Just as Planned

Like I have been telling you, Susan Collins is the “moderate” face that the Republican caucus is using to kill the repeal of DADT:

We talked earlier Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid’s (D-Nev.) surprise move this morning: he’s getting started tonight on the defense authorization act, which includes a provision on repealing “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell.” I talked to a senior Senate aide who’s helped flesh out where things stand in more detail.

At this point, Sen. Susan Collins (R) of Maine, who claims to support repeal, appears to be the senator who stands in the way of success. On Friday, Collins had a lengthy meeting with Reid and Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-Conn.), trying to resolve her concerns and clear the way for passage. They didn’t reach an agreement.

This was soon followed by President Obama reaching out to Collins directly over the weekend, urging her to do the right thing. They didn’t reach an agreement, either. This led to additional talks between Reid and Collins this morning.

In a nutshell, Collins is asking Democratic leaders for unlimited debate on the defense bill. Reid, in turn, is offering Collins a compromise: votes on 10 separate amendments*, seven of which would come from Republicans, three of which would come from Democrats.

Collins has responded that this isn’t good enough, and she’ll refuse to let the Senate vote up or down on the legislation.

It’s worth emphasizing that Collins just isn’t being reasonable. Looking back over the last couple of decades, a total of 10 amendments is entirely routine for this defense authorization bill, and is actually far more than the number of amendments considered most of the time.

Why not just give in and tell Collins she can have unlimited debate? Because Republicans really are desperate to kill the legislation, and the most far-right members will keep offering unrelated amendments indefinitely, running out the clock on the lame-duck session, and derailing the bill.

It has been so obvious this is what she has been doing that some idiot who was dumb enough to vote for Bush has told you EXACTLY what she is doing. Not once, but twice.

This needs to be said, over, and over, and over again- there is no such thing as a moderate Republican. They are all rotten to the core. They either agree with everything the frothing lunatics in the party want to do, or they enable it. Susan Collins may fool herself into thinking she is not a bigot because she personally supports ending DADT, but if you ask me, the wife who sews eyeholes into pillow cases and the kisses her husband on the cheek as he heads off to the Klan rally is as culpable and as much a scumbag as he.

Any idiot “independents” who can not figure this out, or anyone who pretends to be a “reasonable Republican” should be called out for their complicity.

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158 replies
  1. 1
    Hunter Gathers says:

    She’s not a bigot, she only does the bidding of bigots. And, best of all, when she sides with her bigoted colleagues, all the blame gets put on Obama. It’s a win-win situation for her. She gets to claim that she’s not a bigot, while making sure the black guy gets the blame. Loverly.

  2. 2
    suzanne says:

    They either agree with everything the frothing lunatics in the party want to do, or they enable it.

    Yup.

    I often wonder if they’re self-aware enough to realize what hypocritical shitstains they are, or if the cognitive dissonance is just so damn strong that they genuinely believe they can be for something while really being against it. Another variant on “stupid v. evil”.

  3. 3
    cyntax says:

    This needs to be said, over, and over, and over again- there is no such thing as a moderate Republican. They are all rotten to the core. They either agree with everything the frothing lunatics in the party want to do, or they enable it.

    Fair enough. Not that anyone here was exactly doubting your take on Collins’ role (or Snowe’s). Of course that means that “working” with this crew over the next two years sure will be fun.

  4. 4
    Nick L says:

    This needs to be said, over, and over, and over again- there is no such thing as a moderate Republican. They are all rotten to the core. They either agree with everything the frothing lunatics in the party want to do, or they enable it.

    Eh, Lugar’s okay. I disagree with him on a lot of things, but I think he’s relatively honest and well-intentioned.

    The rest can go to hell.

  5. 5
    TooManyJens says:

    Her phone keeps being busy, so I left a voice mail. Everybody call and tell her she’s not fooling anybody.

  6. 6
    long ago says:

    “sewing eyeholes into pillow-cases” = new post tag, no?

  7. 7
    Culture of Truth says:

    They either agree with everything the frothing lunatics in the party want to do, or they enable it… or they leave the party and become annoying conservative Dems.

  8. 8
    Maude says:

    I just feel sad about this. She is awful like the rest of them and detrimental to the military.
    Had a network timeout when I tried to do comment a few minutes ago. It was the most brilliant comment ever.

  9. 9
    chopper says:

    there are moderate republicans. they’re called ‘blue dog democrats’. and they’re just as infuriating as mainstream republicans.

  10. 10
    burnspbesq says:

    Realistically, there is only one solution to this problem: do away with the 60-vote requirement for motions to proceed and cloture motions. The downside risk to this is real and significant. Someday the Destroy America Party will have a majority in the Senate. Are you willing to take that risk?

  11. 11
    c u n d gulag says:

    Republicans maintain Party discipline by threatening Senators and Congresspeople that if they don’t follow along to the letter, they’ll lose their Committee position, and money for re-elections.
    Democrats? They let Liebershits keep his Homeland Security leadership position. And you wonder why our side sucks. There’s no punishment at all for being against anything.
    So, sometimes, even if they want to be moderate, they can’t because of this. Now, add the fact that anyone NOT agreeing with the ones frothing at the mouth will get Teabagged in the primaries in ’12.
    Hence, compliant lemmings!

  12. 12
    4tehlulz says:

    This is Obama’s fault because he won’t abolish The Senate(tm) with an executive order.

  13. 13
    PeakVT says:

    there is no such thing as a moderate Republican. They are all rotten to the core.

    There are some moderates, but apparently they are all cowards.

  14. 14
    4tehlulz says:

    Also, I hope Luke Scott doesn’t decide to go for stroll outside Camden Yards for awhile.

    (Obama) was not born here,” Scott asserted to Answer Man in the session’s last segment. “That’s my belief. I was born here. If someone accuses me of not being born here, I can go — within 10 minutes — to my filing cabinet and I can pick up my real birth certificate and I can go, ‘See? Look! Here it is. Here it is.’ The man has dodged everything. He dodges questions, he doesn’t answer anything.

  15. 15
    Culture of Truth says:

    Obama should sell Maine back to France.
    Pay off half the debt and use the rest for stim. We’ll throw in Kennebunkport for free.

  16. 16
    MattF says:

    And Obama gets blamed for not repealing DADT single-handedly. Also. Bah.

