Here’s the link to the live stream of the ongoing live stream of the call from the four holdouts at the Malheur Federal Refuge:
JJ McNaab is live tweeting this and providing commentary.
The FBI pulled their cordon and blockade in tighter earlier this afternoon (local time) after one of the four hold outs got around the previous lines of containment in an ATV and then retreated back to the refuge when the FBI tried to speak with them. As I’m listening to the live stream the FBI negotiator is continually instructing the hold outs to lay their weapons out, place their hands up, and come out peacefully. One of the hold outs, either David Fry or Sean Anderson is complaining to Franklin Graham that since the FBI won’t grant them the concession of letting Michelle Fiore escort them out, the FBI clearly can’t be trusted and want to kill them.
The whole thing is surreal and bizarre.
I’ll post updates as they come in.
——-UPDATE at 10:44 PM EST ——–
For those that are interested and curious, this is Gavin Seim who is hosting the live stream:
http://callmegav.com/
——–UPDATE at 11:00 PM EST———-
Sean Anderson just stated he thought he had the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence on his side. I cannot stress this enough: The Declaration of Independence is not a source of foundational law or governance in the US. It is a documentation of stated grievances against the acts of King George in the 1770s.
——–UPDATE at 11:24 PM———-
Here’s the link to the live updates at OPB (h/t Cheryl Rofer). OPB confirms that Cliven Bundy is on his way and has called for the militia to meet him there.
redshirt
I don’t understand the diplomacy. Are there hostages?
Villago Delenda Est
Please, oh please, Lord, grant me a wish. That Michele Fiore does something incredibly stupid with a firearm and she has to be taken out.
Bonus points if You somehow manage to get Franklin Graham involved on the ground and in the engagement area.
Adam L Silverman
@redshirt: The four hold outs and Michelle Fiore claim they are being held hostage by the FBI because they won’t let Fiore or Franklin Graham come in and escort them out and because the FBI wants them to disarm. Sandy Anderson has just stated she will not disarm and she will not go to their jail.
Mike J
These are crazy people.
“They showed up with MRAPs against four campers! “
Ella in New Mexico
Been listening for over 30 minutes and I simply cannot believe how much horse shit these people believe….
Best parts: tears of joy when they heard Michele Fiore was in Portland…
Them finally telling the screaming idiot David Fry to STFU because they couldn’t hear themselves think…
Them refusing to come out until the morning when Fiore can hold their hands and walk them out…
Them telling the FBI to go get Sheriff Palmer…
JPL
Fiore is such a jerk.. You have to walk out with your hands up, so how are they going to photograph.
Adam L Silverman
@Villago Delenda Est: Apparently Franklin Graham is on his away as well and has offered to escort them out tomorrow morning at 7 AM local time.
dedc79
As performance art, this is fascinating.
As reality, it is depressing as all hell.
hilzoy
Michele Fiore is actually trying to talk them down. The actual militants just sound insane. The oddest moment was when one of them said: We told the FBI that they are doing this the wrong way!
#NotAWinningStrategy
WaterGirl
Adam, I paged you at 9:28. What took you so long? :-)
Adam L Silverman
@Ella in New Mexico: Its a hermetically sealed epistemic closure feedback loop.
Cheryl Rofer
Cliven Bundy says he is on his way too.
Baud
@Adam L Silverman: We Juicers can relate!
Cheryl Rofer
A reporter on scene says she can hear helicopters.
Adam L Silverman
@hilzoy: She’s trying to talk them down within her deluded understanding of what she thinks is going on. Its frightening that Sean and Sandy Anderson are so whacked out that they make Michelle Fiore seem reasonable.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: I thought the FBI tightened the cordon to keep outsiders like Fiore from going in. Seems to me the FBI would be crazy to let an elected official in there with them, regardless of what they say they want about an escort.
But why does the FBI need to do anything else? Have they demanded the the 4 remaining loons surrender by some deadline? Any reason why the FBI can’t just talk to the crazy people until they get tired and pass out?
Baud
Called out Fox.
beltane
They are being “crucified”.
I have a perverse desired to transport these people back in time and haul them in front of the Inquisition.
Villago Delenda Est
@Adam L Silverman: Escort them out to the FBI, who will slap cuffs on these criminals and airlift them to Portland to await trial, I should think.
They should transport them via Blackhawks to Portland, and bill their families for the helo time. Do it in the daylight so at least they can enjoy the scenery, the Cascades from the air are quite a sight.
Mingobat f/k/a Karen in GA
The butthurt entitlement is strong with these crackpots. The shame of it is there are other groups out there who actually agree with them.
We mock them now, but I’m genuinely afraid the country will collapse under the weight of these yahoos’ stupidity one day.
Adam L Silverman
@WaterGirl: I had to finish up dealing with a purse snatcher in crime alley!
Seriously, I stopped at the store on the way home from the dojo for bananas. Not realizing that I could live stream some. Didn’t get home till 9:30, had to take care of the four foots, get changed, then looked to see what was happening, saw the insanity, and started the post.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Adam L Silverman: They are delusional.
Sean says “that’s why they’re giving me a felony.”
Fiore is trying to calm them down while supporting their idiotic beliefs. Sean and Fry are melting down, and beginning to squabble with one another.
CaseyL
If Michelle Fiore goes in there with them, she becomes a hostage. Ditto Franklin Graham. I don’t blame the FBI for saying no.
ETA: Not that I give a rat’s ass about what happens to Fiore or Graham, but I’m sure the hostage possibility is on the FBI’s mind.
jl
@Baud: I take pause when I remember that Baud! 2016! is our only channel to the outside world.
redshirt
@Adam L Silverman: So just participants. No human shields, no children?
I don’t understand this game. Isn’t the FBI just encouraging the next stand-off?
Ella in New Mexico
I’ve got the live feed, the Oregonian and the Bundy Ranch FB page open at the same time…we all live in totally different universes…
Cheryl Rofer
@jl: FBI has said nobody else will be allowed on the refuge until the four come out without their weapons.
Adam L Silverman
@Cheryl Rofer: Yep, that was announced last week and I covered it in the last update and in a comment in Mistermix’s post on Mount Saint Mary’s. What’s the over/under on him being arrested if he approaches the refuge tomorrow?
hilzoy
@Adam L Silverman: True. This is, um, not a general statement of support for Fiore. But at the moment, she is trying to do a good thing.
