A thread for you.
*** Update ***
The intro to Face the Nation:
“Today on face the Nation, John McCain, and he is not happy with the President’s response to Iran.”
Fifty bucks says that Schieffer won’t be bothered to mention “Bomb bomb bomb Iran” when we learn how much McCain cares for the Iranian people.
I’m seriously sick of wingnuts and Republicans. Or is that redundant?
*** Update #2 ***
Alright, I watched the entire segment. I challenge anyone to come up with one substantive suggestion from McCain. The sum total of the Republican plan for Iran can be summed up as “More Bigger Pom Poms!”
Hunter Gathers
If it’s Sunday, it’s time to see John McCain on my teevee.
demkat620
@Hunter Gathers: That’s President John McCain to you buddy.
He’s coming on the tv to tell us we need to bomb the Iranians into freedom.
All snark aside, what is the fascination with McCain?
Lola
At least we don’t have to see Meghan McCain on the Sunday tv shows. Yet.
Bill E Pilgrim
@Hunter Gathers: Sunday is great news for McCain!
@demkat620:
It’s the BeltWinger obsession with imaginary parity. It’s the same reason that “McCain is winning!” despite all indications to the contrary was so persistently heard right to the end, even just admitting a likely blowout was not centrist enough, despite it being reality.
vishnu schizt
@Lola: I watched Real Time last night, I felt sorry for her. It was quite obvious that she was struggling to tow the family line. The ability to hold to diametrically opposed views and believe both to be true is probably difficult at 24. At some point I expected her to agree with Maher that most republicans are douchebags.
CapMidnight
We’ve been Maverick-rolled
Hunter Gathers
@demkat620:
Two Words:Tire Swing
cleek
Three words: He’s a Whore. or
Punchy
@Lola: I’m not sure she fits on my TV screen.
linda
good grief, i’m watching an msnbc promo for mtp that has fred thompson opining on obama’s handling of iran.
me
Now Gregory is talking to Netanyahu for fucks sake. Do they think he’ll actually have anything useful to say about Iran?
Throwin Stones
Happy Father’s Day to dads and happy Summer Solstice to all.
Oh, and bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb Iran. Also.
/McCain-Palin
YellowJournalism
@vishnu schizt: That was so sad. You could tell she was really having a hard time. She struggled to get the words out, and at times looked like a teenager doing public speaking for the first time in an English class. Maher often looked like he felt sorry for her, even at one point looked like he wanted to give her a reassuring hug or something. Katty Kay came off as annoyed or impatient with some of Ms McCain’s responses, too, although at times I couldn’t blame her. Meghan McCain needs to decide whether she wants to truly become a “rebel” in the Republican party and start really speaking out on certain issues (not just sex-related social issues), or just go back to being a Democrat.
MikeJ
CBS Sunday Morning: WTF? Is this 1978? Normally a decent show but they’re debating “is graffiti art?” And so far haven’t mentioned Haring, or Banksy.
tc125231
@Bill E Pilgrim:
demkat620
Oh Jesus Christ, please make Mccain stop. Thank FSM this guy didn’t win.
Incoherent.
Violet
Even if it’s redundant, it’s worth saying twice.
I FF through any appearance by David Gregory. Although I do get a good laugh when he shows up on the Today Show subbing for Matt Lauer. They never had Timmy sub for Matt Lauer – he was their politics star. Don’t dilute the brand. But Gregory? He’s such a lapdog, he’ll do anything they want. Pathetic excuse for a MTP moderator.
@Bill E Pilgrim:
Win!
Seriously, is this one of those you-never-forget-your-first-love situations where the press just can’t quit him? Pathetic. Message to the press: You’re not still in high school. Try dating a new guy.
They keep inviting the same people back over and over again. I’m trying to imagine the Sunday shows ten years from now. All the usual players, but they’re rolled in in wheelchairs and taken off their oxygen tanks only to answer questions. Scary stuff.
tc125231
@linda:
Throwin Stones
On this week with George, Huckleberry Graham just told me that Obama needs to be more like Reagan and speak truth-to-power to the Iranian people. At least George had Dodd on to counter, and not Lieberman.
Why do the repubs like DFH’s in Iran?
Redhand
Yeah, he’s also appearing on Fox. What a fcuking joke.
And John Cole is right, Schieffer will never mention the bomb Iran contradiction in McCain’s new-found freedom fighter sentiments.
I’ve long since given up watching the talking heads on Sunday. This is just more evidence of their irrelevance.
Rey
Where is Palin? why can’t we hear what she thinks about the whole situation?
I truly thank God everyday that John McCain lost on Nov 4th, 2008
Davis X. Machina
Since the days of DeGaulle and King Haakon and Queen Wilhelmina, it’s been customary to interview the head of the government-in-exile. And it builds up support for its eventual restoration to power.
linda
@tc125231:
and he sounded like he’d just rolled out, too. it’s astonishing watching these assholes dominate the conversation who know fuckall about the region and view everything thru the prism of who’s winning the current news cycle — obama or the republicans.
gbear
I thought that guys like McCain and Thompson were supposed to disappear into a cloud of white noise last week after the transfer to digital TV.
One of the differences between republicans and wingnuts: Republicans talk about bombing people. Wingnuts talk about shooting people.
Neocons just want to kill someone, anyone, and don’t even care how. Could be bombs, bullets, or denial of health care and a place to live.
Anton Sirius
Oh, look, the new troll is misogynist as well as racist.
