Open Thread

The site conversion is complete, I am still sick, and the Raiders got jobbed yesterday.

*** Update ***

PS: I don’t support torture or the death penalty, but for the love of everything holy, can we waterboard OJ Simpson and then shoot him?






93 replies
  1. 1

    The Niners may go to the prom but they’ll be the ugliest girl at the dance.

    They have won two games with almost no offense. They will surely be humbled in Pittsburgh if they don’t recognize the invention of such things as play-action and the forward pass. Is it any coincidence that Mike Nolan was a defensive coach with the Baltimore Ravens, or that Trent Dilfer is the backup quarterback?

  2. 2
    zzyzx says:

    The Raiders game would have knocked out 20 people in my suicide pool so I’m pretty pissed.

  3. 3
    Jake says:

    Hand? Blow?

  4. 4
    Zifnab says:

    PS: I don’t support torture or the death penalty, but for the love of everything holy, can we waterboard OJ Simpson and then shoot him?

    Only if it will get that crazy SOB off my TV. Seriously, OJ and Britney and ANS and random missing girls in Aruba need to GTFO my daily news. There absolutely has to be more interesting shit going on in the United States than this.

  5. 5
    Punchy says:

    The Raiders game would have knocked out 20 people in my suicide pool so I’m pretty pissed.

    /Looks at the Browns-Bengals score, compares to Last Man Standing picks, and smiles.

  6. 6
    Jon says:

    I’d rather waterboard the moron who thought that OJ should be leading the news this morning.

    BTW, anybody else think it was not a good idea to give the Pats something to be pissed off about?

  7. 7
    DougJ says:

    Did you all see that McCain is a baptist now?

    Jesusland Not Buying McBaptist

    MEDIA ADVISORY, Sept. 17 /Christian Newswire/ — While campaigning in predominately Baptist South Carolina, presidential candidate Senator John McCain (R-Az.), revealed that he is Baptist and has been for years. This new revelation will come as a shock for most in Jesusland, according to David Jeffers, author of Understanding Evangelicals: A Guide to Jesusland. “Evangelicals, and in this case those of the Baptist faith, are not going to be easily swayed by McCain’s pandering,” Jeffers said.

  8. 8
    D-Chance. says:

    Iraq wants Blackwater out of their country.

    I didn’t realize that the number of “private security contractors” was at 30,000. And those are official estimates, so who the Hell knows how high the real number might actually be.

    So how many civilian deaths are due to these professional goons running amuck with no oversight and no accountability? And how is it that “the greatest military in the history of this gosh-darn (to get past the Fox Emmy censors) planet” needs a posse? Are we all fine knowing we have a ghost army as well as a formal one in operation? And just how sovereign IS Iraq, that fledgling democracy, when their occupiers have both official and “unofficial” armies hovering all about, neither answerable to any Iraqi?

    (note: formerly a “David”, but since there seems to be multiple “David”s on the board, name changing…

  9. 9
    Tsulagi says:

    can we waterboard OJ Simpson and then shoot him?

    Let Jesus do it.

  10. 10
    JakeB says:

    I know it’s “all part of the game”, but what a wretched prick Shanahan is.

  11. 11

    Did you all see that McCain is a baptist now?

    I’m fairly certain I am not a Baptist.

  12. 12
    Jake says:

    I didn’t realize that the number of “private security contractors” was at 30,000.

    Makes you wonder if the various militias in Iraq should just re-brand: “No really, we’re private security contractors!”

  13. 13
    Wilfred says:

    You have to think of private security contractors as illegal immigrants doing jobs that American soldiers won’t do, like shooting wildly into crowds of brown people, for instance. Then it makes sense. It’s good practice for when they sub-contract border security in the Southwest. Then it would be that the people who are like illegal immigrants in Iraq would be shooting the real illegal immigrants here, only the shooting would be legal because the immigrants are illegal, and brown, so it’s ok.

  14. 14
    Zifnab says:

    Then it would be that the people who are like illegal immigrants in Iraq would be shooting the real illegal immigrants here, only the shooting would be legal because the immigrants are illegal, and brown, so it’s ok.

    I hope they get to shoot liberals too. Cause liberals in this country could really use a good shooting.

  15. 15
    montysano says:

    Seriously, OJ and Britney and ANS and random missing girls in Aruba need to GTFO my daily news. There absolutely has to be more interesting shit going on in the United States than this.

    More interesting than Britney? Blasphemy!

    Rome is on fire, and there is no shortage of fiddlers….

  16. 16
    The Pirate says:

    As long as we’re allowed to execute J.R. Reed I’m happy.

