriffwho “was one of the first to start in on the liberal attack.”
    __
    Phillips urged tea party supporters to blame liberals for the attack on centrist Democratic Rep. Gabrielle Giffords of Arizona, who was shot through the head and is now fighting for her life, as a means of defending the tea party movement’s recent electoral gains.
    __
    “The hard left is going to try and silence the Tea Party movement by blaming us for this,” he wrote. Clinton used the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing to “blame conservative talk radio, especially Rush Limbaugh” and “The tactic worked then, backing conservatives off and possibly helping to ensure a second Clinton term.”
    __
    “The left is coming and will hit us hard on this. We need to push back harder with the simple truth. The shooter was a liberal lunatic. Emphasis on both words,” he wrote.

    This was carried out by a leftist, which you can tell because it was a leftist, and also because leftists questioned Tea Party rhetoric, and anyone who criticizes Tea Party rhetoric is obviously a leftist trying to silence our free speech, and we’re pretty sure that if we just keep repeating this shit just like we did with Goldbutt’s nonsense about Hitler being leftist, it will at least muddy the waters of discussion because the shooter was obviously a leftist.

  3. 3
    BGinCHI says:

    I’m sure Kyl has also criticized Joe Arpaio for all the horrible things he’s done to prisoners in Maricopa County.

    Both sides do it, after all.

    After Kyl almost saved us from a treaty that makes the world safer from nuclear war, it’s shocking he’d hurt his credibility this way.

    Hell with it: Fuck Jon Fucking Kyl.

  4. 4

    were there no other versions of that video besides a Politico one?

    (and co-sign BGinCHI)

  5. 5

    The sheriff is, indeed, eloquent.

    And quite right, too.

    If you would like to tell the sheriff how right he is, try this link:

    http://pimasheriff.org/contacts/

    There is an email form, address, and phone numbers.

  6. 6
    Cat Lady says:

    Methinks Kyl doth protest too much. Not that the asshat will suffer any consequences for his free speech.

  7. 7
    ruemara says:

    drop a word of encouragement to the good Sheriff
    Pima County Sheriff
    1750 E. Benson Highway
    Tucson, AZ 85714-1758

    And to his bosses, although I have no idea if this is an elected vs hired position, but it couldn’t hurt.

    Pima County Board of Supervisors
    130 West Congress Street, 11th Floor
    Tucson, Arizona 85701

  8. 8
    Ana Gama says:

    Via Sully, tweet of the day:

    “necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear surveying equipment shall not be infringed.”

  9. 9
    scav says:

    Well, you see, Sheriff Clarence Dupnik’s words can be interpreted in a way that hurts some people’s feelings of being perfectly correct at all times. Such rhetoric is harmful and its implications are to be considered and guarded against. Unlike other rhetoric which is free and unlimited and without real-world repercussions and is the defining characteristic of this Great Nation.

  10. 10
    Joshua Norton says:

    That’s one thing that escapes the wingnut reptile brain as they mindlessly shout “free speech” every time they open up their gaping maws. Free speech doesn’t mean freedom from its consequences. Nor does it invalidate my free speech to call you a mindless idealogue and full time rat fucker.

    Deal with it.

  11. 11
    Comrade Javamanphil says:

    Crazed anti-government shooter is clearly a big-government, gun control leftist! Sky is green, ocean is yellow, war is peace, etc…

  12. 12
    Yutsano says:

    @Ana Gama: Was that pourmecoffee? It sounds like his work.

  13. 13
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Joshua Norton: Ding, ding, ding.

  14. 14
    El Cid says:

    Did you all hear that the shooter was a leftist? He is because I heard it. So it’s true. Also everyone else who complains about the shooting is a leftist. It’s all a plot against the Tea Pary.

  15. 15
    Jay C says:

    @BGinCHI

    Hell with it: Fuck Jon Fucking Kyl.

    Y’know: if the initials didn’t have another, more prestigious reference; referring to Senator Kyl henceforward as “JFK” would be a great idea….

  16. 16

    @Ana Gama:

    the right of the People to keep and bear surveying equipment shall not be infringed

    Cute!

  17. 17
    BGinCHI says:

    @Linda Featheringill: Thanks for that Linda!

    Just sent a supportive comment. I’d guess that it really does matter to hear from people, so if you have time, folks, go and submit something.

  18. 18
    El Cid says:

    @Joshua Norton: Right wingers remember that famous ruling by Oliver Wendell Holmes saying that only conservatives can trap people in a theater which is on fire.

  19. 19
    fasteddie9318 says:

    I give up. How does one get through to these psychopaths? They can’t walk themselves back after real, violent tragedy strikes their political opponents. What does it take?

  20. 20
    schrodinger's cat says:

    mistermix@top
    Oh noes now the Ms Manners of BJ (Extremely Dull Kain) will come along, to scold you, clutching his invisible pearls about how it is intemperate to speak out and blame conservatives/Republicans for their own speech/actions.

  21. 21
    maya says:

    Hyl Kyl should see if Jan Brewer can get Pima County BoS to fire Sheriff Dupnik a la Sarah Palin troopergate methods. We must put limits on free speech, but only on the other guy.

    And if leftists were really behind all this wouldn’t Molotov cocktails be the weapon of choice?

  22. 22
    amorphous says:

    Seriously, Arizona probably dropped into the bottom 5 in my personal list of states I’d want to live in. I’d never live there, but there are many other states that I’d also never live in.

  23. 23
    Ana Gama says:

    @Yutsano: No, Rob Trucks.

  24. 24
    BGinCHI says:

    @Jay C: Yepper. And FJFK is even worse.

    How about FUCKYL.

  25. 25
    KCinDC says:

    Republicans have already made clear that accusations of racism are a far worse problem than racism is. Now they want us to know that the real outrage in our political conversation is not violent rhetoric, but condemnations of violent rhetoric.

  26. 26
    J says:

    @scav: Well said!

  27. 27
    dmsilev says:

    @Ana Gama: They’ll pry my theodolite out from my cold dead hands!

    Seriously, we’ll now have a litmus test of whether a person is even vaguely worth listening to. If they say that Palin’s sudden retroactive interest in precision mapping equipment is plausible, you can cross them off the list.

    dms

  28. 28
    Tom says:

    Watch about 30 seconds at both 4:30 and 8:00 of this early ’90s documentary about hate groups in America, then tell me that it’s inappropriate for people to criticize Palin and others for “take back America,” “real Americans” and “reload” rhetoric coupled with “targeting” members of Congress.

    http://video.google.com/videop.....211611015#

  29. 29
    Professor says:

    It is undertood that the gunman has taken the 5th. Why are the dittoheads NOT screaming for the ‘Cheney’ or enhanced interogation method to be applied? Idiots!