Where have you gone, Brick Oven Bill? A thread turns its lonely eyes to you.
Ash
At this point I can’t even blame McCain anymore. I’d much more like to cut the balls of all the producers of the Sunday shows who think it’s a good idea to let all these fucking dimwits infect my television.
patrick
It’s like they think we’re goldfish with three second memories.
Or they are.
“Hey, look at that!”
“Hey, look at that!”
“Hey, look at that!”
someguy
Screw him and his meddling in foreign affairs. We have no business telling anybody anywhere what to do, especially in light of our own history of repressing people in this country, and our own imperialist adventures. You’d think a guy who firebombed Hanoi and then got punished for it by the people he attacked would know that. The scary thing is that among Republicans, he’s one of their smart guys.
And lets face it, the rioting Iranians aren’t freedom fighters. They are spoiled middle class brats who get violent because they don’t like their government and the results of their last election, much akin to our own Republicans.
Brick Oven Bill
A fascinating interactive chart of New York City murders, surprisingly produced by the New York Times.
…
Meghan McCain is delusional. I am, however, willing to trade both her and her dad for Senator Jim Webb.
This is my favorite McCain Blogette Posting. “Jumping on the bed with excitement.” This can all be yours. Jim Webb.
GregB
Most of the people who are weepy eyed about the protesting Iranians have been advocating nuclear annihilation of that nation for decades.
These people now feel that there are some Iranians who aren’t Islamofascists dedicated to destroying Israel and restoring the caliphate?
Rightwingers are sociopaths.
-G
demkat620
Why does John McCain sound like he thinks he’s running in 2012? He can’t seriously think he’d get a rematch?
Laura W
linda
@GregB:
the last thing these f*cking republicans are interested in is democracy. if they care so much about the outcome as a true reflection of the will of the people, why are they doing everything they can to stymie the policies that the winner of our last election introduces.
gnomedad
@demkat620:
I’m guessing they want to show they’re “balanced”, so they trot out the guy who ran against Obama. Very imaginative.
demkat620
Jack Jacobs on MSNBC is repeatedly trying to say the Iranian revolt is basically over.
Don’t really see how he can be so certain.
tc125231
@patrick:
tc125231
@linda:
vishnu schizt
I think Pam A. has those bigger pom poms ask her.
On the other hand I think the republitard strategery here is the F.A.G. approach (Film Actors Guild). The republitards think of Obama as the failed Gary who has failed to act and better use his acting talents to bring about change lest the world fall into chaos
America Fuck Yeah!
Montysano
My son came back from Bonnaroo with the flu. We’re still waiting to hear if it’s H1N1. Now, I seem to have a touch of it, which is probably good. In 1918, those who got the early mild version built an immunity to the later, more virulent version.
Kind of a sad day: first Father’s Day since my dad passed away.
And yeah….. MeMeghan. Maher is pretty much a heartless bastard, so it was a first to see him take pity on her.
The Grand Panjandrum
@demkat620: Unless, and until, someone of Rafsanjani’s stature speaks up forcefully the protesters don’t have a real leader. Mousavi has helped to galvanize the protests but his inability to effectively provide a voice for the opposition seems to be the one missing piece. This election was ostensibly never about the people being “for” Mousavi as much as it was about being against Ahmadi and his gang of thugs. With no real leadership that is willing to get out front I don’t see that this particular round of unrest will actually lead to any change, even if it is only incremental change.
Bill H
@Montysano:
My sympathy. My Dad died at 72, very peacefully, and Father’s Day is still a little bit poignant. It gets better, but you never lose touch, and that’s a good thing.
geg6
George “No to Bluejeans!” Will was especially funny today. In a discussion on the health care debate in which even Cokie Roberts and Sam Donaldson were making the case for a public option (but not nearly as cogently and clearly as Robert Reich), Will got all shrill and outraged as he pointed out that people just don’t seem to understand! If there is a public option, then most people will probably opt for it! And then all those health insurance companies would be out of business! And the public just doesn’t get that! Horrors! Apparently, George Will thinks the American public has some great resevoir of love and affection for the HMOs and PPOs and POSs that will cause us all to cry and rend our garments when they go to that well-deserved seventh circle of hell from which they came. Bulletin to Mr. Will: nothing would cause more joy and cheering in the streets than seeing the health insurance companies forced into the same bankruptcy to which they have forced so many of their paying customers and/or die as so many of those customers have done due to their indifference to anything other than lining their own pockets.
Ash Can
Via the GOS, Michael Steele has the health care problem all figured out:
Goldang, why didn’t we think of that ourselves???
Bob In Pacifica
“Bomb Bomb Bomb. Bomb Bomb Iran.” Too much to expect the talking heads to remember that, but how about a little game of “Shia or Sunni”?
geg6
That Michael Steele. Damn, he’s good. It must be that hip hop style of his.
Davis X. Machina
They’re not even trying. Which is O.K. because the voters aren’t even listening.
When Dr. Pavlov rang his bell, he wasn’t making an argument. And when his dogs salivated, they weren’t giving their reasoned assent to a series of propositions.
David
No Public Option is a recipe for a future bailout for the insurance industry. Just like the auto companies, insurance companies are not being responsive to the market.
Brick Oven Bill
I will throw in Michael Steele at no extra cost. Also Lindsey Graham.
geg6
BOB: So sorry. They’re yours. You keep ’em. Oh, and we’re keeping the good senator from VA also.
Throwin Stones
@Ash Can: Michael Steele, FTW! He is truly a gift that keeps on giving.