  17. 17
    montysano says:

    BTW: our local newspaper carried a fairly extensive article on Greenspan. The money quote? Greenspan liked Bill Clinton because “he had a preference for facts”. That tells you everything you need to know about our current situation.

  18. 18
    Grumpy Code Monkey says:

    In totally unrelated news…

    Al Gore won an Emmy!

    My wife digs Current TV, but neither of us had any idea he was involved with it. That’s kind of cool.

  19. 19
    srv says:

    The site conversion is complete

    The new look is wonderful.

  20. 20
    Xanthippas says:

    Please Mr. Cole, you have to blog about this.

  21. 21
    cleek says:

    and this… where ConYank begs for his readers to donate so he can replace his BBQ grill, cruelly knocked-over in a storm.

  22. 22
    Jake says:

    Pakistan continues its march towards democracy!

    Nope. Nothing to see here…

  23. 23
    Jay C says:

    PS: I don’t support torture or the death penalty, but for the love of everything holy, can we waterboard OJ Simpson and then shoot him?

    Wasssamatta, John? You some kind of barbarian? This is inhumane! Disgusting!

    We should just shoot him first, then waterboard him.

  24. 24

    I loved this response to the Blackwater thing. Note all the hedging and laugh (bitterly).

  25. 25
    Punchy says:

    Pakistan continues its march towards democracy!

    There’s a healthy number of Kos Krazys who blog about this happening in 2008. It won’t, but it DOES keep their blood pressure up…which they seem to enjoy.

  26. 26
    Jon says:

    I know it’s “all part of the game”, but what a wretched prick Shanahan is.

    Concur without reservation. Especially his whole “oh I was so wronged by the Raiders” schtick that comes up even though it’s been what, 17 years now? If the NFL was serious about outlawing the cut-block he’d be 4-12 every year. Oh well, at least the dirtiest line in football means Jay Cutler should be safe…go Dores…

  27. 27
    grumpy realist says:

    I have a dumb question: how did Britney Spears get to be so famous and why should anyone care about her? (Aside from being the mental equivalent of a ghastly road accident that you just can’t stop gawking at.)

  28. 28
    Far North says:

    That Raiders always seem to get jobbed. Remember the Tom Brady “Tuck” playoff game? Regarding yesterday’s game, when a coach tells an official that he’s going to call timeout, then a timeout should be signaled right then and there. This crap about telling an official that you’re going to call timeout, then waiting until a split second before the snap is a bunch of crap.

    At least the Raiders are showing some character this year. Last two years, if they fall behind by halftime, they usually quit for the rest of the game.

  29. 29
    Face says:

    The site conversion is complete

    Lasik?

  30. 30
    ThymeZone says:

    can we waterboard OJ Simpson and then shoot him?

    Is he a Republican? Then, yes.

  31. 31

    At least the Goldman family is getting his money from that book.

  32. 32

    Can an Arizona or Detroit fan properly advise me when it’s ok to write off my Dolphins for the season?

  33. 33
    Zifnab says:

    Is he a Republican?

    OJ is a non-partisan kind of stupid.

  34. 34
    Face says:

    Can an Arizona or Detroit fan properly advise me when it’s ok to write off my Dolphins for the season?

    The day you traded for TrINT Green.

    Before turning off the lights, could you please trade Chambers to the Bears? Tnx.

  35. 35

    Face,

    C’mon man, we don’t have an O-line, our Defensive middle is about 300 years old, and we haven’t had a decent running game since the last guy we traded for got lost while staring at the swirls in his bong…can you at least stop clammoring for the few decent players we have left…thanks!

  36. 36
    pharniel says:

    Can an Arizona or Detroit fan properly advise me when it’s ok to write off my Dolphins for the season?

    That’s hard, because the lions managed to win against the cowboy as thier last game last year, but in general when they hold on to a reasonable loss or lead in the first part of the game, but then manage to make miraculus drives showing amazing talent and capability, only shoot themselves in the ass near the red zone/goal line.

    repetedly.

    basically if they play every game like the chargers last night, you’re ready for lions hood.

  37. 37

    You guys have to read this

    Richard Viguerie on why Bush is a wimp for not picking a fight over AG.

  38. 38
    Zifnab says:

    You guys have to read this

    Richard Viguerie on why Bush is a wimp for not picking a fight over AG.

    My mind has been totally blown. Thank you Other Steve. I think I just took the long view down the rabbit hole that leads to the Republican logical process. It’s dizzying.