Cheryl Rofer
@efgoldman: He’s said before he’s coming, he’s not coming, he’s coming. Can’t make up his mind.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
Sean is screaming that Mark (the FBI dude, I think) needs to shut up or he’s going to push this where he doesn’t want it to go.
@hilzoy: She is indeed. But she is equally deluded even as she tries to calm them.
New Prayer – father confound the wicked … give us a place in liberty.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: The FBI is going to keep the cordon tight and can wait them out. The FBI gets to rotate their personnel every six to eight hours back to their nice, warm hotel rooms and warm food. Unless the hold outs do something really stupid or violent, or Sandy Anderson goes into labor, in which case I’d expect an effort would be made to send in EMTs to evac her to a hospital, the FBI is more than happy to let them sit there and stew in their own juices.
Cheryl Rofer
@Adam L Silverman: I have a feeling this will be over before tomorrow.
jose
This is like the worst clusterfsck of a conference call I have ever heard.
And Michelle Fiore is a terrible crisis negotiator (who knew?) – especially with the idiot host breaking in. These guys just need to give up and walk to the FBI, and I am getting more and more pessimistic that is will happen with those two on the phone stirring it up.
beltane
James Madison is facepalming in his grave.
jl
@Cheryl Rofer: But the FBI has presented no demands to the crazies at the headquarters, right? If the FBI has not, what are they so upset about? Or did they just dial their crazy up to 11 at the thought of an elected official and another Bundy coming out there and now they are fraught with disappointment and proleptic separation anxiety? Or what?
dedc79
@beltane: Sandy thinks she’s Jesus and George Washington.
chrome agnomen
all that praying they’re doing? could be that jeebus ain’t on their side!
Baud
Anyone else find Franklin Graham the most annoying of these characters?
WaterGirl
@Adam L Silverman: Just glad you are here now!
Adam L Silverman
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): If she didn’t have a track record of believing the same things and making outrageous statements, she would be undertaking an excellent negotiation strategy of trying to establish rapport and demonstrate empathy with them.
Baud
I’m impressed that they haven’t mentioned Obama yet.
Ella in New Mexico
“Ok, guys, can we just stop and say a prayer again”
Someone tell Gavin Seim God IS SENDING THEM A RESOLUTION–TO SURRENDER
Steve in the ATL
@Baud:
This alone would have gotten you my vote but alas I’m slightly older than your target demographic.
JPL
What constitution did they read? Time to pray again. Now the nation has failed bullshit.
Gin & Tonic
Who’s this Gavin Seim idiot who’s moderating the call?
beltane
@dedc79: She’s totally whacked out. This is starting to look like an attempted suicide by cop situation.
Cheryl Rofer
@jl: The FBI has told them to walk out with their hands up and no weapons. FBI continue to repeat that they should walk out.
Sounds like Mark (the negotiator) is continuing in a very persistent way to wear them down. Not clear that allowing them the outlet to Fiore isn’t interfering with that. OTOH, she does pull them down from suicide by FBI every now and then.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: Thanks for info. So, this is just the hold outs acting crazy because they thought Fiore and Bundy would come and something wonderful would happen, and now it is not and they are having a tantrum?
Sounds like nothing needs to happen unless the crazy hold outs totally melt down.
Except: “Sandy Anderson goes into labor” Oh great. She is in late preganacy? Wonderful (sarcasm alert).
PaulW
Oh, there’s a hole all right. There’s a couple of a holes and they’re ruining a federal park with their play-acting towards sedition and faux outrage.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Adam L Silverman: Agreed. And it’s actually working in this case, but that doesn’t excuse her previous idiocy.
Is it okay to say “just shoot me” yet?
Sandy keeps screaming that she is not going to jail.
The Lodger
Sandy Anderson is pregnant? Sweet Jesus.
Adam L Silverman
@efgoldman: Sorry, dropped out of that to do the update post and then over to the comments here. I would think there are decent odds. It would not surprise me to find out there is a sealed, closely held Federal charging document and warrant for his arrest from the standoff at his ranch and they have been patiently waiting for a good time and place to arrest him. It is equally likely that they don’t want to provide any additional reasons to escalate, so they’ll just tell him he can’t go in and escort him to the road. Not quite sure how to handicap this.
beltane
God just told me that these people, particularly Sandy, need to be tranquilized.
JPL
@The Lodger: She says not.
Adam L Silverman
@redshirt: As long as these four are willing to, essentially, place themselves under self arrest at the refuge and the FBI can control access to the location, they are happy to try to wait them out. They don’t want a firefight if they can avoid it. Not because the FBI will lose, but because the last thing anyone wants is a dead pregnant woman as the result of a shootout with Federal officers.
Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.)
This shit show fail parade has been going on for, what, more than a month, now? And reading about these asswipes bitching and moaning about how they can’t get anybody to guarantee that they can walk out and not get arrested, well, it just came to me in a flash that all this pitiful shit has been happening because these losers took over a fucking bird refuge. How sad is that? They took over a bird refuge, and sat there, freezing their asses off without any snacks for a month and a half. They terrorized half a county over a bird refuge, and now that they can’t go home to Mommy safe and sound without getting in trouble, they want to die in a shootout?
This is American conservatism, boiled down to its rancid essence.
WaterGirl
@beltane: My dogs want to know why I am laughing all of a sudden.
JPL
@Adam L Silverman: Do we know anything about Jeff?
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
Sandy and David are losing it again.
Adam L Silverman
@Cheryl Rofer: If it is, I’m afraid it will be suicide by Federal law enforcement officer. Sandy Anderson just whined to Fiore that they should just kill them and get them over with.
I’m wondering if it wouldn’t make sense to just pump a mood stabilizer into the air vents to calm them down.
Baud
Prayer times are like commercial breaks in this soap opera.
CaseyL
Michelle: We’re missing a prayer time, guys
Sandy Anderson: Gyuhhhh.
beltane
The FBI should just blast Taylor Swift until these people surrender. I’d give it half an hour at most.
The Thin Black Duke
Meanwhile, Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown and Tamir Rice are still dead. This ain’t fucking funny.
jl
@Cheryl Rofer: Thanks. Was that an order or a “friendly” suggestion?
