Hey, remember the Fortunate Son(-in-Law)? Apparently, when he wasn’t toasting future business deals with Chinese oligarchs, he was horning in on Mike Flynn’s meetings with Ambassador Kislyak.
The NYTimes, more in sorrow than anger:
Michael T. Flynn, then Donald J. Trump’s incoming national security adviser, had a previously undisclosed meeting with the Russian ambassador in December to “establish a line of communication” between the new administration and the Russian government, the White House said on Thursday.
Jared Kushner, Mr. Trump’s son-in-law and now a senior adviser, also participated in the meeting at Trump Tower with Mr. Flynn and Sergey I. Kislyak, the Russian ambassador. But among Mr. Trump’s inner circle, it is Mr. Flynn who appears to have been the main interlocutor with the Russian envoy — the two were in contact during the campaign and the transition, Mr. Kislyak and current and former American officials have said…
The New Yorker reported this week that Mr. Kushner had met with Mr. Kislyak at Trump Tower in December. Hope Hicks, a White House spokeswoman, confirmed on Thursday that Mr. Flynn was also at the meeting in response to questions from a New York Times reporter…
What is now becoming clear is that the incoming Trump administration was simultaneously striking a conciliatory pose toward Moscow in a series of meetings and phone calls involving Mr. Kislyak.
“They generally discussed the relationship and it made sense to establish a line of communication,” Ms. Hicks said. “Jared has had meetings with many other foreign countries and representatives — as many as two dozen other foreign countries’ leaders and representatives.”…
Bonus story, here come the Trump Crime Cartel’s Rosencrantz & Guildenstern, per USA Today:
Attorney General Jeff Sessions is not the only member of President Trump’s campaign who spoke to Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak at a diplomacy conference connected to the Republican National Convention in July. At least two more members of the Trump campaign’s national security officials also spoke with Kislyak at the event, and several more Trump national security advisers were in attendance.
It’s unknown what the Trump campaign officials who spoke with the ambassador – J.D. Gordon and Carter Page – discussed with him. Those who took part in the events in Cleveland said it is not unusual for presidential campaign teams to interact with diplomats…
Hossein Khorram, an RNC delegate from Washington State who wasn’t part of Trump’s campaign, attended the diplomacy event and said it provided a forum for diplomats to share their concerns with GOP officials. After formal panel discussions, the attendees broke off into informal conversations.
“Basically the ambassadors — including the Russian ambassador — they were expressing their, mainly, fears about the war on terror and collaborating with the United States,” he said. “There was no promises made on behalf of the Trump administration.”
Sessions, Gordon, and Trump campaign national security advisory committee member Walid Phares all spoke on stage at the Global Partners in Diplomacy program on July 20 in an auditorium at Case Western Reserve University, according to the program schedule and pictures posted on social media. Current Deputy National Security Advisor KT McFarland was also present at the day’s sessions…
“Nice little party ya got here — be a shame if something were to happen to it.”
THANKS, REPUBLICANS!
rikyrah
drip drip drip
little by little
Jerzy Russian
For the record, I have had no contacts with the Russian or any other country’s ambassador. It seems like I am the only one who can claim that.
Baud
Sergey is a bit of a slut.
XTPD
Probably Kushner’s greatest crime was running the New York Observer into the center of the Earth.
Percysowner
Donald Trump Jr. was paid $50,000 for meeting to discuss U.S.-Russia cooperation in Syria. Well at least Russia bought him cheap.
rikyrah
why hide the visit?
why not parade him like everyone else at Trump Tower?
Uh huh
Uh huh
efgoldman
Drip
Trickle
Faucet
Niagara Falls
Gravenstone
O/T (but still Trump-centric) but I saw several headlines this morning about Trump considering “direct military action” against the NK nuclear program. Choosing not to link directly as the three headlines currently showing are of sketchy veracity (CNBC, BI and NY Post *shudder*)
Still, if that’s even remotely accurate, no way that could go wrong. =P
amk
lovely family. lovely cabinet picks. lovely job done, murkan voters.
japa21
Does Kushner even have an official title within the government? Who provides him written authority to speak for the US? Does he have a security clearance? Is it even legal for him to be doing this.
jayboat
WTF FBI???
