I’m hoping this turns out well, because I lost interest in V and Flash Forward in record time.
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by John Cole| 89 Comments
This post is in: Media, Television
I’m hoping this turns out well, because I lost interest in V and Flash Forward in record time.
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superking
V is unwatchable.
2liberal
V lost me very quickly also. The idea of romances between lizards in human skin and lizards just doesn’t work. There will be a lot of tension about who is an alien and who isn’t but the FBI agent son and the black man romances just don’t work IMHO.
2liberal
whoops humans and lizards in human skin is what i meant. NO edit function available.
South of I-10
I’m done with V. Still watching Flashforward, but they better get it together soon.
smiley
My draft lottery number in 1973 was 007 (true fact). Then I became #7. If it wasn’t for #6, I would never have made it out alive.
Aaron
I am not giving up on Flashforward yet. I will give them at least the benefit of the doubt for the season. The early seasons of Seinfeld kind of sucked, too – not anywhere near as good as it became in later years. So I would argue that sometimes a show and its writers need time to figure things out.
gbear
From the short preview I heard on Fresh Air last friday, The Prisoner is going to suck. They’re doing some serious messing with the goods.
Bret
I wonder if Jesus Caviezel knows that Ian McKellen is gay. I doubt he’d be too happy about that.
Max
I am taping The Prisoner, and have like 6 Flash Forward eps on the dvr. Everytime I start to watch, I find I’m just not into it.
I have started watching the first season of Lie to Me. It’s really good.
Tonight, I’m going to watch online the Obama townhall from China. It will be streaming on whitehouse.gov around 8:45pm San Francisco time. I’m not converting it to eastern time, you fuckers always get it in your terms and we in the west always have to do the math.
professor fate
i already hate the flashbacks with the loft with the basketball hoop – it screams yuppie.
Rheinhard
Well, at least he resigned from something.
I can see where they wanted to offer the role of the old escapee in the first few minutes to Patrick McGoohan. He even had the same costume, down to the canvas loafers!
demkat620
@Max: Well, that’s what you in the west get for always being late to the party. :)
Donald G
After last weeks episode, I find that I have absolutely no further interest in the V remake. I find neither the characters nor the storyline in any way engaging.
Suicidal Zebra
Watched the new Doctor Who and Top Gear today. Enjoyed them a lot, even if waiting for 6 weeks till the next Who turns out to be more of a kick in the nuts than I was expecting.
Maxwel
I agree with all the above. V is ludicrous and boring. Too bad, I recall the original to be riveting and scary.
Tim F.
FWIW, I09 says that you will have more fun watching grass grow.
You Don't Say
I liked the first two FF episodes, but since then it just gets worse and worse each week. I watched the last 10 minutes this week and that may be the last I watch of it. (Am really enjoying Community.)
Go Colts!
professor fate
wouldn’t you at least take a canteen if you’re going to go into the desert again?
just asking.
RedKitten
@Maxwel: I had such high hopes for V — I loved it as a kid. But yeah, I watched the first episode, and was underwhelmed. The second episode came on, I watched the first 15 minutes, and then went back to playing Crush the Castle.
Rick Taylor
If I have a chance I’ll watch it, but I’m going in skeptical. The Prisoner was Patrick McGoohan’s original creation, infused with his personal vision; a remake to me doesn’t make much sense, at least on the surface. Usually I think it’s better if people create new works rather than redoing perfectly good older ones, but that’s especially true with such an idiosyncratic work as this one.
South of I-10
I am recording The Prisoner. I’ll start it once Little South goes to bed, which won’t be long, judging by the amount of yawning going on.
Max
Speaking of viewing stuff…
Did anyone see 2012? It did massive box office but I haven’t read any reviews.
Does Lloyd Dobler get Diane at the end?
Corner Stone
@Bret:
Like most of the hypocrits, I feel sure he doesn’t give two shits about it since he’s getting paid to work with Ian.
RandomChick
I’m going to give Flash Forward a few more episodes, but so far I’ve been really disappointed. For a “mystery”, it sure seems to be lacking in dramatic tension.
The character development is pretty lacking as well. I keep asking myself, “why am I supposed to care about these people again?”
