As this Democratic Congress draws to a close and we prepare for a couple years of wingers and triangutards vying to see who can hit the hippies hardest, let’s remember that Pelosi, Reid, and Obama did deliver a few big victories, not just DADT repeal, but also the health care bill for example. This is more than we got last time Democrats held Congress and the White House.
I write this all with the full knowledge that this is just the kind of video Leni Riefenstahl would post if she were blogging now.
Yutsano
Does that mean we can compare you to the Nazis now? I’m just getting the Godwin out of the way as early as possible here.
Davis X. Machina
Dr. Biobrain, Obama’s Clear Liberal Voice, part I.
An interesting tour d’horizon.
Morbo
@Yutsano: No, we can’t. How mendacious do you have to be to infer that someone simply talking about Leni Riefenstahl is making a Nazi reference?
NobodySpecial
I am of two minds about this.
Yes, we’ve gotten a hell of a lot more than we did with Clinton. No question.
However, that initial Congress he had only a 53-47 Senate.
We delivered 60 when they asked for 60. We delivered both Houses by huge majorities. It feels at this time like a wasted opportunity because so much should have gotten done and so much we did stands a good chance of being undone if 2012 goes as badly as the Chicken Littles figure it will. Hell, with the Senate as is, I wouldn’t be surprised if they get a straight up vote to repeal ACA that Obama will have to veto.
Goddamn the Blue Dogs. Fuck Max Baucus, Blanche Lincoln, and the rest of that crew in the Gang of Mouthbreathers Who Claim To Be Democrats. My only hope is that someday they feel some small morsel of shame on their deathbeds at how badly they fucked America.
jeffreyw
Bah, hard to think straight when you’re hungry.
Elie
It is a wonderful thing to be able to see something good like this — to live through it and experience it without the second thoughts and doubt that mean it can only be celebrated some time hence in history…that we are too screwed up to fully appreciate the success and what it means in a simple, meaningful way.
We must savor this today and the victory for health care and the many many other things that will be happening — all 4000 times better than we could be living in the alternate universe had McCain Palin been in the WH.
Yutsano
@NobodySpecial:
If you remember, Chicken Little was mistaken. But he made a lot of noise, just as our naysayers tend to do. My personal opinion is very little to nothing will get done over the next two years, but the teabaggers are gonna end up the most pissed off because their saviors they just elected will show themselves to be just standard run of the mill tax cut and spend Republicans. That will be even funnier to watch.
@Morbo: The joke, it has been missed.
Restrung
Teddy Partridge is mad.
http://my.firedoglake.com/teddysanfran/2010/12/18/white-house-wont-commit-to-ending-dadt-discharges-now/
I’m not suggesting anybody click the link. The hell is wrong with these people?
Loneoak
NANCY SMASHED!
Mike Kay (Team America)
This is all Obama’s fault!
mk3872
@Restrung: To me, this is why Obama has and will continue to negotiate with conservatives in both the Dem & Repub party.
You can’t do business with the hard-left that FDL represents. They’re NEVER pleased. Full stop.
amk
@NobodySpecial: CD too much ?
….
ummm, since you “delivered” them, they’re your babies. Got it ?
suzanne
@Yutsano:
See, I don’t know if they’re smart enough to get that they will have been played. I don’t really think most Teabaggers have any agenda outside of being contrarian—whatever the BLACK DUDE WHO LISTENS TO HIP-HOP wants is BAD!—so I don’t know if they’re going to hold these shitstains they elected accountable. It depresses me.
Loneoak
@Restrung:
Yipes. Shoulda stayed in the boat. Those people really exist? DADT was a discriminatory policy that just about everyone on our side hates, the Obama Admin promised to repeal it, they pushed to repeal it, they got their military leadership behind it, and repeal it they did in the most permanent possible manner. And some unnamed functionary says something like “we’re not entirely sure whether this will cause investigations to end right now” and the Fiery Lake of Dogs commenters claim Obama has no moral compass and doesn’t actually want repeal because of the ghey? Yeesh.
I don’t even understand how that is supposed to be progressive, rather than just stupid.
Mike Kay (Team America)
@Restrung:
it’s called “Obama Derangement Syndrome”
Make no mistake, this is a bitter, bitter day for the Professional Left™. Like the wingers, they loath Obama so much it burns them to see Obama get any props.
Glonda
LOL!
The sheer levels of self-referential irony in that statement remind me of the Steven Colbert portrait that is prominent on his show.
NobodySpecial
@Restrung: Forgive Harry Reid and Carl Levin for assuming that because Obama says he’s gonna sign the bill they got passed preventing gays from being kicked out of the service, that he’d actually want to stop kicking gays out of the service before the military gets around to finishing the policy.
This is what pisses off a lot of the ‘hard left’ or whatever you want to call them. This costs Obama NOTHING to do. It’s not like Republicans or the Manchin wing of the Democratic Party is even gonna scream too loudly about it now that it’s virtually law. And best of all, it stops punishing gay servicemen. But Obama can’t bring himself to actually use his office in the way it’s intended to control the running of the military.
amk
@mk3872: Bingo.
Tattoosydney
@Restrung:
If you spend any time celebrating what you have and what you have achieved, the anger that drives every day of your existence might just leach away, and then where would you be?
Loneoak
@mk3872:
Ugh, they are not the hard-left. They are the emo-left.
Most of my friends are hard-left, as in green-anarcho-queers and wildcat-striking-unionists. They wouldn’t piss on Firedog Lake if it was, uh, on fire.