Throwin Stones
@Brick Oven Bill: No deal, BOB. Webb is sane and all ours.
BP in MN
So he’d sit down with them and tell them to cut the bullshit?
Betsy
@geg6:
You know whereof you speak. The people have spoken.
I made a fab dinner last night from my farm share. I fried some tofu till crispy. Set aside on paper towels. To the still-very-hot pan: added chopped scapes and minced ginger, then shiitake mushrooms and broccoli, then thinly-sliced summer squash. After they all softened, I added some broth, soy sauce, mirin, and pepper. When done, served it over the tofu. It was yummy. Everything from the farm bag except the ginger and mushrooms. Mmmmm.
JL
Happy Father’s Day to the dads on the site
Thanks for the update on the Sunday Shows. Once again it appears that I didn’t miss anything.
GregB
Wingnut Primer 101:
2 weeks ago: It is outrageous that President Obama is giving aid and comfort to Muslims with his flowery speeches.
Today: It is outrageous that President Obama is unwilling to give aid and comfort to Muslims with his flowery speeches.
-G
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
Bob Schieffer: Of course. [ a beat ] Gentlemen, over the last few weeks, the tone of this campaign has become increasingly nasty. Senator Obama, in describing your opponent, your campaign has used words like “erratic”, “out of touch”, “lying”, “losing his bearings”, “senile”, “dementia”, “nursing home”, “decrepit”, and “at death’s door”. Senator McCain, your ads have featured terms such as “disrespectful”, “dangerous”, “foreign”, “sleeper agent”, and “uncircumcised”. Are you both comfortable with this level of discourse?
Sen. Barack Obama: Uh, look, Bob: uh, obviously, in any campaign, harsh things are going to be said. And certainly, both of our campaigns have now and then crossed the line. But, I have to say; I am troubled by some of the things said about me at my opponent’s rallies. Things like “traitor”, “kill him”, and “off with his head”. Uhhh — and, unfortunately, Senator McCain has yet to condemn these comments.
Sen. John McCain: Bob, as to the “off with his head” comment, that was shouted at a rally we held at a Renaissance Fair. The gentleman had too much mead and he was removed by security.
===//
How much imagination do you need to believe that this is a real transcript, and not the one from Saturday Night Live?
Heh.
Bill E Pilgrim
@geg6:
Just putting that in the present tense. Also.
Will’s argument here is also this bizarre mirror image of another one that people like him put forth on alternate days, which goes like this:
Me: “But places with universal health care still have private health insurance as an option for anyone who wants it.”
George Will (or facsimile) “See? That proves that universal health care is useless!”
It’s oddly interchangeable as I say, with this argument that Will hyperventilated today, which leads to no other conclusion except that these people believe that universal health care is like a Pandora’s box that must not be opened because if it is it will fail so miserably that everyone will choose it and we’ll have nothing else. Despite the fact that nowhere else where it exists is this the case.
If you can’t make that last sentence make the slightest bit of sense then welcome to the monkey house.
kay
I just don’t think the vast majority of Americans are interested in more engagement in the middle east, in Russia, or really anywhere else John McCain feels a moral imperative to jump in.
I can take that apart and say we’re bailing on our responsibility as the world’s police force, or whatever, and that’s a fair argument, that we meddle when we want and then back off, but I don’t know how John McCain can ignore the fact that, IMO, most Americans would prefer to invest time and treasure here, rather than there. And, I don’t blame them for that.
“Most” means something. The majority opinion means something. If that pisses off neoconservatives like McCain, or the liberal humanitarian interventionist wing that allies with the neoconservatives, well, so be it. They can’t just ignore it, and they are.
passerby
@GregB:
Good catch GregB.
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
Answers we’d love to hear from Johnny McPalin:
Why wait for people on tv to make your Sunday? Write your own screenplay.
JenJen
You know, I don’t remember Al Gore or John Kerry getting invited to go on Sunday programs every damned week to trash the President, or explain how they would have done things differently. Did I miss that whole part of the last eight years?
McCain’s BFF, Lindsey Graham, was on “This Week,” in classic high dudgeon, urging President Obama to “lead the free world instead of following it.” Ummm…. OK, Lindsey, but didn’t Americans make a decision last November, part of which was choosing calm, thoughtful rationality over the uninformed, cowboy diplomacy favored by your BFF and the Wasilla Wingnut? Also, when presented with the new NYT/CBS Poll showing that 72% of Americans favor a government health care plan, Lindsey said, and I’m paraphrasing, “Well, they’re not gonna get it. It’s not even going to get out of the Senate. Socialized medicine will be disastrous for this nation, and it’s not going to happen.”
Why does he hate America? Lindsey knows they lost the election in 2008, right? Why do these guys still insist they get to be the ones who decide?
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
@JenJen:
Graham knows that Democrats, and especially the ones who live on blogs, are terrified of Republicans, and quake and pee themselves whenever any Republican or pundit anywhere says BOO! Especially if it’s on tv.
The American Experiment has failed, and we are all doomed and just so completely fucked.
Just trying to save time here.
passerby
@kay:
I second that.
And right now there are those in Congress scratching their heads over how we can pay for a public option for healthcare. They need only look at the $$$$$ we’ve spent in ME wars (makes the MIC happy) and consider how that chunk could’ve been spent here–if spent at all.
Are they really that obtuse? (A trick question.)
burnspbesq
At least McCain isn’t suggesting that we send in Roland the Headless Thompson Gunner to take out Khamenei.
