If you doubt my Cheney-centric view of Bush scandals, read this account from today’s WaPo article that I referenced below.
For months, Olson and his Justice Department colleagues had pleaded for modest shifts that would shore up the government’s position. Hamdi, the American, had languished in a Navy brig without a hearing or a lawyer for two and a half years. Shafiq Rasul, a British citizen at Guantanamo Bay, had been held even longer. Olson could make Cheney’s argument that courts had no jurisdiction, but he wanted to “show them that you at least have some system of due process in place” to ensure against wrongful detention, according to a senior Justice Department official who closely followed the debates.
The vice president’s counsel fought and won again. He argued that any declaration of binding rules would restrict the freedom of future presidents and open the door to further lawsuits. On June 28, 2004, the Supreme Court ruled 8 to 1 in the Hamdi case that detainees must have a lawyer and an opportunity to challenge their status as enemy combatants before a “neutral decision maker.” The Rasul decision, the same day, held 6 to 3 that Guantanamo Bay is not beyond the reach of federal law.
The veep quite literally believes that the Executive branch can imprison any American, torture him and never answer about it to any court. You or anybody you know could find yourself naked in a cell one day and never see a lawyer or contact family. They could hold you until you die. Assuming that a Cheney-approved “review” process resembles Guantanamo, which seems if anything optimistic, prisoners could face a presumption of guilt, no access to their defense counsel and no right to review the evidence against them. Cases that the accusers lose can just be re-tried again and again until the government gets the result that it wants. Defense counsels who take their job too seriously would get punished as an example to others.
The whole premise would sound laughable, like some Kafka parody, if it was not happening today on American soil. The upshot of the Cheney-approved review process is that you don’t need any link to terrorism to find yourself locked up forever. Just the accusation, flimsily supported in a sealed brief, is more than enough.
It would really make my day if those few Bush fans who still back this drifting derelict of an administration would grow some balls and be honest about what they are defending.
Gus
Don’t hold your breath.
Teak111
I just heard a knock at your door, Tim F.
Rome Again
It sounds as if the court scene in Midnight Express is kinder by comparison, at least they HAD a trial, even if guilt was predetermined and it was in another language.
Not that I’m comparing a movie to real life (although ME was inspired by a true story, correct? Why Yes, yes it was!) – it seems you stood more chance of a tiny little bit fairer trial in Turkey in the 70’s than you do today in the United States. How proud we must be to say that… NOT!
Bruce Moomaw
Andrew Sullivan: “You get the distinct sense that, in wartime, he finds democracy itself repugnant. The feeling, Mr Vice-President, is mutual.” The only point on which I disagree with this is that — given his obsession with secrecy even on matters that have no connection whatsoever with the war effort, such as just who he talked to while setting energy policy — I think he finds democracy repugnant in peacetime, too.
It really is difficult not to regard Cheney as — quoting Victor Gold (!) — a “paranoid megalomaniac”. But then, the warning signs were always there. Consider, as just one example, his statement of his activities as Ford’s chief of staff: “They warned me that I’d have to deal with Nelson Rockefeller. And, by God, I dealt with Nelson Rockefeller. By the time I was through, there was nothing left of him but a grease spot on the Oval Office rug.” I think the guy simply gets a tremendous personal kick out of power — which he may have done from his teenage years on, judging from his early record as a small-scale juvenile delinquent — and that this also plays a major role in his strong attachment to torture (that is, he doesn’t get sexual pleasure out of it; he simply gets a tremendous emotional high out of imposing his will forcibly on other people by any means necessary). All Hedley Lamarr had to find then was his Gov. LePetomaine — in this case, a childish man (one G.W. Bush) who was willing to follow Cheney’s advice simply because it helped W. stick a thumb in his hated daddy’s eye — and then receive that other gift from the gods (or from the Devil) on 9-11-01, to enable him to follow his lifetime dreams
Bubblegum Tate
Tim F: Unserious about fighting terror. Obviously.
ThymeZone
Well, when you have a Sooo-Preem Cowart justice basically telling us that Jack Bauer is the new model of ethics, there’s no reason for the Veep to be shy and reticent.
Just in case anyone forgets why we don’t want to lose our focus over things like the Memorial Day cave in the war funding thing, this is why. The Dems, as unorganized as they are, are right now all that stands between you and these fucking lunatics in the GOP.
Remember to tip your congressman, and we are here all week.
Heh.
Punchy
Is this correct? Are you telling me Thomas and Scalia voted different from each other? Is this a first, or is this sentence just incorrect?