  17. 17
    Church Lady says:

    I think that calling ALL Republicans “rotten to the core” might be just a tad overstated. That’s a pretty broad brush you’re painting a mighty large swathe of the electorate (or even elected officials) with. Were you “rotten to the core” when you were actively voting Republican for almost 20 years? I somehow doubt that. You are the same person inside now that you were then. Just because one has certain political beliefs (and usually doesn’t buy into every single plank of a particular Party’s platform) doesn’t make them terrible people. The way they live their lives matters more.

  18. 18
    cyntax says:

    @burnspbesq:

    Someday the Destroy America Party will have a majority in the Senate.

    And at that point, they’ll do away with the filibuster. Cause that’s how they roll.

  19. 19
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    How can you blame Collins or the GOP!?! Surely, this has to be ALL obama’s fault.

  20. 20
    Agoraphobic Kleptomaniac says:

    The compromise will be to remove the DADT provision altogether, and then ask for a commission (6 repubs, 3 dems) to study the effects of the study released 2 weeks ago, per king McCain, and a vote on repealing DADT to take place October 15th, 2012 based on their findings.

    /endprofessionalleft

  21. 21
    Culture of Truth says:

    Why do I suspect a tea bagger birth certificate is a crayon drawing saying “BORN HEAR”

  22. 22
    daveNYC says:

    Realistically, there is only one solution to this problem: do away with the 60-vote requirement for motions to proceed and cloture motions. The downside risk to this is real and significant. Someday the Destroy America Party will have a majority in the Senate. Are you willing to take that risk?

    You don’t think that the Republicans won’t ditch the various super-majority rules if they don’t get their way? They almost did a few years ago, and they’ve only gotten nuttier since then.

  23. 23
    cleek says:

    anyone doubt that she loveslovesloves being the center of attention whenever a bill needs to get through the Senate ?

  24. 24
    burnspbesq says:

    @4tehlulz:

    You’ve obviously been hanging out with Sandy Levinson in Austin, drinking margaritas at La Zona Rosa.

  25. 25
    Navigator says:

    Harry Reid:

    “Certainly, Senator Collins.

    And I will adjourn this Congress immediately after an up-or-down vote is taken. Plan yours and your Republican colleagues’ Holidays accordingly.”

  26. 26
    Emerald says:

    Why would Reid do this if he isn’t absolutely sure he has the votes? Pelosi never schedules a vote until she knows she’s gonna win.

    Does anybody have a clue why they’re doing this today?

  27. 27
    Lolis says:

    A million times yes. Susan Collins is a fraud who probably only supported DADT repeal cause she thought she would not have to go on record for it. I think Reid should schedule unlimited debate with the requirement that it goes seven days a week until it is done. If Republicans want to filibuster they can keep it up on Xmas Eve and Xmas day.

  28. 28
    calling all toasters says:

    But, but, but…. she’s a lead-pipe cinch to vote ‘yea’ on the BESTEST TAX DEAL EVAH. Have you no faith in her ability to get the rest of the Democratic agenda passed?

  29. 29
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    Can someone who is gay or lesbian answer why any gay person votes republican?

    are just self-hating?

    I ask because while there are black republicans, I’ve never heard of black person who voted for a segregationist, yet there’s a good chunk of gays who pull the gop lever. Do they just not care about DADT and/or marriage?

  30. 30
    Joe Beese says:

    And failure to repeal DADT will come as such a painful blow to Obama’s mighty, equality-loving heart.

    He so wanted gays to be able to die in Afghanistan for him. (He just didn’t want them to be able to get married before they left.)

  31. 31
    Stillwater says:

    @Mike Kay (Team America): yet there’s a good chunk of gays who pull the gop lever

    More than we’ll ever know.

  32. 32
    Admiral_Komack says:

    @Hunter Gathers:

    She’s full of shit.

    Now when is Act Up going to act up at Susan Collins’ office, or the office of any other Republican Senator (like John McCain)?

    When?

  33. 33
    Paul in KY says:

    @Nick L: IMO, if Sen. Lugar was honest, he’d switch to being an Independent & caucus with us.

  34. 34
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    @Stillwater: McCain’s chief of staff is gay. I’m not kidding. Bush’s last chief of staff, Josh Bolten is gay.

    I mean, you don’t think rent-boy Jeff Gannon got a white house job by accident.

  35. 35
    mr. whipple says:

    Now when is Act Up going to act up at Susan Collins’ office, or the office of any other Republican Senator (like John McCain)?

    When?

    As soon as they’re done protesting at Obama events.

  36. 36
    Bullsmith says:

    Do people in Maine not get tired of this stuff? It’s not exactly subtle, or rare.

  37. 37
    ThatLeftTurnInABQ says:

    @4tehlulz:

    This is Obama’s fault because he won’t abolish The Senate™ with an executive order.

    That’s impossible! How will the Emperor maintain control
    without the bureaucracy?

  38. 38

    @Culture of Truth: If we’re selling back maine, can we sell back the louisiana purchase too? And maybe also Seward’s Folly (aka Alaksa)?

  39. 39
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    @Admiral_Komack:

    Now when is Act Up going to act up

    When are gays gonna mobilize against those who stand in front of the door and shout:

    Homophobia Today!

    Homophobia Tomorrow!

    Homophobia Forever!

    Harvey Milk is rolling over in grave over the lack of gay activism.

  40. 40
    Tonal Crow says:

    @burnspbesq: And what makes you think that the Destroy America party won’t simply end the filibuster itself? It’s not like it’ll need our permission should it obtain a majority in the Senate.

  41. 41
    Mark S. says:

    Can this be the issue that we fight on? Because otherwise these nihilistic goopers will do this over and over.

    @Church Lady:

    OK, Church Lady, we’ll restrict it to elected officials. At least 5-10 Republican Senators aren’t homophobic bigots, but none of them are willing to buck their party on this or pretty much any issue of any consequence. Is that integrity? Is that anything remotely admirable.

  42. 42
    Suck It Up! says:

    all the blame is already being put on Obama and Harry Reid.

  43. 43
    burnspbesq says:

    @Emerald:

    The little news screen in the elevator says that Pryor has come around.

  44. 44
    Culture of Truth says:

    @TheMightyTrowel: I like it.

  45. 45
    Annelid Gustator says:

    @Navigator: Technically, couldn’t the Republicans run out the clock completely: the new congress is seated January 4th… so all terms expire on the 3rd?

