CNN says that Paul Manafort was wiretapped through the past couple of years under suspicion for his ties to Russia.
The warrants for the wiretaps were obtained through the secret FISA court. One seems to have started in 2014 and ended last year, under concerns about work done by a group of Washington consulting firms for Ukraine’s former ruling party. Then another warrant was obtained that extended into this year, part of the FBI’s efforts to investigate ties between Trump campaign associates and suspected Russian operatives.
Unfortunately,
The FBI wasn’t listening in June 2016, the sources said, when Donald Trump Jr. led a meeting that included Manafort, then campaign chairman, and Jared Kushner, the President’s son-in-law, with a Russian lawyer who had promised negative information on Hillary Clinton.
The anonymous sources are mentioned so many times in this article that I wonder if the reporters have some reservations about them.
Meanwhile, the New York Times was composing a piece about the fearsome tactics of Robert Mueller. That article starts out with the FBI raid on Manafort’s home. Not much new about that, except
The special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, then followed the house search with a warning: His prosecutors told Mr. Manafort they planned to indict him, said two people close to the investigation.
The rest of the article is about Mueller’s aggressive tactics, which is interesting, but I have to wonder why the Times put this into an article. It’s background more than news, which is helpful. It’s possible that someone behind the scenes, not necessarily at the Times, thought it was time for a warning.
BlueDWarrior
I’m not sure any ‘normal’ outlet is going to get info on the precise timing of when any listening happened, unless the leakers-that-be in the NatSec arms of the Government were trying to steer public opinion.
It’s just my gut feeling that the community knew the contours of what Manafort was doing, but may or may not have any specific, actionable bits of info – at least to date. We will see what we see after while though.
schrodingers_cat
Vichy Times is the Pravda for the Trumpian regime, that’s why. What does head cheerleader Haberman have to say?
MomSense
Holy shit, CNN is also reporting that Manafort was being wiretapped since 2014 and captured conversations with trump.
I want them all in shackles and orange jumpsuits. Treasonous bastards.
TenguPhule
FTNYT is fluffing Trump.
And spiking Mueller.
Traitors galore.
TenguPhule
@MomSense:
Not enough coincidences in the world.
Patricia Kayden
But but but I thought we were told that if Secretary Clinton was elected, she would be under constant FBI investigation. What has happened?
TenguPhule
Trump says he wants a massive military parade down Pennsylvania Avenue on July 4
Not only no, but fuck no.
This is not normal.
HumboldtBlue
Man this shit is depressing. This is better.
Cheryl Rofer
@TenguPhule: Seems more like a warning to the Trumpies that shit is getting serious and that people might think about coming to talk to the friendly folks in Mueller’s office. There was a helpful article at Lawfare a week or two ago explaining how leaks work, and from what was said there, I would not expect leaks to be coming from Mueller’s shop, also that Mueller and his people seem to be the ultimate professionals. Maybe someone caught up in the investigation warning his brothers in omerta that these guys really mean business? Maybe the article didn’t contain everything it might because the Times wanted to compete with the CNN scoop?
different-church-lady
@TenguPhule: Two words someone ought to make him aware of: Anwar Sadat.
TaMara (HFG)
Is anyone else getting the blaring video ads running constantly. So tired of getting screamed at before I can find the mute function at the top of the tab.
Trentrunner
Just dropping in for the obligatory:
If you’re hoping Mueller will somehow save us from Trump, you’re in for more 11/8-level disappointment.
Only we can save ourselves, by taking back the House and then winning the Presidency and Senate.
JPL
Donald doesn’t even know who he is. He only saw him once.
efgoldman
@Cheryl Rofer:
Take a company each of Army, Marines, Air Force and Navy, bring out one of the bands, and have them march around and around the block. He wouldn’t know the difference
BlueDWarrior
@TenguPhule: Of course it isn’t. Trump and his fanbois and gurls want to live in a twisted fantasyland where America has a benevolent dictator that always makes the correct decisions (because he is the one making them), and grossly jingoistic military parades are one of the hallmarks of a despotic regime.
These people won’t be happy until Big Daddy is whipping all the bad little boys and girls, including themselves.
And I’ve said it in other contexts, there are hardworking doms out there that will let them get this out of their system without it affecting the rest of us.
different-church-lady
@BlueDWarrior:
You sure about the benevolent part?
HumboldtBlue
Aaaaaand moderation. I come by for the first time in weeks without having called, no letter or note, throw out some cusses and a solid fucking link to good music and this is what I get.
I see how y’all are.
BlueDWarrior
@different-church-lady: … fair point. I think some of them wouldn’t mind living under an Idi Amin, so long as they were white and tossing the chosen minority du jour into the nearest body of water you could easily drown someone in.
Yeah I really shouldn’t put anything past a lot of them…
TenguPhule
@Cheryl Rofer:
I would like for this to be true.
But the FYNYT past behavior counts against them for a lot.
TenguPhule
@TaMara (HFG):
Yes, Alain said he was going to swap it out with these big ugly ads up top instead.
He lied to us. Now we have both.
Villago Delenda Est
@HumboldtBlue: Just FYWP being FYWP.
p.a.