  39. 39
    whippoorwill says:

    I used to think our side had the most fantastical conspiracy theorists until I came across this, Now I’m not so sure.

  40. 40
    Jake says:

    I loved this response to the Blackwater thing. Note all the hedging and laugh (bitterly).

    So, US soldiers can’t leave until the Iraqi govt. can function, but when the govt. tries to function (ie by picking who gets to stay in the damn country), this is not a good thing.

  41. 41
  42. 42
    Face says:

    Combining football and douchebags…

    Watching Fox this morn, and the SPORTS GUY (the guy on the right on the couch) is giving some sports talk, and the chick in the middle looks at him and says, “all I really want to know is…did the Minnesota Vikings win? Did my team win?”.

    He looks at her, flashes a smile, and says “Yes, they sure did!”

    I kid you not. Detroit 20, Minnesota 17.

    Fair but Inaccurate, bitches.

  43. 43
    kirkaracha says:

    The Raiders did not get jobbed yesterday, and they didn’t get jobbed in the “Tuck Rule” game either.

    Calling timeout during the field goal attempt was a dick move, but it was legal under the rules. I don’t think it should be legal, but it is. After Janikowski’s miss, the Broncos had 3rd and 2 at the 50. How about playing defense? Nope, the Raiders gave up a 13 yard run. Right then I thought, “Ballgame. This play cost the Raiders the game, but their fans will blame it on the timeout.”

    The Raiders lost their playoff game against the Patriots because they collapsed after having the controversial no-fumble call go against them. (Which was a correct call of a stupid rule.) It was their reaction to the call, and not the call itself, that cost them the game. All the call did was let the Patriots tie. The Raiders were so upset by the call that they checked out for the rest of the game, and in overtime, two Raiders defensive backs totally blew a tackle in the flat that let the Patriot’s receiver run 20 yards downfield and almost into field goal range. On that drive, the Raiders couldn’t stop the Patriots on 3rd-and-5, 3rd-and-7, 4th-and-4,and 3rd-and-5. That’s why they lost the game.

  44. 44
    Rick Taylor says:

    It’s been interesting to see how the administration has used the reputation of General Petraus to push a picture of what’s happening in Iraq, without having to make public where their figures come from, or explain why they differ from the GAO’s conclusions. Petraus is supposed to be taken at his word, because he’s a straight shooter and a general and not doing so would be insulting him. This fits in well with the modern media, where actually researching and critically thinking about what someone says isn’t much practiced, and people prefer think in terms of personalities. Deferring to a father figure sure beats critical thinking. That’s how Petraeus is able to persuade congressmen with his “fact free” testimony. This is why Hillary was attacked for her daring to question the general even mildly critically. This is why an ad with some admittedly childish name calling produced such an over-the-top reaction by the Republicans.

    Th administration did something similar with Colin Powell, using his reputation as a general and a straight shooter to get just about everyone to roll over and say, well that’s it! It’s been proven Saddam has weapons of mass destruction, you’re a fool or a Frenchman if you say otherwise. There wasn’t much there, mostly tales of defectors, lots of confusing photos and recordings, but the defectors were not identified and the interpretations of the calls and photos were uncorroborated, People were expected to take his word for it all, but of course they did; the next day all the papers were buzzing with the news of the emperor’s beautiful new clothes! The administration never produced any convincing independently verifiable evidence for an active wmd program (not surprising in retrospect, as Iraq had none), but the general had spoken! And you were an idiot if you dared to question his conclusions.

    This is cruel, but I was looking randomly through the archives of Balloon Juice, and found this gem John wrote back then:

    If Colin Powell’s presentation did not convince the French, the Germans, and the Democrats running for President, can we change the name from “Axis of Weasel” to “Axis of Stupid Ignoramuses Who Are Willfully Blind and Deserve to be Ignored and Relegated to the Foreign Affairs Equivalent of Latrine Duty?

    I know it doesn’t rhyme or sound as pleasing, but I am tired of slandering weasels.

    Pure poetry.

    It seems like every generation has to learn all over again that you can’t blindly trust people in power, no matter many medals they have, how manly they are, how good a reputation they have. It doesn’t mean you’re calling them a liar, but it means they have to justify their conclusions and be subject to critical scrutiny just like the rest of us poor mortals. In the case of General Petraeus, the general gave us lots of charts, but unless I’ve missed something, no one knows where he got his statistics, or why they differ from other reports. We’re just supposed to trust him and shut up because he’s a straight shooter and he’s been in the field, and if you’re not willing to that, well, you’re either an idiot or a traitor.