EDIT:
@NobodySpecial:
For fuck’s sake, Obama didn’t do or not do anything. They were having their emo-freak out at something a hack spokesperson said, NOT something Obama said or did. The bill passed like 6 hours ago and they expect Obama to wave a magic wand and instantly reverse a military policy with deep infrastructure. The world doesn’t work that way. Grow up.
NobodySpecial
@amk: I speak in a metaphorical way. You speak English and understand how ‘we’ is used, right? Just checking.
And as for me? I, as a resident of Illinois, delivered Dick Durbin and Barack Obama, and secondarily through Blagojevich, Roland Burris. I don’t own any of these lame fucks you’re defending.
Mike Kay (Team America)
@NobodySpecial: you’re the idiot who months ago insisted obama should sign an executive order.
Heh!
amk
@NobodySpecial: Then stop grandstanding with “we” delivered Obama everything and he botched it meme.
And no, I was not defending them or their votes. Just pointing out the political reality to you.
NR
@mk3872: Shorter mk3872: “Jane Hamsher is a bitch, so Obama had to extend the Bush tax cuts for the rich.”
Dennis SGMM
@Yutsano:
I’m hoping that I don’t get thrown into the Chicken Little camp for this. Two things about the 2012 election are worrisome to me. The first is that the Democrats will be defending twice as many Senate seats as the Republicans. The second is that unemployment is still likely to be high then. I was hoping that the economy might gain momentum and as it did so the recovery would pick up speed so that we’d be down to six or seven percent by ’12. Now I’m hearing that so many American companies have figured out how to operate profitably with much smaller numbers of employees that the possible result may be that many workers will remain surplus to needs.
The Democrats took a beating in the mid-terms because of the economy. They may take another one in ’12 if things don’t turn around.
NobodySpecial
@Loneoak: Actually, he could have, at the same time he made any statement about the bill passing, announced that he would sign or had signed an EO directing the military to halt all investigations, just like he could have done it any time in the last six months. And it would have been super-duper legal, because his job as President is head of the military. It costs him nothing, as I pointed out. So why not even bother to do it?
That doesn’t mean that Obama hates leftys or gays, or any of that conspiracy nonsense. But it shows a definite resolve to avoid anything that looks even remotely confrontational after the health care fiasco, and once again, it does so to a demographic that went 70-27 for him in 2008.
NobodySpecial
@Mike Kay (Team America): And he should have. And he could have. And trolls like you aren’t here for serious debate, anyways.
NobodySpecial
@amk: Did I say ‘Fuck Obama’? Who exactly did I blame in that original comment?
Your English is looking worse from moment to moment.
BombIranForChrist
It must be said, if any of the FrontPage Trollers won’t admit it, that sometimes Principle wins over Pragmatism. DADT was repealed because people were not practical. They were principled. And fuck all of you who chose Being Serious over what was Right.
Ohno! John Cole just made fun of me! He made some crack about Hillary!
Fact is: John Cole is High Broderism for Gen X. It’s ironic. It’s incoherent. But it’s the same shit: Embrace mediocrity. It’s all we can get. Reach for the Middle!
As John and official troll DougJ worry themselves over what is practical and possible in Broder’s world, the rest of you should stand up for what you believe. Because the purpose of Democracy is not for each citizen to do what is practical but to voice what is right, and if John and Doug make fun of you, it’s ok.The DADT repeal occurred because of purity, which they deride, because being Cool is a whole lot easier to their ego than being Right.
If John or Doug were in the Senate, they would have come up with a lot of practical excuses against it. And accused anyone against their decision as Trolls or Firebags or whatever their latest slang is against those who dare to believe that our government should respond to the people it serves.
Mike Kay (Team America)
@NobodySpecial:
Dr. Rachel Maddow – MSNBC
Heh!
Tell it Rachel, tell it!! You go girlfriend!
amk
@NobodySpecial: Congrats. You have now mastered the art of being a projectionist a la republican.
MattR
@mk3872:
I don’t get it. Why would the fact that you can never please the small, vocal minority that FDL represents which has exactly zero congressmen or senators who share their viewpoints force Obama to negotiate with conservatives?
NobodySpecial
@amk: I can’t help it if you can’t read. I CAN ask for my tax dollars used for your education back, because you failed.
Karmakin
@Dennis SGMM: It’s mostly the second point I think. It’s a much bigger hole than I think the DC Democrats realize, and that’s why people are upset. Yup. Health Care reform is great and all that. But that damn hole is awfully deep, and really hasn’t even been started to be filled in a lot of people’s minds.
I said this about a year ago. The jobs are not coming back. Not on their own. They’re going to have to be replaced by either government hiring or other programs or some sort of labor reform, at least to maintain a sustained period of full employment in order to cleanse out all the consumer debt and get serious consumption growth going again.
But yes, companies have learned to do more with less. That’s the entire point of productivity growth. They were able to use the financial melt-down as an excuse to cash in on those productivity gains, generally what would happen in those cases is overworked employees would look for a better job. That’s what is supposed to happen.
And if there’s no better job? The system falls apart.
eemom
@Restrung:
Teddy actually used to be a cool guy. I’m thinking he’s another victim of the Jane Hamsher Disembodied Testicle Trophy Collection.
Mike Kay (Team America)
@NobodySpecial:
you can’t read, either
that initial congress was 57-43
Roger Moore
@Restrung:
Media personalities can only dominate the discourse when their party is out of power. When their party is in power, the elected leaders get the lions’ share of the attention, so media whores have to go crazy to get anyone to listen.