The gang that couldn’t cop straight.
gbbalto
OT but please think good thoughts for Betty in Dominica and everyone else in the Leeward Islands, USVI, and Puerto Rico. The eye of Cat 4 Maria is headed directly for Dominica…160 mph winds
ETA: PR has been the staging point for much of the Irma relief and the British have been working out of St Croix… next in line for a hit.
BlueDWarrior
@TenguPhule: It’s the thing that in 30 years the Internet has still not figured out… how to make an advertisement that people would notice, but would not figuratively or literally hijack your browser.
Apparently we’re still working on it.
Cheryl Rofer
@HumboldtBlue: Liberated.
SiubhanDuinne
O/T but Maria is now a Cat 5 and only 15 miles from Dominica. Good thoughts to Betty and anyone else in, or with family/friends in the Caribbean. This lady looks nasty.
Edit: What gbbalto said @#23 except that Maria has been upgraded in the last few minutes to a 5.
Major Major Major Major
So how long until the wingnuts start screaming about Susan Rice or something?
Villago Delenda Est
@efgoldman: He wants to see tanks rolling down the street.
He’s a fucking idiot. There are no tanks around DC handy for this. There is a ceremonial 105mm Howitzer Battery attached to the Old Guard just for firing off gun salutes.
Besides, the tanks would rip up PA AV. And the surrounding streets used to get to it.
Cheryl Rofer
@TenguPhule: I like to look at things in context, not at the context as controlling things.
There’s a developing thread on Twitter that seems to agree with my interpretation. It’s from a person I regard as reliable. Here’s the start of it. I’ll condense it when he’s done.
Cheryl Rofer
@Major Major Major Major: Lol, here it is!
SiubhanDuinne
@TenguPhule:
Alain is a Republican.
gbbalto
@SiubhanDuinne: Sucks so much!
Major Major Major Major
The people on All Things Considered are talking about this healthcare bill with the tone of voice somebody might use to describe the rules for an exciting new sport. Gross.
JPL
@gbbalto: I saw that earlier, and hopefully we will hear from her soon. The devastation caused by Irma is awful, and Maria seems to attack the rest.
Cacti
So, who flips first?
Flynn or Manafort?
MomSense
@HumboldtBlue:
Nice. Haven’t heard that song in a while. It’s like an old friend.
SiubhanDuinne
@Villago Delenda Est:
I believe, but am too lazy to go check it out, that he wanted a great military parade for his inauguration, and was told that Pennsylvania Avenue (and all other streets in DC) would be unable to deal with the weight of the tanks. Not sure why he thinks that will have changed by next July.
MomSense
@gbbalto:
Sending her all my best thoughts.
Omnes Omnibus
@SiubhanDuinne: Infrastructure! You will be so happy!
SiubhanDuinne
@efgoldman:
I want to hear the Marine Band play “You Can’t Always Get What You Want.”
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@TenguPhule: Oh goody. I’m sure Putin would just delight in seeing the US engage in stupid military parades like the old USSR did before it collapsed. Depending on what they use, the equipment would probably destroy the street. Pennsylvania Avenue is not Red Square.
SiubhanDuinne
@Omnes Omnibus:
I am so happy, my head is spinning! This is the happiest anyone has ever been in the history of the world! I am sick of being happy!
Roger Moore
@SiubhanDuinne:
No reason to think he remembers that far back, especially when it involves remembering something he doesn’t want to accept.
Villago Delenda Est
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: Also, too, this is something that more or less is a staple of authoritarian/totalitarian regimes. Which is why we don’t do this shit.
p.a.
@SiubhanDuinne:
Helium balloons. It’s a PARADE!
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Major Major Major Major:
I listen to them a few times in the morning on my way to classes in the car. Whenever discussing anything Trump related the host and the reporter/guest always have this giggly/amused quality to their voices that disgusts me. It’s like a total disconnect with how these policies will affect real people, here and abroad.
chris
@HumboldtBlue: First tune I ever heard on stereo headphones. Thanks for the memory.
Major Major Major Major
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: I get the local KQED news in the morning and they’re completely disgusted by trump.
SiubhanDuinne
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
And Washington, D.C. is not Pyongyang. (At this point, I think he may be more interested in a dick-measuring competition with Kim Jong Un than with waving it in Putin’s general direction.)
trollhattan
@Villago Delenda Est:
IIRC he wanted heavy armor, Soviet-style, down Pennsylvania on inauguration day and was informed the roads can’t take the weight. But in the meantime he’s been at the wheel of a semi and a fire truck and goddamnit, he’s getting his fvcking military parade! I would grudgingly approve if it meant popping his floof-helmeted head out the hatch of an M1 for all the world to see. Worked great for President Dukakis.
SiubhanDuinne
@p.a.:
I want him to inhale great huge hits of helium tomorrow just before he addresses the U.N.
Wouldn’t that be awesome??
Ohio Mom
@SiubhanDuinne: I’d bet on um, age-related forgetfulness.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@SiubhanDuinne:
But seriously, I’m ignorant about Bastille Day. What’s the difference with what France does?
different-church-lady
@SiubhanDuinne:
…yet.
Feebog
@Cacti:
Manafort.
Timurid
@SiubhanDuinne:
They could tell him no while it was being planned because he was still Citizen Trump.