    Actually, with a few honorable exceptions like John, it seems most people never learn this lesson at all. You’d think after getting snookered by Colin Powell’s presentation into supporting a needless hideous war costing thousands of American lives, hundreds of billions of dollars, killing hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, creating millions of refugees, inspiring America’s terrorist enemies everywhere, and turning what was a country (albeit a despotic one) into hell on earth, after all that you would think that by now everyone would show a little more critical thinking when we’re told once again, we have to trust the general. But doesn’t seem to be the case; it looks like we’re going down the same road we traveled before.

    –A proud member of the ASIWAWBDIRFAELD.

  45. 45
    jenniebee says:

    Republican loses job, reputation, after conviction for sexual offense

    Michael Flory, 33, of Jackson, Mich., told a Cuyahoga County Common Pleas judge that his humiliation and self-destruction should be punishment enough for his guilty plea to a sexual- battery charge.

    Judge Peter Corrigan couldn’t have disagreed more.

    Poor guy – he got publicly humiliated and he lost his job, all because he committed a crime! Watch out, people, it could happen to you!

    I’m sure that TZ will be rushing in here to tell us that this poor soul is just the victim of a witch hunt. Also, it would be nice if he could point out that Tweety is on his side, without any hint of either self-doubt or irony.

  46. 46
    Pb says:

    jenniebee,

    That’s relatively happy-go-lucky compared to this story, assuming it all checks out…

    John David R. Atchison, 53, of Gulf Breeze, Fla., an assistant U.S. Attorney in Florida’s northern district, is expected to appear again in court for a detention hearing on Tuesday.
    […]
    According to the complaint, Atchison reassured the sheriff’s deputy who was posing as the child’s mother that he would not hurt the 5-year-old because he goes “slow and easy,” and “I’ve done it plenty.”

  47. 47
    Punchy says:

    If they don’t confirm the first nominee, send up another, making sure that he or she is “worse” (from the Democrats’ perspective) than the first one. If they block that one, do it again.

    The Republican base is demoralized. It is disgusted with the buffoonery and wimpiness of Washington Republicans. In the 2006 election, enough of these activists sat out the election that Democrats took control of Congress.

    Holy Crizzap. Where to begin? He advocates playing a game that kids in 3rd grade play, a Washington form of “I know you are, but what am I?”. THEN he says they’re “disgusted with the buffoonery”….

    My jaw has permanently hit the floor.

  48. 48
    jenniebee says:

    Pb – oh, gross. If I was that man’s wife, it wouldn’t be safe for him to come home.

    I mean, I’m really not a ball buster in any sense of the word, but finding out that my hubby’s “business trips” were to destroy little girls, I’d be tempted to mickey the sumbitch’s drink and take out a little creative vigilante justice on his ass. There are some things that jail time just isn’t enough to pay for.

  49. 49
    ThymeZone says:

    I’m sure that TZ will be rushing in here to tell us that this poor soul is just the victim of a witch hunt.

    Fuck you, you smartass piece of shit. I’ve never suggested any tolerance for this kind of behavior.

  50. 50
    Pb says:

    jenniebee,

    That’s approximately what the reaction was over at Daily Kos too, and I totally understand why. Ugh. What’s sicker:

    News of Atchison’s arrest is “a shellshock” in Gulf Breeze, where Atchison was the president of a local youth recreation board and had been involved in coaching soccer, baseball and other sports, said Lt. Rich Hawthorne of the Gulf Breeze police.

    I believe they’re talking about this youth recreation board… and they aren’t kidding about the ‘youth’ part. :(

  51. 51
    demimondian says:

    He advocates playing a game that kids in 3rd grade play, a Washington form of “I know you are, but what am I?”. THEN he says they’re “disgusted with the buffoonery”….

    How different is it from sending the President a war funding bill with time limits, and, if he vetoes it, sending it back again and again until he gets the message.

    I don’t know what the outcome is going to be, but it isn’t looking really pretty now.

  52. 52
    jenniebee says:

    Ah, I see. Your standard isn’t that the police shouldn’t arrest people who would be embarrassed by public knowledge of the crimes they commit. Your standard is that the police shouldn’t arrest gay people who would be embarrassed by public knowledge of the crimes they commit. Truly, a laudable standard of jurisprudence by any measure. I mean, who the hell really cares about equal protection these days, anyway? That is soooo 1789.

  53. 53
    demimondian says:

    That is soooo 1789.

    Worse, it’s so *last millenium*.

  54. 54
    Pb says:

    How different is it from sending the President a war funding bill with time limits, and, if he vetoes it, sending it back again and again until he gets the message.