  46. 46
    Belafon (formerly anonevent) says:

    @Joe Beese: Oh wait, that’s right, some gays want to be part of the military knowing that they could get killed.

  47. 47
    lol says:

    @ThatLeftTurnInABQ:

    OFA State Directors now have direct control over their territories. Fear will keep the Professional Left in line. Fear of Sarah Palin.

  48. 48
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    @Suck It Up!: see, there never was a realty based community. The firebaggers are nothing more than a mirror of the teabaggers.

  49. 49
    toujoursdan says:

    @Mike Kay (Team America):

    “Because the Dems will take my taxes and give them to poor people. That’s MY money they’re stealing.

    And McCain once said that he doesn’t want to kill gay people, so the GOP really likes us. Honest. Only Dems are homophobic. Look at Obama. He doesn’t like gay marriage.”

    /gay wingnut

  50. 50
    lol says:

    @burnspbesq:

    Like Lincoln, Pryor voted for it the first time around but changed his vote when it became clear it wasn’t going to pass.

    So it’s interesting that he’s coming out publicly beforehand instead of waiting for the outcome to be clear and covering his ass either way.

  51. 51
    somethingblue says:

    @burnspbesq:

    The downside risk to this is real and significant. Someday the Destroy America Party will have a majority in the Senate. Are you willing to take that risk?

    In a heartbeat. Not least because I can’t imagine that the Democrats would really filibuster anything a Republican majority wanted to do. Also too, I think we should have a working Senate, and if the electorate wants to have the Destroy America Party run it, well, that’s their call.

  52. 52
    Anya says:

    These ‘moderates’ hypocrisy is not exposed because our side decided that Obama is the villain of every piece of legislation. He is the enemy so the obstructionist assholes are given cover by a media that’s enamoured with fantacy of some Brave souls fighting the extremists on both sides, and an out of control left, filled with hate for Obama that they miss everything else. They’ve empowered these assholes. Never mind that the crazies on our side sucked the air out of everything that no one is putting a spot light on these douchebaggs.

  53. 53
    Chyron HR says:

    @Culture of Truth:

    Why do I suspect a tea bagger birth certificate is a crayon drawing saying “BORN HEAR”

    That’s ridiculous.

    It also has an big arrow pointing down.

  54. 54
    Davis X. Machina says:

    @Bullsmith: No.

    Collins was re-elected in 2008, 60-40 against the national trend, against a popular three-term US rep. with 100% name recognition (Tom Allen), in an election that saw ME’s Democratic US reps elected or re-elected.

  55. 55
    dollared says:

    Now THIS is what I come here for.

    JC, thanks for pointing the outrage weapon in the right direction.

    And right on about complicity and enablers. There simply no longer is a Bob Dole wing to the Republican Party, much less the Lincoln Chaffee wing. Anybody who pretends to belong owns everything Rush Limbaugh ever said, as their personal mantra.

  56. 56
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    @Suck It Up!: the moronic part, if DADT is blocked, Obama and Reid will get all the blame, if DADT succeeds, Obama and Reid will get NONE of the credit.

    All hail, the so-called, anti-intellectual reality based community.

  57. 57
    J. Michael Neal says:

    @Navigator Harry Reid:

    And I will adjourn this Congress immediately after an up-or-down vote is taken. Plan yours and your Republican colleagues’ Holidays accordingly.

    Susan Collins:

    ‘Senator Reid,

    I plan to be taking my holidays in Maine among my constituents. There will two or three of my Republican colleagues in Washington at all times in order to prevent the bill from coming to the floor. Enjoy opening your presents on the Senate floor.’

  58. 58
    goblue72 says:

    Wait – I thought us libtards were supposed to STFU over Obama’s tax deal because passing that meant we were gonna get all these goodies in the last two weeks of the year – DADT, DREAM, START, etc.?

  59. 59
    Roger Moore says:

    @burnspbesq:

    Someday the Destroy America Party will have a majority in the Senate.

    You’re missing a critical point. If the Democrats can eliminate the filibuster when they’re in charge, so can the Republicans. They probably will, too. There’s no percentage in keeping it in the hopes that it will somehow constrain the Republicans the next time the tables turn.

  60. 60
    Samnell says:

    @Culture of Truth:

    We didn’t buy Maine from France. We stole it from the Indians the old fashioned way, then haggled with the British over how much of the take went to each party, once there were two parties.

  61. 61
    J. Michael Neal says:

    @TheMightyTrowel:
    If we’re selling back maine, can we sell back the louisiana purchase too? And maybe also Seward’s Folly (aka Alaksa)?

    You motherfucker. If you sell back the Louisiana Purchase, it means I miss out on an actual single payer health care system my about 50 miles.

  62. 62
    ThatLeftTurnInABQ says:

    @Anya:
    I’m pretty confident that our upper-income-bracket pundit overlords in the news media would find a way to cover the behinds of the so-called GOP moderates even if the Left (professional, amateur, or will-work-for-food) not only didn’t exist, but had never existed. Stirring shit up amongst the Dems is merely a bonus for them, something to make the hackwork more entertaining.

  63. 63

    Oh John Cole, I do so hate when you’re right. When you’re right, it’s usually bad for the country and my blood pressure.

    Crap.

  64. 64
    Roger Moore says:

    @ThatLeftTurnInABQ:

    That’s impossible! How will the Emperor maintain control without the bureaucracy?

    Fear will keep the outer systems in line, fear of … wait a second. Nobody is afraid of the Democrats. I guess we’ll have to keep the Senate.

  65. 65
    Paul in KY says:

    @lol: Good one. I was trying to come up with a parody line myself & you have beat me to it. Kudos Grand Moff.

  66. 66
    Sasha says:

    Slightly off-topic:

    DeMint is threatening to filibuster the current tax deal.

    Wouldn’t it just be perfect if the GOP (rather than the Dems) scuttled the brokered tax compromise, causing the Bush cuts to expire?

  67. 67
    Dougb says:

    So why doesn’t Obama just pass an executive order ending DADT in his capacity of Commander in Chief? Truman didntwait for an act of congress to enact integration of the armed forces. It was a he’ll of a rocky road but Truman went ahead, in spite of opposition from a far larger proportion of the forces, congress, and the electorate.

    What is the downside for proceeding?

  68. 68
    geg6 says:

    Fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck.

    I hate this country.

    I’m going to go and award a bunch of scholarships to prospective students so I can feel good about something today.