SiubhanDuinne
@trollhattan:
“Vroooom! Vroooom! Vroooom!! I can go ANYWHERE I WANT!!!”
SiubhanDuinne
@different-church-lady:
Well-taken, your point.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@SiubhanDuinne:
Also, a better equivalent to Red Square would be the National Mall
Thoughtful David
@BlueDWarrior:
I always liked this construction, because in Portuguese “boi” is an ox (e.g, usually a castrated adult male bovine). Thus it has a double meaning: “fan-boy” and “fan-ox.”
Although, to be fair, in Portuguese it would probably be better spelled “fãboi” (I’m not kidding), would mean “fan-ox”, but would be pronounced “fanboy”.
p.a.
@SiubhanDuinne: Little hands, little voice, little —-…
Thoughtful David
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: I’ve said it before: FTFNPR
SiubhanDuinne
@Timurid:
In a sick kind of way, there’s something rather wonderful about the thought that he gives an Executive Order (against all advice) to hold a giant military parade along PA Ave, the weight of all the heavy artillery crumbles the pavement to shreds, great huge sinkholes open up and swallow the tanks, the Combined Military Bands play “Nearer, my God, to Thee….”
different-church-lady
@HumboldtBlue: They stand there.
They just stand there.
WHAT DO THEY WANT?
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@SiubhanDuinne:
And imagine if Trump, in his capacity as “C-I-C” decides to ride in the lead tank and falls out into a massive sink hole?
Paging Mike Pence…
Omnes Omnibus
@SiubhanDuinne: Oddly, artillery folks would find tanks falling into sink holes a little bit amusing as well.
efgoldman
@Villago Delenda Est:
Yeah, but think what could happen if an Abrams had a steering failure and just happened to take out the reviewing stand….
TenguPhule
@Roger Moore:
This is sadly true.
Adam L Silverman
@TenguPhule: It also isn’t going to happen. The same problem that prevented it from happening at the inauguration is what will prevent it any other time: the DC streets will not hold up under the type of military equipment that the President wants as part of the parade. This will die in the planning stages.
TenguPhule
@efgoldman:
Wasn’t that the climax of Animal House?
TenguPhule
@Adam L Silverman:
It shouldn’t even make it to the planning stages in the first place.
I can’t believe we’ve fallen so far, so fast.
Adam L Silverman
@different-church-lady: Always amazing that Mubarak knew just when to kneel down and look for his contact lens. Even though he didn’t wear contacts.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@efgoldman:
I’d pay good money to watch Trump, Pence and most of the cabinet getting run over by a 68 tonne tank. And nothing of any value would be lost.
efgoldman
@SiubhanDuinne:
He doesn’t remember what he said, or what somebody said to him, yesterday. Why should he remember what somebody told him in January?
Lefthanded compliment
@SiubhanDuinne: Totally OT, but you mentioned some time back that your younger sister was a classmate of Judy Jacklin’s. So was I (Wheaton Central High, class of ’69), and I’d be interested in comparing notes about that dry old town. BTW, were you a classmate of Judge Woodward’s nosy kid Bob, or was he a year behind you? My email address is (redacted by Adam. I’ll forward it directly to SD for her to follow up. This way you don’t have to worry about having your email posted publicly here.)
chopper
@MomSense:
I don’t assume this is gonna lead to perpwalks but it still warms my cockles.
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
Hey now, there’s no need to insult the Red Square like that.
Adam L Silverman
@TenguPhule: Let me clarify: the President will be told it died in planning because the streets can’t handle it. In reality it won’t get that far.
MJS
@efgoldman: Ramming speed!
Major Major Major Major
@SiubhanDuinne: hopefully he plays in another big truck soon since it tends to co-occur with the failure of Obamacare repeal
SiubhanDuinne
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
You raise an interesting question, to which I do not know the answer. But I suspect it has a lot to do with the fact that in France there is a cultural component to the Bastille Day parades (cultural in both senses of the word — artistic/musical, and drawing on France’s rich history).
(Wikipedia.)
We simply don’t have that in the U.S. I mean, yeah, we have parades with bands and balloons and Boy Scouts and Shriners and all, but we don’t have any tradition of rolling out the tanks, or thousands of goose-stepping troops.
I’m not saying that French troops goose-step, just, our traditionions are peculiar to us, and it is very wrong of Trump to suggest the we adopt/adapt another country’s military ceremonials. Yet another example, as if we really needed one, showing how completely tone-deaf and out of touch he is with the cultural heritage of the country he supposedly leads.
TenguPhule
@Adam L Silverman:
Please make it so.
lamh36
No Drought No More
“The FBI wasn’t listening in June 2016, the sources said, when Donald Trump Jr. led a meeting that included Manafort, then campaign chairman, and Jared Kushner, the President’s son-in-law, with a Russian lawyer who had promised negative information on Hillary Clinton”.
That’s got a Rosemary ’17 minute stretch’ Woods ring to it, doesn’t it?
Recall that CIA operatives drawing their salaries courtesy of U.S. taxpayer dollars admittedly destroyed incriminating evidence concerning the agency’s torture of helpless individuals, and neither congress or the courts did a goddamn thing about it.