Library Grape
OT: For anyone out there who’s as wrapped up in the goings-on in Iran right now, I highly recommend renting the movie Persepolis. It follows a young woman’s life before, during and after the Iranian Revolution. It is deeply moving and re-framed my whole way of thinking about the Iranian people.
burnspbesq
@tc125231:
Fred actually popped into my head earlier this week when I was thinking about Iran.
Or, to be more accurate, his best line from “The Hunt for Red October” popped into my head.
“This is going to get out of control, and people are going to get killed.”
JenJen
@Library Grape: Persepolis is both a fantastic film and graphic novel. Excellent recommendation.
@PeopleAreNoDamnGood: The NYT/CBS Poll helped me live to see another day. I’m not sure we’re totally f’d yet. Lindsey Graham and President McCain be damned!
burnspbesq
@Redhand:
Srsly, dude, get a lawyer. You’re about to be sued by Fashion Company UK for diluting and disparaging their brand, by associating it with McCain.
Library Grape
@JenJen: thanks, it really is an amazing movie. i don’t cry when watching movies all that often but I definitely did when watching it.
JL
@Library Grape: Thanks. For those with NetFlix you can watch it instantly, I just checked.
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
@JenJen:
I think you are on the right track.
But keep in mind, we have a front pager here who will call for grassroots action by Americans in response to a political crisis — IN IRAN — but runs away when David Broder makes a frowny facial expression in public.
Healthcare reform has been declared dead on these pages, but our green fonts will save the Iranian Revolution.
My greatest regret is that I can no longer drink like I used to.
JL
@JenJen: President McCain????
geg6
JenJen, these people like Will and Graham do not live in the real world. For that matter, neither do Schieffer or Gregory. In addition to thinking that the American people love health insurance companies, he also pooh poohed their professed love for Medicare as illustrated by the ridiculously high approval numbers the program gets in EACH AND EVERY POLL done on it. He basically said that the public doesn’t understand how horrible it really is and if they did they’d recoil from it in terror. Even my wingnut co-workers are praying for a public health care option and that’s at a university which provides us with a plan most would consider gold-plated. Of course, the two hundred percent increase in our premiums over the last 7 years and going from no co-pay to numerous co-pays depending on service rendered might have had a hand in that.
Brick Oven Bill
Lindsey Graham might hate America because he is gay JenJen.
Personally, I’d give him one chance in three.
harlana pepper
OT & late, but thanks for the G&G and Lily pics. You had us on pins wondering if you were taking her to meet the relatives!
El Cid
Has Bob Schieffer yet stopped crying about how dare Wes Clark suggest that just because John McCain’s plane was shot down and he was
enhanced interrogatedtortured by teh ebbil brown peepulz this doesn’t qualify him to be Preznit.Fucking Schieffer cried for like 3 weeks in a row about that shit. Fuck him. I hate all these useless establishmentarian bastards.
JenJen
@JL: Yep, President McCain. It’s certainly the way our Awesome Liberal Media seems to feel about him, what with the “come on TV anytime you want, we hang on your every word!” treatment.
@geg6: You know it must be Opposite Day when I find myself agreeing with Cokie f’n Roberts on “This Week.” She pretty much chastised George Will into agreeing that Medicare is extremely popular, and also for Will’s insistence that our children will pay for “Obama-Care”, but showed no similar concern when President Bush gave away the Clinton Surplus in the form of tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans. It was kind of interesting, watching Miss Conventional Wisdom get one right for a change.
kay
@passerby:
I’m completely sympathetic to the Iranian protesters. I’m completely ceding the point that we jump in and screw up the mideast regularly, seemingly at random. Guilty.
But I read a diary on kos, and they have a photo of union members being beaten by police in the 1930s, as a comparison to Iran, and I don’t think it’s the same thing. The union members were exercising a right they had, under the 1st Amendment. If McCain and others are saying I have a duty to enforce the freedom to assemble in Iran, when Iranians themselves actually didn’t write that right into law, I just don’t know about that. I mean, we had a war here, and threw out the old rules, and wrote some new ones.
I get the broader idea, the human rights argument, but I’m not sure what McCain wants me to do about that.
I’m wary of neoconservatives. I question their motives. I think that’s rational. Maybe it’s just that. Mistrust.
Library Grape
@JL: yeah, that’s how i watched it for the first time. it’s actually great quality via my xbox 360
Library Grape
From George Will on This Week today: “The president is being roundly criticized for insufficient, rhetorical support for what’s going on over there. It seems to me foolish criticism. The people on the streets know full well what the American attitude toward the regime is. And they don’t need that reinforced.”
This on the heels of HRH Queen of the WASPs Peggerton Noonanshire’s words earlier in the week: “John McCain and others went quite crazy insisting President Obama declare whose side America was on, as if the world doesn’t know whose side America is on. “In the cause of freedom, America cannot be neutral,” said Rep. Mike Pence. Who says it’s neutral? This was Aggressive Political Solipsism at work: Always exploit events to show you love freedom more than the other guy, always make someone else’s delicate drama your excuse for a thumping curtain speech.“
El Cid
By the way, the Independent‘s actual journalist Patrick Cockburn is shrill today:
Mayken
@YellowJournalism: Either way she is not quite ready for prime time if she cannot even articulate a single argument. Bill’s show is a tough gig but there’s no excuse for being that unprepared. Perhaps Ms. McCain should stick to her blog for now?