Major Major Major Major
There a thing going around the intertrons that’s Carrie from Sex & The City at her laptop musing, with the caption, “and I started to wonder–was the Russian ambassador seeing everybody but me?”
GregB
Russia isn’t sending us their finest.
Davis X. Machina
@Gravenstone: He’s going to run out of alternatives to ‘rally ’round the flag, boys’ sooner or later. Given the present clip with which he’s burning through the ordinary distraction tools presidents have at their disposal, it’s going to be sooner rather than later.
Sorry, Seoul — you’re boned.
zhena gogolia
@Major Major Major Major:
But she got Baryshnikov.
Major Major Major Major
@zhena gogolia: didn’t he hit her?
zhena gogolia
@Major Major Major Major:
Really? I missed that episode.
Corner Stone
@Jerzy Russian: Your last name is “Russian” fer crikey’s sake!
Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.)
They’re all in a tub of Russians up to their ears. They’re going to drown. The only thing we don’t yet know is which ones will turn on the others and how soon.
japa21
We all know the Benghazi folderol and the email scandals were much ado about nothing, but there was some degree of material out there to justify an initial look see, but not enough to go to the extent the GOP did. There is 20X as much material here to have several deep investigations going on, but all we have so far are some little gestures by the GOP, the size of which is comparable to Trump’s hands or other parts.
Gravenstone
@Davis X. Machina:
Pretty much. One of the managers at work spent his teen years living as a military dependent near the DMZ. He said it was common knowledge that NK has enough tube artillery in range of Seoul to basically level the city in a matter of hours. I always thought that had to be a really bizarre background to grow up in.
Major Major Major Major
@zhena gogolia: I think it’s why they broke up. Ages ago though.
@Gravenstone: yep. Millions of deaths in a day or two. Clever situation on NK’s part of course.
ETA: I had a couch surfing acquaintance visiting from Seoul last summer and she was really excited to be in the US and play Pokémon Go. They didn’t have it there because NK jams their GPS.
mai naem mobile
I force myself to listen to Gary Kaltbaum on the radio during the week just to see what the other side is thinking. He’s an FBN guy. Even he tonight was taking a wait and see attitube towards Sessions. He,of course, slammed the media on how they kissed Obamas ass. He usually defends the Trumpers so it was telling today.
Adam L Silverman
@Gravenstone: So I’ve read the reporting on that, specifically the Independent’s. Apparently a National Security Council review was requested for all options pertaining to recent North Korean/Kim government actions/aggression. Including the missile tests. The reporting indicates that a meeting of the Deputies Committee was chaired by KT McFarland, who is the Deputy National Security Advisor. My understanding of what I read is that they’re doing a full top to bottom scrub on possible responses to/action in regard to North Korea. What will happen is that the folks working the East Asia Desk at NSC, and more specifically those working North and South Korea, will pull in everything from the Intel Community, State, Defense, Treasury, Agriculture, Energy, and anyone else from the Interagency that has something to contribute. They will then produce a policy proposal. This will have a short (1-3 paragraph) review of existing policy and the history of the issue at hand with a reference to a much longer annex. Then there will be, usually 3 policy proposals, but sometimes 4 or 2 depending on the issue (occasionally even more). One of these will be status quo – no policy change. One is usually a middle ground adjustment and one is usually a major change. This will include a FAS (feasible, acceptable, suitable) assessment of each option and then conclude with a recommendation of which one to go with and a justification for why it is the most feasible, acceptable, and suitable. Total length of the base document, not counting annexes with supplementary information, should be no more than 5 pages. This will then be staffed back through the Interagency for comments, revisions will be made based on those inputs, and the final document that emerges will then be pushed up to the Principals Committee for review. The Principals will then either accept it or send it back down to the Deputies Committee for additional revisions. Once its blessed off at the Principals level it will be distilled into the preferred briefing format for whoever is President and then briefed to him (and one day her) for a final decision. The briefing book will include the full proposal and the annexes for the President to review both before the briefing and after as he decides what to do.
Or at least this is how it is supposed to work.
Adam L Silverman
@japa21: Senior Advisor to the President.
Adam L Silverman
@Percysowner: This is not going to go away either. As, apparently, the guy who organized the thing on behalf of the Russian think tank immediately went to Moscow for debriefing as soon as the conference was over.