My general impression is that the crazies thought some outsiders (Fiore, Bundy, who else?) would arrive and something nice would happen and some vague fantasy of no consequences would be realized and now they are upset that is not happening.
So, is the FBI making a demand with a deadline (implied or explicit), or just saying “Hey, sorry we can’t let your friends in to play, but you know what? You can surrender peacefully just like you would with your little friends, any time you want if you put down your guns.”
beltane
@Baud: They pray more times a day than Al-Qaida.
hilzoy
Hollowed be thy name, Yah!
Adam L Silverman
@Gin & Tonic: Read it and weep:
http://callmegav.com/
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@The Thin Black Duke: It sure as hell isn’t. It pisses me off beyond belief, and shames me as a US citizen.
As for Sandy’s comment, what about me? Adam hasn’t answered. /joking, mostly.
CaseyL
@beltane: Michelle is using Happy Prayer Times to try and calm everyone down.
WaterGirl
@Adam L Silverman: I was guessing that the FBI moved on this tonight because of the people who were supposedly coming tomorrow to “break them out”. Doesn’t that add to the urgency of the situation?
Adding these other 2 or 3 people to the mix only seems like it complicates the situation instead of simplifies it or at least maintains status quo.
Betsy
This is the most boring and banal conversation. It’s like a bunch of high goth teenagers sitting around trying to freak themselves out while each tries to impress each other with how much self-pity they can gin up.
JPL
@Adam L Silverman: I saw that earlier. Is Franklin still around?
CaseyL
Oh, hell, the phone battery. Please tell me they have a charger.
beltane
@CaseyL: Sort of like the Teletubbies where they gather round and say “Oooh! Big Hug.”
Gin & Tonic
@Adam L Silverman: a) They’re outdoors; b) remember the Dubrovka theater siege.
WaterGirl
@Adam L Silverman: “I’m wondering if it wouldn’t make sense to just pump a mood stabilizer into the air vents to calm them down.”
I was thinking the same thing, except that I couldn’t figure out a way to get the tranquilizers or mood stabilizers in there. :-)
Baud
@CaseyL: I was wondering if the call would drop on the way to the refuge.
Villago Delenda Est
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.): Personal responsibility is for everyone but them. They’re “sovereign citizens” don’t you know! That immunizes them from all responsibility for their actions.
Charles I tried that and lost his head over it.
Cheryl Rofer
@Adam L Silverman: I’ve been thinking about the mood stabilizer through the air vents, but then I think about the Dubrovka Theater in 2002. I’m not sure what is available for that sort of thing. But at the moment, they all seem to be losing it. It’s as if they always have to be crazier than the person they’re talking to. Fiore can’t even get them to pray.
Also, I agree that there probably are preparations to arrest Bundy, although IANAL and don’t know what those options are.
Mike in NC
Franklin Graham needs to be terminated with extreme prejudice, as he’s such an asshole extremist himself.
Adam L Silverman
@Cheryl Rofer: Sandy Anderson seems to be the real issue. She’s coming off as both the least rational and the most extreme. This is an interesting and disturbing parallel to Vicki Weaver, who was the brains behind the Weaver family.
If the FBI really wanted to wear them down, they’d set up huge speakers and blare recordings of cats in heat vocalizing all night long. Or the”meow meow” from the meow mix commercial over and over.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Betsy:
Suggested edit.
dedc79
I feel like i’m listening to four dumb christians turn into four dumb atheists in real time.
Betsy
What is wrong with these people. Whiny. Emo. ADD. Don’t know how to stop interrupting. Couldn’t organize their team of four to tear their way out of a paper bag.
No offense to ADD emo 14 year olds.
I’m surprised no one has shot them for chronic interrupting long before it came to this.
CaseyL
“God is in control of it.”
God is face-palming, actually.
Villago Delenda Est
@Adam L Silverman: All rhetoric, no substance. Typical of his airheaded lot. Haven’t bothered to think things through. Totally adhering to the stereotypes about these assclowns.
Aleta
Cliven has told the Guardian that he’s on the way
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2016/feb/11/oregon-standoff-escalates-fbi-armed-occupants-malheur-wildlife-refuge-live
gene108
Posted this in the prior thread, but Michelle Fiore is conducting a suicide intervention with 4-5 potentially suicidal people.
Cheryl Rofer
@jl: My understanding is that that was the greeting from the FBI after they positioned the vehicles. Lay down your arms and come out. Not just a friendly suggestion.
SiubhanDuinne, Annoying Scoundrel
@Cheryl Rofer:
THE HELICOPTERS ARE NOT LAUGHING.
Gin & Tonic
@Adam L Silverman: Cool, it says he’s an abolitionist. Like John Brown, right?
I decided not to subscribe to his newsletter. I guess I’ll remain uninformed.
beltane
Glenn Beck should negotiate with them.
debbie
I’m just trying to wrap my head around no showers for 40 days. Ick.
Villago Delenda Est
@CaseyL: “Geeze, guys, how can you get My words so Medamn wrong?”
The Thin Black Duke
But hey, Beyonce made some white people nervous at the Super Bowl, so “both sides do it”, y’know?
burnspbesq
@Baud:
*Raises hand.*
Adam L Silverman
@jl: Fry is on the edge of perpetual meltdown. And Sandy Anderson is working herself into a major tizzy. If she doesn’t get preeclampsia it’ll be a miracle.
And I went to a Jewish day school, a Jesuit high school, a Methodist university, have a master’s degree in comparative religion and worked on the faculty team at USAWC with the chaplain assigned as a faculty member, and deployed to a combat zone and have never heard this much prayer.
amk
doing heckuva job, F.B.I.
beltane
@gene108: Sandy Anderson is most certainly suicidal.
Villago Delenda Est
@debbie: Can be done if you’re wearing NBC protective clothing in a temperate climate, but I do not advise it.
Honus
@Baud: “most annoying” is a pretty high bar with this group. But yes.
Adam L Silverman
@PaulW: that was an unintended double entendre. I fixed it above.
Betsy
Mehhhnn come save us fellow patriots! save ussssssss! … hwhine … mwhy aren’t nthey ncoming, mommyyyy??
jl
@gene108: I stopped listening since sound here not good enough to understand much and I came in too late to follow. But you might be right.
Weird that someone like Fiore was trying to talk some sense to what sounded like completely unhinged delusional people.