  69. 69
    J. Michael Neal says:

    @Emerald:

    Why would Reid do this if he isn’t absolutely sure he has the votes? Pelosi never schedules a vote until she knows she’s gonna win.

    Because it’s now or never. He’s prepared to allow about a week’s worth of debate. They have other things that they want to get to, like the START treaty. As pointed out above, at midnight on Jan 3rd, the term ends and all pending legislation dies. If this bill can’t get to the floor now, then it never will. There isn’t any more time to round up the votes.

    Besides which, I think that Collins’ position doesn’t depend upon how long the negotiations go on; it depends entirely upon how close it is to the drop dead moment. If she’s going to come over, it will be at the last minute whether Reid does this now or at some point in the future. Every hour before that is just wasted posturing.

    I’d like to see Reid submit this to cloture and vote to end it right at the start and then leave the chamber. If he votes to end cloture and loses, then he can’t bring the same motion up again. It would be his way of telling the Republicans that this is it for the entire defense authorization bill, and if they vote to kill it, it’s dead. There won’t be any more negotiations. It won’t happen, but that’s my dream.

  70. 70
    ruemara says:

    @Emerald:

    He had the supposed last republican that was waffling say he would vote for it, based, I think, on the tax compromise. Then President Collins pulled this one. Bitch.

  71. 71
    ThatLeftTurnInABQ says:

    @Roger Moore:
    A complete technical readout of this station political party suggests that it is capable of blowing itself up without any outside assistance. Unfortunately the main weapon system was installed mounted backwards, so that it points inwards rather than outwards.

  72. 72
    geg6 says:

    @Lolis:

    This.

    But we’re talking Harry Reid here, so…

  73. 73
    Lee says:

    …sews eyeholes into pillow cases ….

    Wouldn’t that be “cut eyeholes”?

  74. 74
    Davis X. Machina says:

    @Sasha: Side by side with Bernie Sanders. Le Front Populaire vive!

  75. 75
    J. Michael Neal says:

    @geg6: And once again, Reid doesn’t have the power to force the Republicans to stay in town and filibuster. They can all leave town, with two or three of them remaining at any given time so that they always have someone on the floor to object to any motion to proceed. This has nothing to do with Harry Reid’s personality, and whether he would or wouldn’t use this power if he had it isn’t relevant.

  76. 76
    scarshapedstar says:

    Susan Collins may fool herself into thinking she is not a bigot because she personally supports ending DADT

    But she won’t fool me into believing that bullshit. She’s just as bigoted as every other Republican harpy.

  77. 77
    Sammy says:

    I don’t know, Obama seems to be a reasonable republican.

  78. 78
    fenian says:

    That’s quite an insight about Republicans, John.
    I wish the president shared it.

  79. 79
    Martin says:

    Let’s see if FYWP will let a comment through…

    @Sasha: As I mentioned before in another thread, everyone hates this compromise. It’s like asking which you would rather do to cure your flu – get shot in the leg or get slowly stabbed in the leg. Neither one is likely to solve the problem, but goddamnit people are expecting us to do something.

    I don’t think there will be a compromise in the framework of the expiring tax cuts. This isn’t 2001 and what may have made sense in 2001 as tax policy doesn’t make sense now, so simply recreating the old tax policy doesn’t necessarily solve the problems of today. This is sort of a ‘sunk costs’ kind of problem in that you can’t undo what’s been done – and by that I don’t mean the Bush tax cuts but the changes to the economy over the last 10 years.

    I think if a compromise could be argued outside of the framework of the expiring tax cuts, a solution would be more likely to be reached that increased tax receipts *and* still put the burden on the wealthy *and* not result in a top marginal rate increase. In that sense, everyone wins. We get the revenue increases we need, the middle class doesn’t get stuck with the bill, and the GOP holds the line on the tax rate in a responsible manner. But nobody is talking about this because the stage is somewhere else.

  80. 80
    Short Bus Bully says:

    Frothing, John, FROTHING at the mouth.

    Can’t help but agree with you but I don’t wonder if all your rage serves a greater purpose or just raises your volume in vent when you get wtfpwnt in WSG or have a raid wipe.

    Don’t blow a gasket on us.

  81. 81
    scarshapedstar says:

    @J. Michael Neal:

    The fact that Harry didn’t use his power as Majority Leader to fix the filibuster two years ago, and that he won’t do it at the start of the next session, however… that does reflect on his personality.

    And it doesn’t reflect well.

  82. 82
    Suck It Up! says:

    @goblue72:

    its all about meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

  83. 83
    Allan says:

    @Lee: Well, technically both, as a good Klan wife would first cut the eyeholes, then do a baste stitch or embroidery to finish the edges and prevent fraying.

  84. 84
    MTiffany says:

    This situation calls for the atheist’s imprecatory prayer: “Oh God, if there is one, please call your devout little bigot, Preznit Susan Collins, home, that she in her endless neediness may irritate the fuck out of you and try your infinite patience and grace, that the world may be a better place for her having left it.”

  85. 85
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    Lisa Murkowski says she will vote for DADT.

  86. 86
    Comrade Luke says:

    Kevin Drum: Bad news on DADT.

    He ends with:

    If this is really what’s happening, it’s a pretty sobering reminder of the power of the Republican right wing. Collins is sincerely in favor of repealing DADT, she’s not up for reelection until 2014, and she represents a moderate state. But obviously something has scared the hell out of her. She knows unlimited debate isn’t practical, and she knows that repealing DADT in the next session of Congress is all but impossible. So she’s killing this for years.
    ___
    I wonder who or what got to her?
    ___
    UPDATE: Greg Sargent reports further:
    ___
    A spokesman for Collins flatly denies she asked Reid for unlimited debate. Rather, the spokesman says, Collins has pointed out to Reid that the average number of days spent debating previous defense authorization bills has been 11 days, with an average of 14 or so amendments considered. Collins has asked Reid to come up with a comparable offer, the spokesman says.
    ___
    Hmmm. Greg also reports that Reid has upped his offer to 15 amendments, so it’s not clear what the problem is.

    “It’s not clear what the problem is.”

    Can we create another subset of the Left and call it The Obtuse Left?