Adam L Silverman
@Lefthanded compliment: I redacted your email address and have forwarded it directly to SD. This way (one of) your contact information isn’t sitting out in public.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@TenguPhule: @MJS: /very Slovenian accent/: “you can take your thumb out of my ass any time now, Mike”
Jay Noble
Crap. There is some fairly recent precedent. At least HW was welcoming them home
CSPAN has it on tape
Lefthanded compliment
@Adam L Silverman: Thanks. I’m glad that Irma wasn’t worse for you and Betty. I went to college at Eckerd, and have friends in the area.
Timurid
@lamh36: There’s a lot of privacy to be found in a country with no extradition treaty…
Jay Noble
@TenguPhule: RAMMMING SPEED!!!
Adam L Silverman
@Lefthanded compliment: No worries. I’m just a wee bit OCD about posting personally identifying information where it can be easily found.
Villago Delenda Est
@lamh36: This is stupid.
But it’s Junior. Stupid like dad. Probably has his own private goons, anyway.
joel hanes
Cheryl Rofer
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: Russia still does stupid military parades through Red Square, particularly on Victory Day.
Davebo
@Villago Delenda Est:
They explained that to him when he wanted the same thing for his inauguration but Trump has the memory of a fruit fly and everyone in the WH is terrified to remind him.
ThresherK
@TenguPhule: A quick trip to Disney and their Main Street Parade ought to distract him well enough.
We’d end up with some licensing problems, but just replace Mickey with Foxy or. Oswald and the costs will come down significantly.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@lamh36:
Insert tasteless joke here
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Cheryl Rofer:
Putin still has delusions of bringing the USSR back. Not gonna happen, even if the US were to collapse like the SU did tomorrow.
Shana
@Patricia Kayden: It’s all projection with this crew.
Adam L Silverman
@Cheryl Rofer: Who doesn’t?
chopper
@SiubhanDuinne:
oh dang. Betty I hope you’re safe. fuck this.
Ruckus
@SiubhanDuinne:
Are you forgetting that was farther back than yesterday? Which seems to be the limit to drumpf’s memory.
Yeah there doesn’t seem to be a lot to worry about destroying the city streets or paying millions to bring the tanks and so on to DC in the first place if he can’t remember that he wanted something stupid in 9 1/2 months.
joel hanes
@SiubhanDuinne:
drill shows
The Top Secret Drump Corps, of Basel [fullscreen recommended]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HW3QVLlK-kE
p.a.
@Jay Noble: Remain calm. ALL IS WELLLllllllll…
Fair Economist
@SiubhanDuinne:
He can’t remember that he has come into a room to do a signing ceremony. You think he can remember infrastructure information from 8 months back?
Corner Stone
@joel hanes: RAMMING SPEED!!
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Fair Economist: Or remember who his wife is too
chopper
@lamh36:
that’s brilliant. so now any old schmuck can kidnap the president’s kid. then again, given how trump treats his sons, it wouldn’t matter either way. now, if they got their hands on ivanka, the “fuckable” one…
Roger Moore
@Davebo:
I think it’s less a generically bad memory and more a selectively bad memory for things he doesn’t want to remember. Tell him something bad about Hillary, and he’ll never forget it. Tell him he can’t do what he wants, and he’ll forget what you told him in 5 minutes.
Origuy
@joel hanes: I saw the Top Secret Drum Corps at the Edinburgh Tattoo in their first performance, in 2003. They’re amazing.
TenguPhule
@chopper: He still has private body guards.
Roger Moore
@chopper:
I’m sure he’s more worried about having snoops around who might hear his secret discussions with the wrong people. Also too, who might arrest him if/when indictments start being issued.
gene108
@TenguPhule:
I can’t believe we haven’t fallen farther.
All three branches of government are in the hands of Republicans.
They should be able to do what they want, but so far have not.
TenguPhule
@Corner Stone: Toga Toga!
Corner Stone
That was a crazy two play series in the MNF game.
lamh36
I’m cynical, pessimistic and or realistic enough to know this is a def probability
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
As man, Stanislav Petrov died. One of the few people who can claim saved the world.
Keith Earle
@SiubhanDuinne: The pavement will also be less rigid in July vis-a-vis January.
Corner Stone
This is an entertaining, if sloppy, MNF game.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@lamh36:
Hopefully he’ll be in late-stage dementia and have poorly paid STNA’s picking dingleberries out of his ass by then
Wapiti
@Omnes Omnibus: One of the first jobs the engineers had in Panama after the invasion settled was excavating a tank or two that the airborne dropped into a swamp. Not quite a sinkhole, but the tanks weren’t moving on their own, and they were too deep to just winch out.
James Powell
@Trentrunner:
Totally agree. No disrespect to the many fine people who are following this story and reporting here. I am glad to be informed of it – most days anyway. But the proceedings with Mueller are starting to remind of DailyKos diaries with BREAKING! in the title that promised this latest revelation – at long and dear last – was going to blow the lid off the Bush/Cheney Junta and their phony wars.
Jeffro
It’s almost like…like someone said…that there would be indictments coming in late September. I’m trying to remember who that guy was…hmm…lemme get back to y’all on that…
;)
James Powell
@p.a.:
Every available agent was trying to find something anything in Hillary’s emails. You can bet on that.