    Tactically about the same, but qualitatively different–on the one hand, there’s the preservation of the GOP’s corruption of the judiciary at stake. On the other, a considerable amount of blood and treasure, not all of it ours. And yeah, it ain’t pretty.

  55. 55
    ThymeZone says:

    Your standard isn’t that the police shouldn’t arrest people

    My standard is that I’ve never suggested any tolerance for rape or anything like it.

    My standard is further that I’m not taking that kind of crap from you or anyone else here.

    Go fuck yourself, you jackass.

  56. 56
    jenniebee says:

    You know, I hear the bathroom at the Minneapolis airport where Craig was terminally humiliated has become quite a tourist attraction. Maybe you should go stage a sit-in there, in protest of the ‘witch hunt.’ You could do it in costume – get a friend to dress up as a witch and you can dress up as Tweety. Tap away all day to each other and see if anyone arrests you!

  57. 57
    ThymeZone says:

    Maybe you should go stage a sit-in there, in protest of the ‘witch hunt.’

    Maybe, but what I won’t do is take any crap from you to the effect that I will tolerate, excuse or condone rape.

    Not today or any other day.

  58. 58
    Zifnab says:

    Tactically about the same, but qualitatively different—on the one hand, there’s the preservation of the GOP’s corruption of the judiciary at stake. On the other, a considerable amount of blood and treasure, not all of it ours. And yeah, it ain’t pretty.

    Nah, it’s all fair game. The question is one of public support. The timetable bills Congress would keep throwing at the President would be bills supported by the majority of the American population (70% or there abouts at last count). The nominees the President would keep selecting for Attorney General would be known by a handful of Washington elites and partisan affiendos, and the nomination battle would rank just below as Britney Spears nipple slip on the scale of “Things the Average American Cares About”.

    Since this Republican is playing the whinefeast card, he’s betting that the American people would side with the President over Congress when someone finally notices that we don’t have an official Attorney General. Since this Republican has been living under a rock for the past three years, we can assume he hasn’t realized that absolutely nobody currently neck deep in Kool-Aid trusts the President.

    Thus, the difference is that in one case, America would applaud Congress for having balls and boo the President for being an obnoxious dick, and in the other case America would boo the President for being an obnoxious dick and applaud Congress for having balls.

  59. 59
    Tsulagi says:

    According to the complaint, Atchison reassured the sheriff’s deputy who was posing as the child’s mother that he would not hurt the 5-year-old because he goes “slow and easy,” and “I’ve done it plenty.”

    My first inclination with that guy would be to stand him up against a wall and shoot him. But that’s not right. Since now I’m supposed to be a liberal, I’d just let my bleeding heart side out and sentence him to 30 years. With a prison job of handing out soap in the showers for the body builders in the inmate population. I’m sure they’d love to hang with an ex-federal prosecutor/pedophile.

  60. 60
    Jake says:

    Florida is a beautiful state but this isn’t the first story that’s made me wonder if it would be so wrong to saw that sucker off and push it into the Gulf.

    Also, I wish editors would make it a rule that reporters can’t report that a perp’s friends/family are shocked when shit like this happens. Dog bites man.

    And now for your daily dose of Irony. From the FL AG’s Office:

    This spring, the CyberCrimes Against Children Act of 2007 was passed by the Florida Legislature and signed into law by the Governor. Championed by Attorney General McCollum, this law now positions Florida as a national leader in the legal fight against child pornography and the internet solicitation of children.

  61. 61
    capelza says:

    Jake..I agree. I confess to eye-rolling about Florida. Have for years. The whole Anita Bryant anti-gay thing years ago, Elian, 2000, Terri Schiavo, and the pervie creeps that seem to enjoy the sunny warmth of the place.

    I remember eating in a resaurant in Ft. Lauderdale and my husband mentioned we were driving down to Key West. The waitress, bless her heart, said something to the effect to please not judge Florida by the Keys, because they weren’t like the “rest of Florida”. My only thought was “Thank God”.

  62. 62
    jenniebee says:

    Ohhh… I see. Laws against rape should be enforced, but laws that you don’t personally think are necessary on the basis of your personal belief that they’re never really broken, when those laws are broken and are enforced, that’s a witch hunt (the enforcement being doubly baseless since the crime could not have been committed because you don’t personally believe such crimes ever are, QED).

    It’s good to know that when George W. is done picking and choosing his way through Justice dept cases that there’s a liberal contingent ready to pick up where he left off. TZ as the new Deciderer – woot!