  30. 30
    BGinCHI says:

    @maya: First we throw Himalayan salt in their eyes and daze them with a reading of Gramsci, untranslated.

  31. 31
    El Cid says:

    Chip Berlet (long term researcher of the right wing and its violent and conspiratorial sides) terms the right wing targeting of figures with rhetoric encouraging violence as “becking“, after the major national network-supported inflammatory right wing paranoid conspiracy theorist, Glenn Beck.

  32. 32
    JScott says:

    The Tea Party get a dose of their own medicine, and, quelle surprise, find it unpalatable.

  33. 33
    Mark S. says:

    There you go, goopers, start attacking law enforcement officials after this horrific tragedy. That will get the public on your side.

  34. 34
    Morbo says:

    Get this man a Moore nomination! It is named after him, after all.

  35. 35
    BGinCHI says:

    @Professor: Are the teatards against that amendment?

    I can’t keep track.

  36. 36
    schrodinger's cat says:

    @dmsilev: I already have the list, people who fell for the Bush propaganda to take us into Iraq and have not yet changed their opinion even after all the rationales for going to war turned out not to be true.

  37. 37
    Joseph Nobles says:

    JK,FH?

  38. 38

    @dmsilev:

    Palin’s sudden retroactive interest in precision mapping equipment

    heh, indeedy.

  39. 39
  40. 40
    BGinCHI says:

    @Mark S.: They’ve been doing this for years now (including attacking law enforcement and firefighters as public employees and union members who should have fewer rights).

    Political consequences for this? Zero.

  41. 41
    J says:

    @efgoldman: Precisely, and the truth is that Liberals and progressives are equally guilty, more so in fact, because everyone knows that when good conservative real Americans do something that appears to be objectionable, they are to be excused if ‘the Left’ did the same, or are accused of doing the same by good conservative real Americans, which is the same thing really, even though it’s was a terrible thing when ‘the Left’ did it, even if they didn’t really do it. And, anyway, Hippies spat on soldiers returning from Vietnam.

  42. 42
    BGinCHI says:

    @Morbo: That’s perfect.

    God forbid stupid, overpaid Candy Crowley asked Lamar Alexander that question on her show.

    Why doesn’t Moore have a talk show? I don’t always care for him, but we are just being so spectacularly failed by asshats who have talk shows and then don’t have any mental agility, or do the research, to get people to tell some truth.

  43. 43
    numbskull says:

    @Linda Featheringill: Thanks, I sent them a note of agreement and encouragment, but most of all, one of sympathy.

  44. 44
    Drouse says:

    @fasteddie9318: Something along the lines of The Boy in the Striped Pajamas

  45. 45
    Comrade Luke says:

    OK, I’ve heard a lot about these comments, and now I finally watched the video.

    What exactly is wrong with what the guy said? He went out of his way to not call out specific people or organizations, and was just making a general comment in the heat of the moment.

    What’s the issue?

  46. 46
    4tehlulz says:

    @fasteddie9318: Convincing a teahadist to acknowledge reality is like pissing into an ocean of piss.

  47. 47

    @maya:

    And if leftists were really behind all this wouldn’t Molotov cocktails be the weapon of choice?

    I understand they are still considered effective in certain circles. :-)

  48. 48
    freelancer says:

    Sully whiplash:

    Behold what a Senator cannot say on the record:

    A senior Republican senator, speaking anonymously in order to freely discuss the tragedy, told POLITICO that the Giffords shooting should be taken as a “cautionary tale” by Republicans.
    “There is a need for some reflection here – what is too far now?” said the senator. “What was too far when Oklahoma City happened is accepted now. There’s been a desensitizing. These town halls and cable TV and talk radio, everybody’s trying to outdo each other.”

    Marvel at this phrase:

    “Speaking anonymously in order to freely discuss the tragedy.”

    We elect them for this?

    What is this “We” shit? I don’t vote for fucking Republicans Andy, and I don’t presume to speak or question on behalf of the American Public either.

  49. 49
    Mike Kay says:

    on the news, Lamar Alexander, to his credit, says the violent rhetoric must stop, but then dickwads and global warming deniers George Will and Dick Armey insisted violent rhetoric plays no role in actual violence.

  50. 50

    Acceptable: “No, they are not going to like it, but they should it. They’ve known all along that using the reconciliation procedure is a declaration of war. And we are not going to sit back and do nothing about it.” – Sen. Kyl on a procedural matter related to the Health Care Reform bill

    Unacceptable: “When you look at unbalanced people, how they respond to the vitriol that comes out of certain mouths about tearing down the government. The anger, the hatred, the bigotry that goes on in this country is getting to be outrageous.” – Sheriff Dupnik on a shooting spree in his jurisdiction that left several dead or seriously wounded.

  51. 51
    MikeJ says:

    @Comrade Luke: Kyl has a guilty conscience.

  52. 52
    J says:

    @Morbo: Yes, but Michael Moore hates America and Americans, except for the unemployed like those in Roger and Me is about, and those he would like to have better health care, and those whom he wants to spare from gun violence, or those being shipped off to fight in insane wars in Iraq, whereas Sarah Palin loves Americans, except Americans like me and you, and those who aren’t er umm white, those who live on the East Coast, or the West Coast, or Chicago, or can read or voted for Obama, or the Americans she’d like to see shot–just in fun, of course–or tortured. That’s why she’s a real American, and Michael Moore, and anyone who, however much they may disagree with him about something, have ever felt a particle of sympathy for anything he’s ever said aren’t.

  53. 53
    BGinCHI says:

    @Thoughtful Black Co-Citizen: The difference is that one is a dedicated, smart public servant who is on the front lines of the consequences of all the violent discourse and what comes of it.

    And the other is a douchbag Senator.

    FUCKYL.

  54. 54

    @Linda Featheringill: Done. I am sure he’s going to get tons of hate mail, so it’s good to let him know that there are people who applaud him.

    Yes, we have rights in this country, including the freedom of speech. With those rights come responsibilities. It seems to me that too many people are forgetting the latter part.

  55. 55
    BGinCHI says:

    @J: Plus, he’s a fat man. But not in a jolly way like Dom Deluise.