Steve from Antioch
I despise every political position Michelle Fiore holds, but I have to say she is doing a hell of a job in keeping the “Patriots” calm.
debbie
@beltane:
He’d oblige, but his time is taken up trying to dissuade his listeners from voting for Trump.
Betsy
Fiore is all like “some people in New York and New Jersey are watching you” … oh, boy! I bet that really revved their engines
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
Bundy’s attorney speaking now on the live feed.
Fiore – you have 4 elected officials here.
Sandy is going off the deep end. This will not end well. Adam can they lob anesthetic canisters in there? Or is there too much risk of friendly fire with that?
Cheryl Rofer
@Adam L Silverman: Sandy Anderson is definitely a problem, although Dave Frye also breaks things up by screaming when people start to calm down.
Sandy is scared of going to jail. I almost feel sorry for her. It probably seemed like a cool adventure at first, and then got worse and worse.
Roger Moore
@Baud:
But praying in the direction of Mecca 5 times a day is a sign that you’re totally evil.
Villago Delenda Est
@Adam L Silverman: “Brains” of the Weaver family. Rabbit ears needed.
redshirt
I hope the lameness of these losers de-inspires other like minded “patriots” around the country no doubt thinking about doing something similar.
Adam L Silverman
@The Lodger: 7 months I think.
nhoj
Can the feds put HE in the roof?
AnotherBruce
I’m back from my respite from the house of crazy. What mind bending bullshit did I miss?
Baud
I’m impressed by this live streaming tech.
Cheryl Rofer
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): I keep thinking of the nonlethal options, but earlier the Final Four said that they would consider teargas as the first shot being fired, so they would then feel justified in firing back. No guarantee that flashbangs or teargas would disable them sufficiently to prevent shooting, either toward the feds or their own heads.
Betsy
You just want to tell them to shut up and call it a fucking *night*. It’s like listening to a roaring drunk at 3 a.m. who desperately needs to pass out and sleep it off. Or a toddler who keeps working himself into agony and can’t collapse as he generates more and more adrenaline.
Adam L Silverman
@JPL: Jeff Banta? He came onto the call about five minutes ago or so and spoke to Fiore. Apparently he is one of Fiore’s constituents, which is, I guess, the justification for her going to the refuge.
Mj_Oregon
@Adam L Silverman:
Sandy is NOT pregnant. The pregnant woman left the refuge before LaVoy was shot.
Baud
Oh, they just went Godwin. Not good.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: Unless Anderson’s health goes south or starts to deliver, I guess the FBI will just keep talking. Seems the best course.
Not sure what best course is if they seem ready to commit violence on themselves or take some pot shots.
What a pathetic mess these hold outs, well failed insurrectionists and pointless criminals, are.
redshirt
@Adam L Silverman:
Your words are wise as usual, but! At some point there is an emboldening factor for like minded people, and simply the authority of the law.
Many people will compare other situations and how violent the police are. No knock raids on weed dealers, shooting dogs, etc. We hear about it every day because it happens every day.
And yet these loons sit protected in their bird sanctuary.
It’s curious, the imbalance. This large discrepancy.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: I’ve heard the FBI negotiator several times very clearly and it is an order: put your weapons down, come out with your hands up.
Betsy
They’re definitely feeding on Fiore’s begging them to do things. They’re also getting off on the idea that 59K are listening. She’s playing right into their manipulations and tantrums. Get this woman off the phone. She’s just giving them grist for their emo mills.
gene108
@Betsy:
She’s doing a good job in talking these guys down. Speeding in a rental car, on the phone, being live streamed on YouTube. It isn’t easy. Forgive the less than perfect script.
Adam L Silverman
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): huh? I haven’t answered what?
Villago Delenda Est
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): Did they say what direction they’re coming from? I assume from the north of Burns, having turned off I-84 onto US 395 in Pendelton, the terrain from Pendleton to Burns is pretty rugged. Nothing like the Cascades or the Wallowlas, to the west and north, respectively, however. Also not exactly prime time for cell phone companies, who cherry pick like every other telco when it comes to facilities…heavy along the Interstate, not so much along the two lane roads in the middle of nowhere, where Burns is.
From Bend to Burns along US 20 it’s pretty flat most of the way.
Cheryl Rofer
This is the OPB updating feed.
Betsy
hwhine .. we have to walk out with our hands up and our guns down … it’s not faAAAAIIIIRrrrrrr
Roger Moore
@Adam L Silverman:
I take it Nyan Cat would violate the Geneva Convention or something?
jl
@Mj_Oregon: Good news, if that is true. Then no reason for the FBI to do anything but wait them out and talk, unless these sad and sorry crooks start any violence.
dedc79
@Baud: So that’s a crucifixion reference and a nazi reference in a ten minute span. What would make the crazy trifecta? A reference to slavery?
Baud
@dedc79: The dude mentioned being a slave.
burnspbesq
Trying to calculate the median survival time for these people in the general population of a Level 3 Federal prison, and thinking it’s pretty close to zero. They may have to be put in the Supermax for their own safety.
cdmarine
Jesus Christ, these people are insane. Bugfuck insane.
Betsy
“why do the Black folk get the ACLU and we don’t??? whinnnnne”
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
And now….A Braveheart reference! Better and better…
redshirt
@Baud: Anyone who works and is not the boss is by definition a wage slave.
CaseyL
It’ll be interesting to see how long they, and esp. Fiore, can keep talking before they go hoarse, lose their voices, and pass out where they stand.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: Well, if it takes a few days to execute the order, no harm done, in my view. even though it is infuriating. The important thing was to stop anybody, particularly an elected official or Budny from trooping in there and making a bigger mess.
dedc79
@Baud: ah, guess i missed that. The trifecta is complete, then.
Also, I love that they want more help from the ACLU.
Adam L Silverman
@WaterGirl: I think the FBI initially responded to the ATV ride outside the earlier cordon. Would they like this resolved before they have a traveling freak show and circus tomorrow? Definitely. But I don’t think they are going to do it in a kinetic/lethal manner. They are going to stay on their lines of containment, continue to issue the orders to lay down weapons and come out with their hands up. And they’ll prevent anyone from going in. I expect that Ms. Fiore and the other state legislators from Washington and elsewhere, as well as Ammon Bundy’s attorney, and Reverend Graham, and Cliven Bundy will be stopped at the turn off to the refuge and turn them away.