  63. 63
    whippoorwill says:

    Jenniebee

    If you need to pick a fight, go trolling for wingnut blood. Otherwise, I don’t know what the hell your talking about. Thymezone ain’t no angel, but your accusations are out in left field.

  64. 64
    chopper says:

    This is cruel, but I was looking randomly through the archives of Balloon Juice, and found this gem John wrote back then:

    not to rag on john, but i do like going through the old posts. just to see the big difference in how people thought back then. honest people like john took their lumps, admitted they’d been snookered and turned around. most all of the pro-war people who posted on those threads haven’t, and to this day likely change the subject whenever 2003 is brought up. i wonder whatever happened to all them. i wonder whatever happened to their dignity.

    It seems like every generation has to learn all over again that you can’t blindly trust people in power, no matter many medals they have, how manly they are, how good a reputation they have. It doesn’t mean you’re calling them a liar, but it means they have to justify their conclusions and be subject to critical scrutiny just like the rest of us poor mortals. In the case of General Petraeus, the general gave us lots of charts, but unless I’ve missed something, no one knows where he got his statistics, or why they differ from other reports. We’re just supposed to trust him and shut up because he’s a straight shooter and he’s been in the field, and if you’re not willing to that, well, you’re either an idiot or a traitor.

    well said.

  65. 65
    chopper says:

    If you need to pick a fight, go trolling for wingnut blood. Otherwise, I don’t know what the hell your talking about. Thymezone ain’t no angel, but your accusations are out in left field.

    eh, TZ picks more than enough fights with people here, those who aren’t spoofs/trolls. he needs to have the piss taken out of him every once and a while just like everyone else. hell, more often if you ask me.

  66. 66
    whippoorwill says:

    Point taken chopper, but if your accusing someone of condoning rape then a little evidence should be in order. I get the feeling this has something to do with the Malkin thread a while back and if it does Jenniebee should say so, that’s all.

  67. 67
    Pb says:

    I agree, but also note that the Iraq war was a horrible idea before it lost the public support of the American people. Therefore, opposing it then might have been politically tone-deaf–according to an opportunist–but ultimately also the right and principled thing to have done, both then and now.

  68. 68
    Andrew says:

    I think we need a national task force of elite toe tapping police who will roam public restrooms throughout our great land, stopping the scourge of wide stancing, before it is too late.

  69. 69
    Dave says:

    My standard is further that I’m not taking that kind of crap from you or anyone else here.

    Except for my crap, TZ generally likes my crap, because it smells like roses.

  70. 70

    I got in trouble over in another forum for calling the war Stupid.

    I apologized, and noted that from now on I would refer to it as Judgement-Challenged.

  71. 71
    ThymeZone says:

    Laws against rape should be enforced, but laws that you don’t personally think are necessary on the basis of your personal belief that they’re never really broken, when those laws are broken and are enforced, that’s a witch hunt

    Two things:

    One, that’s a juvenile and deliberatley obtuse interpretation of my argument. If that’s the best you can make of it, tough shit. My argument was made, made well, and it stands as written back on the original Craig threads.

    Two, what you are saying here has nothing to do with today’s case, nor anything to do with the obscene crime of rape as represented by this case, and your attempt to link them is bullshit.

  72. 72
    ThymeZone says:

    TZ picks more than enough fights with people here

    Actually, that is not the case. I make strong arguments and take strong positions, and defend them aggressively. I respond in kind in arguments. I almost never “pick fights” because I don’t particularly care for them, and have no need to do so.

    A few of us have staged flame wars here over the last couple years, but you’ll have to figure out for yourself what those were and who the participants were. Just as an example though, you’ll find if you look closely that most of the arguments between demi and myself are pretty much staged. Not all though, and not even we always know for sure which ones are which.

    But in the case of something like the Craig case, I don’t waste time “picking a fight.” I say what I think, period. What happens, happens, I don’t give a shit.

  73. 73

    Don’t know anything about the latest Simpson caper, but I offer open minds the following:

    http://southofheaven.typepad.c.....index.html

    and

    http://southofheaven.typepad.c.....index.html

    as reasons why it’s unlikely that Simpson committed that double murder. Science suggests that everything you know about the murders on Bundy is wrong.

  74. 74
    Tufdaawg says:

    ok, i have all you monkeys beat. I am a Red Sox fan and with less than two weeks to go we are going to blow our frigging lead and not even make the playoffs. (I am 41 and have been a sox fan for 38 years; the first 3 years, i wasn’t old enough to know any better.)