Bex
@zhena gogolia: It was in the series finale.
schrodingers_cat
@Major Major Major Major: Carrie was such a whiny bitch. I never liked the show, couldn’t get its appeal.
mai naem mobile
What I find disgusting is that Trump and Musher did it for money. They were already very wealthy but they just had to get more money to get even richer.
SiubhanDuinne
@Jerzy Russian:
What about Baud! ?
schrodingers_cat
@Gravenstone: International pariah status is what he seems to be aiming for. First the travel ban, now this and I am sure elebenty percent tariffs will be announced soon.
Gravenstone
@Adam L Silverman: Normally I’d be comforted to learn that it’s basically a review of the situation and update of reasonable/practical responses. But seeing KT McFarland mentioned in there tends to … temper my level of comfort.
Jeffro
@Davis X. Machina: I don’t think the military will let him drop the hammer on North Korea, at least not as a first-strike. We would be talking about millions of people dead.
Adam L Silverman
@SiubhanDuinne: He’s up to his eyeballs with the Burkina Fasons. Or is that Burkinan Fasos. Either way, you get the idea.//
Jeffro
@Adam L Silverman: i’m sorry did you say that something as long as five pages might be presented to the current president ?
dmsilev
I have to confess a connection with the Russians: Some of my great-great-grandparents emigrated from there.
Mainly to escape Tsarist-era pogroms.
Iowa Old Lady
These guys need to slow down with their corruption. I can’t keep up.
AndoChronic
As Dan Rather said, ‘The fuse is lit.’
danielx
@Gravenstone:
@Davis X. Machina:
Spoiler – if something bad happens, Trump will say it’s the South Koreans’ own fault for locating their capital 35 miles from the DMZ, and has nothing whatever to do with him running his mouth.
In 1950 the NKs took Seoul in four days. Kind of wondering how long it would take now.
Major Major Major Major
@Jeffro: the military isn’t supposed to “let” the president do things.
Mnemosyne
People were saying in the previous threads that it’s probably easiest to list the Trump figures who do not have Russian connections, but then we had trouble coming up with a list. His son Barron? Maybe Tiffany?
schrodingers_cat
Its time to fess up my Russian connections.
I know two Russians, but neither is an ambassador called Sergei. I have at least 4 matroshka dolls, a cutting board and some shot glasses with CCCP insignia.
I sometimes put a scarf around my orange kitteh’s head and call her Olga.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: Worse. Baud has been seen in the land where the Jumblies live.
Baud promised we would all go to sea in a sieve, he did. But Trump delivered!
Thru the Looking Glass...
@GregB:
And we’re clearly reciprocating…
Quid pro squat…
dmsilev
@Iowa Old Lady: Handy time-saver: They’re all corrupt.
Thru the Looking Glass...
@schrodingers_cat: I’ve used Russian dressing on my salad…
***hangs head in shame…***
I also like blintzes… and vodka…
Major Major Major Major
Clickhole had a good article today. http://www.clickhole.com/blogpost/not-america-welcomed-my-immigrant-parents-muted-xe-5655
lollipopguild
@SiubhanDuinne: Baud has been seen with Boris and Natasha.
Adam L Silverman
@Gravenstone: As long as she’s the Deputy NSA she chairs the Deputies Committee. But the more people that LTG McMaster brings in, like the announcement today that Fiona Hill from Brookings is coming on board as the Senior Eastern Europe and Russia Officer on the NSC is a good sign.
What you want is process. Process, specifically the Interagency process that the NSC oversees, is what reduces the chances of the Yemen raid. And whacked out Executive Orders. The people on the NSC – the professionals, civilian and military, from the various agencies and departments within the Interagency and the political appointees – are the ones that keep things on the straight and narrow. Process will also begin to place, and then keep, the WH SIG in a box, which will minimize the damage that those folks can do.
Davis X. Machina
@mai naem mobile: In the 70’s and 80’s I had a friend who used to take comfort in the fact that various traitors — Hansen, Boyce & Lee — had done it for money, and not out of ideological motives. (This was supposed to prove the system in the USSR was incapable of drawing converts. I used to point out that in a capitalist country, doing something just for the money is ideological.
dmsilev
@Thru the Looking Glass…: Just so long as you don’t dip the blintzes in the vodka, you’re ok.
schrodingers_cat
The question remains, will the white dwarf go supernova?