Nicole
Really? Did they just make a Twin Towers analogy? Argh.
RandyH
I am fascinated with the story already. BTW, AMC also has the original 1967 series online…
http://www.amctv.com/originals/the-prisoner-1960s-series/
Cat Lady
Colts/Patriots:
Not a rivalry, but a high level seminar.
That is all.
adolphus
Yeah, I think the way out of the village is to follow the two towers, which is either a cheap 9/11 reference or Number 2 is Gandalf.
Lesley
Anything with Ian McKellen in it is bound to have bite + AMC produces Mad Men and Breaking Bad – both excellent.
V is very bad. Suitable for ten year olds.
Flash Forward is straddling the fence. It’s got enough suspense to keep me interested.
Cat Lady
@Cat Lady:
With all the wicked smaht cool kids you wished you were.
GAME. ON.
adolphus
Does this remind anyone else of Dark City? Kinda?
RandyH
This movie is beautifully shot. I wonder what locations they used? Has a South Africa feel to it.
John T
My date and I watched the first 20 or 30 minutes of the first episode of V before losing interest. But I’m actually grateful for the bad acting and atrocious writing, because if the show had been more entertaining the two of us might have kept our hands to ourselves.
Comrade Scrutinizer
@Suicidal Zebra: I liked the new Dr. Who a lot, although I didn’t like the wait for it. They’re setting up for a killer finale. At least this time we won’t have to wait months for it to come on.
Getting the TG ep now…
Cat Lady
@Cat Lady:
I’ve got my very own BJ Sunday Night Football Open Thread!
w00t!
Brady to Moss – Thing.Of.Beauty.
+5
OriGuy
OT (but it’s an open thread, right?)
New wingnut explosion on the horizon. Obama is at the APEC conference, where there is a tradition of dressing world leaders in the traditional garb of the host country. If they thought he was a Maoist before, just wait!
John Cole
The Prisoner is boring as hell. This is like Memento without a plot and twice as long.
Cat Lady
@Cat Lady:
“Shredding the secondary”.
This.
Onkel Bob
Cat Lady, are you happy too? 24 unanswered…
Cat Lady
@Onkel Bob:
EDELMAN?!! FUCK YA’
professor fate
Sand is not inherently interesting.
Really.
Onkel Bob
uh oh, we should not be so confident… (or vocal about it)
Tim in SF
@Maxwel:
No. The original V was pretty corny. It was no where near riveting and scary unless you were a child.
V wasn’t even originally written as sci-fi. The original script centered around the fifth column during WWII, but at the time NBC wasn’t buying WWII scripts. They told writer Kenneth Johnson they wanted a SCI-FI script from him. So he changed the Nazis to alien Visitors, re-submitted the script and it got made.
The Nazi stuff still abounds, though. (ever notice how Nazi-riffic the Visitor flag is?).
Here’s more info. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V_(1983_miniseries)#Influences
adolphus
John: Yes boring.
And seriously, if they are working on some sort of 9/11 symbolism with those towers (how could they not?) I’ll be more than a little cheesed off.
Of Bugs and Books
@OriGuy:
While he’s dressed up as a Maoist, he should announce that he’s ordering the U.S. of A. to convert to a metric measurement system.
Anyone using feet and inches will be sent to internment camps.
Cat Lady
@Onkel Bob:
I like our chances.
Darkrose
I want to like FlashForward so much, but I just have a whole lot of “I don’t care” about the main character and his manpain. Mark’s an asshole, and I’d rather see his wife with the guy from Pirates of the Caribbean, because he’s at least doing something other than sitting around moping and doing everything he can to make sure the future turns out like his vision.
Cheryl from Maryland
Am watching the original Prisoner — Number 2 is a new actor every episode. That makes it so much better than the remake from the get go — Ian McKellen will win any mano a mano smackdown with Jim Caveizel. I mean, why bother?
adolphus
I think I’ll miss the next two installments of the prisoner. I think my shower needs re-grouting anyway.
skippy
i’m still watching v, but ff lost me. ater weeks of giving it another chance, i finally said why am i wasting my time and dvr space on this non-tension-filled, uninteresting drivel, and i deleted it fromy dvr.
have read not so good things about the prisoner.
i actually wonder why they bothered to remake tbe prisoner, considering how similar (at a basic level) lost is to the original’s intent (if you replace govt. authoritarianism w/private corporate involvement).
also: just saw 2012. it’s great for what it is. be sure to suspend your disbelief willingly and severely, however. great ride!