Wrb
The most interesting bit, for me is that this is on display the fantasy that for many people justify our lax gun laws that incidentally kill 10000 to 30000 Americans a year, depending on what you count: the guns permit people to take a stand against the state.mwhen the state owns the armored vehicals, drones and Blackhawks will it ever turn out otherwise? If not, why pay the price in lives for indulging the fantasy?
SiubhanDuinne, Annoying Scoundrel
@Adam L Silverman:
This is so perfect. I am in love with this sentence.
Baud
Man, I was about to sign off and something happened.
jl
@Betsy: And what is stopping them from calling the ACLU?
different-church-lady
@Adam L Silverman: “Do I need to count to ten? One…. two….”
redshirt
@efgoldman:
It’s like a synopsis of our domestic politics. The R’s were mostly crazy back then too, but they were civil about it for the large part. The genteel New England Republican was a well respected species for a while, now extinct, alas.
Betsy
@Baud: @redshirt: According to their school of thought, anyone who isn’t freely exercising the right to oppress others is a slave. Albion’s Seed theory.
Adam L Silverman
Sean Anderson just stated he thought he had the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence on his side. I cannot stress this enough: The Declaration of Independence is not a source of foundational law or governance in the US. It is a documentation of stated grievances against the acts of King George in the 1770s.
burnspbesq
@Villago Delenda Est:
I’ve driven that stretch of 395. Don’t think I ever lost cell reception completely, although it was one bar for most of the stretch between John Day and Burns.
scav
@Betsy: “Where’s my ACLU?” !!!!?! OK, now I’m laughing hysterically.
Adam L Silverman
@JPL: Franklin Graham? I haven’t heard him on the call in almost an hour.
jl
@Betsy: Thanks. I was not aware of that happy and very chummy ethical principle.
Adam L Silverman
@CaseyL: The bigger issue is when Fiore and company hit the dead zones in the mountains in about twenty minutes or so. When that happens I fully expect the Andersons to completely come apart at the seams.
CaseyL
“They won’t kill anyone while we’re all live-streaming.”
They will if you clowns start shooting first.
Adam L Silverman
@Gin & Tonic: That wasn’t a mood stabilizer. That was something with a very long name that makes one relieve their worst nightmare over and over for about ten hours or so.
The Thin Black Duke
@Betsy: Here comes the new Confederacy, same as the old Confederacy.
Adam L Silverman
@WaterGirl: Logistically its not possible. If I listen to much more of this, someone may need to pump a mood stabilizer in here!
Mnemosyne
@Ella in New Mexico:
“First, I sent you a boat. Then I sent you a helicopter!”
Cheryl Rofer
The FBI told them that their patriot friends have abandoned them. I was wondering when they would bring that in. It ups the psychological ante: you’re all along, only we can help you.
But Fiore says no, that’s not true. I’m not sure that’s a good thing. Some tricky psychology going on. The back and forth could disorient them and serve the FBI’s purposes too. Sandy screamed that a couple of new vehicles have appeared in another position. I take what the Final Four say with a grain of salt.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: Madison wrote that any person has the Declaration of Independence on their side, along with the rights comforts and mercy of Natural Law if they want to rebel. But not the Constitution, and good luck to them, they will need it.
Maybe someone can explain that to him.
AnotherBruce
Oh shit, as a sentient being, this really hurts to listen to. The only problem with stupidity is that it is not immediately hurtful to stupid people.
Steve from Antioch
@Villago Delenda Est:
Fiore said earlier that she was at the airport in Portand and wanted an FBI helicopter to come get her. When that was shot down, she started talking about driving there. I think that’s more than 250 miles. It will be a while.
beltane
David Brooks should be made to listen to this.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Adam L Silverman: Is is acceptable for me to beg
yet? Or is that in poor taste? I’d strive to be tasteful.
/joking, mostly
Aleta
Fiore agrees with the occupiers that the FBI negotiator Mark is being very rude, interrupting all the time.
WaterGirl
@Baud: What happened?
Adam L Silverman
@Cheryl Rofer: They are both mentally/emotionally coming apart and feeding off of each other.
Logistically there is no way to introduce a mood leveler. Moreover, I’m sure that even if there was they wouldn’t do it for fear that if something went wrong, someone had a bad reaction, the Feds would be accused of poisoning them.
Frank Wilhoit
Who was it said that publicity is the oxygen of terrorism?
Baud
@WaterGirl: They got excited because they heard some vehicles.
I’m about to give up. This could go on all night.
Adam L Silverman
@Frank Wilhoit: Mao.
jl
@Cheryl Rofer: The FBI are the experts I suppose, But if no reason to resolve this quickly, why not just string it out in as boring and placid a way as possible until they get punchy from lack of sleep and their will power gives out and they stagger out?
Seems like these crooks are so unstable, psych tricks could escalate things.
Adam L Silverman
@gene108: Amazingly enough she’s the good guy in all this. And they’re going to pray again.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
Most. Convoluted. Application. Of. Occam’s. Razor. EVER.
Mike J
CaseyL
@Baud: It’s possible Fiore will hit a phone dead spot in about 20 minutes. It’s also possible that the fool going out to light the heater will start a firefight.
Cheryl Rofer
@Adam L Silverman: Exactly.
rk
Someone posted this over at Gawker. If the media in this country wasn’t so corrupt and utterly worthless, this little segment should be played along with snippets from the Republican debates. These sad, deluded, pathetic, illiterate morons are repeating things which republican mainstream (not fringe) politicians say. Planned parenthood killing babies, our rights being taken away, getting our country back and God. These pathetic fools will either die, taking innocents with them, or in the best case scenario spend their lives in prison.
When the weasel Rubio says Barack Obama is deliberately destroying this country, or Fiorina lies about planned parenthood, this is the result.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TXxSd1AmK8
Adam L Silverman
@debbie: they most likely have the portable camping showers. If they didn’t bring a couple they were really stupid.
Nate Dawg
This farce has gone on long enough. Hope the law enforcement people stay safe.
Betsy
@gene108: Hmm. I guess if it keeps them from firing their guns, it’s plenty good enough.
Villago Delenda Est
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): I’m holding out for 300 references.