Mike Kay (Team America)
@eemom: you mean he’s part of her veal pen.
Heh!
NobodySpecial
@Mike Kay (Team America): Typo. Oops. ;D
Yutsano
@Karmakin: Sort of. Corporations are about to run into the squeezing blood from a turnip scenario where they will have to decide if possibly cutting into the stock price and profit margin is ultimately better for the health of the company. In an economy where two-thirds of the engine is consumer spending, eventually something will have to give. And if the super-rich demand too much (I’d argue they are now but that’s for another time) then labor movements and even Communist rumblings will start back up again. The college graduates coming out now know how fucked they are, and they know they’re ultimately responsible for changing it.
@Dennis SGMM: That’s not Chicken Littling, that’s making a reasonable argument. And if we were facing the dynamics of 2010 in 2012 I’d agree. But a lot can change in two years for the good as well as the bad. Plus defending twice as many seats is only a reasonable statistic if you assume all of them are vulnerable. I just don’t see that happening regardless of the state of the economy.
amk
@NobodySpecial: Perfect teabagger puerile response. I want my money back. You are getting good at this game.
NobodySpecial
@amk: I repeat, I’m sorry you can’t read.
mclaren
HCR is not a victory and it’s not reform. It merely gave private health insurers and medical devicemakers and doctors and hospitals a fabulous new captive market of 330 million people forced to buy crappy unaffordable private insurance that’s guaranteed to escalate in price infinitely, forever.
Short version: Obama and the Democrats turned the U.S. government into legbreakers for the medical mafia loan sharks.
That’s a victory?
That’s something to celebrate?
DADT is nice and symbolic and irrelevant to the real problems facing this country.
Reinstating usury limits would be a victory. No civilization in 5000 years has tried to live without limits on the interest rates businesses can charge people. We’ve had no limits since 1982, courtesy of Reagan.
Ending one of our pointless unwinnable eternal wars would be a victory.
Repealing some of the Stalinoid provisions of the USA Treason Act (misnamed the USA Patriot Act) would be a victory.
People are still shooting themselves to get medical care in the ER. That’s not a victory, that’s just another step closer in the long long line to the gates of the gulag.
Comrade Luke
The headline at NPR.org is “Ending ‘Don’t Ask’ Lets Obama Fulfill Another Clinton Promise”
Can someone explain to me WTF that means?
Yutsano
@Comrade Luke: Other than, “We Can’t Give the Black Guy Credit for Shit”? Ya got me.
NobodySpecial
@Yutsano: Yeah, most of those seats are not very vulnerable at all. Obama will be on the ballot as well, so turnout should be bigger, making those seats less likely to be lost. I can also see a couple of weak Republican seats flipping (Nevada, Mass.) regardless of any Dem losses that might happen. My personal bet is 55-45, with Lieberman being replaced by a Dem.
Comrade Luke
I’m as happy as the next progressive that DADT got repealed, but I also shake my head when I think about the fact that we’re all overjoyed because gays in the military can now…say they’re gay. I mean, it’s just crazy that it was even an issue, let alone some do-or-die thing for so many people (and by people I’m referring to politicians), don’t you think?
Earl Butz
Obama didn’t make my bed this morning, so I declare his presidency to be a failure.
/”progressive”
Mike Kay (Team America)
@Comrade Luke: clinton had promised to lift the ban on gays in the military in 1992. When he attempted to, Congress threw a shit fit and passed DADT in response, codifying the ban.
NobodySpecial
@Comrade Luke: Clinton originally tried for full repeal and DADT was the compromise.
amk
@NobodySpecial: Hey, I blame the incoherent crap from firebaggers.
Comrade Luke
@Yutsano: It’s actually a little worse than that. The headline I added is what you get when you actually click the link. The headline on the main page is “‘Don’t Ask’ Repeal Fulfills Another Clinton Promise”.
I thought it was a typo, but no.
NobodySpecial
@amk: Well, you can blame whomever you like. Doesn’t make up for your complete lack of comprehension. Come to think, you’re pretty quick to pull that ‘teabagger’ card. Project much?
Dennis SGMM
@Karmakin:
You’re correct: the state of the economy will affect Democrats’ electoral chances more than anything else. It’s never good to go into a General Election having to defend two seats for every one being defended by your opponents. Add to that the fact that Senate seats are far more costly to defend and the Democrats would have a challenge even in a normal economy.
There’s also the fact that the Citizens United decision was handed down relatively close to the mid-term. Despite that, a lot of money was spent on behalf of Republicans. By ’12 there will be more money and the spending of it will be much more focused and organized.
Yutsano
@NobodySpecial: I’ll be honest in that I haven’t done any research on it, but I’d bet 55-45 sounds about right. Unless we get some O’Donnell teabagging effects going on. Then everything will be up in the air.
Karmakin
Yutsano I personally think that ego, hubris, but most of all, the concept of the tragedy of the commons will prevent that from happening.
I hope that I’m wrong and you’re right and we see corps step up and end the recession. Because that might be the only way out.
amk
@NobodySpecial: There is a reason why firebagger became a favorite in intertubes in such a short time. Two peas in a pod and all that.
Joey Maloney
That alone is worth the price of admission right there, that is.
gwangung
I don’t think you appreciate how your first paragraph relates to the second. You “got” the 60 because Blue Dogs got elected.