Jeffro
@JPL:
Who, that Felix Sater guy? Yeah…I take Trumpov at his word about that, despite the Everest Base Camp level of evidence about them. Don’t you? LOL
We may finally be in for some comic relief folks. It’s entirely possible. Maybe. Let’s hop!
Corner Stone
@Jeffro: Jeffro Mensch?
debbie
@lamh36:
No way. What TV show would want him, knowing they’d never get more than a 27% market share?
Roger Moore
@debbie:
These days, there are plenty of people in TV who would kill their parents to get a 27% share.
TenguPhule
Fuck, Wapo just confirmed.
lamh36
rikyrah
The FBI raid on Manafort’s House – they got permission from the judge to PICK HIS LOCK. He didn’t know that they were in his house -UNTIL THEY POUNDED ON HIS BEDROOM DOOR.
TenguPhule
@lamh36:
Why the hell was she even getting that in the first place?
FUCK THESE GRIFTERS.
Major Major Major Major
@debbie: I would watch his treason trial.
TenguPhule
@rikyrah:
/Snort
Excuse me, I need to find a quiet bathroom so I can break down into hysterical laughter.
A Ghost to Most
Man, I can put up with a certain amount of skeevy ads, but the ad for PureFlix xian streaming service just made me grind my teeth.
chris
@TenguPhule: IIRC the Secret Service is broke. There will be more I think.
rikyrah
Spandan @ TPV @thepeoplesview
Stop harassing Nancy Pelosi. If you wanted a ‘clean’ Dream Act, you needed to have worked a LOT harder to elect Hillary Clinton.
2:45 PM – 18 Sep 2017
Jeffro
@Cacti:
Carter Page! Er, I mean, Manafort! Er, I mean…
Regnad Kcin
@joel hanes: and it’s all in the syndicate
Jeffro
@Adam L Silverman:
I thought he was reaching down to tie his Velcro shoelaces?
J R in WV
@Adam L Silverman:
They can lay down sheets of steel on the pavement, and cover that with a layer of something, rubber, to provide the traction tank treads wouldn’t have on bare steel. There are lots of ways to make a military parade ala Bastille Day or May Day in Red Square happen for el Presidente. But it would be wrong, and that’s why it shouldn’t happen.
You would think with his campaign manager being next to indicted Trump might suspect he could be in for trouble. That pardon power only works so far.
Jeffro
@lamh36: As long as he has to do it in an orange jumpsuit, he can “Apprentice” his aged buns off…
sm*t cl*de
GO AWAY! ‘BATIN’!
Shana
@Villago Delenda Est: But think of the privatized infrastructure money he could funnel to his friends to repair the roads! You’re just not thinking this thing through….
Jeffro
@Corner Stone: Sometimes, on rare occasions…I can read tea leaves. And see dead people. And my tea leaves tell me that Manafort and Flynn and many, many others are among those dead people.
raven
@Lefthanded compliment: I just came back from the Willowbrook Class of 67 reunion. We talked a bit about the Wheaton homeboy who ran with some of our friends.
rikyrah
Anika Noni Rose’s Patience With Cicely Tyson Is the Blackest Thing That Ever Happened This Week
Damon Young
Today 11:38am
……………………………………
trollhattan
@rikyrah:
Damn straight. Nancy SMASH is a treasure and somehow still getting things done. Anybody have a problem with that?
efgoldman
@J R in WV:
Or they can build a battalion of phony tanks out of cardboard and plywood, same way we fooled the German reconnaissance in WW2
trollhattan
@sm*t cl*de: 20 quatloos for Idiocracy ref.
Jeffro
Just for the record: Manfort = FISA warrant. Page = FISA warrant. How many others in the Trumpov campaign and/or administration?
Shouldn’t this be front page news, all day every day? I mean, I know Trumpov is nominally a Republican and therefore not subject to “Democrat Rules” (much less “Clinton Rules”) But sweet baby wiretapping jesus, this is eight steps beyond normal or explainable.
efgoldman
@trollhattan:
all the people who were yelling at her because her bill wasn’t pure enough.
raven
@efgoldman: And inflatables!
oldgold
This has to be disquieting news to anyone who spoke with Manafort since 2014.
The game just became much dicier for all the possible targets.
Major Major Major Major
@efgoldman: hey, i know those guys.
Baud
@Major Major Major Major: Explain.
Shana
@SiubhanDuinne: I like how you think.
The Pale Scot
@schrodingers_cat:
WORD
sm*t cl*de
@raven: Obligatory helium-inflatable scene.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F828xcRMDn8
Another Scott
The Rapture is Saturday, just in case you had plans:
Nice knowing you folks!!11
Cheers,
Scott.
trollhattan
@efgoldman: @Major Major Major Major:
They are hereby welcomed to the queue for receiving their dope slaps. Today only, administered by a 95-pound lobster.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@trollhattan: I saw those protests on the MSNBC, and they went to a young activist who agreed with the protestors that Dems are as big a problem as Republicans on immigration. At the end of the interview they revealed that he had been an outreach director for a presidential campaign. Guess which one?
Repatriated
@p.a.:
Alternatively, the FBI wasn’t listening, but some other Three Letter Agency was and the problem now is how to get what they heard but shouldn’t have, into evidence.
trollhattan
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: [eyeroll]
Major Major Major Major
@Baud: I’ve met Bay Area ‘progressive betters’?