Cheryl Rofer
@jl: It’s a drip-drip-drip, to achieve the result you’re describing.
gene108
@Adam L Silverman:
I’ve had friends in crisis situations, not suicidal, but panic attacks. You can’t talk them down, without beginning to agree with some of their cray-cray principles first, because otherwise everything you tell them will just get met with resistance.
WaterGirl
@Baud: I was about to give up, too, until I read Adam’s comment that Michele will likely run into mountains and no cell service in about 20 minutes. Seems like maybe the connection with her is al that is keeping the crazies in check.
beltane
@rk: Yup. These people talk like the average ran-and-file Fox viewer. It’s only their behavior that’s more extreme.
Betsy
@jl: agree.
Baud
@WaterGirl: Yeah, I know. Decisions, decisions.
AnotherBruce
@CaseyL: @CaseyL: I have just traveled from Bend to Seattle, I can tell you they will hit dead spots. Especially when they leave Bend to Burns.
The Thin Black Duke
This is a different ending than the movie playing in their heads promised them.
delk
@Adam L Silverman: ugh—my dog is named Gav.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Villago Delenda Est:
Haven’t heard any references to Xenophon yet. Not tonight, anyway.
Adam L Silverman
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): Anything they project in would likely be perceived as incoming fire of some sort and could trigger outgoing fire from the hold outs. Moreover, there is a pregnant woman in there and I don’t think anyone wants to take a risk of putting her or her pregnancy at risk.
WaterGirl
@Baud: You can go to bed. I’ll wake you if something happens. :-)
Baud
@WaterGirl: Thanks! I’m off.
Howard Beale IV
@Cheryl Rofer: There is no vaporized benzo-what was used during the theater crises was fentanyl, but the FSB didn’t calculate the correct dosage which led to the massive deaths. I think the Feds having the layout of the place could do a much finer calculation of the necessary doage to make them loopy enough to deal with. It’s still a dangerous attempt, tho.
Cheryl Rofer
Fiore’s ETA is 1 am Pacific Time. About 8:15 right now.
Aleta
Dan Ackroid playing Jimmy Carter, talking down a phone caller on a bad trip:
(“Do you have any Allman Brothers? OK, put that on”) (IIRC)
beltane
Who is Victoria?
jl
I hope it all goes peacefully, and the failed and pathetic insurrectionists are peacefully arrested and in jail soon, and no one hurt.
If it does end peacefully, an audio record of their pathetic deluded insanity might be a good thing.
Edit: in other words. good night. Everyone have a good vigil over what I hope are boring proceedings.
Adam L Silverman
@Villago Delenda Est: Part of the reason the Weaver’s wound up on the Fed’s radar is that Vicki was sending letters to elected officials, and Federal law enforcement, that began with; “To the Servants of the Whore of Babylon in Exile” and then went on with lists of accusations and things that would happen to them. She was also the one that initially drifted into Christian Identity and then pulled her husband and family with her. If you see interviews with Randy Weaver he is clearly not very bright.
Cheryl Rofer
@Howard Beale IV: I think it was a mixture of fentanyl and something else. As Adam has been saying, law enforcement isn’t going to lob anything in. Just gotta wear them down.
Adam L Silverman
@nhoj: Helium? Do you think this would be better if they all sound like Donald Duck?
Adam L Silverman
@AnotherBruce: All of it!
Aleta
Great, they’re trying to put the 18 year old singer who was in the car when Lavoy was shot (and prob has PTSD) on the phone.
hilzoy
@rk: Don’t forget when they asked the FBI why they “allowed” Hillary Clinton to run for President. Which is an interesting view of the FBI’s legitimate authority.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Adam L Silverman: It was mostly snark as I understand there aren’t vaporizable benzos, so any anesthestic might be really dangerous. (or what Howard Beale IV said…) And the tossing thereof could result in return fire.
G*d, that crazy singer has called and may sing.
Villago Delenda Est
@Steve from Antioch: WELL over 250 miles. Try 400 on the ground.
AnotherBruce
The phone line will go down several times on this little journey.
beltane
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): There will be music?
Betsy
Han Solo blasts control console. “Boring conversation anyway.”
Going to bed.
WaterGirl
@Baud: sweet dreams.
Adam L Silverman
@Mj_Oregon: Okay, I could’ve sworn I’ve seen reporting that indicated she was pregnant as well. But if she’s not, than I stand corrected. Regardless she’s clearly disassociating.
Steve from Antioch
I wouldn’t be surprised if Fiore is being coached by the FBI. She is doing everything right and I can’t imagine she is that capable.
The FBI could cut off the cell phone connection anytime they want, so it whatever is happening it is with their consent.
Adam L Silverman
@redshirt: There usually isn’t ongoing media presence or live streaming of 4 AM no knock raids.
Steve in the ATL
@hilzoy:
They are probably wondering why they are facing charges when Hillary hasn’t even been arrested yet
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q):
How do I know nothing about this singer? Does she lean towards Ashcroft or The Shaggs?
gene108
@Steve from Antioch:
Interesting. Hadn’t thought about that angle.
Adam L Silverman
@Cheryl Rofer: Thanks I’ll put the link up top.
Villago Delenda Est
@burnspbesq: “Can you hear me now?”
redshirt
So, if I’ve learned anything from this incident, you just need to take over a not-too-important government property with no violence or hostages, but with lots of guns and snacks. And then you can have a weeks long platform for your brand of crazy.
Spread the brand!
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Adam L Silverman: So is her husband. And Fry has been gone for a bit, so I’m no longer sure he can be talked down. The closest to sane seems to be Jeff Banta, who’s been mostly quiet.
I wish they would understand the concept of “walk out without your weapons.”
Steve in the ATL
@redshirt: You forgot the most important part: be white and conservative
Adam L Silverman
@Roger Moore: Both the cats in heat vocalizing and the meow mix jingle used to create sleep deprivation do. Of course these aren’t prisoners of war, nor are the enemy combatants.
gene108
@redshirt:
Like minded weed dealers do not blow up Federal buildings as payback for the no-knock raids.
They are terrorists and the government is a bit cautious for the greater good.
Aleta
They just went around the dark side of the moon.
(Sorry to joke.)
redshirt
@Steve in the ATL: Implicit, but yeah, should have mentioned that too.
Imagine the Black Panthers holed up in a bird refuge?