    Oh, and his name rhymes with Gore.

  56. 56
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    Kyl is, to put it mildly (we wouldn’t want to be shrill or anything like that, you know) a worthless sack of wingtard shit.

  57. 57
    jazzgurl says:

    What does that say? I guess that he is the only adult in the room.
    If only…..the GOP would stop being so disgenous and attempt at, I can’t even say truth, er, attempt at conversations about what is! Ye gads.

  58. 58
    Ana Gama says:

    @Linda Featheringill: Thanks for that. Note sent.

  59. 59
    WaterGirl says:

    @BGinCHI: I sent one, too. Thanks.

  60. 60

    @Linda Featheringill: Great idea. At least one PalinDrone is encouraging his followers to send Dupnik nastygrams for his attack on the Tea Party.

    (You can use the googles to search Hill buzz + Sheriff Dupnik if you haven’t yet had your daily dose of assholery.)

  61. 61
    Dennis SGMM says:

    I’m sticking with my original post of several threads ago: by Tuesday night half of America will believe that Gabby Giffords is a Republican and that the shooter is a liberal Democrat.

  62. 62
    Mike Kay says:

    Leave it to Fixxed News.

    They’re crying that Sheriff Clarence Dupnik is politicizing the tragedy and – get this- inflaming the public.

    hahahhahahahah that’s rich, coming for fixxed news.

    To his great credit, Dupnik won’t back off

    (Scroll down for video)

    *

  63. 63
    WaterGirl says:

    @numbskull: Duh. I forgot to include my sympathies when I wrote the email. But I did thank him for being the kind of community leader that Gabby Giffords talked about a few months ago. She said it was community leaders and not just politicians that need to speak out against the vitriol.

  64. 64
    BGinCHI says:

    @WaterGirl: Thanks go to Linda. And thanks for sending.

  65. 65
    jazzgurl says:

    And to these men in suits who dress up and go to Congress everyday. ‘Suit and ties can’t cut the gig for moral decency’.

  66. 66
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @fasteddie9318:

    hey can’t walk themselves back after real, violent tragedy strikes their political opponents. What does it take?

    Rides in tumbrels, I fear.

  67. 67
    Maude says:

    @asiangrrlMN:
    There’s no freedom of speech in broadcasting.
    I want to see if any of the rightie radio hosts calm it down.
    What about the public airwaves. Why is Clear channel allowed to dominate them?

  68. 68
    harlana says:

    Has anyone had the stomach to watch Fox throughout all/some of this?

  69. 69

    @Maude: Well, I’m talking more in general. Free speech. But, as the sheriff said, there is a consequence to that speech. I highly doubt any rightwing talking head will change his/her rhetoric. In fact, I think they will double-down. It’s all they really have.

    @harlana: No. I can’t watch them on a good day, and this is definitely not one of those.

  70. 70
    mr. whipple says:

    And if leftists were really behind all this wouldn’t Molotov cocktails be the weapon of choice?

    If leftists were behind this they would have shown up(late) with paper mache’ puppet heads, became dejected immediately, and gone back home to bitch on the internet.

  71. 71
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: Eek! The left does it too. Both sides! Both sides!

  72. 72
    JPL says:

    @Linda Featheringill: I read earlier that the shooters mom works for the Board of Supervisors. Obviously, it does not change the fact that the sheriff should be supported.
    The tea party by their reaction is showing their true colors.

  73. 73

    Shorter fReichtards: The new sheriff’s a … Nazi!

  74. 74
    Frankie T. says:

    Jack Shafer at Slate has a predictably contrarian column criticizing Sheriff Dupnik’s comments and offering a “Defense of Inflamed Rhetoric.” (this is the headline of Shafer’s piece, presumably written by an editor at Slate). It’s a good example of why I stopped reading Slate years ago.

  75. 75
    handy says:

    @Frankie T.:

    Slate always annoyed me with their we’re-contrarian-to-be-contrarian nonsense. Goat boy is the worst of the bunch.

  76. 76
    Zuzu's Petals says:

    You knew it had to happen:

    Westboro Baptist Church, the Topeka church known for its inflammatory anti-gay protests, plans to picket the funerals of the six people gunned down in Arizona on Saturday.

    It’s like death triggers a certain kind of depravity in these people.

  77. 77

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    Hee-hee.

    Rides in tumbrels, I fear.

    Hey. These guys pine for an old fashioned world. Right?

    [chuckle.]

  78. 78
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Not to worry, I doubt if any wingtards understand what a tumbrel ride is all about. Or what a tumbrel is. Or any of the history I’m alluding to.

  79. 79
    Davis X. Machina says:

    @mr. whipple: Depends on how you feel about that whole Comintern-Third-International thing.

    After that it gets complicated. You have your Trotsky toddies, your Mao-tais, your Gramsci grogs, your Althusser aperatifs, your Habermas highballs, your Tito-tinis, your Long Island Iced Chés….

  80. 80
    The Raven says:

    I think the most likely outcome of this is a crackdown: more investigations, more policing, more censorship. Possibly deployment of porn scanners outside of airports. While Sheriff Dupnik blamed his local people, who he knows very well, FBI director Mueller has blamed the internet–us.

    It is difficult for me to see anything that is likely to lead to a reduction of hate speech. The Tea Party leadership shows no shame; I do not expect Murdoch to reign in Fox News or the Kochs to reign in the radical-right groups they fund.

    Nothing to see here, move along.

    Croak!

  81. 81
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: Good point.

  82. 82
    mistermix says:

    @harlana:

    Megyn Kelly dances around with the Sheriff, who gets the better of her (IMO) during this interview:

    http://video.foxnews.com/v/449.....t_id=87937

    (This is the same video that Mike Kay linked to above – missed that earlier. Worth watching.)

  83. 83
    Jager V. Wilfork says:

    This summer Arizona will allow unpermitted concealed carry of guns.

    I had a chance encounter in Phoenix last week with a retired Boston Police detective (he had a Pats jacket on) after chatting up the Patriots, Sox, Celts and Bruins he told me he thought Sheriff Joe’s Maricopa County Sheriff’s Department was the “most corrupt and unprofessional law enforcement agency he’d ever seen”. He said, “they spend their time trying to make trouble rather than preventing it”!

  84. 84

    @Zuzu’s Petals: I was hoping that was just a rumor. This is really going to get ugly. Damn them.

  85. 85

    @Davis X. Machina:

    #80.