And know people like the undocumented activists yelling at pelosi today with helpful slogans like “all of us or none of us”.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Fucking O’Malley.
rikyrah
Damn , she going ALL THE WAY
His Nigra Wake-up call is about to be Fierce!!
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/909905389487104003
Baud
@Major Major Major Major: I thought you meant you know those specific people.
At some point, people who want us to succeed need to stand up to the people who hate us.
Major Major Major Major
@Baud: oh but it’s so much easier to organize twitter mobs to yell at people inches away on the political spectrum!
Baud
@Another Scott:
But not Trump?
debbie
@rikyrah:
That was quite a moment.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
the GRU?
Baud
@Major Major Major Major: They’re among the haters we need to stand up to.
Repatriated
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: well, explaining how we know what the GRU heard could be a little… awkward.
Major Major Major Major
@Baud: then I’m confused by your statement. Who’s not standing up for themselves?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Repatriated: I’ve always assumed they’ll tell us as soon as it suits their purposes
J R in WV
@rikyrah:
I thought it was a good job by the younger woman, Anika Noni Rose, very caring and personal, to help Ms Tyson out. As you say, living legend. Maybe the best thing of the week, can’t speak to the blackness of it, but surely a best thing for the Emmys. And done so respectfully, too.
El Caganer
If Trump can’t get the military for his parade, maybe he can get the juggalos instead.
Villago Delenda Est
@Another Scott: Meade is yet another dipshit looking for fellow dipshits to con.
Baud
@Major Major Major Major: Dems do not stand up for Dem leaders in a conflict situation. There’s no social penalty for being an ineffective or counterproductive activist.
Repatriated
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Well, yeah.
More to the point, it might have been one of our allies, by invitation.
SiubhanDuinne
@Lefthanded compliment:
I would have to check with my sister — I may be seeing her later this week — but if I recall correctly, it was Judy Jacklin’s sister that my sister knew, not JJ herself (although she probably met her in passing, just as I met Judy’s sister Pam, I think her name was). Not sure how the Wheaton Central High connection works in. I went to Oak Park-River Forest High School all four years (1956-60). My sister, three years younger, went to OPRFHS 1959-61, then transferred to Evanston High when our mother remarried. I honestly don’t remember at this point in which town my sister palled around with Pam Jacklin, but probably Oak Park.
My brother — Joyce’s twin brother Steve — worked as a sound designer/editor in LA for years, and at some point did a film with Jim Belushi. Just to bring everything full circle :-)
(BTW, email address for you that Adam provided does not work.)
Villago Delenda Est
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Wilmer? Or Donald?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Villago Delenda Est: the former
Major Major Major Major
@Baud: gotcha.
SiubhanDuinne
O/T but Cat 5 Maria just made landfall in Dominica. Hope Betty will check in with us as soon as she is able.
Gin & Tonic
Does anyone remember a brief story about some allegedly hacked SMS messages to or from Manafort’s daughter, in which she referred to his assets as “blood money”? Why might she have called it that? Because Manafort was at least somewhat implicated in Yanukovych’s decision to allow his Berkut force to fire on protesters in the streets of Kyiv. These events happened in late February of, wait for it, 2014.
What a coincidence.
Repatriated
@Repatriated: They got the evidence to resume monitoring from somewhere…[Alcoa Yarmulke] Perhaps they wanted to make it seem as though they’d stopped looking…[/Alcoa Yarmulke]
Adam L Silverman
The man who wasn’t there makes an appearance:
Millard Filmore
@J R in WV:
That will not work. The weight of the tanks may crush any buried conduits for water, sewer, electric, steam, subway, car tunnels (an interstate goes under Pennsylvania Ave), whatever. An engineering survey must be done first, and the weight of the tank will have to be distributed among an appropriate number of wheels (like carried on a flatbed truck).
Jeffro
@El Caganer:
Can’t decide if 10,000 Juggalos marching down Pennsylvania Ave is the end of the empire or a new post-Trumpov national rebirth. I guess it decides what they decide to chant?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I’ve found this guy’s twitter feed pretty useful in all these health care dramas
Jeffro
@Adam L Silverman: Wait…isn’t that the same guy who…
different-church-lady
@Another Scott: I was wondering when this year’s rapture was.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud:
Antichrist, that’s why he wears his hair that way; covers up the 666.
Adam L Silverman
@Gin & Tonic: Yep. In the texts she claims her father has killed at least one person in Ukraine in support of Yanukovych.
http://www.businessinsider.com/paul-manafort-daughter-text-messages-ukraine-2017-3
Sab
@Another Scott: Rapture this Saturday? That should be interesting. My city is having its marathon that morning.
J R in WV
@Sab:
Rapture Marathon Slogan: You can run, but you can’t hide !!!
ETA: tune up humor… ;-)
Steve in the ATL
@Sab: do we know the time of the rapture? I was planning to watch the Georgia-Mississippi State game.
Steve in the ATL
@Adam L Silverman: he’s only killed one person? Piker.
Miss Bianca
@Another Scott: Oh, man, it’s been a while since we had an “End of the World” date, hasn’t it? At *leas* a couple of years, n’est-ce pas?