Moreover, those Blue Dogs don’t necessarily represent YOU. They represent the voters who elected them. And those voters aren’t any more liberal than the Blue Dogs; in fact, many Blue Dogs may be more liberal than their constituents.
Focussing on the Congressmen is, I think, missing the point. Because they’re only the start, because you HAVE to work on the voting population as well, or you can’t get as far as you want. You can START on that path, but you can’t let matters sit and think things are accomplished.
sherifffruitfly
Overall, we have gotten the most progressive stuff under Obama/Pelosi/Reid than at any other time in my lifetime (I go back to Nixon). And it’s not even close.
I want more, but I remain completely comfortable with all the support I have given Obama, and plan to give in the future.
I’m one of what seems to be an almost extinct breed: white Democrat who isn’t whining about Obama (at least not very much at any rate).
And LOL @ all of the DADT-single-issue fucktards who call themselves “progressives”, and have been bitching and whining since Obama-Day-1, and helped the republican takeover of the House. It is VERY fitting that DADT repeal took place AFTER the election. Let those fuckwits stew with a shitty Congress for a few years.
Dennis SGMM
@Yutsano:
I hope that the optimists are correct and I devoutly hope that someone comes up with some initiatives to get the economy back on track – not just because it would help my party.
asiangrrlMN
The naysayers are fucking harshing my high. This is not a symbolic victory, and it wasn’t fucking easy. Should it have been? Hell yeah. But, we have to accept that our current congressional system is so fucked-up, this is a motherfucking big deal as Joey B. would say.
And, so we can all focus our hate properly, I give you this. Didn’t I (Blow Your Mind?).
Oh, and Nancy SMASH! That is all.
WarMunchkin
Aaaahahhaha, this article is just too funny:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/12/18/AR2010121803395.html
NobodySpecial
@gwangung: In some parts, you’re right. But in many of them, it’s so much nonsense that does nothing but covers for Blue Dogs. Many of the positions that poll so well with voters are express planks in the Democratic platform that would, if you imparted that logic to it, would also pull Republicans in blue states like Collins, Snowe, and Brown over to our side.
But it never works that way. Republicans show discipline because there are real punishments for not showing it. Blue Dogs show no discipline because they are rewarded for it with committee assignments.
In many of these cases..DADT, the original tax plan, ACA w/PO..there was no good ‘voter’ excuse for many of the no votes and grandstanding on our side of the aisle. They were all proposals that the majority polled on OUR side on. So you have to concentrate fire on those pols and get them in line.
wengler
This was a good thing. I am glad.
This will be the last good thing in national American politics for a very long time.
People should remember this time when Obama talks about ‘very hard choices’ in his State of the Union a month from now.
Next year is going to be a very bad year in American politics. The year after is going to be even worse.
srv
@BombIranForChrist:
At least McCain got tortured (regularly) to turn into a cranky old man, not sure what John’s excuse is.
“we prepare for a couple years of wingers and triangutards vying to see who can hit the hippies hardest”
I’m not sure what a traingutard is, but why interrupt the Broder-Juicers regular schtick?
Sentient Puddle
@srv:
I’m going to take a wild guess and say that part of it is people blithely trying to compare him to Broder.
srv
This is the third time I’ve asked this in the last couple of days, with no response. Various right-wing sources have noted for the last couple of days that the great tax-bill salvation does nothing for the 99’ers. I don’t know what to believe, but here’s Consumer Affairstake on it. I can’t find any pragmatist blog talking about this.
Now, if true, I thought all progressives where evil nihilists because they didn’t care about the 99’ers who will be on the curb freezing next week. Just wondering if all the pragmatists are nihilists too. Thx.
freelancer
@srv:
WTF are you talking about? Seriously. No. Really. I’d like to know. What. The. Fuck?
NobodySpecial
@srv: Well, first, that Consumer Affairs guy is clearly a firebagger or a member of the Professional Left.
Second, there was no chance to get a bill to cover the 99’ers. If you want to argue different, show us the 60 votes.
Third, The obvious difference is that there is a bill, so the 99’ers can feel warm knowing that other people won’t be screwed like 99’ers.
Race Condition
@DougJ (top):
-10 for the song referenced in the title.
-20 to me for recognizing it.
Please tell me you have a sister. It’s the only reason I recognize it (I have 2).
GregB
This is what it sounds like when doves cry.
J. Michael Neal
@NobodySpecial: Let’s go through a sequence of posts. First, here’s you:
As pointed out, we already have a problem. The only way you delivered 60 is if you include the Blue Dogs and all the rest that you are cursing. Without them, no 60. So, if they aren’t voting with us, then we never got to 60. However, you got more hilarious than that.
If you’re disowning them, then you didn’t deliver shit. You weren’t delivering 60. You were delivering 2. You don’t get to take credit for delivering 60 unless you are prepared to own every single one of them. Make up your mind.
And if you start denying them committee assignments, then the majority goes away. There’s a key difference between the Republicans and the Democrats. It’s that, for Republicans, the big corporate money is on the same side as the base. If they enforce party discipline, they can make the money for a candidate disappear.
Democrats can’t do that. A lot of the big money wants centrist Democrats. If you enforce party discipline, the candidate still gets funded. They can still run a strong campaign. You’re stuck with them, unless the party starts actively running against the incumbents, in which case you’re likely to lose the seat.