  75. 75
    Andrew says:

    Actually, that is not the case. I make strong arguments and take strong positions, and defend them aggressively. I respond in kind in arguments. I almost never “pick fights” because I don’t particularly care for them, and have no need to do so.

    You, sir, are a huge poopy-head.

  76. 76
    D-Chance. says:

    One last Blackwater item… from an article on WaPo.com:

    Blackwater officials acknowledged earlier this year that one of their off-duty workers shot and killed a security guard for an Iraqi vice president last Christmas Eve. Company officials have said they fired the employee after flying him out of the country and are cooperating with federal investigators.

    I wonder if the off-duty worker qualifies for unemployment benefits…

  77. 77
    Far North says:

    Kirkaracha,
    Probably 90% of all NFL followers would have called the Brady “tuck” a fumble, even after being read the precise tuck rule. It was a fumble. If the official, Walt Coleman, rules it on the field that’s one thing. But he reversed his original fumble call on the replay, which has made me anti instant replay ever since. You say the Raiders didn’t stop the Pats on blah blah blah. But the Raiders made a big play when they had to that should have won them the game. But the official essentially came in and said, “Nope, you have to make two big plays”.

    Bottom line: It was reprehesible to reverse the call on the field based on that replay evidence.

    BTW, I thought this was a football thread.

  78. 78
    rachel says:

    Much better to torment OJ than this poor woman. Homeland Security keeps the USA safe… how?

  79. 79
    TenguPhule says:

    Much better to torment OJ than this poor woman. Homeland Security keeps the USA safe… how

    They terrorize us over here so that Al Queda doesn’t have to bother…or something like that.

  80. 80
    TenguPhule says:

    What happens, happens, I don’t give a shit.

    Please donate to the ‘Give a shit to Bush fund’.

    Your donation of shit will be mailed to the Bush ranch where it will frolic freely in its natural habitat.

    Operaters are standing by!

  81. 81
    TenguPhule says:

    According to the complaint, Atchison reassured the sheriff’s deputy who was posing as the child’s mother that he would not hurt the 5-year-old because he goes “slow and easy,” and “I’ve done it plenty.”

    My first inclination with that guy would be to stand him up against a wall and shoot him. impale him through the ass with a sharpened iron stake and leave him hanging outside until gravity finishes the job as an example.

    Fixed.

  82. 82
    Soliton says:

    Y’all really want to know why the Dems are so weak kneed?

    The Anthrax mailer has not yet been caught.

    “You have such beautiful grandchildren, it would be a shame if anything were to happen to them”.

    That’s all it takes.

    Make no mistake, the Dems are fully and completely aware that their families could be the next targets if they get too frisky.

  83. 83
    jake says:

    My first inclination with that guy would be to stand him up against a wall and shoot him. impale him through the ass with a sharpened iron stake and leave him hanging outside until gravity finishes the job as an example. ^But while you’re sharpening the spike you realize that a pedophile in prison has the life expectancy of an egg in an avalanche even if he isn’t a Caucasian southern male in a Detroit prison and he used to send people to jail for a living. Then you stick your fingers in your ears and shut your eyes because what happens next will make the iron spike seem quick and painless.

    Further fixed.

  84. 84
    Punchy says:

    And here I thought a pedophile was someone who like to have a lot of pets. Damn.

  85. 85
    Lee says:

    Bob In Pacifica,

    Read the 2 posts.

    Too bad he did not follow up with anything more substantial. This might just be me, but I’m always skeptical about after-action experts on any topic. I find it difficult to imagine that the defense did not bring up these very same issues.

    Where was the Bundy info?

  86. 86
    chopper says:

    I almost never “pick fights” because I don’t particularly care for them, and have no need to do so.

    whatever you say.

  87. 87
    jenniebee says:

    One, that’s a juvenile and deliberatley obtuse interpretation of my argument. If that’s the best you can make of it, tough shit. My argument was made, made well, and it stands as written back on the original Craig threads.

    Your argument, sir, was a piece of dross founded on self-contradictory reasoning and without basis in any theory of justice or law more developed than L’etat c’est moi.

  88. 88
    Zifnab says:

    Make no mistake, the Dems are fully and completely aware that their families could be the next targets if they get too frisky.

    Tell it to the troops.

    If Democrats “being frisky” ends the war, and a couple Congressmen receive letter bombs as their reward, it still saves – what? an American a day? – and untold billions that could be spent to improve quality of life in the US.

    If Congressmen and Senators really are afraid of domestic terrorists to the point that they won’t fight for legislation, then maybe all that Republican bullshit about Democrats being soft on terrorists isn’t as bullshitty as we thought.