  87. 87
    geg6 says:

    @J. Michael Neal:

    I’m not retarded; I understand how a filibuster works. If Collins wants her endless debate, I say give it to her. Keep debate open until Jan. 3 at midnight. We all know it’s not gonna pass anyway. Why not actually stand up and show America that the Dems, at least, take governing seriously and are willing to do whatever it takes to try to do it, even if they fail because of GOP obstruction? Who the fuck cares what the GOPers do? They’re going to do it anyway. And they keep going on and on and on and on about how the GOP obstructs, but they never show it (Americans are very, very stupid [witness election day 2010], they need pictures). I know it won’t be a Mr. Smith Goes to Washington filibuster, but instead of always backing down and whining about GOP obstruction, there will be a demonstration of it, even if it isn’t as dramatic as a Hollywood movie.

  88. 88
    geg6 says:

    @Mike Kay (Team America):

    Gotta say, I’m loving the new and improved Vengeful Lisa Murkowski. I’m sure I’ll hate her again soon enough, but for now, she’s awesome.

  89. 89
    TooManyJens says:

    @Comrade Luke:

    Rather, the spokesman says, Collins has pointed out to Reid that the average number of days spent debating previous defense authorization bills has been 11 days, with an average of 14 or so amendments considered.

    Not according to OpenCongress:

    I took a quick look through the legislative histories of Defense Authorization bills of years past, and, going back to 2003, I found that most of the bills passed in a single day and the longest debate was 9 days. That makes the average length of debate for these years to be less than 3 days.

  90. 90
    Tsulagi says:

    Awww, don’t go harsh on Susan. She just wants some of the same Dem love and attention her sister Olympia got while helping take the R out of HCR.

  91. 91
    Culture of Truth says:

    The Alaska senator said that she will only vote to break a filibuster of a key defense spending bill with the repeal attached if “the majority allows for an open and fair amendment process.”

    Collins, Brown, also maybes.

  92. 92
    fraught says:

    @Mike Kay (Team America): There’s still lots of gay activism. It’s just that it’s all happening over at Americablog where activists are typing Obama hate till their fingers are bleeding. They’ve been working nonstop since the inauguration, vowing never to vote evermore, or raise a penny because Obama, not Susan Collins, betrays them daily, hourly, throwing them repeatedly under every bus in Washington, spiting in their faces, whilst he is stabbing them in their backs.
    Act Up showing up on peoples’ doorsteps is so Gloria Gaynor.
    Please!

  93. 93
    4tehlulz says:

    @Mike Kay (Team America): That’s….unexpected.

    Lisa Murkowski is just going to troll the GOP for six years, isn’t she?

  94. 94
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    Teabaggers are calling the Senate and saying repealing DADT “is the wrong thing to do”.

    You may wish to counter those voices by contacting the senate. (202) 224-3121 It’s up to you.

  95. 95
    Nick L says:

    @Paul in KY:

    Eh, the dude’s a lifelong conservative Republican; I don’t see any pressing need for him to actually change parties.

    But he’s not a modern Republican: he rebuked McConnell’s leadership, is on-board for New START and DADT repeal (without any ridiculous deals, if I’m correctly informed), came out against the Iraq War (in 2007, but he broke party lines to do it), supported Sotomayor and Kagan, he’s liberal on immigration, against the Cuba embargo, and not too insane on gay rights issues (though he is old).

    He’s not perfect, but I’d give my right nut to have a Republican Senate caucus made up of 42 Richard Lugars. (okay, throw in Jim Inhofe for comedic effect)

  96. 96
    Moses2317 says:

    @Mike Kay (Team America): Exactly! Here are some direct numbers to call:

    Olympia Snowe (Maine) – (202) 224-5344

    Susan Collins (Maine) – (202) 224-2523

    Scott Brown (Massachusetts) – (202) 224-4543

    George LeMieux (Florida) – (202) 224-3041

    George Voinovich (Ohio) – (202) 224-3353

    Jim Webb (Virginia) – (202)-224-4024

    Lisa Murkowski (Alaska) – (202) 224-6665

    John Ensign (Nevada) – (202) 224-6244

    Richard Lugar (Indiana) – (202) 224-4814

  97. 97
    ChrisWWW says:

    I thought all Democrats had to do to get DADT passed is eat the tax cut sh*t sandwich?

    In any event, if DADT repeal doesn’t happen before January, can Obama sign that executive order? Pretty please? And if he doesn’t what will the excuse be then?

  98. 98
    john b says:

    voinovich has been busy every time i’ve tried at both his DC office and cleveland office.

    i’ll keep trying.

  99. 99
    TooManyJens says:

    @Moses2317: I’d add:

    Mark Kirk (Illinois) – (202) 224-2854

    Although right now his voice mailbox is full.

  100. 100
    TooManyJens says:

    @ChrisWWW: I’d like that to be the point when they stop appealing the Log Cabin Republicans case.

  101. 101
    Moses2317 says:

    @john b: For Voinovich, you can also try:

    Southeast, OH Office:
    78 West Washington Street
    P.O. Box 57
    Nelsonville, OH 45764
    Main: (740) 441-6410
    Fax: (740) 753-3551

    ——————————————————————————–

    Cincinnati, OH Office:
    36 East 7th Street
    Room 2615
    Cincinnati, OH 45202
    Main: (513) 684-3265
    Fax: (513) 684-3269

    ——————————————————————————–

    Northeast, OH Office:
    1240 East 9th Street
    Room 3061
    Cleveland, OH 44199
    Main: (216) 522-7095
    Fax: (216) 522-7097

    ——————————————————————————–

    Toledo, OH Office:
    420 Madison Avenue
    Room 1210
    Toledo, OH 43604
    Main: (419) 259-3895
    Fax: (419) 259-3899

    ——————————————————————————–

    Dayton, OH Office:
    (Based out of Cincinnati)
    36 East 7th Street, Room 2615
    Cincinnati, OH 45202
    Main: (513) 684-3265
    Fax: (513) 684-3269

    ——————————————————————————–

    Central, OH Office:
    37 West Broad Street
    Room 310
    Columbus, OH 43215
    Main: (614) 469-6697
    Fax: (614) 469-7733

  102. 102
    Moses2317 says:

    @TooManyJens: Good addition. Does anyone have a district office number for Kirk?

  103. 103
    Shade Tail says:

    @Dougb #67:

    So why doesn’t Obama just pass an executive order ending DADT in his capacity of Commander in Chief? Truman didntwait for an act of congress to enact integration of the armed forces. It was a he’ll of a rocky road but Truman went ahead, in spite of opposition from a far larger proportion of the forces, congress, and the electorate.