General Winfield Stuck
I pre ordered a Star Trek 6 dvd yesterday from wally world for ten bucks and they already mailed it with free shipping. Be here Wednesday. Good deal, couldn’t believe it.
GlenInBrooklyn
I’ll give V one more week, maybe…
Flash Forward is more interesting. I’ve held on to marginal sci-fi novels for years because there was an intriguing idea in them.
General Winfield Stuck
@John Cole:
teevee has been dead to me and so for a couple of years now. Just awful programing and I am tired of CSI and Law and Order stuff. I don’t know what’s wrong, but the movie side of Hollywood isn’t doing all that great either.
Cat Lady
The original came out 42 years ago, and it was mind blowing because it was before universal surveillance seemed possible. Now, they’re relying on the scenery to convey the same chilling effect, but it looks like an eco-resort. And Ian McKellan will always be Gandalf. Meh.
WereBear
Patrick McGoohan is not a number! He is a free man!
As a HUGE fan of both the actor and his series, I can’t muster enthusiasm for any remake.
You remake when the original lacked something, or there’s something really new to add. Didn’t see that happening.
Maximus
I really tried to give V a chance. I had to turn it off halfway thru ep. 1, when the FBI mom started lecturing her son about tagging red “V”s on walls. The clunkiness of the dialogue, characters, pacing, acting, and direction screams old-school network TV.
Scott H
I posted this link before. Funny BI re: the Prisoner.
btw, I have tivo’d the show; may yet watch it.
cs
Flash Forward’s core concept had me hooked, despite the mostly uninteresting cast, until the agent committed suicide which reveals that the visions may not actually predict the future.
The main reason I was hooked was because I thought the writers were setting it up so that the future was as immutable as the past, and that everything foreseen would happen, no matter how much everyone tried to avoid it. That this show would be a modern version of a Greek tragedy where they try to ignore or thwart Cassandra, the oracles, or fate, but end up doomed anyways.
But now the future isn’t set in stone necessarily. Tragedy can be averted with heartwarming moments for everyone and the writers can continue to make it up as they go along.
General Winfield Stuck
@General Winfield Stuck:
Should be Star Trek Xl. not 6- Roman Numeral conversion FAIL.
You Don't Say
Anyone watch the Pats Colts game? May be the best game EVER for us Pats haters.
Aaron Baker
Hmm, V the remake is vastly better than the original, which was so stupid it sometimes hurt to watch. Also, Morena Baccarin is more than easy on the eyes. I don’t know whether the lizard/human romances will ultimately work; but so far, the Visitors’ technology appears so sophisticated that disguising themselves as an alien species may be the scientific equivalent of a cakewalk. The show may yet collapse into complete silliness, but I’m still watching it with interest.
New Yorker
Yes. I shut it off when Manning got picked the 2nd time, but then checked my fantasy team (I have Manning) and turned it back on in time to see Bill Belichick jump the shark and blow the game.
Delia
@John Cole:
I’m on the left coast and have currently finished the first hour. I don’t think I could possibly finish a whole miniseries. I liked Ian McKellan better as Gandalf and am thinking of putting LOTR in the DVD player. The Jesus guy is just a whiner.
New Yorker
I dunno, I can’t see how a regular season game can be more schadenfreude-licious than the Colts comeback in the 2006 AFC championship game, or the Giants winning the Superbowl on a last-minute drive.*
*Given that I’m a Giants fan, I’m biased in favor of that last one.
You Don't Say
@New Yorker: How soon I forget!
I guess its the heat of the moment. I’m just in shock at what a horrible decision the Pats made.
Hyperbole on my part … but just.
disappointedGOPer
Delicious Pats tears are delicious.
parksideq
@New Yorker:
Co-sign. David Tyree’s helmet-catch is one of my favorite Giants highlights ever. And it was great to be at the parade the Tuesday after the Super Bowl.