ETA: @different-church-lady: And as usual, you get there first! : )
Omnes Omnibus
@Steve in the ATL: Well, we have been told that the world was created at 9:00 am, so I would think that a certain symmetry would be appropriate. As a management attorney, do you really expect to be raptured? And the teams? They’ll likely stay behind as well. You should be fine.
Sab
@Another Scott: Rapture this Saturday? That should be interesting. My city is having its marathon that morning.@Another Scott: What Time? Steve in the ATL and I need to know.
misterpuff
@lamh36: Hard to bug out with a security detail surrounding you.
Steve in the ATL
@Omnes Omnibus: good points. Maybe the punters and a long snapper have a chance at getting raptured?
ETA: 9 am GMT? Or eastern time as New Yorkers assure me that manhattan is the center of the universe. Daylight savings time or not? This is getting complicated.
Adam L Silverman
@Jeffro: Wasn’t there. He wasn’t there. No one has ever met with him.
Omnes Omnibus
@Steve in the ATL: I wouldn’t rule it out. I fully expect to be around. I’ll miss my mom though.
ETA: The guy who calculated it out was English.
Steve in the ATL
@Omnes Omnibus: no worries–my mom will still be around to get you chicken soup from the club when you’re sick and forget to mail your birthday card
efgoldman
Matt Barnes out of the Red Sox bullpen in the 11th
He’s a human white flag.
different-church-lady
@Miss Bianca: Its a moveable Armageddon.
tobie
The afternoon thread about Ty Cobb’s and John Dowd’s lunch at the BLT Steakhouse seems like ancient history already but there’s one question that’s stuck with me all day. Cobb apparently said that McGahn had two documents in a safe to keep from Mueller. If those documents have been requested, isn’t that refusing to comply with discovery? Isn’t that a serious offense? IANAL but I imagine McGahn would have to invoke executive privilege expressly to justify withholding documents. Anyone else catch this?
Adam L Silverman
New open thread is up!
different-church-lady
@efgoldman: Single / Caught Stealing / Strikeout / Ground out
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Omnes Omnibus: Bishop Usher? or Ussher
Jeffro
@Adam L Silverman:
“All the right places and people, but nothing to be exhumed…” – imaginary Warren Zevon lyric
SiubhanDuinne
@Steve in the ATL:
GMT, according to the Beyond the Fringe fellers..
different-church-lady
Imaginary Warren Zevon would be a hell of a name for a band.
Steve in the ATL
@Adam L Silverman: that’s how it’s gonna be, huh? As soon as I show up you move to a new thread. Fine–I’ll go back to daily kos and rejoin my Wilmer bros!
Adam L Silverman
@tobie: Depending on what the documents are they may either be covered under executive privilege claims or attorney-client privilege claims. The speculation is that it may be the McGahn annotated copy of the Stephen Miller drafted justification memo for firing Comey and McGahn’s formal memo delineating why it could not be used.
different-church-lady
@Adam L Silverman: But I hadn’t wrung all the fun out of this one yet.
Adam L Silverman
@Steve in the ATL: Think of it as me providing a fresh canvas for you to paint upon.
Adam L Silverman
@different-church-lady: You don’t have to leave this one yet. Or you can hang out in both.
tobie
@Adam L Silverman: Thanks for the explanation. There are so many angles to this. Mcgann is not Trump’s personal attorney–but counsel to the Office of the President–so it’s hard to say where attorney/client privilege begins and ends in this case.
different-church-lady
Fun fact: 57 of the Red Sox 143 games so far this season have gone 15 innings or more.
Steve in the ATL
@Adam L Silverman: would love to sully that thread as well but I have an early flight tomorrow. Can’t wait to breathe that fresh Rocky Mountain air! Or what’s left of it that gets piped into a law firm conference room in downtown Denver.
Adam L Silverman
@tobie: Correct, he’s the White House Counsel. Cobb is the inside the White House (as in on the government payroll) attorney hired to handle the inquiries from the Special Counsel’s office and the Congressional investigators so that McGahn can do his job. Dowd is the outside counsel/personal attorney for the President on these matters. So Dowd represents the President because McGahn cannot (and should not) in a criminal investigation. Cobb is, essentially, the liaison officer.
Mai.naem.mobile
I remember reading somewhere(it was a legit source)that Carter Page had been under a FISA warrant since 2014 so it makes sense that they got Manafort during a conversation he had with Page and got a FISA warrant on him. I’m pretty sure Page and Flynn have already flipped. Also,Donny Jr probably gave up his SS protection because somebody told him how Bill Clinton’s SS detail had to testify in front of Congress during the Monica deal. I figure Manafort,Flynn,Kushner and Donny Jr. will be doing some time in the Big House and I ain’t talking Mar A Lago. I hope they all go broke. The whole lot of grifters .
Omnes Omnibus
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I misremembered the time. Probably because I recently watched Inherit the Wind and it was 9:00 am there. My apologies to all whose lives were affected by my error.