    Obama can’t do that because, first of all, thanks to a Supreme Court decision in the decades since Truman, it is now illegal. And second, DADT is an actual law rather than just military policy, and executive orders can not end a law.

    He *could* in theory issue an executive order telling the military to stop enforcing the law, but either Congress or the courts could put a stop to that fairly easily; Congress with a new law mandating enforcement, and the courts with a judicial order mandating it. Not to mention, the next president could easily over-turn Obama’s order with a new order re-instating the policy. Passing a new law through Congress, by contrast, would be a much more permanent solution.

    *That* is why Obama can’t just order the policy to be ended.

  104. 104
    pattonbt says:

    @ChrisWWW:

    I’m kind of in agreement with this. Obama comes out today and says “Enough is enough. Senate, do your job, get it done the congressional way. If not, I will take matters into my own hand and do the right thing for the right reasons”. By doing this he could counter some of the negative spin he is getting on the tax cut compromise while doing the right thing. He can finally “take credit” directly for something and maybe change some of the “compromiser” label. It’s a good fight and he would win. And he would show bigots for bigots.

  105. 105
    A L says:

    Looks like the Tea Party spooks are pulling her strings. This won’t be the last time this happens as the newfound Tea Party komissars aren’t going to do a damn thing about the Washington subsidy train, so it’s back to the old strategy of pillorying minorities and whipping up other social issues.

  106. 106
    Maody says:

    @MTiffany:
    I am so stealing this:

    This situation calls for the atheist’s imprecatory prayer: “Oh God, if there is one, please call your devout little bigot, Preznit Susan Collins, home, that she in her endless neediness may irritate the fuck out of you and try your infinite patience and grace, that the world may be a better place for her having left it.”

  107. 107
    pattonbt says:

    @Shade Tail:

    I see your point, but by signing an executive order Obama could make the Republicans have to fight to reinstate it. Probably a fight they really do not want to take on. The Republicans just want to demagogue on the issue. And it is getting harder (but by now means impossible) and harder in this day and age to demagogue on gays and come out winning.

    Unless of course it’s gay muslims.

  108. 108
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    @ChrisWWW: by law, he can only suspend it, the law, which is a congressional act, does not grant him the authority to end it outright. While a suspension it is preferable to the status quo, it also premits President Palin to lift the suspension during her inaugural address, and you know she will. That’s why overturning the law is the optimum outcome, then Palin can’t do anything by herself.

  109. 109
    Chyron HR says:

    @ChrisWWW:

    And if he doesn’t what will the excuse be then?

    If he DOES, what will the excuse be for not giving him credit? Oh, that’s right:

    He so wanted gays to be able to die in Afghanistan for him.

    DADT repeal is an Obama plot to kill fagortz! The true liberals have spoken! How dare you not take our serious criticism seriously!

  110. 110
    Comrade Luke says:

    Clearly the problem is the Homosexual Professional Left.

  111. 111
    ChrisWWW says:

    @Mike Kay (Team America):
    That’s a red herring because laws aren’t permanent either. Tougher to undo, yes, but not anywhere near impossible. By your logic we might as well wait for a Constitutional Amendment before we stop this bigoted policy.

    Obama should suspend it in January because it’s the right thing to do and because it will show Americans that openly gay soldiers didn’t unravel the armed forces. If President Palin decides to undo it anyways, that would be a temporary setback, but another chance for Democrats and gay-rights activists to punish Republicans politically.

  112. 112
    nhoj says:

    @burnspbesq:

    You know the thing is that the republicans don’t need the filibuster when they are in power because they don’t want to pass any real legislation. The first thing they will do is drop Paygo and then pass more capital gain tax cuts through reconciliation.

    People point to the SS privatization battle but that wasn’t filibustered by the dems, it never made it out of committee!

    If we are going to have elections then the people who win the elections should be able to pass the laws they ran on by a majority vote.

  113. 113
    Culture of Truth says:

    TPM reports that Reid and Lieberman are playing ‘good cop, bad cop’ with Susan Collins.

  114. 114
    fenian says:

    More like “good cop,” “dickhead cop,” I believe.

  115. 115
    celticdragonchick says:

    @pattonbt:

    I’m kind of in agreement with this. Obama comes out today and says “Enough is enough. Senate, do your job, get it done the congressional way. If not, I will take matters into my own hand and do the right thing for the right reasons”. By doing this he could counter some of the negative spin he is getting on the tax cut compromise while doing the right thing. He can finally “take credit” directly for something and maybe change some of the “compromiser” label. It’s a good fight and he would win. And he would show bigots for bigots.

    Grayson would do that…but that simply is not how Obama works. We have seen that.

    I must admit, however, that John Cole has been right about the Maine snow queens, and I was wrong.

  116. 116
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    @celticdragonchick: and that’s why grayson is a loser.

  117. 117
    celticdragonchick says:

    @Mike Kay (Team America):

    Standing up for the truth and calling the GOP out on their mendacity is an interesting definition of loser.

    I’ll gladly take the one termer who actually speaks truth to power over the two faced, fawning hackery that is the norm.

  118. 118
    Bobby Thomson says:

    TPM reports that Reid and Lieberman are playing ‘good cop, bad cop’ with Susan Collins.

    That is what Beutler reports, under the headline: “Lieberman To Reid On DADT: Back Off, I Got This”

    Senate Democrats are on the precipice of getting a Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell repeal past a key procedural hurdle tonight. But key negotiators have grown frustrated by Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid and his staff for upping the pressure at a fragile moment, potentially scuttling the deal. “I’ve been pleading with Senator Reid, don’t hold a vote on the defense authorization bill, the repeal of DADT, until we have a good opportunity to work out a fair process for the consideration bill with Senator Collins and some of the other Republican,” said Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-CT) this afternoon after a Dem caucus meeting. “Senator Collins really wants to vote for the bill with the repeal of Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell, and Senator Scott Brown is the same and I think there may be at least one other Republican Senator to make that clear today.” . . . Lieberman has been the lead Dem negotiator for repeal, and has been in regular contact with all three Republican supporters. But earlier today his efforts were undermined, in his view, by Reid’s announcement of a test vote tonight, and by leaks from the leadership, accusing Collins of demanding too many procedural concessions, putting the success or failure of the vote tonight at her feet.