This is beyond the fact that that the entire structure of the Democratic party, and particular it’s Senate positions, is that everyone wants to be their own individual. That’s true not only of the Blue Dogs, but pretty much everyone else. It’s not that they’re thinking of their ideology; it’s that they’re thinking of their prerogatives. Booting the centrists won’t change that. The left wing of the party is just as bad about it.
Calouste
@Race Condition:
You’ve never watched Jackie Brown?
Mike Kay (Team America)
what is “high broderism” — is that when Broder is smoking pot?
I mean really, “high broderism” compared to what – “mid broderism”? Like a Model A, doesn’t broder only have one gear?
NobodySpecial
@J. Michael Neal: And here comes the clown car to continue down the path of fail.
Let’s discuss two words you seem to have a problem with.
I’ll put this in the simplest terms possible, ones you may be able to deal with.
One of these things is not like the other!
Class dismissed.
Yutsano
@NobodySpecial: English could clear up a helluva lot of misunderstandings with a plural you. Just sayin’. Hell even Japanese has a plural you and they barely even USE pronouns.
Mnemosyne
@NobodySpecial:
I was wondering how the firebaggers were going to manage to turn Obama keeping one of his major promises into a betrayal of all things progressive, but you guys managed it. I have to admit, it’s quite a talent to always come up with some way that Obama failed you by doing exactly what you wanted him to do.
So, remind me, why exactly were we all calling our Senators to get them to vote for the repeal? It sounds like we should have saved ourselves some time and let the repeal go down to defeat again since, after all, absolutely nothing has changed.
Matt
Can we get a ‘Nancy SMASH’ tag on this post? God knows where we’d be without our amazing Speaker of the House. She should get more props on this.
asiangrrlMN
@Matt: Agreed. She has done a hell of a damn good fucking job (pardon my French) as Madame Speaker of the House. She deserves major props for her part in getting this bill passed.
Karen
Firebaggers, seizing defeat from the jaws of victory.
Yutsano
@asiangrrlMN: Amen to fucking that. She threw a shit ton of legislation at the Senate that Harry just let languish. And it was some seriously good progressive stuff. Not to mention she got her caucus to swallow some bitter pills when it became necessary. She is one damn good speaker. Hell I’d love it if Feinstein croaked tomorrow and Jerry appointed her as the replacement.
Mnemosyne
I don’t know why Truman gets any credit for desegregating the US armed forces since it took six years for them to be completely desegregated. If he wasn’t able to wave his mighty presidential pen (ahem) and get everything desegregated within 24 hours of signing the executive order, why did he even bother trying?
Mnemosyne
@Yutsano:
You are just cruel for dangling that sweet possibility in front of me. Especially right before I have to head off to sleep.
Yutsano
@Mnemosyne: You wuv me and you know it. :) Of course if I’m Dianne now I’m checking all my drinks.
Mnemosyne
@Yutsano:
Did you see that Ah-nold was trying to quickly sell 24 state buildings to paper over a hole in the budget before Brown gets into office?
That asshole can’t leave office fast enough for me. I wish Brown could help him along with a boot to the ass.
And with that, I’m off to bed. Hopefully no more trees will fall into our driveway overnight.
(I’ll tell that story tomorrow — still too much rejoicing about DADT to start relating today’s personal tribulations, funny as they are.)
asiangrrlMN
@Yutsano: Mmmmm, I love it when you talk like that. That would be awesome. Can you imagine the damage Nancy SMASH would do in the Senate? Oh, Mnemosyne is right–you are too cruel to dangle such a tempting sugar plum right before bedtime.
@Mnemosyne: Oh, good lord. That would be funny if it weren’t so fucking sad (Arnie selling off the state to pay the debts). And, I hope no one was hurt in the tree carnage. Night.
Yutsano
@Mnemosyne: Whiskey Tango Foxtrot? Yeah, how in the hell that’s supposed to save any money is beyond me. My guess is it was an accounting gimmick to shiv Jerry with a monetary sucker to limit his options in fixing the crisis. I hope Maria rips his balls off for that one.
@asiangrrlMN: This is where I whistle innocently and look cute. :)
freelancer
@Karen:
Fixed.
NobodySpecial
@Mnemosyne: Well, you can’t give Obama much credit for DADT, since he insisted that’s Congress’s job. Give it to Harry and Nancy before you give it to Barack.
Second, what I’m talking about is using an EO to end investigations and dismissals until the law takes effect. Once again, he’d have been well within his rights to issue that EO at any time in the last six months, after the first lawsuit went through the lower court. He’s CinC, he controls military organization, he has precedent in Truman’s EO to integrate the military that the Supreme Court would not overturn. And once again, it costs him nothing politically.
The law has passed, and when he signs it, it won’t be necessary. But we lost people who were discharged who didn’t need to be in the last six months on this bullshit. Maybe they deserve a little consideration from you.
asiangrrlMN
@Yutsano: You always look cute and innocent. I don’t know how you manage it with that devious mind of yours.
@NobodySpecial: Now you’re being churlish. I think we can spread the credit around. People have wanted Obama to use the bully pulpit, as it were, and he’s been pretty insistent on repealing DADT for the past few weeks. And, while I go back and forth about the EO, I am not confident that the Supreme Court would not overturn it narrowly (5-4).
freelancer
@NobodySpecial:
And being a Chief Exec who know that Congress is full of wild cards, but is of the opinion, as a Constitutional Law Professor, that the Legislature was intended to be the strongest of the three branches of government, and that the Executive and the Office of the President was to be weaker, doing everything he could to make the departments beneath him acquiesce to the possible/inevitable change that he promised in the campaign was nothing more than weak sauce and empty talk from a politician in a suit.