Still, it’s nice to see a Manning ruin Tom Brady’s night. Now hopefully having the bye got the G-Men get out of their funk.
New Yorker
Oh yeah. I’m always on the Colts’ side in the epic Colts-Patriots rivalry.
Belichick may have really messed things up for the Pats come playoff time. Sure, they’ll probably win that weak AFC East, but what about a bye? Cincinnati is 7-2 and just beat Pittsburgh in Pittsburgh. They’ve got (I think) Oakland, Cleveland, and Detroit on their schedule next. It’s hard not to think the Bengals have the inside track on the other bye.
So, instead of a 1st-round bye and then hosting, say, San Diego in Foxboro in January, the Pats may have to play in round 1 and then go on the road to Indy or Cincy. That’s a HUGE swing…..
ruemara
Glad I’m not the only one getting bored as hell watching the prisoner. Working on uploading new stuff to my etsy but I swear, this thing is making my eyeballs bleed.
Seanly
I almost DVR’d The Prisoner remake, but had my doubts. The original was so awesome crazy when I saw it 20 years ago. The disrespect for blindly following authority resonated with my teenage self. I’d love to watch the series again.
Another reason not to DVR it is that AMC is not in HD on Dish Network. I’m a year behind on Breaking Bad which might be the best show I’ve ever seen and will just wait for the second season DVDs.
electricgrendel
Amen. V and FlashForward are total snoozes. ABC cannot make compelling sci-fi, it seems. Both projects should be awesome. V is just laughably bad. I really like the actress that plays Ana (she’s awesome in Firefly!), but man. That show is simply mindbogglingly boring. The lizard aliens appear to have a master plan of standing around, looking placid and speaking in Valium-tones until all of humanity is asleep and the lizard aliens are able to…uh…do something?
TV is season is disappointing in general.
Delia
And another thing, I’m pretty bored with Stargate Universe. The other Stargate shows were fun, but this one really needs to lighten up and fast. I’m looking forward to the Caprica series, but that’s about it.
parksideq
@parksideq:
Grammar fail/FYWP
@New Yorker: Who would’ve guessed that the Bungles would be in a strong playoff position? “Ochocinco” means “good luck charm” in Spanish, right?
Drunken Economist
Lessee. Weepy, moody viola soundtrack? Check!
Equally weepy, moody, emo actors? Check!
Just enough cliche from the original show for “continuity”? Check!
Methinks I’ll be dragging out the old DVDs and washing away this brainscrum.
-Drunken Economist
http://mindtaker.blogspot.com/
http://twitter.com/drunk_economist
Big E
V.. sorry excuse for TV
‘new’ Prisoner,,,,,,, sorry excuse for TV…insult to the original
Defying Gravity….. glacially slow soap opera
Flash Forward…. still watching…. barely
I do miss BSG for my sci-fi fix
some intense movie friends and I had a discussion one time about the remake of King Kong, and why it failed as a movie…
it came down to that at the time the original was made, much of the world was still a mystery to the population, and many of the central ideas of the movie at the time, like the suffering during the Depression, undiscovered territories and islands, technologies like radio and movies were still relatively new, the way it was threaded together made for a great movie back then……and it still holds up.
most movies now are really good ‘blow shit up’ movies, just to see special FX…..sacrifice story for FX
the first Jurassic Park had a small amount of the original King Kong premise of ‘something that could be’….. Alien had a good amount of suspense and story… and Blade Runner was wonderful. The original ‘Thing’ and Day The Earth Stood Still were other stories fit for their time., which is why they worked so well…..
Yutsano
@Aaron Baker: I actually just watched the first episode of “V” on Hulu. They took what was essentially half the plot of the original and condensed it down to one episode. And it doesn’t work, it’s so hurried I have no idea where they’re going to go from here. It would have been much better to leave the sleeper cell discovery on the periphery for awhile and build up to it.
adolphus
Just reading Tom Shales’ review of The Prisoner in Kaplan and he liked it, but only for McKellen’s performance.
About half-way through is this sentence:
I admit that I was only 2 when the original series aired and have watched it all only recently on DVD. But my DVD was in color. All the stills I have seen were in color. What’s he talking about?