    But I think it far more likely that Lieberman and Collins are playing good cop bad cop with Reid.

  119. 119
    Suck It Up! says:

    @Mike Kay (Team America):

    a loser who sticks by his principles, so there, nyah. ;)

  120. 120
    FormerSwingVoter says:

    Huh.

    Lisa Murkowski appears to be on board now.

    http://voices.washingtonpost.c.....-on-d.html

    I shouldn’t be counting chickens or anything… but there’s a non-zero chance that this actually happens.

    Fingers crossed.

  121. 121
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Bobby Thomson: I think that this is one of those times where Lieberman is doing the right thing. Remember, he has to do it every once a while to justify being kept in the Dem Caucus.

  122. 122
    Suck It Up! says:

    @celticdragonchick:

    I’ll gladly take the one termer

    and that’s why liberals are where they are. at some point people like to win. “president grayson” would realize that soon enough and you might just find yourself devastated.

  123. 123
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    @celticdragonchick: yup, he’s a loser. not only did he lose his incumbent seat by 20 points, he accomplished nothing in his one term. Nothing. Nada. Zilch. Zippo. The middle of a donut.

  124. 124
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @FormerSwingVoter: Why the fuck can’t some of these fucking people just do the fucking right fucking thing every fucking once in a fucking while and fucking do it simply for the fucking reason that it is the fucking right fucking thing to fucking do?

    /rhetorical question

    Ending the DADT will have no effect on on my life other than the fact that when it ends I will live in a country that treats its citizen a little more equally. On the other hand, I think that is a worthwhile goal.

  125. 125
  126. 126
    les says:

    @Bobby Thomson:

    But I think it far more likely that Lieberman and Collins are playing good cop bad cop with Reid.

    Naw, for that they’d need a good cop.

  127. 127
    YellowJournalism says:

    @Shade Tail: Your entire post should be added to the BJ Lexicon just so people can cut and paste when someone proposes that strategy again and again.

  128. 128
    FormerSwingVoter says:

    And Lucy pulls away the football again:

    http://gay.americablog.com/201.....witter.com

  129. 129
    FormerSwingVoter says:

    Or maybe not?

    http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.....hp?ref=fpi

    This is ridiculous.

  130. 130
    ChrisWWW says:

    @YellowJournalism:
    It’s a weak excuse like I explained in my comment. Obama should do the right thing now, regardless of what a hypothetical future president might do.

  131. 131
    Bobby Thomson says:

    @les: True dat.

    Collins and Lieberman are playing the role assigned them by their party: ensure that the tax “compromise” is passed.

    She will never vote for it, which is the only reason Lieberman screamed at having their bluff called tonight.

    For that matter, Lieberman has no interest in DADT repeal beyond pretending to support it. It won’t be enough. He’s toast in Connecticut.

  132. 132
    Cacti says:

    I’m not sure if Susan Collins is a bigot.

    I’m 100% certain she’s an opportunistic, feckless liar though.

  133. 133
    Mike Kay (Team America) says:

    TPM says it’s doeable.

    http://www.talkingpointsmemo.c.....?ref=fpblg

  134. 134
    Cain says:

    @cyntax:

    And at that point, they’ll do away with the filibuster. Cause that’s how they roll.

    With our luck when the Democrats take back the senate they’ll re-institute the filibuster and watch as the republicans filibuster them all over again.

    cain

  135. 135
    Just Some Fuckhead says:

    @Bobby Thomson:

    For that matter, Lieberman has no interest in DADT repeal beyond pretending to support it. It won’t be enough. He’s toast in Connecticut.

    Meh, his eventual loss in a couple years wouldn’t be nearly as cool as him dying slowly from leprosy.

  136. 136
    MTiffany says:

    @Bobby Thomson:

    But I think it far more likely that Lieberman and Collins are playing good cop bad cop with Reid.

    “Good cop, bad cop?” I think you mean, “backstabbing dickhead, mendacious twat.*”

    *And before anyone else calls it, I’m claiming that for the title of my movie spoof of “Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon.”

  137. 137
    Admiral_Komack says:

    @Bobby Thomson:

    I don’t care what they say; just watch what they do.

  138. 138
    chopper says:

    @Mike Kay (Team America):

    lol, gays pulling the goop lever.

  139. 139
    cyntax says:

    @Cain:

    With our luck when the Democrats take back the senate they’ll re-institute the filibuster and watch as the republicans filibuster them all over again.

    Yup. That sounds like the Dem’s definition of bipartisan.

  140. 140
    ThatLeftTurnInABQ says:

    @MTiffany:

    And before anyone else calls it, I’m claiming that for the title of my movie spoof of “Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon.”

    I’m almost afraid to ask just exactly what sort of artifact will play the role of the Green Destiny.

  141. 141

    @celticdragonchick:

    Standing up for the truth and calling the GOP out on their mendacity…

    Isn’t nearly as good as actually winning the vote.

    If we have to settle for “standing up” and “calling out,” then fine, he should stand up and call out.

    But if there’s even a chance of actually winning the fight, it would stupid to start strutting around, like a kick returner who hasn’t quite beaten the kicker.

  142. 142

    Holy crap.

    If Collins will actually vote to move the bill in exchange for 15 amendments and 4 days of debate, Reid should be all over that like…something that is often all over some other thing.

    @ChrisWWW:

    Obama should do the right thing now

    Not NOW. IF the Defense bill is moved without DADT. Until that happens, repeal isn’t dead.

  143. 143
    Bobby Thomson says:

    @joe from Lowell: The 10 Republican amendments include the poison pills that ensure it doesn’t pass. So it’s not the gift you think it is.

    LG&M nailed this one.

  144. 144
    ChrisWWW says:

    @joe from Lowell:
    I mean he should if it fails to get passed in the lame duck session.

  145. 145
    Devildawg says:

    @Navigator:

    That would require a spine, something he has not shown in a long, long time.

  146. 146
    Case says:

    I do find it interesting that the President has completely stopped talking about repealing the Defense of Marriage Act.

    Ah,well. When DADT “repeal” dies tomorrow for a second time,it will be up to the courts to do the right thing.

    Can anyone tell me what LGBT civil rights accomplishments the Dems made from 1980(when they promised to give us our equal rights) to 2008?

    Yes,yes. Things are “equal” now.
    The President signed the Hate Crimes Bill. He also signed an EO allowing us to visit our spouses and partners in the hospital. All noble things.
    None of which excuse his outdated and bigoted views (which some Dems do share) on marriage.