I cannot emphasize this enough, but here goes.
Fuck Yourself with a Blue Ringed Octopus. Your opinion is noxious poison.
amk
@NobodySpecial:
.
There fixed. You’re welcome.
IM
@Yutsano:
Isn’t you the plural you? I thought thou was the singular you until it fell in disuse.
Dicky Kunc
If there was no firedoglake element, the hypotenuse of triangulation would be much shorter and less would ever get done and mr. happy medium would be able to go much farther to the right. If only everyone would settle for less, his job would be so much easier!
Chalk it up as an epic win but remember that tomorrow is another day.
Dicky Kunc
@Restrung: I think its a service to people in the military to inform them that just because this bill passed doesn’t mean it is time quite yet to breathe easily.
Who wants to be the last person discharged under a bogus law simply because you jumped to quickly to dance on its figurative grave? Why be so consumed with FDL angst and weldschmertz?
IM
Now that we are all Leni Riefenstahl anyway, I can do a bit of godwinning.
Yesterday I searched the wides of the Internet, because I wanted to hear “In the navy” from the Village People. (Silly and cheap, yes). Now I actually didn’t find them but traveled over Marlene Dietrich and Vera Lynn to Zahrah Leander.
One fitting song:
“Ich weiß, es wird einmal ein Wunder geschehen und wir werden uns wiedersehen!”
It would be nice to see Nancy Pelosi again. Because a woman belongs in the house. With a gavel in her hands!
(If you don’t like it: Just listen to Vera Lynn and “We will meet again.” Same in British)
Regarding the dark age of a republican house:
“Davon geht die Welt nicht unter, sie hat ja schon viel gesehen”
IM
@Dicky Kunc:
I don’t doubt the good intentions of FDL. But I am not sure that they are efficient at building pressure from the left
simonp
look how do we know obama is even going to sign DADT into law? he’s sold us out enough times already trying to appeal to “democrats” like joe lieberman!! ALL YOU OBOTS ARE GOING TO LOOK SO SILLY WHEN HE VETOES IT TO LOOK “BIPARTISAN”. OBOTS!!
Admiral_Komack
@Mike Kay (Team America):
With the stroke of a pen, the President wil change “Act Up” to “Shut The Fuck Up”.
freelancer
@IM:
I doubt FDL because their idea of “pressure” amounts to kneecapping.
TR
For someone named “Nobody Special” your level of intelligence seems quite “special” indeed.
agrippa
The economy.
The recession is the main problem.
agrippa
@Yutsano:
Yes, I think that next to nothing wil get done in the next two years. What little that is done by the House will be fatuous and/or hypocritical. That is what Congress looks like for the next two years: fatuous and hypocritical.
It comes down to the economy. Even the teabaggers will notice that.
If the economy improves and the Democrats run good candidates and a good campaign, 2012 will work out OK.
amk
Why mccain voted against DADT yesterday. The real reason.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aotlEpmAFVQ&feature=player_embedded
You steenky libruals are only out to vilify him.
Resident Firebagger
@mclaren: What you said — plus the coming dismantling of Social Security, the foreclosure crisis in general and HAMP, an Obama special that’s seldom discussed on B-J, in particular. Plus the fact that HCR won’t even happen till 2014 (which, given the R-ing of Congress, likely means, not at all).
As I said in another thread, even if Reid and others deserve credit, I think the by far the biggest reason it happened is because the military was willing. But beyond that, I believe people like Teddy Partridge who were demanding what’s right had a helluva lot more to do with this than any noble, pragmatic centrist.
I am seriously, truly glad that DADT is close to being put down. But don’t expect me to respond to this by getting all gooshy over the fascist Wall Street tools that run this country…
freelancer
@amk:
No need for libruls to perform any vilification rites, McCain made his bed years ago. Dear Old Johnny made himself a Bond antagonist in the mold of Abe Simpson and he keeps tying more and more onions to his belt to try endear himself to the 27 percenters.
freelancer
@Resident Firebagger:
I’m not happy about the Payroll Tax Deduction. That said, it’s not a death knell for SSI. By ANY MEANS. WTF is HAMP?! (Okay, Google sez it’s the foreclosure reduction program, aka the most evil thing ever!) Then there’s the hypothetical handicapping of the implementation of the settled law that is the ACA, which in your humble opinion, you say is “likely” to result in nothing good. Seriously, you need to be told to go fuck yourself, in fact, I tell you this morning: Go Fuck Yourself. You’re waving a white flag in the face of a tapestry that hasn’t even been woven yet. The Money Party doesn’t bat a thousand, not when they’re still beholden to votes. They are still responsible to the people.
But Golf Clap to you, sir, looking out for the greater good and making your righteousness known. You’ve done a yeoman’s job. Well done. You’re a legend.
I hate speaking for anyone on this site, aside from myself, but you know what? Fuck it. As a service to everyone who reads the comments, could you change your name to “Drive-by Firebagger”? Mmkay? You shouldn’t consider yourself a “resident”. If Cole banned dickheads, you’d be in the first 5 to be evicted. The wingnuts are bad enough, but somehow, you and your ilk easily earn more scorn. So yeah, fuck yourself, and fuck you. Fuck You. You are poison, and I will be waiting for you in the tall grass next time you show up here.
DougJ
@Race Condition:
You don’t like the Delfonics.