Adam L Silverman
@dedc79: Sean Anderson made one about twenty minutes ago or so. So if you had those three, bingo!
Mj_Oregon
They are not in a building. They set up a camp to one side of the main administrative building and have been outside “camping” because they can say they’re just campers and not breaking any laws. There’s no way of concentrating any kind of aerosol tranquilizer where they are right now.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: I would be very, very surprised if they let anyone in. They will intercept these folks well outside the road to the refuge and we’ll see what happens as a result.
Mike J
@redshirt:
Imagine wearing the wrong hat to the Super Bowl.
Adam L Silverman
@SiubhanDuinne, Annoying Scoundrel: Glad this post and comment thread has served a useful purpose this evening.
hilzoy
@Steve from Antioch:
This is a really good point.
Aleta
This innocent claim that they’re merely camping in the outskirts of the refuge? They’re camped in the building’s driveway turnaround, using the refuge generator, propane tanks and gas cans, vehicles, firewood, cookware …
Steve in the ATL
I really need to go to bed but I can’t look away. I just opened another bottle of wine, in fact.
Sorry CNN et al, but it has not occurred to me at all to turn on the TV.
CaseyL
Oh, goody: Sean Anderson is letting his freak flag fly.
Villago Delenda Est
@efgoldman: HE and WP both do numbers on structures. WP is supposed to only be used against structures and equipment. You know, like belt buckles.
redshirt
@Adam L Silverman: True.
So, call the media before one takes over a rest area.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Adam L Silverman: Shit. I missed a bingo.
But in my (admittedly limited in this area of law) opinion the Geneva Convention is not applicable. Lots of noise is legal!
AnotherBruce
Jesus, they think the phone is going out because of FBI? They flipped out because of a temporary loss of reception, probably in the mountains. It’s a long fucking drive from Portland to Burns and they are going to lose phone contact several times. I know, I’ve done the drive several times myself because I love the refuge and Steens Mountain. I want to go back there this spring and watch the crazy dance of mating Sandhill Cranes. Fuck these idiots. It’s personal for me.
gene108
How do you fight this system Sean?
Go to the Martin Luther King, Jr. memorial in D.C. He fought the system. He had major wins.
There are ways to do it.
It’s been done.
Aleta
Cut to a commercial for the NRA.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: Sure, and then he hijacked a Constitutional convention to radically remake the nature of the United States. We do not and have never governed anything in the US according the Constitution. And other than the Catholic founders, none of the others believed in Natural Law.
Villago Delenda Est
@Aleta: They are physically occupying Federal property, and they’re armed. Whether or not they’re in the buildings themselves now is irrelevant. They’re impeding the stated use of the property, as an administrative and educational center. Despite Ammon Bundy’s ludicrous claim that the entire occupation is an “education effort”.
Adam L Silverman
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): Okay, now I’m tracking.
gene108
Get rid of Common Core! Bonus Square in BINGO!
Gin & Tonic
Now they’re whining about Common Core. I’ll bet a beer that not a one of them could state even one fact about curriculum standards.
Villago Delenda Est
@efgoldman: Left out the part about the Archangel Gabriel delivering The Constitution on stone tablets to Philly for transcription to parchment.
sigaba
@gene108: Martin Luther King proudly went to jail. The guys’ most infuriating tick is their insistence that civil disobedience means everyone gets to walk.
PhoenixRising
@gene108:
Obviously weed dealers are leaving things on the table in terms of their negotiating position. Should think about a trade group, union, etc. that would commit randomly timed acts of violence against the Union.
Mj_Oregon
hollow points, guns, obamacare, common core? oy. That’s it for tonight for me.
I hope that it ends well.
Adam L Silverman
@delk: I am merely the messenger.
PhoenixRising
Obamacare?
Common Core?
Are these people sober?
Cheryl Rofer
Fiore is saying that the FBI has told her that they are not going make any moves tonight and will wait for her and Graham to arrive tomorrow morning.
sigaba
@PhoenixRising: Common Core is the new fluoridation.
Adam L Silverman
@beltane: The girl from that Kansas family of singers. She was in Finicum’s truck. They had traveled to the refuge to improve morale by signing patriotic and religious songs for the occupiers.
Mnemosyne
@Adam L Silverman:
It’s a breakup note.
Adam L Silverman
And we have a common core reference. Drink!
Soylent Green
Fiore: “Did you guys eat dinner?”
“No, we’ve got some snacks.”
nhoj
@Adam L Silverman: Helium is He and that would be comical but I doubt these people are sound enough of mind to grab their weapons in case of the roof being on fire.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
Sandy just told Rev Graham to tell Mark “we wouldn’t leave because we’re not going to jail.”
Fiore asks if they need her to pick up some McDonalds on the way there. Apparently snacks are running low.
Roger Moore
@PhoenixRising:
I think they’re high on
lifeJesus.Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@sigaba:
Ironically, OWS seems to have shared the same idea.
Omnes Omnibus
I know these guys have a lot of dildos, but I am wondering if they have enough wetsuits?
sigaba
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): I’m not so crazy about them either…
FlyingToaster
@PhoenixRising: They ran out of Hillbilly Heroin and Meth weeks ago. Weeks, I tell you.
No, they’re just dumb as rocks.
dr. bloor
@PhoenixRising: They don’t need alcohol. This is a nest of Lennie Smalls with live ammo.
Adam L Silverman
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): Yep, Fry and the Andersons are disassociating.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Omnes Omnibus: Clearly not, because they’re cold.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Omnes Omnibus:
One can never have enough wetsuits or drysuits.
sigaba
@Soylent Green: Ah snacks. A motif, like CRM114 in a Kubrick movie.
CaseyL
Who is Pedro??
….oh my god; someone crank-called them. too too funny.
Anoniminous
@Adam L Silverman:
Margaret Thatcher in a speech to the US Bar Association, actually.
nhoj
@Omnes Omnibus: They’re saving those for barter in prison.
redshirt
Scooby snacks are anti-government.
Adam L Silverman
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): This comes from the fringes of the 2nd Amendment maximalist stuff where it overlaps with the extremist libertarian and the Skousen ideologies: disarmed people aren’t free, they are slaves. Anything or anyone that leads to disarmament is an affront to Liberty and the beginning of the slide into slavery.
beltane
Good night, people. I’ve reached my wingnut quota for the day.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@srv: I thought that was Sean, but I’m getting lost. Gavin says they’re getting troll calls. Go Anonymous!