    I shared this with my family and we all enjoyed it!

    Long Island Iced Ches?

  86. 86
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Davis X. Machina:

    Long Island Iced Chés….

    Dammit, I just spit my Mao-Tai all over my keyboard…

  87. 87
    Davis X. Machina says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: What little tumbrel-producing capacity we had went overseas in the late ’70’s. Pitchforks, well, we used to do pitchforks until 2002.

    But we still have significant torch-related programs.

  88. 88
    J says:

    @BGinCHI: Damn right! and he isn’t fat ilike Rush Limbaugh , who might seem–to people like you who hate America–to be low mean and hateful, but isn’t because he loves America and Americans, except those he doesn’t, like you and me and everyone we know, who aren’t real Americans anyway, because Sarah Palin and Rush Limbaugh hate them, and they love America and Americans, and the people Michael Moore doesn’t hate aren’t real Americans, because Michael Moore doesn’t hate them and he hates America, and anyway Rush Limbaugh isn’t fat, just big–gross, swollen, bursting–with the love of America and Americans, real ones that is. @Dennis SGMM: You’re probably right, but I’m not willing to bet that they won’t go for the ‘she brought it on herself’ line or ‘not that she had it coming, but …’. some of them anyway

  89. 89
    Maude says:

    @asiangrrlMN:
    As far as free speech in general, it would be good if the hate and violent speech wasn’t acceptable. My hope is that perhaps it might not be as much as it was before.
    Don’t know if you know, but Beck goes off the air in NYC on Jan. 17th. His ratings stank.

  90. 90
    Mike Kay says:

    @Frankie T.: see, even the libural Slate magazine absolves violent rhetoric.

    Shafer is glibertarian.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J.....rtarianism

  91. 91
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Davis X. Machina: I understand the French make a good tumbrel.

  92. 92
    mr. whipple says:

    @Davis X. Machina:

    Imagine the fighting over the speaking order. (Although the Iced Ches prefer to not speak at all but rather symbolize the oppression of the worker thru a 27 minute interpretative dance.)

  93. 93
    scav says:

    @Davis X. Machina:

    Pitchforks, well, we used to do pitchforks until 2002.

    Yeah, but we’ve repatriated the production of rusted pitchforks recently to BJ, no? I’m sure she can whip up a line of tumbrel driers in no time.

  94. 94

    @Maude: I’m glad about Beck. I agree that hate speech and all the hateful rhetoric should be shunned in our society. I just do not see how we go about effecting that change without a massive change in our societal underpinnings as well. Sorry to be such a Gloomy Gusset. Heh. That’s kinda funny.

    @scav: Yes. I will work overtime to get it done.

    @The Raven: This is true. We must stand up loudly, consistently, and fiercely.

  95. 95
    The Raven says:

    I just do not see how we go about effecting that change without a massive change in our societal underpinnings as well.

    On thing that doesn’t work is giving in to the haters. We can start from there.

  96. 96
    suzanne says:

    My senators make me want to de-louse.

    The saddest irony here is that Gabby was being talked about to run against FucKyl in 2 years. Sniffle.

  97. 97
    jk says:

    Mistermix,

    Jon Kyl’s reaction was disgusting, but to me, John McCain remains the more despicable senator from Arizona because if he hadn’t selected Palin to be his running mate, she’d still be Sarah Who? to 98% of the nation.

  98. 98

    @suzanne: How are you doing, suzanne?

  99. 99
    Jager V. Wilfork says:

    @jk:

    She’d still be harassing her ex-brother in law in Alaska, while Todd ran the statehouse

  100. 100
    freelancer says:

    Let me preface this by saying I’m not an anti-gun person. My family has guns, I grew up in the hunting culture and I don’t own any guns personally. That said, Rand Paul couldn’t be more tone deaf if he tried.

    Paul also said Sunday that calls for more restrictive gun laws shouldn’t play a part in the tragedy.
    “I don’t think that plays into this at all. I think they’re unrelated,” he said. “This is probably about a very sick individual and what should be done for that person.”
    “But the weapons don’t kill people, it’s he individual that kills — that killed these people.”

    Loughner incapacitated 20 people in a matter of seconds. He couldn’t have done that with any other type of weapon. Not with an ax or a knife or a crossbow or nunchakus. He wasn’t a Navy SEAL, he wasn’t Magneto, he was a nutcase weakling white boy. The weapon helps. And because of that, it’s not tyrrany to make sure that certain weapons stay out of the wrong hands. 20 lives, including a nine year old girl, is too high a price to pay for unrestricted/unregulated gun ownership.

  101. 101
  102. 102

    @freelancer: Agreed. It’s a lot harder to kill 6 people like that without a gun–especially the kind he had. There has to be middle ground in this gun debate.

  103. 103
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @freelancer: He couldn’t have done it with a bolt action rifle or double barreled shogun either. A semi-auto pistol with an extended magazine has only one purpose, the one it was used for on Saturday.

  104. 104
    Sko Hayes says:

    @mistermix:
    Cripes but Ms. Kelly is squirming around trying to find excuses for the violent rhetoric.
    Funny that she mentions his “speculative opinion”, and fails to remind viewers about all the speculative opinion that was rampant on Faux News after the Ft. Hood shooting.
    I just can’t watch the rest of it, but the sheriff stood his ground, good for him.
    I also dropped an email thanking him for taking a stand.

  105. 105
    HRA says:

    @harlana:

    G. has been watching Fox off and on since sometime yesterday after the regular channels (NBC, ABC, CNN, CBS) ticked him off by certain hosts and talking heads said “both sides incite people”. We have not had Fox on for at least 3 years. They were being pretty decent until Megan Kelly (?)
    went after the Sheriff Dupnik. G. shut them off again.

    Both of us watched him yesterday and today when he spoke about the atmosphere of hate and we agreed with him.

  106. 106
    MikeJ says:

    @Davis X. Machina: I’m drinking my Manahatta, named after the noble native Amerinds who were exploited by white European men.

  107. 107
    harlana says:

    @mistermix: Thank you for sharing that. I admire this man for speaking the truth and not backing down. Little twit anchor lady didn’t stand a chance.

  108. 108
    Sko Hayes says:

    @freelancer:
    I just now read a tweet retweeted by Rude Pundit:

    Guns don’t kill people. People in states without gun-purchase background checks & waiting periods kill people.

    I did hear that this guy had had a background check though, but not verified.