Thru the Looking Glass...
@Jeffro:
Yeah but think of the level of distraction from his Russian problems it would provide…
There’s always an upside… and an ulterior motive…
Bex
I have a kovsh.
Thru the Looking Glass...
@dmsilev: Embarrassed look accompanied by silence…
dmsilev
@Adam L Silverman:
So, basically we’ve moved from containment as grand-scale foreign policy to containment on the scale of a single building.
chris
@schrodingers_cat: Yup. Then keep deporting POCs until the pure white homeland is achieved.
Adam L Silverman
@Jeffro: It will be in the briefing book for him to review as he sees fit. Or to ignore. What he’ll get is a one pager with the options that come out of the principals committee and an explanation of why the proposed one is superior to the other ones. Everything else will be in the briefing book as background.
p.a.
“You’re very clever young man. Very clever. But it’s Russian assets all the way down.”
Lizzy L
@Adam L Silverman: The thought of KT McFarland overseeing the process to recommend policy/action on NK to the President gives me the heebie-jeebies.
efgoldman
@Gravenstone:
Huh. When my dad was there (1959-60) it was a 13-month tour, no dependents allowed.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: But, will ‘process’ ensure that a sane and honest person will be with Donny when he looks at the one pager and checks off one of the boxes? He ain’t reading no briefing books.
GregB
For the record, Russian dressing was invented in Nashua, NH and I once lived there.
That is the extent of my connections.
chris
@schrodingers_cat: Haha! Olga!
I have a Russian fur hat with hammer and sickle badge that was purchased for me at Checkpoint Charlie in Berlin. When I wear it I have an an uncontrollable urge to say, “Papers, please!”
Thru the Looking Glass...
@GregB: Well am I ever relieved to learn that..
Adam L Silverman
@dmsilev: That, and apparently based on AP reporting, Seb doesn’t have a clearance. Provided that reporting is accurate, no matter what he may say on TV, he’s not actually looking at anything of substance. Which means anything he’s recommending is based on not much at all. And I’m not surprised by this. The externally funded (by his relative by marriage) named professorship at MCU wouldn’t have required a TS clearance, let alone an SCI. Once he left that position and went back to the IWP and his side gigs at Breitbart and Fox, even if he had a Secret clearance, it would have been made inactive. But given what the WH needs to deal with on any given day, a Secret level clearance isn’t going to be of much help. Except, apparently, to read the report on Russian interference in the 2016 election.
danielx
I must confess: daughter insists that one of kitten duo to be adopted in future should be named Ivan. And there’s a couple who were Russian figure skaters living a couple of houses down from me. I’m told one can see Russia from their back yard.
Edit: and I once almost purchased a stainless steel flask with a KGB insignia on it at a gun/militaria show.
Another Scott
@schrodingers_cat: My father had a pen pal in the CCCP in the ’60s-’70s. They exchanged gifts occasionally. My dad got a watch from him (I don’t recall what my dad sent back in return, maybe a Seiko?). I remember seeing one letter where the guy had an intricate drawing of a single-blade safety razor that he was hoping for. I was shocked to see it – it looked like something out of the ’40s. I think my dad sent him one, along with a bunch of double-blade cartridges and a handle. ;-)
Cheers,
Scott.
p.a.
@chris: that’s becoming a marketable skill in the US of A.
Mai.naem.mobile
@mai naem mobile: freaking autocorrect . I meant to say Dolt 45 and Kushner not Musher.
efgoldman
@Adam L Silverman:
Isn’t she one of Mango Malignancy’s village idiots?
State? Without any of thee professionals left? Is Jared going to send a report?
Energy? Where Goodhair Perry is “in charge”?
Doug R
@dmsilev: Family on my Dad’s side fled Ukraine in the 1920s.
Adam L Silverman
@Lizzy L: She’s just chairing the meeting because she’s the Deputy NSC. My educated guess is that just about anything and everything they discuss, including, possibly, what take out to order for lunch, goes right over her head. I expect that she will eventually leave of her own accord because she is not going to be able to perform at LTG McMaster’s required level for his subordinates. I’ve seen what happens when his staff lets him down. It is not a pretty sight. There’s a colonel somewhere in the US that hasn’t sat down since early 2013.