  89. 89
    Pb says:

    If Democrats “being frisky” ends the war, and a couple Congressmen receive letter bombs as their reward, it still saves – what? an American a day?

    Maybe for that day; lately it’s been closer to 3, maybe 23 a week or so.

  90. 90
    demimondian says:

    Besides, I imagine that that John Boehner would be the first to point out that a couple of Congressmen would be a small price to pay for the benefits we’d receive?

  91. 91
    Rick Taylor says:

    I don’t know if I can bring myself to vote for Hillary Clinton after she voted to authorize this insane war in 2003; my vote will probably go to Obama on that basis and that basis alone. But I have to say, I’m liking her more and more. She’s the only candidate I know of who’s questions to Petraeus were tough enough to arouse the wrath of the right wing thou-shalt-not-question-the-general machine, and when attacked, she rightly refused to voice an of-course-the-add-was-awful even as an aside and focussed on what hitting back. She more than any of the Democratic candidates knows what it’s like to be the full on target of the Republican slime machine (Vince Foster anyone?), and I suspect she’s better prepared than any of them to fight back when the time comes (John Kerry’s major failing). So yeah, I’m wavering.

  92. 92
    Rick Taylor says:

    Sorry, John, I’ve changed my mind. I approve of the MoveOn tactics. First the bulk of the ad was well reasoned, it wasn’t just name calling. The pun on his name brought attention to the ad, but it wasn’t the meat of it. Now it would be wonderful if we lived in a world where arguments were always taken on the merits, but we all know the coverage the ad would have received if it had had the arguments without the headline: nada.

    Second, while making a pun on someone’s name is kind of dumb, the substance of what they were saying wasn’t out of bounds. They weren’t saying he was a traitor (obvious to anyone who read the thing); they were saying by distorting the data, he was committing a betrayal of trust (a theme they’re continuing), and at the very least, there’s an argument to be made for that. I don’t buy this, ohhhhh, say what you want about the war but we must not question the general’s integrity.

    I keep coming back to Colin Powel. Was he an honorable man who served his country and had unusual integrity? Yes. Do I feel he betrayed us? I sure do. If what he’s saying now is true, he knew the war was a bad idea. He knew there’d be a civil war. And yet he used his good name to put a pack of misleading propaganda in front of the UN, the world, and the country, which helped enable the war we’re in now (and set a precedent, that the United States simply cannot be taken at its word by the world when it says something is so). He himself called it a blot on his record (I would say it was a blot on ours). He betrayed us, and I’m still angry about it, and I have no trouble saying so.

    Would I put Patraeus in the same category? I’m honestly not sure, but the question isn’t beyond the pale. I don’t buy that the General is some saint, and whatever we do we must not question his integrity, and if we do question his conclusions we must periodically put in a comment about what a wonderful person he is. There’s a strong case that he’s cooking the books and allowing himself to be used as a prop to continue the war. At the very least, it’s not an outrageous thing to suggest; it’s not beyond the bounds of civilized debate. The very virulence of the Republican response to the ad makes me think maybe it was necessary. Well reasoned arguments by themselves (which there have been plenty of) would not have pierced the hagiography. Someone somewhere has to be rude enough to shout, the emperor has no clothes!

    What about on practical grounds? Was the ad effective? Of course it appalled the media elite, but who cares about them. As far as the country is concerned, what sort of effect did it have? Maybe it was beneficial. Instead of having a full week of paeans to Petraeus with maybe a few timid questions, we got to see Republicans making fools of themselves. Most of the American people by now aren’t fooled; they know the war is going badly, they know the surge isn’t turning it around, and getting the Republicans up there in a lather about an ad when, excuse me, there’s a war on?, might have been a good thing. It was either that or enduring hours of paeans to the General, and I think I prefer the former.

    Remembering when the Swift Boaters were attacking Kerry, I thought the Republicans were fools. I thought sure it would backfire. But I believe I was wrong; it may have even cost the Democrats the election. So when my own side uses a play on words that is arguably childish, but that is used to bring attention to an argument that is genuinely substantive, I feel no need to apologize. In a perfect world arguments would receive attention bases on their merits, and MoveOn’s rhetoric wouldn’t have been necessary. We don’t live in such a world.

  93. 93
    TenguPhule says:

    In a perfect world arguments would receive attention bases on their merits, and MoveOn’s rhetoric wouldn’t have been necessary. We don’t live in such a world.

    Amen, Rick Taylor.

    If only more ‘serious thinkers’ understood this, we’d all be better off.

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