I cannot for the life of me envision Thomas or Scalia voting along with Breyer and Company…for ANYTHING.
Wilfred
More like Kafka’s parable “The Problem of Our Laws”.
What troubles me most is that the powers given by these usurpations would rest with anyone. Why would Bushco fight for this power only to surrender to another person, or party, who might use it against them in some form? Sometimes I wonder if Bushco really are planning a bloodless coup.
srv
As this existential war has clearly shown, our own worst enemy is right here at home. They want to destroy our freedoms, and we cannot just leave it to the Congress or Courts to protects us against this threat. Sometimes, more of a sacrifice is required for the greater good.
Jay C
The sick part is, Tim, that they generally have. Only most Bush-Administration-defenders have taken the cheapjack option, and founded their self-righteous defenses of these abuses on the shaky grounds that it is (somehow) only “terrorists” who have suffered, or will suffer, from Abu-Ghraib-style maltreatment. “Terrorists”, of course, being vicious, beyond-the-pale not-quite-humans who deserve everything they get. And attempt to deflect any criticism with huffy defensiveness and “well, they’re worse” excuse-mongering:
(Blah-blah 9/11! Blah-blah dhimmis-and-burqas! Blah-blah beheadings-and-stonings! Blah-blah caliphate! 9/11!! Dhimmi! Caliphate! Burqa! 9/11!!)
I’ve never quite understood the logic behind the theory that, in a war with enemies who are rightly scorned as sadistic, violent barbarians, the preferred course of action (or excuse therefor) by so many has been to sate that WE should become: well, sadistic violent barbarians.
Maybe Darryl can explain it to us.
Pixie
Since Cheney is part of the Legislative branch, does this mean he doesn’t have any say in Executive policy then?
Mr Furious
It would really make MY day if those few Bush fans who still back this drifting derelict of an administration would grow some balls and be honest about be forced to endure a healthy dose of what they are defending.
srv
It’s just another example of just how embarrassing Thomas is. Scalia had quite a long rant about Habeus Corpus being the bedrock of western civilization and what not. He’s fine with it being suspended, he not without some process or declaration.
craigie
There aren’t any such people left.
Except, of course, the people who control our airwaves and newspapers.
Mr Furious
There. That’s what it was supposed to look like.
Zifnab
Waterboard Scooter!
I need to make that into a bumper sticker.
jrg
Or the Republicans who say one minute that we should carpet-bomb middle eastern cities, the next minute are talking about “winning hearts and minds”, the next minute, they defend the torture at Abu-Ghraib, and still the next minute, they blame “thuh liburuls” for losing Iraq.
Yeah, because the way to a person’s heart is through the electrodes on their nipples. There’s no way anyone would want to blow up an American soldier with an IED after being tortured.
Can we please put some adults in charge? These bed-wetting, nitwit conservatives have done enough shredding of the constitution.
Dreggas
*snickers* Ummm…well…for some it might be LOL.
Pb
Punchy,
As usual, the truth is more complicated than the papers let on; see here — Scalia dissented from the
majorityplurality opinion, and so did Thomas, separately, but that doesn’t mean that they agreed with each other, either:Dreggas
Snarkiness aside,
Is now a good time to call for massive demonstrations across the country with marches on washington? I mean seriously when is enough enough.
Zifnab
Hey, listen, I think marching on Washington would be a great idea. If you want to pitch me the $3.00/gallon for gas plus the price of a hotel plus food, and throw in a vacation day so I go rally without missing work, I’ll be right there marching next to you.
Rome Again
No Dreggas, it will never be the right time. Don’t you get it? We have to be one for all and all for one or it will nevr work (heaven help us!). Personally I was ready to march way back when they started the Patriot Act crap, but, look how much has happened since, and we’re STILL not ready. Not until the last ball drops, and by then, it will simply be too late. Sorry for my pessimism, I don’t see it changing, sorry. I’d love to help, if it does.
ThymeZone
Well, let’s all calm down. The important thing is that Paris Hilton is still in jail, right? For today, at least.
So let’s keep everything in perspective.
jrg
Sorry, but if the results of the last election did not send a message, no amount of marching will.
Save your energy and use it to get a responsible Democrat elected in ’08.
Chad N. Freude
Can’t argue with a professional opinion. LQTS (Laughs quietly to self).
Chad N. Freude
Ms. Hilton’s most egregious error was not being married to the Los Angeles City Attorney:
Not that this has any direct bearing on Dick Cheney’s transformation into Mussolini, but it does support the view that an elected official doesn’t have to follow any laws.
Dreggas
LOL.