Mai.naem.mobile
I have a friend who applied to the CIA in the 80s. He’s ethnically Ukrainian and speaks Russian. Anyhow they turned him down because he was too old. I think he said he was 30. He thinks the Ukrainians screwed up giving up their nukes.
p.a.
@Another Scott: did you know that era ‘medicine cabinets’ had a slot in the case to dispose of the blades by dropping them inside the bathroom wall?
Adam L Silverman
@jl: The National Security Advisor should be there. Whoever else is there is up to the President.
danielx
@efgoldman:
Still was in 1964. My uncle was a career master sergeant and he truly disliked the place because the North Koreans were (and are) among the craziest, most indoctrinated people in the world. Disliked it so much he decided to volunteer for Special Warfare school, thereby leaping from the proverbial frying pan right into the flames.
Mai.naem.mobile
I saw a piece somewhere(BJ maybe?) that private sector cos. are seeing unbelievably qualified applicants for their jobs because of all the people leaving federal jobs at State,DOD etc. Major brain drain from the US government. This is going to cause long long term damage.
efgoldman
@danielx:
The South Korean army is parsecs more formidable now.
Also in 1950 there were no ICBMs (land or sub-launched) that could reach NoKo in minutes.
Also, I doubt very much that the Chinese would send troops this time.
Not saying it would go terribly well for the South Koreans, but it wouldn’t be a complete walkover either.
Of course, with two narcissistic megalomaniacs facing each other 10000 miles apart, who knows.
Another Scott
@p.a.: Yup! I remember seeing labels in such old cabinets. It always seemed weird to me.
Cheers,
Scott.
Immanentize
@Adam L Silverman:
Smile.
ETA. That type of story is the only thing keeping me on the sane side of CraCra Town.
Adam L Silverman
@Mai.naem.mobile: Its the NSA specifically. There was a news article about it last week.
Adam L Silverman
@Immanentize: I’m sure there’s more than one, and from screwing up for other commanding generals. But this is the one I know of.
lgerard
@danielx:
A few years ago there was a book written by a person who had gone to NK to teach privileged teenagers, called Without You, There Is No Us.
The take away is that these young adults were like little children, incredibly naive
efgoldman
@Adam L Silverman:
What’s to prevent Citron Shitgibbon from looking at a piece of paper, then handing it across and saying “Seb, what do you think about this?”
schrodingers_cat
@Another Scott: Actually, if I count acquaintances I know >10 Russians and a few Ukranians too.
chris
Too late but… she seems nice.
From wikipedia
Immanentize
@chris: damn. Didn’t know that.
Adam L Silverman
@efgoldman: Nothing. The President has ultimate declassification authority. However, looking at a one page, bullet pointed summary isn’t going to get you very far if you want a deep understanding of what is going on.
Thru the Looking Glass...
@efgoldman:
Not to mention the hair…
Это курам на смех
@Adam L Silverman: Who knew that foreign affairs were so complicated?
Adam L Silverman
@Это курам на смех: The same folks that knew that health insurance was complicated.
Another Scott
@schrodingers_cat: My grad school adviser’s family escaped from Ukraine in the ’40s (he himself was born in Germany and grew up in Australia). He and his wife spoke Ukrainian at home. They’re amazingly devoted to their homeland even though they never lived there…
People who think Ukraine is just going to roll over for Putin and the “little green men” really have no idea what Putin’s got himself in to.
Cheers,
Scott.
Turgidson
Don’t worry everyone. Michael Tracey says Dems are being stupid for caring about any of this. We can all go home.
Lizzy L
@lgerard: Read that book. Extremely interesting.
Wag
@schrodingers_cat: And if he does, will he ignite the bloated red giant whose gravity is sucking him in?
XTPD
@schrodingers_cat: My Russian connections: I have a mostly-Russianized Ukrainian friend whose parents worked at Chernobyl (about 10 years before her time); she’s actually very apolitical.
danielx
@efgoldman:
One more reason my level of unease is well above normal at the moment….and I’ll give lord shortfingers his due, he hasn’t started executing people with antiaircraft guns. Yet, anyway.