  109. 109
    jk says:

    @suzanne:

    “My senators make me want to de-louse.”

    You have my sympathies, but people living in Oklahoma have it pretty rough too between Tom Coburn and James Inhofe.

  110. 110
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Villago Delenda Est #67:

    *Rides in tumbrels, I fear.*

    Okay. This year for sure I’m learning to knit.

  111. 111

    “But the weapons don’t kill people, it’s he individual that kills—that killed these people.”

    I for one am impressed by Rand’s ability to hork up NRA slogans on command.

  112. 112
    harlana says:

    @Maude: Haha! Who knew??

  113. 113
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Thoughtful Black Co-Citizen: Technically, it is the bullet that kills the person.

  114. 114
    The Raven says:

    @Thoughtful Black Co-Citizen: “I for one am impressed by Rand’s ability to hork up NRA slogans on command.”

    They’re like hairballs, aren’t they?

  115. 115
    scav says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: so are we really really really sure the 2nd covers ammo?

  116. 116
    jk says:

    @freelancer:

    If Jack Conway hadn’t got caught up in that stupid fucking Aqua Buddha nonsense, he might have won that goddamn Senate race. I hope Conway’s wife punches him in the neck once in a while to remind him that he blew it big time.

  117. 117

    @jk:
    don’t let the people of Kentucky off that lightly.

  118. 118
  119. 119
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @scav: That is an interesting thought. Easy to get guns, but hard to get ammo?

  120. 120

    @Omnes Omnibus: But throwing that sucker hard enough is REALLY difficult.

  121. 121
    JPL says:

    @mistermix: Thank you for the link. The sheriff did handle himself well and the people of Tuscon should be proud of him.

  122. 122
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Davis X. Machina #80:

    After that it gets complicated. You have your Trotsky toddies, your Mao-tais, your Gramsci grogs, your Althusser aperatifs, your Habermas highballs, your Tito-tinis, your Long Island Iced Chés….

    …. your Anarchist Alexanders, your Soviet Sours, your Roosky Rickeys, your Castro Coolers, your Leninist liqueurs…..

  123. 123
    jk says:

    @arguingwithsignposts:

    I don’t follow Kentucky politics, I just remember that before Jack Conway descended into the rabbit hole of Aqua Buddha with his ridiculous and idiotic tv ad, polls had him within 5 points of Rand Paul.

  124. 124
    Davis X. Machina says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: We ran that as a debate case years ago. Daniel Patrick Moynihan may have tossed it out there — I can’t remember.

    It had three advantages. It was unexpected. It could be shown to work, at least as much as you could show it without an actual pilot program somewhere. And it kept the affirmative team from violating the state constitution.

  125. 125

    @jk:
    the fact that rand paul was even considered a serious candidate should say all you need there.

  126. 126
    jk says:

    @asiangrrlMN:

    That’s priceless. Thanks for posting it.

  127. 127
    Nellcote says:

    Congress should be made to go through a TSA scanner before attending the State Of The Union speech in a couple of weeks. I don’t trust those fuckers.

  128. 128
    Liberty60 says:

    @Frankie T.: Jack Shafer at Slate has a predictably contrarian column criticizing Sheriff Dupnik’s comments and offering a “Defense of Inflamed Rhetoric.” (this is the headline of Shafer’s piece, presumably written by an editor at Slate)

    I read that, hoping for a good defense of strong opinons and rhetoric; instead it was a “they all do it” sort of thing.

    Thing is, saying hateful things is not the same as saying things hatefully.

    If I said, politely and civilly, more in sorrow than anger mind you, that black people were less intelligent than whites, and someone were to respond with obscene suggestions about my mother, which one of us would need to tone down our rhetoric?

    It is the Right that is offering succor and comfort to the notion of white supremacy by altering history (such as the Texas textbook commission or Haley Barbour), and it is the Right that is openly proposing we allow people to die for lack of money (As AZ Gov, Jan Brewer is doing at this very moment), it is the Right that openly regards unemployed people as lazy stray animals, and it is the Tea Party that is suggesting that only property owners be allowed to vote.

    These things are being said politely, calmly, in measured civil tones. These are also hateful thoughts and ideas, and responding to them with anger and indignation shouldn’t be condemmed.

  129. 129

    @jk: It’s a classic.

  130. 130
  131. 131

    @SiubhanDuinne: Buttery Nipple of Mother Russia, Tequila Uprise …

  132. 132
    jk says:

    @arguingwithsignposts:

    You make a good point. I still can’t wrap my mind around the fact that Sarah Palin is considered a serious and credible candidate for President of the United States. What the fuck is wrong with this goddamn country that a babbling buffoon and knuckle dragging neanderthal like Palin is sitting in the catbird seat? I keep hoping that I’m going to wake up from this nightmare and Sarah Palin will be working a cash register at McDonald’s. Fuck John McCain for fucking all of us up the ass by inflicting this Alaskan monstrosity on the country.

  133. 133
    handy says:

    @jk:

    Reagan was the consummate empty suit if there ever was one, but the guy knew his craft, and generally speaking took on the style of a uniter (yeah I know tell that to the Air Traffic Controllers, etc.). Palin, on the other hand, is the most talentless, incurious, intellectually small person I’ve ever seen rise to such a high stage, and what’s worse is she has staked her career as the fomenter, the divider. Even Dubya at least tried the “guy I’d like to have a beer with” card.

    She’s Wally George with lipstick and real hair.

  134. 134
    jinxtigr says:

    That sheriff’s at risk. Teabaggers are already talking about how he must be removed.

    Boehner’s scared for a reason. He knows quite well that he’s in the crosshairs too. This is NOT a Republican thing, it’s a tea party thing. The Reps are not in control of it.

    The guy Sully was shocked by, who had to go off the record to say he doesn’t like the tone of discourse? He’s scared, Sully. He’s scared that if he calls out Fox/Beck/Palin/etc, teabaggers will KILL HIM.

    Maybe he knows more about them than you do.

  135. 135
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @suzanne: I’ll add my dulcet tones to the Linda 6 and asiangrrl choir: Howya doing?

    Also too, a photo of Mia would go down a treat.

  136. 136
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    This is probably about a very sick individual

    You mean like yourself, Rand Paul? You barely disguised racist, authoritarian shitstain?

  137. 137
    Zuzu's Petals says:

    @jk:

    Fuck John McCain for fucking all of us up the ass by inflicting this Alaskan monstrosity on the country.