Dreggas
Sadly I agree, I guess the whole “until it’s me or mine I could care less” schtick is the way it goes.
Chad N. Freude
I forgot to note that
I apologize for letting my obsessive rage at lying, deceiving, dishonest local politicians overtake my intense fear of and rage at lying, deceiving, dishonest national politicians.
Rome Again
If you don’t mind, I’d rather not talk about nipples today.
ThymeZone
Well, Nipple Mondays have a long and noble tradition around here.
Wilfred
Say that name 5 times fast. Thinking of nipples.
ThymeZone
I think that’s what you meant.
Zifnab
Unfortunately, that’s how its always been. The difference between now and thirty years ago is that there were alot more “me and mine”‘s getting drafted into Vietnam. When everyone lives in fear of getting press-ganged into the US Army, you see a much more vocal and lively underclass rebellion.
But we’ve been divided and conquered. Divided by state, by class, by income, by favorite baseball team. Riots were something that happened, because a great number of angry people happened to be in the street at the same time. Marches were organized in the dense urban areas when fifty of your neighbors would go rushing down a couple blocks to a rally and you’d pop along for the ride.
And in big urban metropoli, you still see that sort of thing. We saw the cleaning workers’ strike around the Houston Galleria and the immigrant protest marches in LA and NY. But you can’t expect that sort of thing out in suburbia where you’ve got to drive five miles to the grocery store. It’s a different dynamic. People don’t roll like that down here.
Rome Again
Really? That is just udder nonsense and you know it.
ThymeZone
Don’t get me going, I just might milk this controversy for all it’s worth.
Rome Again
Churn it, baby!
Rome Again
and No, I’m not trying to butter you up! ;)
Rome Again
Gosh, I gave you plenty of time to respond. I had a cigarette and you missed out. You’re getting creamed. Better give it up. Haha!
ThymeZone
I’m whipped.
Chad N. Freude
Ice cream in agony at these godawful puns.
ThymeZone
You are on the Rocky Road to perdition, amigo.
Jake
Citizens don’t wake up and say “You know what would liven things up? A little fascism, that’s what we need.” They just keep hitting the snooze button and one day … oh shit!
But growing balls would make that easier. See: Abu Gahrib; alligator clips…
Chad N. Freude
That’s a sher bet.
Chad N. Freude
I just looked at Freerepublic.com and found this in the comments on an article about Rahm Emanuel’s remarks on defunding the OVP:
Rome Again
QQ
OH SHIT!
Richard Bottoms
I’m sorry. It took some time for me to stop laughing.
Richard Bottoms
Isn’t that evil?
Janet
Sorry this is off topic but we have devised a plan to put pressure on the press. They think we are not out here seething. Well, we are. Please check out my homepage to see what we are planning
jrg
Sheesh, WTF do these judges think “On High” means? Just because weed is not mentioned, they assume it means “High on something other than pot”?
An ancient bong has been found near the Garden Tomb, where Jesus is believed to be buried. Sure, the “scientific experts” say that carbon dating indicates it was made in a high school pottery class circa 1972, but creation science has brought us great insight into the problems with “scientific experts” and “carbon dating”.
“Jesus was on high”. The bible says it. I believe it. That settles it.
jrg
In fact, Jesus just told me to post the above to the wrong thread.
jake
It would be, but thanks to the power of They Want 2 Kill Us (TM) overturning a few hundred years of democracy is the right thing to do.
Let’s look at how TW2KU works:
Say you have a bunch of guys and you think they’re bad guys or they look like bad guys or have names like bad guys. Anyway, you’re not sure about these guys. Normally, it would be evil to grab them, haul them off to prison, torture them and then just keep them there forever because unlike the common or garden child molestor, you’re too much a chicken shit to let them go for fear they’ll tell someone what you did.
But add a few drops of TW2KU and volia! You’re not shitting on democracy, you’re defending Lady Libery from ravening hordes of Islamofascistgayenviromentalist!
Works great on those pesky blood stains too.
timeisart
The way to Joe American’s heart is through his stuffed wallet. Joe is still shuffling along in an economy enhanced by stagnating wages and ruthless cuts in personnel and benefits. The jumped up economy is the insidious hole card in the Bush/Cheney rigged poker game because as long as Joe American can pay his bills and buy his beer, hey, things aren’t too bad, are they? Guess what is waiting for the new Democrat president (if we aren’t forced to keep our old Republican one)? An economic collapse, of course. When Joe American can’t pay his bills and buy his beer, he will scream for how it was a couple years ago when whats his name was in power. Wasn’t he a Republican?