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
Finally, after a solid morning of bullshit, something really good on Sunday tv: Fareed Zakaria.
Let’s watch.
Library Grape
@JenJen: yeah, but she was out there demagoging deficits, which reich called her out on
JL
@JenJen: There are quite a few titles I would like to give McCain but President is not one of them.
Sullivan had a blog about Froomkin that is relevant to the topic of MSM
passerby
@kay:
And keep an eye on how Ds vote along side and with “neoconservatives” on these large issues. They are beholden to corporations and banks–all of them–bought and paid for.
So when Lindsey Graham states that The Public Option will never happen, he’s not just speaking on behalf of Rs, he speaks on behalf of his fellow club members, aka, the US Senate.
For me, “mistrust” is an understatement when it comes to my view of our “elected officials”.
Bill E Pilgrim
@El Cid: That was one of the most despicable things I saw in the entire campaign, and as we know that’s saying a mouthful.
Schieffer actually had framed the question as “riding in an airplane and getting shot down” and Clarke repeated it back to him when he answered, saying no, that doesn’t qualify someone to be President. The wingnutosmear went crazy over the “riding” part because it sounded so dismissive, and Schieffer never, not once, owned being the one who had said it, but just repeated the story as an example of how “low” each side had gone.
It was really beyond cowardly, that one.
JenJen
Moonshine Patriot watches “Meet The Press” so you don’t have to!
This part seems just about right to me:
Gregory: is Obama’s health care plan
on life support?
Thompson: yes it’s going to cost one million dollars which shows no one has any clue I mean a million is what I got paid to say stupid shit on Law & Order
Gregory: it’s a trillion actually
Thompson: What!? Holy shit!
Gregory: this is very scary
Thompson: there will be rationing and deaths
Nunn: look the old bed was on fire when the
dog went out hunting
Gregory: um what
Nunn: if you want the cookies and ice cream
you gotta milk the cow
Gregory: gosh it’s like being with two charming
old senile grandpas
Gregory: [ high pitched voice ] the deficit!! Omg!!
Library Grape
@JL: I loved that Sully article this morning. I wrote a little meditation on it earlier today:
The key thing that angers me about the mainstream media, especially in the political arena, is their endemic inability to seriously challenge leaders to substantiate their claims (i.e. “call bullshit”). The norm for most media (with some notable exceptions) is to simply act as scrivener to the elites in this country. You’ll find this on CNBC with the business elites and on CNN with the political elites. My view is that the reason for the explosion in readership of blogs and other so-called “new media” is that there are more people in that space willing to call bullshit on a regular basis and, not only that, substantiate their assertions with links to evidence to back themselves up.
The problem I see with taking this trend to its logical conclusion is that we run the risk of throwing the baby out with the bathwater. If people get so fed up with the hackery present in, say, the Washington Post, we may ultimatley inhibit their ability to do the excellent international field reporting on which so many bloggers rely.
I don’t know how this is ultimately going to play out. I’d like to think that the current climate of justified revulsion at the sins of the mainstream media leads them to someday reform their wicked ways. Unfortunately, their ongoing trend toward mindless infotainment seems to be pretty profitable for the outlets that master the craft (see, e.g., Fox News, CNN, etc.). As a result, I’m not that confident that things will ever get better.
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
@Bill E Pilgrim:
But don’t forget the outcome: McCain lost by ten million votes.
I really can’t thank Bob Schieffer enough. Seriously.
Besides, any guy who can go on tv and make me look young by comparison is worth keeping on forever, AFAIC.
burnspbesq
@Library Grape:
Whoa – an actual George Will Lucid Moment. Those are to be treasured, as they are exceedingly rare.
Rick Taylor
Then he fits the modern Republican party like a glove; the same party that gave us the budget without numbers. Trash the opposition, continually spout buzzwords, and imply you’d do things differently, and offer nothing of substance.
Bill E Pilgrim
@burnspbesq:
If only Fred could have found the presence of mind to mumble something like that to George W Bush around 2003.
I guess that’s why they call it acting. You get to be honorable and prudent and look like you care about people’s lives as long as it’s only for show.
LD50
She’s probably confused because she thought that when we invaded Iran in 2003 that we would have kicked Khomeini out.
Library Grape
@burnspbesq: VERY rare :)
JenJen
@Lola:
After watching her get pwn3’d by Paul Begala on Bill Maher’s show Saturday night, I’d wager that Meghan will stick to going on The View and writing her silly teenaged rants for The Daily Beast, before she thinks about getting back in the ring with a liberal on the panel again. :-)
geg6
For all those feeling sorry for Meghan McCain on “Real Time” Friday, I must call bullshit. My reaction was similar to the barely disguised contempt shown by Katty Kay. She was unprepared, uninformed, and unintelligible and then acted like everybody should feel sorry for her and give her a pass because she’s ONLY 24! Fuck her. Grow the fuck up, stupid, vapid bitch. You wanna high profile blog and to be an opinion shaper and make appearances bloviating on political shows like a big kahuna? Then you better be able to handle a wrestling match with the big kahunas. Paul Begala (!!) punched her in the face exactly as she deserved and I laughed out loud when he did it. Fuck Meghan McCain and fuck sympathizing with this stupid, rich, cry baby non-entity.
John Hamilton Farr
Nope. Don’t have one. Wonder why?
dr. luba
@JenJen: No, Ms. McCain would be quite at home on most Sunday Morning Gasbag shows. She would be with her kind, in her comfort zone, and not asked any substantive questions.