    In a way I’m grateful she was inflicted on us when she was clearly not ready for prime time. I hate to think how much more palatable folks would have found her had she had four plus years as governor and more grooming and PR by the likes of Bill Kristol.

  138. 138
    PurpleGirl says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: I crochet but I’ll gladly join you for duty at the guillotine.

    (Oh, have I hurt the fee-fees of a wing-nut by implying the use of a guillotine? Am I being just be just as hateful as a wing-nut?)

  139. 139

    @jinxtigr:
    at #136.

    Boehner’s scared for a reason. He knows quite well that he’s in the crosshairs too. This is NOT a Republican thing, it’s a tea party thing. The Reps are not in control of it.

    I was wondering about that. Boehner did look frightened and I wondered what he was afraid of. But being afraid of being shot or whatever would explain the remarks about doing one’s duty regardless.

    And he might know them. Or he might have been warned that he is a potential victim.

  140. 140
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    Incidentally, I’ve been struck today that NPR in its hourly news updates has taken full responsibility for jumping the gun (sorry about the cliché) yesterday and erroneously reporting that Gabrielle Giffords had died. NPR has fully apologized (four separate times to my certain knowledge, maybe more) and acknowledged that they were irresponsible in reporting this on less than solid confirmation. Classy.

    I’m not saying other media outlets *haven’t* also apologized and assumed journalistic responsibility, but I don’t know one way or the other. Anyone?

  141. 141
    jk says:

    @handy:

    At least, Ronald Reagan served 2 full terms as governor before becoming President unlike half-term Sarah. Beyond her blatant ineptitude and infantile vindictiveness, the most aggravating thing about the current political landscape is how the MSM has just fallen hook, line, and sinker for Palin’s bullshit. I expect nothing from assholes like Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity, and O’Reilly when it comes to Sarah Palin, but Wolf Blitzer, Anderson Cooper, John King, Candy Crowley, David Gregory, and Chuck Todd deserve a special place in Hell for phoning it in when it comes to Palin and for spitting the bit in their coverage of other issues documented by Glenn Greeenwald.

  142. 142
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @PurpleGirl #140: Well, I already do bargello, will that work?

    Anyone around here into tatting? (Not you, asiangrrlMN!!)

  143. 143
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    The first rule about these sort of things is that first reports are often wrong.

    That it takes time to sort out events, separate the participants from the trauma of them, and figure out what exactly happened.

    Of course, all of this works against the dynamic of the “breaking news” mentality that drives what passes in this country for public information networks that are, far more often than not, not about informing, but capturing eyeballs and ears for the benefit of a message from our paymasters…

  144. 144
    Davis X. Machina says:

    You can go vote for Palin’s criminal prosecution for Aggravated Federal Some Damned Thing or Another It Doesn’t Matter I’m Angry here. And here. And here. The last one is actually from April, and for sedition. (I understand there is a three-link limit.) There are more.

    It appears stupid is distributed in a normal, bell-curve way right across the political spectrum.

  145. 145
    Mike Kay says:

    Via Sully,

    I forgot about this, less than a year ago, Boehner himself engaged violent rhetoric.

    Another Ohio Democrat, Steve Driehaus, clashed repeatedly with Boehner before losing his seat in the midterm elections. After Boehner suggested that by voting for Obamacare, Driehaus “may be a dead man” and “can’t go home to the west side of Cincinnati” because “the Catholics will run him out of town,” Driehaus began receiving death threats, and a right-wing website published directions to his house.

  146. 146
    The Populist says:

    @El Cid:

    Yet he is into white supremacist garbage. Weird how that makes him a leftist.

  147. 147
    Maude says:

    @SiubhanDuinne:
    Did CNN say sorry?
    In Britian, you can’t have images like the Palin crosshairs map on leaflets, sites or other places.
    Rand Paul never had a thought in his life.

  148. 148
    Mike Kay says:

    and right on cue, “media critic” Howard Kurtz (who’s married to a gop political consultant) defends sarah palin.

    http://andrewsullivan.theatlan.....wrong.html

  149. 149
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Davis X. Machina:

    I think most people here would be happy if she would just get off our fucking TVs and go back to Alaska.

  150. 150
    Davis X. Machina says:

    @Mnemosyne: She makes otherwise sane people crazy, that’s for sure.

  151. 151
    jk says:

    @Zuzu’s Petals:

    I hadn’t considered that possibility. It’s hard to know how things would have unfolded if that scenario had played out.

    Right now, I’m just disgusted by the fact that Palin has a very powerful platform to disseminate her views, but manages to avoid being held accountable for her statements and actions by the MSM.

  152. 152
    JPL says:

    @Mike Kay: Boehner seemed dismissive of Driehaus’ complaint. That could be weighing on Boehner today. If the Republicans don’t tow the line, they will be included in Sarah’s cross-hairs. If not Sarah’s then certain Erick Erickson will target.

  153. 153
    Mark S. says:

    Erick Erickson says that calling attention to the right’s violent rhetoric could incite violence against teabaggers. So we should all just shut up about it.

  154. 154
    tkogrumpy says:

    @BGinCHI: Done!

  155. 155
    SenyorDave says:

    Kurtz is one of the many reasons I no longer subscribe to the Washington post. He is a hack.

  156. 156
    Barb (formerly Gex) says:

    @The Raven: We just need to hang on til the FOX demographic dies out. Right?

  157. 157

    Oh yeah I forgot about the guy who shot up the Panama City, FL, school board. He was a liberal because he liked “V For Vendetta” or some such BS.

    This is just all so very stupid. We’re behaving like panicked rats in a maze. Instead of enacting some sensible gun laws in this country to keep the nutters from going apeshit.

    And BTW, I read that there were a few people carrying handguns at the grocery store, just as part of what they normally do. And fat lot of good they did protecting the innocent people at this event, right? So there’s the death of another cherished right wing meme.

  158. 158
    The Populist says:

    @Linda Featheringill:

    Can we elect him to the Senate over McCain or Kyl? Seeing how worthless and bogus those two are, this sheriff is just what this country needs…an honest and fair minded human being.

  159. 159
    The Populist says:

    @Barb (formerly Gex):

    It’s coming. The young folks hate what the modern GOP stands for. If only they’d vote more often, the right would die off faster and we’d have people running this country that would care about education, the general welfare of PEOPLE not corporations and the promotion of entrprenuerial small business owners over mega-corps.