And Mr. Shales, the balloon has a name, dammit! Rover. Do him the respect to use his name. You wouldn’t want us to call you “the balloon” instead of your name would you?
Patrick
A botched abortion that should be flushed down a toilet.
Where the original was written by and starred Patrick McGoohan, the television equivalent of Orson Welles and Cary Grant, the remake is a half-baked homage to Lost, and stars the cast of a shampoo commercial.
Patrick
And nice catch on Tom Shales adolphus.
The original was filmed in vivid, striking color.
PaulW
The revised Prisoner has its problems:
1) Jumps in dialogue. The conversations between Jesus and Gandalf… excuse me No. 6 and No. 2… seem choppy. They’re talking about one issue one minute and another topic the next. Later conversations between the two suggest there had been other conversations about identity, free will, supression of thought, what have you, but again the audience is unaware and left to grasp at the overt hammy chattering. There looks to be missing scenes (something you don’t want in Puzzle Shows). The jumpy editing crap isn’t helping either.
2) Early confusion, too much even for a Puzzle Show. While we’re supposed to get puzzles and hints about what’s going on, we’re getting overwhelmed with two seemingly different plot lines: Number 6’s identity issues and Number 2’s family issues. Example: If Number 6 is ‘dreaming’ or suffering from an identity crisis in which the Village is a projection or Matrix-induced fantasy, why is Number 2’s obsession over his sick wife (which appears to be a real-world concern for Two) played up so much?
3) Storytelling issues. You’ve got the overriding story arc of “Why is Number 6 a Prisoner, why did he resign, what does he know, and will he escape?” but then you get what seem to be stand-alone plot episodes that don’t really contribute to the overall arc (Just what was the point of having a fake brother-family plotline? Just to make Six think he’s crazy?). While the original series did too, for some reason on that story arc they did a better job of making it seem like the Village was a more expansive, conspiratorial place. What I’m getting is the feeling of things getting crowbarred into the story, and the whole plot getting forced into a six-episode format where a more leisurely 12-episode (or 17 episode) format would help the show breathe.
4) No one’s asked yet: Who is Number One?
5) The New York flashbacks are focusing too much on the ‘date’ with the spy girl and not as much on Six’s place of work/reason for resigning. I know they’ll want to hold back on anything revealing, but there ought to be more tidbits about Number 6’s previous life in order to highlight just why he might have ended up in the Village…
6) Six of One…
To be fair, some of the things they’ve done right:
1) Landscape and locale, for one. Excellent set designs. Sparse, cozy housing that still comes off as CREEPY AS HELL.
2) Using Post 9/11 trauma. Yes, they’re using the Twin Towers symbolism early and often, along with terrorist-themed acts of destruction. But that’s the world we live in. The original series was guilty of this as well (feeding off Cold War paranoia and threat of nuclear war).
3) That creepy lady winking at Number 6 during the tour bus ride. Man, that just throws you off your game, don’t it?
4) Sparse use of Rover. Is he a security device, a mental projection of 6’s paranoia, or a surviving alien from the Roswell crash (it is, after all, a weather balloon!)?
5) The map scene.
6) Half dozen to the other…
Jason
I enjoyed it. The Twin Towers reference is a very good one, instantly recognizable for today’s audience. I would consider it really not to be a remake, more of a re-envisioning. If it was more like the original it would seem dated. The original certainly does, since the things 6 rails about are things we give away at the supermarket every time we use a discount card.
I think the family plotline was not just to make 6 think he is crazy (remember the original one where they similarly made 6 think he was 12 pretending to be 6, badly? What was the point of that? Well, there wasn’t, really, if the objective was to find out why 6 resigned, but in context of the psychological torment of the show, it made sense.) It was also to dislocate him on the most fundamental level, family. And of course to make us wonder about 2’s family and how “real” it is. Remember what 2 in the original said? “We are both lifers, my boy.”
Anyway, we are all in the Village now. “Be seeing you.”
The Saff
I gave up 45 minutes into it and went upstairs to watch my season #1 DVD of “thirtysomething.”
uh_clem
Based on the reviews, I’m going to skip the remake of The Prisoner. The original series is astounding, perhaps the best TV series ever. If you haven’t seen it, seek it out and watch.