She merely needs to avoid Maher, Begala and parts of MSNSBC.
LD50
Actually, I thought I heard that there is potential for huge untapped fields in Sudan, but that country is so wildly dysfunctional and dangerous, it’s not usually taken into consideration.
But of course we Americans know our real future is OIL SHALE!!!!!1111!!!!!
someguy
Yeah, but try to find anybody to stand up to the Republicans who are still basically running the country despite having lost both houses and the WH. They are still getting their way on pretty much 100% of the issues and nobody will say a damn thing about it. Maher was right – if supermajorities in both houses isn’t enough to get the agenda through then somebody has some ‘splainin to do.
passerby
@Mayken:
Watching that Megan segment on Real Time, I got the distinct impression that I was listening to a teenager–15 or 16 y.o.–not a 24 y.o. (which she repeatedly held up as some kind of excuse for something).
IMO, Begala was not trying to bully when he fired back with that crack about not being born yet when the French Rev took place, though it quickly and succinctly pulled the rug out from under her juvenile excuse for not being informed.
When BM introduced her, she admitted to being nervous. Too bad she didn’t listen to her instincts. Because no, she’s not quite ready for the big leagues. I did not feel sorry for her so much as I felt embarrassment for her.
Peter J
Fixed.
LD50
@demkat620:
I can’t imagine that he’ll make it all the way to 2012 without falling out of bed and breaking his hip.
Sorry. That was mean.
Persia
@demkat620: Can you imagine what would have happened if we’d paid half as much attention to Al Gore for the last eight years?
geg6
Persia @105: But…Al Gore is FAT!
John Hamilton Farr
Oh, and happy Father’s Day to all. Reading how real fathers treat their kids helps me fill in the missing pieces. My old man did a lot of good things in his life but never had himself together, never put a hand on my shoulder to say, “That’s all right, son” when it mattered — too busy drowning his own insecurities at the officer’s club and chasing other men’s wives. Father & son events were the hell of my life, because I knew my dad would never be there.
So all you dads out there: let your kids know they count for something in this world. Tell them all about yourself and what makes you tick. And when they come to you to show you something that they’re proud of, PAY ATTENTION and urge them on.
It fucking matters. It really does.
Library Grape
@dr. luba: If Liz Cheney can get a free pass to be on the teevee as an elite legacy, why not Ms McCain?
Mayken
@passerby: Yeah, she definitely came across as much younger than her 24 years. And using her age as an excuse was a huge cop-out. Bill has had other 20-something guests on before who didn’t sound like they were at their first high school debate session.
I will give her this; it’s very brave of her to go on his show. I feel myself to be a pretty articulate and well-informed person but I wouldn’t want to do it! But to come on so unprepared and unable to get a single point across except how young and nervous she was… please! As the saying goes, if you cannot run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!
Library Grape
@someguy: If, after 4 years of this, Dems get their asses handed to them on healthcare and climate change because lindsay graham and chuck grassley pissed their pants, I will be done with the Dems (again). Douchebiscuits like harry reid will be their downfall.
JL
Meghan McCain might be allowed on Fox. They can invent her overnight by saying those liberals were mean to her. Think of Sarah when she was asked soft ball questions by Katie Couric.
Library Grape
@John Hamilton Farr: yeah, i liked the obama father’s day message that ran on the teevee machine today
Library Grape
@JL: because the essence of republican feminism is that we need to treat the poor lil’ delicate flowers like ladies, for heaven’s sake!
Mayken
@JL: And like Ms. Palin, Ms. McCain will be unable to answer them.
It is really sad, with so many truly well-informed, intelligent and articulate women out there in the political sphere that these two get so much friggin’ attention. **sigh**
geg6
JL: FOX would have some problems with Ms. McCain’s inability to tow the proper line on reproductive choice and gay marriage. Not to mention the fact that she’s not a virgin and isn’t married and refuses to lie about it.
JenJen
@dr. luba: Fair enough. Again, I’d say she learned her lesson Friday. No panels featuring liberals like Paul Begala or Bill Maher! I think she’d be safe with Your Weekly Sunday Liberal, like Bob Shrum or some other such fool. ;-)
@geg6: Word. When Begala is en pointe, he really can be the best at laying down the smack. “Tee hee, I wasn’t born yet” is not a viable excuse when you’re trying to become a member of the political chattering class, and someone is questioning your knowledge of American political history. You went to Columbia, fercryinoutloud, Meghan. Did you ever read a book while you were there?
geg6
JenJen, if little Miss Meghan can’t handle a milquetoast like Begala, she can’t even handle a total wimp/idiot like Shrum either. She should stick to The View where Whoopie will take a shot but Elizabeth Hasselbeck will be standing ready to give her a tongue bath.
JenJen
Fred Hiatt’s Wingnut Collection is quite impressive. Last week, we heard from Paul “The Comb Licker” Wolfowitz. Today, Michael Gerson adds his stick to the Iranian drumbeat.
Oy. It burns, it really does.
JL
@John Hamilton Farr:
What an important message for all care givers. Thanks
Laura W
@geg6: My reaction to Ms. McCain on Maher? Pissed off at Maher for letting her suck up so much air time with her coquettish vapidity on his last show before a break. He looked like a deferential enabler. Took me by surprise, actually.
Weak weak weak.
(PS: I look just like Scully! You’re good.)