  160. 160
    jk says:

    @Mike Kay:

    Howie Kurtz is the clown prince of toolishness in media criticism. Prolonged exposure to his column or tv show has been known to cause dizziness, drowsiness, nausea, and heartaches. Do your head and stomach a favor and ignore his bottomless pit of bullshit.

  161. 161
    Calouste says:

    @Linda Featheringill:

    I wouldn’t be surprised if there had been death threats against Boehner. He is fairly high profile and there are a lot of deranged people. I guess it hits home when you have received death threats and someone else who has also received death threats actually gets shot.

  162. 162
    The Populist says:

    @jk:

    Thank god for Keith Olbermann and Rachel Maddow. At least they offer a facts based, reality reporting of news items that matter to many.

  163. 163
    The Populist says:

    @Calouste:

    The only threats this guy gets are people asking how much spray on tan he uses.

  164. 164
    Mike Furlan says:

    @KCinDC:

    Exactly.

  165. 165
    The Populist says:

    @Linda Featheringill:

    There are more of us common sense people (right and left) in America than some tea bagger nuts. Seriously??? Why can’t folks like Boehner realize this and say ENOUGH to these idiots like the Koch Brothers, Armey and the other morons????

  166. 166

    @Mark S.:

    So we should all just shut up about it.

    My Senator Lamar Alexander said a similar thing to Candy Crowley this morning:

    “CROWLEY: Was it over the line, sort of specifically, since it’s now being talked about everywhere, with Sarah Palin’s web ads about people that she would like to see targeted for political defeat.

    “ALEXANDER: Well, Candy, I think you’re responsible, by bringing this up, of doing the very thing you’re trying to condemn. You’re making and implying a direct connection between Sarah Palin and what happened. You’re picking out a particular incident. Well, I think the way to get away from it is for you not to be talking about it.

  167. 167
    Dennis SGMM says:

    @Calouste:
    If there had ever been any death threats against Boehner (Other than from bar owners whom he stiffed on his tab) he would have been on every news outlet squealing like a stuck pig. Look at what happened when a nearly vertically descending stray bullet landed on a windowsill in Cantor’s office. The Republicans like to dish it out but, they sure as hell can’t take it.

  168. 168
    The Populist says:

    @Zuzu’s Petals:

    At best the same 25-30% of America who LOVED GW Bush, love her. These are your standard hard core righties who hate anything with liberal in it and want America “pure”.

  169. 169
    jk says:

    @The Populist:

    John McCain is now 74 years old, so I’m hoping that he’s planning on retirement when his current term expires.

  170. 170
    The Populist says:

    @jk:

    Paul will lose the minute he starts cutting off pork for Kentucky. Fact…

  171. 171
    The Populist says:

    I know how to fix America and make the right happy…

    We cut all pork spending, close bases in small towns where it’s there JUST to support some old, pointless place. We cut everything that reeks of corporate welfare so Michelle Bachmann’s family farm can pay for itself.

    Time to put up. I guarantee you this. When the pain hits home, these tea baggers will be the ones that are targeted by the villagers.

  172. 172
    jk says:

    @The Populist:

    Yes. Also check out Democracy Now with Amy Goodman and GritTV with Laura Flanders.

  173. 173
    The Populist says:

    @scav:

    I posted a link in another thread where some tea bag site wants to waste time sending post cards disapproving of the man for dissing the tea baggers. Sorry, he never mentioned the tea party so they need to get over it.

    The Sheriff was on the money and deserves praise for being honest and not sugar coating it.

  174. 174
    The Populist says:

    @jk:

    Is that the network that has Thom Hartmann on? I will do that as I know how to find it on Directv.

  175. 175
    Alex S. says:

    @Zuzu’s Petals:

    That goes to show that the WBC is just out for law settlements.

  176. 176
    The Populist says:

    @J:

    Wrong. The facts show how wrong you are. Lefties want to engage people, righties want to beat you down with propaganda so they can “win.” See, it’s all about winning on the right.

  177. 177
    Mark S. says:

    @The Populist:

    We’ll see if he’s as bright as his old man. Ron rails and rails against pork but still brings home the bacon to his district.

  178. 178
    The Populist says:

    @J:

    Wow nice troll job B.O.B. This reads like one of your stupid screeds.

    Limbaugh is fat. PERIOD.

  179. 179
    The Populist says:

    @Mark S.:

    Agreed. This is why he wins with minimal opposition.

  180. 180
    Odie Hugh Manatee says:

    @Linda Featheringill:

    Thank you very much for that link! I sent him a message of thanks and support from our family.

    I hope others will do the same. It’s long past the time to counter the rhetoric of the insane nutcases on the right, bless him for doing so.

    Don’t let the crazy asshats on the right bury this guy in their bullshit.

  181. 181
    PurpleGirl says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: Yes, that will work. I do bargello also.

  182. 182
    jk says:

    @The Populist:

    For Grittv, go to grittvdotorg

    For Democracy Now, go to democracynowdotorg

    There’s also Free Speech Radio News at fsrndotorg

  183. 183
    Mary G says:

    @Linda Featheringill: I have sent a message as well. I was so struck by this speech, so calm, so reasonable, in the middle of such madness. We need more people like him in public life.

  184. 184
    jk says:

    @Southern Beale:

    Shorter Lamar Alexander: Candy, we’re all scared shitless of Sarah “Mooseburger Helper” Palin, so please stop asking all of us to comment about her, ok?

  185. 185
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Dennis SGMM:

    Look at what happened when a nearly vertically descending stray bullet landed on a windowsill in Cantor’s office.

    You’re assuming that Cantor actually believed his bullshit and really thought that someone had shot at his office, but even at the time it was very clearly a diversionary tactic to try and get a “both sides do it” story in the media after a Democrat’s office had been attacked.

    I think it’s slowly dawning on the Republicans that the Tea Party Frankenstein that they cobbled together in order to take back the House in 2010 is about to take over the party for real, but they can’t figure out how to stop it without being trampled themselves.

  186. 186
    catclub says:

    @J: “Hippies spat on soldiers returning from Vietnam. ”

    One suspects that it was actually the VFW and American Legion guys who did the spitting – and calling them losers. But all is now forgotten.

  187. 187

    @Mnemosyne:

    I think it’s slowly dawning on the Republicans that the Tea Party Frankenstein that they cobbled together in order to take back the House in 2010 is about to take over the party for real, but they can’t figure out how to stop it without being trampled themselves.

    Oh where have I heard that before?