Hopefully the remake will prod people into seeing the original who otherwise wouldn’t.
John PM
Late to the party, as always:
I am watching both V and Flashforward. I have very fond memories of the original V from my childhood. The two miniseries, for as cheesy as they were, were very compelling. The one season of V:The Series, was not, which should have tipped off the creators of the “reimagined” series. I do not know how they are going to sustain any type of creative tension over more than a few episodes.
I really like Flashforward. It helps that I read the book before the series started. The series so far incorporates elements of the book, but has made numerous changes to make it more dramatic. The book took place almost exclusively in Switzerland at the Hadron Large Collider. The Flashforward was 21 years in the present, not six months. The Flashforward was the result of a science experiment only, and not part of what is appearing to be some grander experience. My main problem with the series is the casting of three British/Irish actors as Americans; none of them sound natural, which is making it hard for me to suspend disbelief. I am going to stick with it for now, but after wasting 2-and-a-half seasons on Lost, I will pull the trigger if Flashforward gets too convoluted.
yet another jeff
I had hopes for both V and The Prisoner…but I already had concerns that seem to be validated.
Ugh, sounds as if it’s like when Fox-TV redid Vanishing Point as a Made-for-TV atrocity with Viggo Mortensen.
JohnR
“You remake when the original lacked something, or there’s something really new to add”
eh? perhaps on your planet – here, it’s all about money.
Anyway, I’m seeing that I was right to skip it – the original was so great, especially after watching Patrick as a ‘secret agent’ all that time. Admittedly the last episode was as close as most of us ever got to an acid trip, but by that time, who cared? I figured this remake could only be depressing, because (a) everything that gets remade now is shit, (b) when the original is 100%, how can you avoid being disappointing, and (c) when the original was made, the fear was that we might all be in the Village some day; now we all _are_ in the Village, and that takes some of the tension away..
Professor Fate
85 – We are all in the village – That’s the deal that I think the Series as done now does not even dare look at full in the face – Escape the village? Hell a more accurate picture would be a walled community under seige by people doing their damnest to get the hell in. Nobody wants to escape and if it means gving a few of your rights and the rights of people you are afraid of so be it, at least you’ll be safe.
you want to disturb folks – make a series about that.
Sleeper
I’m still watching FLASHFORWARD, but there’s a big problem within the concept that makes it difficult to enjoy.
Assuming that history cannot be changed – which is the existential crisis affecting the entire human race after being shown their futures – the question then becomes, why didn’t everyone’s flashforward show them realizing that they were currently experiencing their flashforward? This was a very traumatic experience, it was common knowledge when it would happen, so why doesn’t their future show any signs of the cultural impact? Wouldn’t there be flashforward gatherings, parties, etc? Wouldn’t people want to be calling others, or, hell, liveblogging the flashforward? Wouldn’t anyone watching the news during their flashforward be seeing a news story about it – actually, since they could probably pinpoint the exact time of the impending flashforward, wouldn’t there be live TV shows covering it? Shouldn’t a lot of people’s flashforwards have just consisted of them watching the Flashforward coverage on CNN? (Okay, probably Fox. bleh.)
And if the future revealed in their initial flashforward didn’t reflect the impact that this very important event had on humanity, then it stands to reason that that was just a possible future. Or a glimpse from an alternate world. Or the future as it was, before the flashforward altered it. Something. Meaning the futures shown will be changed. Meaning they’re not the future at all.
I don’t understand why no one on the show (or any of the writers) has thought of this.
gerry
I have mixed feelings about the remake. It’s too early to make a judgement on the story line. Jesus’ acting is stilted and hard to watch. McGoohan’s character KNEW something but I don’t know if Jesus’ character knows anything for sure. He does seem like a whiner.
I think the portrayal of the village is more realistic in the remake and the people are about the same in both; controlled with missing pasts. I think 93 was supposed to be the original #6, with the costume and all. His apartment seemed to be the same as 6’s in the original. A nice touch, I thought. I’ll give it one more try but I don’t think it will do it for me.