JL
@geg6: She could go on Face the Nation.
geg6
Does anyone think the WaPo would be the rag it is today if Katherine Graham was still alive and running the show? Her son is surely a very poor excuse of a newspaperman, especially compared to his dad and his mom. Pitiful.
Dave C
John McCain wasn’t on my TV this morning. GPS with Fareed Zakaria was, though. Oddly enough, he invited actual Iranian-American experts on to discuss what’s happening there, and they proceeded to have a calm, rational and informative discussion. What a quaint notion!
Robertdsc-iphone
The visuals. Oy.
(testing the new paste feature for iPhone 3.0)
JL
@geg6: The paper cares about viewership and money, not much for actual reporting anymore. Walter Pincus wrote some important articles in the lead up to the Iraq war that were buried inside the paper.
geg6
OT, but I need help people. I thoughtlessly put my teevee on Bravo for no apparent reason and am now finding myself strangely fascinated by The Real Housewives of New Jersey. I managed to never be drawn to any of the other Real Housewife shows, but for some reason I find myself drawn to this one. This may well be a sign of the apocalypse.
El Cid
I actually didn’t mind the Meghan moment on Maher as much because as soon as Begala called her out she got a lot more contrite, unlike the rest of the Republican Party Dixie Confederate Free Market Baptist Uprisin’ brigades, who pull out bullshit charges (“medical fascism”!) and stick to them.
What confuses me is the attitude that 24 is somehow almost child-like, that grown adults and people who have been through a full university get to make idiotic unsupported arguments as though they were elementary schoolchildren. And the scary CPAC kid who was 13 or whatever could make coherently incoherent Republican arguments, but now apparently the general standards are that 24 – 30 year olds are sort of like infants, yet if you’re any age and you make timeless right wing hack arguments you’re “serious”.
We (well, our idiot establishmentarian media) really allow the entirety of public discourse to be dominated by idiocy, and it’s been this way for at least the last 3/4 century or so.
Library Grape
You guys watching Zakaria? Did you catch this bit from Zbig?
“In Iran, we have two different forces at work. You have those who are for more democracy but who are also nationalistic and you have those who are supporting the regime who in many respects are … very similar to our Neocons. They are Manichean, they look at the world as divided into Good and Evil and many of them see America as the personification of Evil…
[Obama] has struck exactly the right note. He’s offering moral sympathy, he’s identifying himself morally and historically with what is happening in Iran but he’s not engaging himself politically, he’s not interfering, because that would turn out badly and it could be exploited by the Neocons in Iran to crush the revolution, to wipe it out. I don’t know if the revolution will prevail, it may take time, but the longer it lasts the better are its chances. But we don’t want it escalate into a total showdown because if there’s a total showdown now, the chances are that the worst elements, the Iranian Neocons, will prevail.”
Library Grape
@El Cid: Pick up a copy of “Idiot America” if you really want to get depressed
Martin
Yeah, I thought it would go over well to directly compare our neocons to the Iranian hardliners. I wonder who will be the first at the WaPo Op-Ed page to call Zbig a pussy for rejecting the nuke option.
That’s pretty much the only show worth watching on Sunday any more. I’d rather watch the Jesus people than another episode of Face The McCain, Meet the McCain, and This Week with John McCain. (Swap in the appropriate GOP toadie each week)
Martin
BTW, New Jersey is the apocalypse.
JenJen
@Library Grape: I think he nails it, again. Gotta love Zbig.
passerby
@Library Grape:
and/or rent Idiocracy: it haz elektrolites.
Library Grape
@Martin: that reminds me of an SNL joke a while back:
Q: Why is the NJ state motto “The Garden State”?
A: Because it’s too hard to fit “The Oil and Petrochemical State” on a license plate.
dslak
@passerby: It’s what plants crave!
Ondine Breck
Tell me again about that private health insurance plan all the CongressFolk and Senators are signed up on. What? They have a Public Option? Oh.
Argive
I thought it was: “MOAR REAGAN PLZ KTHXBAI.”
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
@Laura W:
Maher wouldn’t be able to get her in bed if he were mean to her.
I thought he might start kissing her hand right there on the show.
The whole thing was weird. Begala was going for some rhetorical theater, which I thought was the point of the show, but Maher literally stepped in between him and Ms. McCain.
Little Dreamer
The only John McCain I’m interested in is this one.
Little Dreamer
@Library Grape:
I’m seriously thinking that the Neocons in this country want to get the U.S. involved in a land war in Asia.
I hear that’s a bad idea.
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
@Little Dreamer:
I think the USS John McCain was named for the Senator’s ancestor(s).
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
Sorry, the link for the USS McCain namesake info.
burnspbesq
@Martin:
Wrong-o, mon ami. New Jersey is now, always has been, and always will be, God’s country. I would abandon the festering wingnut sewer that is OC in a heartbeat if my kid wasn’t rooted here.
201 FA LIFE!
Elie
— Library Grape on the movie “Persepolis”
You are right on — fabulous movie that I would highly recommend….
As we discuss the Sunday talk shows, I must say that while it is good to keep up with the media bull that they spout, there actually IS a show that is informative and was so this morning and that is Fareed Zakaria’s GPS — which has great informative comments by Zbgniew Bryzinski and other guest experts on internet and networking.
Happy Father’s Day to all fathers out there —
burnspbesq
@Library Grape:
Well, if you’re going to be like that …
Q: Why is New Jersey full of toxic waste and DC is full of lawyers?
A: New Jersey got first pick.