They’re pretty good!
jinxtigr
I wonder how it plays out if Obama’s set up with a lot of ‘Repeal Fulfills Another Clinton Promise’. On the surface it seems like a slam, or trying to steal credit. But people loved Clinton, except that he conned them. If somebody’s come along who’s doing the Clinton promises, but for reals, it seems like that’s setting up Obama to be loved.
Thomas
This DADT repeal has me very happy. Firstly it was obviously the right thing to do to repeal a blatantly discriminatory policy. Secondly on a political level it is just great to have a true victory which didn’t involve compromise. This isn’t like healthcare where we won by co-opting the right wing position (even if that now supposedly amounts to “sohshulism”). We flat out won. Feels pretty good especially given the fact that once the GOP is in charge there will be zero coming out of Congress that’s worthwhile.
John Cole
This is spoof, right?
If not, seriously, go fuck yourself. Two weeks ago you emo manic progressives were shitting all over me calling me an O-Bot because I still had hope Obama had a plan and it would get repealed.
Now, it’s all backslaps and handshakes in the emo set, telling each other there is nothing you can do if you don’t let John Cole drag you down.
Go eat a bag of dicks.
Triassic Sands
Classic Reportage:
NPR’s Weekend Edition reports that…
The obvious implication of that statement is that every Democrat voted FOR DADT.
I guess they didn’t think it was worth explaining what “Democrat” (Spineless Joe Manchin) was doing while the rest of his fellow Democrats were voting.
Rather than be on the wrong side of history, Manchin just decided to pretend history doesn’t exist. It probably wouldn’t be a bad idea if we did the same for Manchin. What an auspicious start.
freelancer
@DougJ:
@John Cole:
Seriously guys, go back to bed. I had it covered. Besides, no one could ever decipher what the hell a “Broder-Juicer” is.
For some reason, an Obama campaign promise and progressive victory fulfilled unleashed the hordes of fucktardery and otherwise split-brained armies of typists who needed to rage at something.
Go back to bed.
mr. whipple
You are making a difference.
eemom
“didn’t I do it baby…….didn’t I do it baaaaaaby…..”
??
I THINK that is the referent for this post title, but I keep hoping I’m wrong.
freelancer
@freelancer:
Also, see this, and wield it as needed.
God, if the GOP wasn’t so batshit, and the center wasn’t as pervasively ignorant, I might just have a mind to hate those left of the center-left with every fiber of my being.
sparky
it is possible to be glad that a stupid wrongheaded policy was finally reversed without giving hosannas and claiming that this was a big deal for Obama. and do that without being a firebagger but simply paying attention, to wit:
someone on this thread said that Obama had used his political capital in getting DADT repealed. as if having the military–the only organization affected in this legislation–on your side was somehow not relevant. and guess what: the person who went to Congress and said it would not be an issue was appointed by Jr.
so you might want to consider who, exactly, is wearing the rose-colored glasses here.
mai name
I for one am genuinely surprised that DADT go through. I am fervently hoping that this means that the rational wing of the GOP is making a comeback. This kind of puts my faith back in the Obama WH because I could not believe that he gave them the tax cut without getting DADT and the START treaty. I am very unhappy about the payroll tax. I think its a horrible precedent and the Repubs have set a trap at the same time. I am sick and tired of the beating up of the FDLrs on this blog. I still believe that without them the Dems will go even further to the right. I think they point out stuff and get the base going on stuff that is not pointed out by the MSM. And while I like Josh Marshall, his audience is tiny compared to the MSM.
Also too I like Barack Obama. I know this sounds like one of those stupid Bushbots, but I find Obama to be a smart witty decent human being who I would like to have a latte with. And then I would take him for a spin in my green volvo to the
birkenstock store,farmers market, mosque.Edited because I forgot Nancy Pelosi. Pretty much none of Obama’s stuff would have passed without Ms.Pelosi who is going to go down as one of the most effective speakers evah!!!
Cacti
So, how long before the professional left and the rest of the frustrati start saying some variant of…
“Obama repealed DADT so he could send teh gheys to Afghanistan to die!”
sparky
these days it seems that much of the heat here is generated by inapt comparisons that set off some kind of tripwire.
@John Cole: ?
or maybe i missed something a couple of weeks ago so i could understand this. in any event the proprietor here is most assuredly not Broder-esque.
and cuz nobody hates a long thread more than me, (ha ha) i thought i’d highlight this funny:
@freelancer:
NYT earlier this year.
in case anyone missed the joke, the idea that Obama respects the law has to be pretty amusing since at least as to the National Security State he appears to be to the right of Bush.
ps: not knowing about HAMP is um interesting, as it is 100% an Obama policy. oh, and surprise:
but yeah i guess you could avoid that problem by calling the guy who wrote that a firebagger too. seems a kind of all-purpose shoutdown tool.
sparky
WP question relating to my comment going into moderation:
do links to comments here also count as links? cuz otherwise i can’t figure out why i’m in moderation (2 external linkies).
danke to anyone who knows.
sparky
oh and McCain: i have no love for him at all, and it was a good thing that enough people were sick of the GOP to keep him out of the WH.
that said, is it possible that he’s entered a kind of early onset dementia? if so it might be best to just ignore him rather than make fun of him, if only so that it doesn’t give the Rs the opportunity to say Ds hate the old folks or some such tripe.