    They don’t give a shit. Teanuts can’t take back EVERY seat. The Frankenstein is very useful to them and will continue to be so.

  188. 188

    @jk:

    Trust me I will be calling his office tomorrow.

    *SIGH*

  189. 189
    jk says:

    @Southern Beale:

    Lamar Alexander is probably still curled up in a fetal position after having to answer questions about Sarah Palin.

  190. 190
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Southern Beale:

    They don’t give a shit. Teanuts can’t take back EVERY seat. The Frankenstein is very useful to them and will continue to be so.

    One of their colleagues — someone they saw almost every day — is lying in a hospital bed because someone came to one of her political events and shot her in the head. Imagine how you would feel if you came into work one day and found out that the co-worker you despise most had been shot in the head while out on company business by someone who had a grudge against your company. Wouldn’t that freak you out more than a little?

    Republicans are very bad at empathy, but they can actually get a clue when something bad happens to someone they know personally (cf Sandra Day-O’Connor being indignant when her grandson can’t get health insurance, Nancy Reagan getting upset about Alzheimer’s when Ronnie had it).

    Now that this has happened to someone they know personally, some of them are realizing that this could happen to them next time. We, of course, say, “Well, no shit, Sherlock, that’s what we’ve been telling you all along,” but it really did take something like this to make them understand that they are not invulnerable and bad things don’t only happen to people they don’t know.

  191. 191
    The Populist says:

    @Mary G:

    I agree and would not care if the sheriff has an R next to his name if he ever ran for bigger office (I believe he’s a D)….seeing how he HANDLED this situation with grace and honesty makes me wish we had more like him in public office nationwide.

  192. 192
    The Populist says:

    @jk:

    Remember when these guys wouldn’t go on record to comment on Limbo’s insanity? I remember one con got called out for saying Limbo is not the boss of him and the next day he was praising the fat slob.

  193. 193
    Dennis SGMM says:

    @catclub:
    My hippie friends didn’t spit on me when I returned from Vietnam. On the other hand, the Cold Warriors who’d never fired a shot in anger were quick to both rebuff me as “someone who might go off” and to blame me and the others who fought there for losing to a bunch of Commie gooks.

  194. 194
    JBerardi says:

    @jk:

    John McCain is now 74 years old, so I’m hoping that he’s planning on retirement when his current term expires.

    Going by my generally reliable principle that any senator’s thoughts and motivations can be accurately divined from an analysis of Godfather II, it’s safe to say that McCain thinks he’s going to live forever.

    They all do, of course.

  195. 195
    JBerardi says:

    @Dennis SGMM:

    …Cold Warriors who’d never fired a shot in anger were quick to both rebuff me as “someone who might go off” and to blame me and the others who fought there for losing to a bunch of Commie gooks.

    I am shocked, SHOCKED…

  196. 196
    Kobie says:

    @The Populist: That strikes me as “guilty conscience” more than anything. How can something that doesn’t even mention the Tea Party be an “attack on the Tea Party”?

  197. 197
    stuckinred says:

    @catclub: That was my experience.

  198. 198

    @Southern Beale: “Because shut up, that’s why.”

  199. 199
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Maude #149: Don’t know whether CNN said sorry or not. I haven’t heard them do so, but I’ve been a lot closer to the radio than to TV so it’s possible.

    I was just talking to a UK friend about all this, and he made the same point that it would be against the law to use bullseyes and rifle sight cross-hairs in campaign materials.

  200. 200
    Cacti says:

    Since Sheriff Dupnik spoke from the heart about the dangers of hate speech…

    He will be the target of a sustained hate campaign from professional hatemongers on right wing radio, starting tomorrow.

    Hate Inc. can’t abide someone criticising what made them a fortune.

  201. 201
    sukabi says:

    @JBerardi: and why not think that, they are after all benefiting from the best medical care our money can buy.

  202. 202
    Calouste says:

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    You can’t even lie about your opponent in the UK. It gets you ejected from parliament.

  203. 203
    Barb (formerly Gex) says:

    @Mnemosyne: They could cut off the money flow. But they won’t do that because otherwise a Dem might get elected.

    I’m in MN. I recently had to point out to a Republican in Bachmann’s district that the fact that they reelected her not only says that they think she’s better than any Democrat, but also that she is better than any other Republican they could run instead. They could present a different candidate. It’s fun to do that because some of them are actually embarrassed by her.

  204. 204
    scav says:

    @The Populist: shh! snark is my mother tongue. pass it on.

  205. 205
    jl says:

    I’m going to write the sheriff’s office and the board of sups and express my appreciation and support for Dupnik, and tell them that I hope he keeps up the good work.

    Will try to keep a condemnation of Kyle’s vile comments out of it, but not sure I will be able to do it. But, I want to keep it nonpartisan.

  206. 206
    bob h says:

    So, it’s completely appropriate for Dupnik to speak to the climate of hatred in Arizona,

    As a Sheriff, he probably sees what a battleground it is clearer than anyone.

  207. 207
    Lorna says:

    Dupnik made no direct connection between hateful rhetoric and the shooter.

    I totally disagree time after time in every interview I have seen the good sheriff insert his opinion on what he thinks. Not what is fact. His opinion has no business in a police briefing and since he inserted his opinion, his political affiliation is very relevant! He is now (interview with Geraldo) going further and naming names on the right……..no motivation? Where is his proof? More BS. Do as I say, not as I do because I know better than you! Very relevant that he is a democrat and has run as a democrat. Not relevant had he not inserted his opinion into police briefings.

  208. 208
    Calliope Jane says:

    This is a late comment, but…

    Kyl is such an ass. Listening to local (Tucson) news, we heard/saw comments from other officials (including the President, plus McCain and Brewer) but nothing from Kyl (which was fine by me). Now this. Such an ass.

    Every comment I heard from Dupnik, from the first telephone interview when he was the first to push back on all those reporters saying Gabby had died, for fuck’s sake — he’s been commenting on the vitriol and I, for one, am so proud that he’s been doing it. Dupnik knows better than anyone about all of the hatred stirred up down here (guns at town halls, death threats, vandalism, etc– and that’s just to Giffords, not to mention all the threats Judge Roll, who was also a friend of Dupnik’s, received) and I’m proud that he’s my sheriff and I’m proud to have voted for him–and will continue to vote for him–for as long as he wants to serve.

  209. 209
    Comrade Kevin says:

    @Lorna: Someone has a guilty conscience, and it isn’t the sheriff.

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