  147. 147
    Taruna Oils says:

    It’s OVER…Miss Collins has stated she will not vote to allow the bill to move forward. DADT is here for good. Thanks Nobama.Maybe now that your presidency has been proven a complete and utter failure at every level, you should just give up and maybe get invited to the home of one of those billionaires you just helped out. oh..and take Joe solmonese with you..he just LOVES fancy dinner parties, and photo ops.
    buh-bye Obama..buh bye..hope you enjoyed your ONLY term as the worst president coward in history.

  148. 148
    Shade Tail says:

    @ChrisWWW:

    It’s not a weak excuse just because you say so. You say we might as well wait for a Constitutional amendment? By your logic, you should dismiss that as the same “weak excuse”. Constitutional amendments can also be over-turned. Check out Amendment #21 if you don’t believe me.

    You can lecture people about doing the right thing until you’re blue in the face, but at some point you have to face reality about your strategy for getting it done. The satisfaction of having accomplished your goal is cold comfort if you just lose it again later, and I speak from bitter experience. I live in California, so I very recently saw gays win the right to marry, only to have it taken away again after just a couple months. That was worse than never having it in the first place. No way am I going to accept anything like that happening again if I can avoid it.

    Nobody wants gay equality more than I do, but I want it to be as difficult to over-turn as possible while still having a shot at passing it in the first place. The best way to accomplish this is a new law from Congress. Your way is much too weak and could be over-turned much too easily.

  149. 149
    TooManyJens says:

    @Taruna Oils: Go away. We don’t want any aromatherapy oils.

  150. 150
    Mark says:

    @Case

    Go fuck yourself.

    Democrats vote for gay marriage and civil unions at the state level (95%) while Rs vote against (88%). Democrats voted 90% for ENDA. Rs voted 80% against. Democrats are all onside for ending DADT. Rs are uniformly against. Maybe you forgot that Republicans put anti-gay marriage initiatives on the ballot in virtually every state.

    But of course, it’s the Democrats who are against you.

  151. 151

    @Case:

    I do find it interesting that the President has completely stopped talking about repealing the Defense of Marriage Act.

    Do you know why President Obama has completely stopped talking about repealing the Defense of Marriage Act?


    BECAUSE THE PRESIDENT CAN’T REPEAL THE DEFENSE OF MARRIAGE ACT YOU WORTHLESS, IGNORANT STEAMING PILE OF SHIT!

    Do you have any idea how our government works? That was a rhetorical question, obviously you don’t because you’re incredibly fucking stupid, like George W. Bush or Sarah Palin stupid. The president doesn’t get to wave a magic wand and repeal laws that the congress passed. Congress has to pass a repeal of DoMA and the president then has to sign it into law.
    Oh, and for all of you stupid fucks who think that President Obama ought to issue an executive order and repeal DADT, yeah, that would be really brilliant, Darrell Issa would use that as the first count in the impeachment proceedings. Why the fuck aren’t you worthless shits getting in John McCain’s face about this? Or that bigoted Republican cunt Susan Collins? What, is it easier to shoot your buddies in the back than it is to shoot at the enemy?

    I’m surprised that you retards aren’t demanding that President Obama issue an executive order instituting a single-payer health care system while he’s out repealing DoMA and DADT. It’s not just that fucks like you and the teabaggers are clueless. No, it’s as if you fucks evolved in some alternate universe where the laws of nature prevent clues from ever coming into existence.

  152. 152
    victory says:

    It’s a good thing President Collins keeps her word. You know, like the word she gave in 1996 to only serve 2 terms? You remember the Republican “Term Limit” Rush of ’96, right?

    Well, Susan was one of them. How’d that work out, there, Susan?

  153. 153

    @Taruna Oils:

    Aromatherapy is for dipshits, so why don’t you take your aromatherapy bullshit, fold it until it’s all sharp edges and pointy corners and then stick it up your ass? I mean you’re obviously fucktarded because you’re into aromatherapy, which is bullshit, but also because you sit there bitching about Susan Collins being a bigoted cunt and then blame that on President Obama.

  154. 154
    Case says:

    I do understand how things work. I never wanted him to “wave a magic wand”.

    I did expect him to at least talk about the issue,and work with Congress on some sort of repeal plan.
    Anything. But no. Nothing.
    Support is amazing. We’ve never had it from a President before. Action is what is needed. Nothing grand. Willing for a viable plan.

    While sad that there was no public option,I am thrilled that there was some type of health care reform enacted.
    Better for a partial victory now,than no victory at all.

    Also,yes. I do know that the GOP is firmly anti-gay.
    However there comes a point where we can no longer blindly vote without some sort of sweeping change. They’ve had thirty years,and it wasn’t until now that we’ve seen any.

    Telling us that it takes time sounds less convincing in a world where our allies already have equality. I’ve voted Dem in every election since I turned 18.
    The President is a good man. A brilliant man. That still doesn’t mean I can excuse his and others unscientific views.
    Let’s not forget the Dem elected officials who are firmly anti- gay. Why am I not allowed to be critical of them?

    I don’t doubt the party’s sincerity. However, we’ve done all we can do. It’s up to them now.

    I am neither firebagger nor kool-aid drinker.
    I do have a right to be critical of any politician regardless of my sexual orientation. Some of us are tired of being told whom to vote for and being threatened with Republican rule if we show anything less than silent reverence for the DNC.

    Finally,I don’t mean any ill will. It wasn’t my intention.
    The end is in sight,and our liberation is almost here. The feeling is similar to the night before Christmas. You know it will be here soon,and become impatient.
    So forgive us any outbursts of disillusionment.

  155. 155
    bob h says:

    Many of those “idiot independents” turned out in November because of concern about deficits. Now they have in the tax bill a demonstration how much the Republicans they supported really care about deficits. But will any of the independent numbskulls even notice?

  156. 156
    Paul in KY says:

    @Nick L: Certainly 42 Sen. Lugars would be better than the 41 whackjobs (and Sen. Lugar) they have at present time.

  157. 157
    Paul in KY says:

    @Just Some Fuckhead: I’ll second that!

  158. 158
    Chuck says:

    Am I the only person who thinks the Repubs and such have this DADT thing backwards? I mean, it’s obvious they hate the gays, why wouldn’t they want them up at the front lines getting shot at?

Comments are closed.