YMMV.
lllphd
@BombIranForChrist:
um, do you really expect anyone to take seriously a comment from “bombiranforchrist”? am i missing something?
that title explains your inclination to spin issues to the extreme, while missing the numerous internal contradictions. such as bombing for christ? what the hell is THAT?
it happens to be entirely possible to stand and fight for ideals and principles while acknowledging the realistic requirement for compromise in a democracy. see, the problem with insisting that we all do what’s right is that not everyone shares the same sense of what’s “right.”
hence, um, that – ya know – democracy thing.
Nick
@NobodySpecial:
Funny how fast “we” becomes “1”
ETA: Thanks for Mark Kirk btw
Nick
@Cacti:
http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2010/12/18/183749/51/296#c296
kabiddle
Again, when you think that the party of human dignity has gone soft, it pulls it off. DADT repeal is huge, and the O man got it the way he wanted it — not by executive decree, not by the courts, but as a matter of legislation. Hard fought, hard won, and never having to look back. Sometimes I really love this guy. And Nancy — I think she will be viewed by history as the greatest Speaker in modern times. Harry, oy, they do come out swinging after the lights have turned off, don’t they?
Joe L. — well, I think he jumped on a bandwagon in order that he not have to find another job next year, so lets not give him much credit beyond his own lilly-livered ass. Same with Mr Brown. Look and see. Olympia? Don’t know enough.
Yes, I am giddy. A victory over the fear-peddlers. Time to double-down.
Suck It Up!
@srv:
There is no help for 99-ers in the bill and I only heard of one person from the House mentioning that fact. Prior to the mid-terms Debbie Stabenow tried to get the Americans Want To Work Act passed but it failed in the Senate. I don’t even know if the House leadership brought it up when they were thinking of changing the tax cut bill. Contacted my senator about the issue and was told that once the other unemployed are taken care of, he will address the 99-ers. I wrote his office and basically told him he was full of it.
Seems funny that so many people are bringing up the 99ers(not referring to you of course), but prior to the tax bill I barely heard (or read) a peep about 99-ers. I didn’t even see any reports or push on the Americans Want To Work Act.
Nick
@NobodySpecial:
Boy, you’re more bitter about him winning than McCain is.
Mnemosyne
@asiangrrlMN:
Fortunately, the only damage was to the tree itself and the mailboxes under it. Though the kitty next door is going to be very sad to discover that his favorite tree to perch in is now gone.
Still raining steadily this morning, so we should be getting mudslides sooner rather than later. Yay.
mclaren
“Triangutards.” That’s a good one! I like that almost as much as “hatriots.” Or “teahadists.”
And if there’s a less trollish front-pager than DougJ, I don’t know who it would be. “Chief troll DougJ.” Just bizarre.
Mnemosyne
@NobodySpecial:
In other words, once again you wanted Obama to do something that no president in the history of the country has been able to do by getting the military to work on his schedule and not theirs.
It took six years to completely desegregate the US military after Truman’s EO. And Obama was supposed to give you the same result within 12 hours of the law being passed by Congress?
Mnemosyne
@sparky:
So all of the work that Obama and his administration did over the past two years was completely meaningless because, hey, Gates would totally have repealed DADT all on his own?
Weird that Gates never quite got around to it while he was Bush’s Defense Secretary, but suddenly revved up and got it done as Obama’s Defense Secretary. Almost as though the new president asked him to make it a priority or something.
Nah, that couldn’t be it. It must all be due to W’s genius of appointing Gates in 2006 so he could lay low until a new president arrived who would ignore his efforts to repeal DADT. Or something. Either way, we should be praising George W Bush for this result, not Obama.
(On another note, yes, links to other commenters count towards your limit of three, so if you respond to a commenter using the “reply to” button and then include three links to stories, you’ll get thrown into moderation.)
different church-lady
You don’t know what you got ’til it’s gone…
mk3872
@MattR: Any
“progressives” in congress that are the darlings of the FDL or DK crowd will get no love from Obama.
This is because Obama is interested in serious legislation that actually stands a chance of passing and making a difference.
And the FDL / DK crowd is only interested in bills that are purist liberal partisan ideas with NO conservative ideas at all. So they cannot negotiate with Obama, Blue Dogs or Repubs.
However, the middle-of-the-road Repubs like Lugar, Snowe, Collins and Brown CAN & WILL do business with the WH.
ruemara
@NR:
You have a faulty interpreter. There is nothing deprecatory towards Jane Hamsher in what mk said. Maybe, you should stop treating political reality as if these are 2 teams, winner take all.
@NobodySpecial:
I’m sure others have brought it up, but this is a long thread. The make up of the military is set by Congress under the law of DADT. Issuing an EO to defy the law as a blanket policy is not legal. The current application of DADT restricts all expulsions as under the review of Joint Chiefs, effectively putting a firm structure and limitation on the more punitive practice that was going on before.
AxelFoley
And people take Greenwald seriously?
Mike Kay (Team America)
@AxelFoley: some people find him cute (jonas brother), and thus the high school-like fanboys.
Mike Kay (Team America)
@John Cole:
Hey, c’mon. That’s no way to insult Glen’s groupies.
Ryan
@mclaren:
Nobody is forced to buy insurance, they just have to pay more tax if they don’t.
Lisa
I heard on NPR that they have stopped investigations for about six months now, according to the Joint Cheif’s office. What is all of this fucking hysterical bullshit about Obama continuing investigations into gay servicepersons? Jesus, FDL is a bunch of twats.
Lisa
@Nick: Nice p0wn! Very well done, sir.