Adam L Silverman
@Mai.naem.mobile: No, the reporting was very clear that the FISA approval for Manafort started as a result of the work he was doing in Ukraine. And included the constellation of US campaign consultants and political strategists doing work for Yanukovych and his Party of Regions. You may now speculate if Tad Devine was also subject to FISA approved surveillance.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Omnes Omnibus: Heh– that’s where I got Usher’s name, from Matthew Brady. I never knew who he was until this “internet” thing came along.
Gin & Tonic
@Mai.naem.mobile:
No it doesn’t. Page is a) a nutjob and b) small potatoes. Paul Fucking Manafort has real skeletons in his closet. Lots of them. If the IC *hadn’t* gotten a FISA warrant on him after the events of February, 2014, they’d have been grossly negligent.
Millard Filmore
@Adam L Silverman:
Dang! How do you keep up with all this stuff … AND have a day job?
Adam L Silverman
@Millard Filmore: I read very quickly. And I’ve been able, for various reasons, to work on research projects for my boss from home for a while now. So I get to structure my time how I want.
jmw
@Cheryl Rofer:
Not defending current Russian regime but if we had a national trauma that close in memory I imagine we would have parades every 6 months.
J R in WV
@Millard Filmore:
Have you never driven in a construction zone? They lay down 1/2 inch or 3/4 inch plates of steel over vast openings, and drive 100 ton coal trucks over those giant holes, no problems. You might to calculate how big and thick a sheet of steel is needed, and how many sheets, but I suspect that would be all the engineering needed. The issue is the tracks on the pavement, not the weight alone, and steel plates solves the tread chewing the pavement issue totally. In WV coal trucks weigh up to 125 tons… ~35 tons heavier than a main battle tank, I suspect.
If you also unload the ammo, short the fuel, you lighten up that big guy quite a bit.
Pounds per square inch, spread over the comparatively vast size of a highway hole covering sheet of steel, would be easy to calculate and to manage. They do drive heavy concrete trucks around downtown DC after all. Two side-by-side sheets 8 feet wide, however long required to make the pounds/inch adequate. I’ma not gonna do the math, because I don’t care to. Disprove my hypothesis with math if you want to.
Obviously they would need to start now to get it done by next July 4th. A lot of work to be canceled if Trump is arrested/indicted/impeached…
I don’t think we have many big ICBM rockets on wheeled trailers, but it would be easy to fake, the Red Square folks do it all the time.
Adam L Silverman
@Millard Filmore: Give this entire thread a read:
RobNYNY
@tobie: My understanding is that all of Mueller’s requests to the White House have been informal, without the force of law.
burnspbesq
I’d love to see the affidavit that the FBI presented to the magistrate in order to get permission to run a no-knock service of the Manafort search warrant.
That was the juiciest detail in the Times story: they picked the lock on his front door and invited themselves in to serve the warrant.
burnspbesq
@RobNYNY:
It will only stay that was as long as he gets full cooperation.
Another Scott
@J R in WV: Around the 7 minute mark in GHWB’s 1991 Gulf War Victory Parade in DC there’s a tank rolling down the road. There was some APC or rocket launch system or something on tracks a few minutes before as well.
They could run tanks and stuff down DC if Donnie insists. I think Donnie had his chance, though.
FWIW.
Cheers,
Scott.
Omnes Omnibus
@Another Scott: That was an artillery piece. Guns are much lighter than tanks. Also, it was only one gun; A battalion of guns would have torn up the street.
Omnes Omnibus
@Another Scott: @Omnes Omnibus: If you don’t know what you are talking about, you shouldn’t really make a call. With military things, being able to tell the difference between a self propelled howitzer, an armored personnel carrier, and a MBT is a marker.
frosty
@J R in WV: Agreed, I was thinikng PSI too. If you want a tank to go across bare ground, the treads had better spread the weight out enough that it could handle a city street without crushing the utilities underneath. My guess is that the surface pavement layer would be the only problem.
But hell, I’m not a highway engineer.
Another Scott
@Omnes Omnibus: meh. ;-) Other contemporaneous reports said there were “tanks” in the parade. I didn’t have time to watch the whole thing to see if M1A2s were there or not, so I just thought I’d give some time stamps for others who wanted to look through it.
I know this stuff is near and dear to your heart, but lighten up.
Cheers,
Scott.
1stgengirl
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: Do you often have morning classes in your car?
bjacques
C’mon! Missiles! Lots of missiles on flatbeds! We’re talking Trump here. You can make those out of sheet aluminum tubing, spray-paint them olive-drab and scribble some numbers on them. Make the parade a kid’s idea of what an army looks like. Trump will never know the difference.
Zach
People who are in Mueller’s sights (Manafort) are leaking exactly the kinda stuff that they think might push Trump over the edge into Saturday night massacre territory… which would probably result in Trump’s impeachment and a pardon for all involved so that America can move on or whatever.
Specifically: leaking that Manafort was wire tapped and that he was talking to Trump… feeds right into Trump’s paranoia that he’s under surveillance personally and that deep state is operating without keeping him in the loop.
If it works, today’s tweet storm should be epic.
It might explain why the tweet storm yesterday was so off the rails despite a relatively good news day for Trump (no bad news; polls modestly less horrible; markets up a bit).
Cheryl Rofer
Lawfare has a more detailed analysis of the two articles that is consistent with my post at the top. They are lawyers, though, so they can pull more information out.