Little Dreamer
@JenJen:
Books? Those are for those liberal commies. Republicans don’t need no stinking books, our Jesus tells us what to believe.
/wingnut
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
@Little Dreamer:
NMYM!
Little Dreamer
@PeopleAreNoDamnGood:
Ah, I didn’t think of that. Well it’s weird to have a military ship named with the same name as a sitting U.S. senator.
Thanks for clearing that up for me (even if the beginning of this conversation happened IRL) ;)
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
Based on her appearance on RTWBM, she might have read Anne of Green Gables.
Little Dreamer
@burnspbesq:
I left 201 for 302 in 1970. ;)
Little Dreamer
@PeopleAreNoDamnGood:
You don’t have a YM anymore, because you don’t have a Y. ;)
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
In case anyone wonders where the younger McCain (the Senator) gets his charming, thoughtful way of looking at the world.
Aren’t we sorry now that we didn’t elect him president?
Really, aren’t ya?
PeopleAreNoDamnGood
@Little Dreamer:
I know, but Jesus will always be my yardman.
Not to be confused with his sperm donor, who is my Co-Pilot.
Little Dreamer
@PeopleAreNoDamnGood:
So the angel Gabriel was carrying God’s sperm? That sounds kinda kinky, doesn’t it?
I heard it was a roman soldier named Pandira (also called Panthera and Pantera). This information was recorded in ancient jewish rabbinal literature (Talmud)
Ecks
Y’know, if we were debating starting up the post office now instead of health care,
1) Fed Ex and UPS would be donating millions to congressthings, who
2) Would be all up in our teevee’s telling us that the goverment is so incompetent there’s no way it would run a good service, which
3) would unfairly compete with our private sector delivery firms and drive them out of business!!!!11!!, which is socialism, and would be EXTRA terrible because
4) It would lead to government bureaucrats between you and mail to your loved ones!
And the TV people would nod and agree that these were very serious points, and anyone who suggested that a government post office might run well would simply not be invited to appear on the tube. And if someone suggested that for 65 cents the government would pick a letter up at your door, and the drop it off, absolutely reliably all the way across the country 3 days later, they would be laughed at out loud, because everyone KNOWS that the gov is always incompetent, the sky is blue, grass is green, the earth is flat, and Newt Gingrich is a highly reputable font of high quality ideas.
mai naem
Meghan McCain was dreadful on Maher and I also noticed who Maher was trying to protect her. Maybe, Daddy McCain called Maher and asked him to protect his little girl. What surprised me is that first, Meghan has got to have been around when her dad was practicing for debates so you would think some of that would have sunk in just being around it so much. Secondly, Meghan went to a good private school in Phoenix with pretty rigorous academics and then ofcourse, Columbia. Granted she isn’t going to be a Paul Begala but you would think she would have had a passable performance.
Re – Cokie Roberts and the public option – Cokie was treated for breast cancer recently. She has a sister who died of cancer. Her mother is elderly and as people tend to do of her age, probably had illnesses so Cokie probably knows a little bit more about Medicare and health care than a lot of people. BTW, I personally find Cokie annoying because she pretty much adds nothing new to the conversation.
kay
@mai naem:
I thought she was dreadful too. I thought her silly giggling and turn to Maher to bail her out when Begala called her out (politely and fairly gently) was embarrassing.
How old is she? Mid-twenties? Is there some reason she acts like she’s 15?
If she wants to go on tv and offer opinions as a “job” she has to read something, and prepare, particularly if she’s going to attack.
There should be a rule: if you start a sentence with “my dad…” you’re not permitted to present yourself as a serious critic of the man who beat “my dad”.
No more McCain or Cheney daughters, please.
Anne Laurie
Bill Maher has a thing for blonde conservatives — he used to date Ann Coulter.
Chuck Butcher
Implicit in this kind of discussion is the US world leadership role, something I find debatable.
Jason
@Brick Oven Bill: Why is that surprising? They’ve been doing data visualizations such as this for a while.
Little Dreamer
@Anne Laurie:
Gosh, if Larry King wasn’t getting all over Maher’s shit recently for never being married, perhaps Maher wouldn’t have been so interested in being so chivalrous towards Meghan McCain. This is Larry King’s fault.
Yutsano
I never would have seen him as the type to go for trannies…
Comrade Stuck
I wish I hadn’t read that.
Little Dreamer
@Comrade Stuck:
It’s amazing to me that you didn’t know Maher and Coulter used to have a thing.
Comrade Stuck
@Little Dreamer:
I guess I’ve been sheltered cause I didn’t know. But now I do, unfortunately/
Mayken
@Anne Laurie: Ewww! Really? So didn’t need that image in my head!
asiangrrlMN
@Anne Laurie: Apparently, they are still great friends. Astounding. I did not see Meghan McCain on Maher, and she annoys the hell out of me, so I am not going to watch it.
auntieeminaz
@Montysano:
I feel your pain.
Wile E. Quixote
@John Cole
No, I won’t even look at the comments section in my local newspapers any more because they’re over run with wingnuts. 15 minutes perusing the comments section of the Seattle Times or Seattle Post Intelligencer makes me wish that someone would put a bounty on wingnuts, say three bucks a head and no bag limit.
Wile E. Quixote
@Anne Laurie
@Yutsano
I’m surprised (and not a little bit disappointed) that there isn’t a TS porn star named “Man Coulter” by now.
Wile E. Quixote
@Ecks
Bill Maher did a great bit on this. I think I need to send this to a bunch of wingnuts.