Another Scott
@Another Scott: Also too, Russia is making noises about boycotting the Eurovision song contest hosted by Ukraine.
Cheers,
Scott.
Suffragete City elftx
So in their rush to protect Kushner these idiots forgot they had the Russian ambassador enter the back door so it would not be recorded on C-Span.
I consider them evil bastards, but my goodness what doofuses.
danielx
@Turgidson:
Oh well, that’s okay then.
Omnes Omnibus
The last vodka I had was French.
Jeffro
@Adam L Silverman: (chuckle) – that bad hmm?
TenguPhule
@danielx:
That we know of, yet.
It says something of how bad things have gotten when you can’t actually be sure its not true.
Jeffro
@Adam L Silverman: so this whole “deconstruction of the administrative state” thing is a little shortsighted, is what you’re saying?
Lol…ultimately we will be saved by their incompetence
Adam L Silverman
@Jeffro: Yes.
Adam L Silverman
@Jeffro: Yes. Its very hard to utilize the power of the government to achieve your objectives if you’ve dismantled said government because that was the first objective in order to achieve all the others.
Smedley the uncertain
@danielx: There won’t be anything left to take. If the ROK assets and ours are not in the air or on on the move before the first rounds hit Yongsan it’ll be a long up hill fight.
Smedley the uncertain
@efgoldman: Things have changed. Sponsored tours are routine. Finding quarters is another issue…
Ceci n est pas mon nym
@p.a.: My house growing up was built in 1960 and those slots were part of the medicine cabinets. And those razors were still the standard non-electric razor I remember well into the 1970s. I remember buying packs of those single-edge blades all the time, but I can’t remember why. I think because they were so common there were various utility knives built to take them.
The packaging the blades came in had the same little slot in the back of the box for disposal of used blades.
Gin & Tonic
@Another Scott:
Bingo!
Smedley the uncertain
@Gravenstone: Some 30 years ago as I was being read in as a senior civilian at a Major Army command, I made the grand tour of our sub-commands. While being briefed a Yongsan, it was pointed out that the command chair I was sitting in was a primary target of 100’s of tubes of NKDPR artillery. Our troops and the Koreans have lived with this for over half a century. And, to a later comment, accompanied tours have long been routine.
Omnes Omnibus
@Gin & Tonic: Hell, expatriate Ukrainians fighting Russians was a central thread in Frederick Forsyth’s early ’80s novel “The Devil’s Alternative.”
Gin & Tonic
@Omnes Omnibus: Don’t recall having read that one.
Omnes Omnibus
@Gin & Tonic: It’s not bad. With what I am guessing about your background, you may find it interesting.
Nelle
@Doug R: Same here – my dad was about 11 or 12 at the time.
Smedley the uncertain
@Thru the Looking Glass…: Tito’s Handmade Vodka, Austin Texas, USA USA USA
Origuy
@chris:
I have one that I bought outside Red Square, but it has a Tsarist eagle badge. The name for that type of hat is ushanka. The really expensive ones are real fur, but mine is fake fur, what the Russians call “fish fur”. Since my traveling companion is vegan, real fur was out of the question.
Gin & Tonic
@Origuy:
Protip: those hats aren’t for eating.
Omnes Omnibus
@Gin & Tonic: And love ain’t for keeping.
Origuy
@Gin & Tonic: Ever met a vegan who didn’t freak out about fur?
Adam L Silverman
@Origuy: I just want it noted in the official record that I could make a double entendre comment in regard to:
But I am not going to.
Omnes Omnibus
@Origuy: I know some, male and female, who don’t shave. Does that help?
efgoldman
@Ceci n est pas mon nym:
In the long ago lost to history days of analog recordings, they were used to cut tape for splicing out misteakss.
They’re still good for some kinds of paint scrapers.
efgoldman
@Origuy:
I still have my dad’s US Army version from Korea. Damn, it’s warm! I wore it to football games in snowstorms.
(No badge. I think the rank badge was pinned to the front.)
M. Bouffant
@efgoldman: Ah yes, the grease pencil & the editing block.
Scourge7Cs
@XTPD: De-lurking for first time since Cole had one dog to say I miss the halcyon days of the peachy-pink New York Observer like I miss H&H Bagels. A good thing gone forever. You are a person of taste, indeed.