Cheryl Rofer
The number is out and lots of people besides Pedro are calling in.
Roger Moore
@FlyingToaster:
So these are withdrawl symptoms?
Frank Wilhoit
@Cheryl Rofer: See, that is just wrong. That is the legally constituted authority saying that their job is not worth doing. That is the institutions of the nation abdicating their functions, with a great big “whatevs”.
The next lot will know they have 40 days — SORRY, 41! — and will have some idea of what to do with them.
sigaba
@Cheryl Rofer: Quick someone call in as the ghost of Cleon Skousen.
Actually on second thought, is Coast to Coast AM still on the air? …
gene108
Some people are just assholes. Who thought putting the conference line that’s basically keeping 4 people from getting themselves and several law enforcement officers hurt or killed is a good idea?
Pedro may have some blood on his hands before this is over.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
Dissociatives live again on line 1! “They’re bringing in vehicles behind us.”
Prayer again. Drink!
PhoenixRising
…Happy Meals for everyone. How many girl toys and how many boy toys was that again? Apple or fries?
This has passed up surreal and arrived at farcial.
I have an early appointment to take the cat to the vet, so I’m tapping out. Someone text me if we’re getting a new republic more in line with these fools’ preferences, ‘kay?
Omnes Omnibus
@Frank Wilhoit:
How are they not doing their jobs?
Cheryl Rofer
More vehicle movement.
sigaba
@PhoenixRising: This is Dog Day Afternoon as directed by Alexander Payne.
delk
Have they got to the repeal Obergefell part yet?
Ruckus
@debbie:
Did 45 days, no shower in the navy. Once. In the Caribbean in the summer. The ship could not make enough fresh water for showers or laundry. It isn’t as bad as it sounds as long as everyone doesn’t shower. However. When we got back to home port and had hooked up shore power/water/steam from the dock, I took a steaming hot shower for 1 1/2 hrs. I still felt scummy.
Cheryl Rofer
@Frank Wilhoit: We don’t know how what the FBI says correlates with their plans. Additionally, anything can happen between now and then.
CaseyL
The call ended on the feed I was listening to. Time to find another feed…
FlyingToaster
@Roger Moore: Dissociation, ranting about irrelevant subjects, “camping” on a driveway, threatening to shoot everyone?
Either withdrawal or brain damage. Hard to tell the difference when they’re this far along.
And I seriously doubt that Sandy Anderson is pregnant as she’s 47; having been a 46-year-old primipara, if you want that baby, you’re at the damn OB/GYN every two weeks. Not “camping” in the driveway of a bird refuge, with GUNZ.
The Republic, Blah Blah Blah...
@Adam L Silverman: Shhhhh…
Let them go on and on and on like this…
Soon they’ll be quoting L.Ron Hubbard, the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, and the Martian Chronicles…
Aleta
“We’ve got plenty of food. That’s why we know God wants us to be here. If he didn’t want us to be here, he wouldn’t have made us comfortable (here).” (Sandy Anderson)
Really?
Lawless Feral Gummyment!
wvng
On JJ MacNabs twitter feed, she just shared a Bundy email putting out a call of patriots to descend on the refuge NOW!.
Adam L Silverman
@Anoniminous: Good to know!
lgerard
This Gavin guy is no Pete Santilli
better hosts please
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@sigaba:
“Actually on second thought, is Coast to Coast AM still on the air? …”
This would work better on Phil Hendry’s show/podcast.
Mike J
One of the finest examples of American literature is Letter from a Birmingham Bird Sanctuary.
NotMax
Live stream? Sorry, voyeurism not my bag.
Cheryl Rofer
Reporter Amanda Peacher of OPB is at the refuge. She isn’t tweeting. I’m guessing that she has access to law enforcement and won’t be able to say much until this is all over.
PhoenixRising
@Ruckus: I once won an extra consecutive day’s leave on a bet with my 4 peers–I was the last to tap out and shower. 8 days. I took a lap through to (solar hot) take a layer off, swam 2 miles in the lake, then added soap and rinsed back in the hot and cold running etc.
1) I was far more uncomfortable most of the weeks I spent as a professional Girl Scout than these clowns have been for their 40 days in the high desert…it didn’t make me worthy of respect for the sacrifices I was making.
2) I want a Happy Meal with fries. Nuggets, not a cheeseburger.
2)
sigaba
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): PHIL HENDRY DOES A PODCAST?
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
Is anyone else getting a headache from listening to this?
Frank Wilhoit
@Omnes Omnibus: Their job was to end this situation within the first twelve hours, by whatever means necessary. As that was not done, and as I have said in other fora, the authorities (county, state, federal) left themselves looking incapable and indifferent. The “occupiers” won, regardless of what happened after the first twelve hours or what happens after these new outsiders are allowed in tomorrow (I can hardly type for outraged incredulity) and some further days or weeks go by, during which the flow of seditious propaganda will go unchecked.
Gin & Tonic
When that moron Gavin got to “patriots serving time behind bars for liberty,” I had to tap out. I had ancestors and relatives disappear in the Gulag. These fucking idiots have no fucking idea what liberty means.
gene108
@PhoenixRising:
Was the pay good? How about the fringe benefits?
Did not know there’s such a thing as professional Girl Scouts.
Felonius Monk
And then there is this very strong statement of support for the Final 4.
sigaba
@srv: No it’s like Diabolique— Finicum is still hiding at the ranch.
Villago Delenda Est
@srv: Please.
Agent provocateur to draw out Cliven Bundy, not small potatoes Ammon.
gene108
We are NAZI Germany now!
sigaba
@gene108: Some friends of mine are professional Girl Scout staff, they’re some of the happiest and most content people I know; one of them left a job as a comic book editor to do it.
Omnes Omnibus
@Frank Wilhoit:
Cite?
nhoj
@Villago Delenda Est: AP doesn’t want to be associated with this nonsense. They just want to bring the sexy….
Not Really Safe for Work:
http://www.agentprovocateur.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/500x/040ec09b1e35df139433887a97daa66f/c/a/cathie_0020_setf_retouched.jpg
PhoenixRising
@gene108: Well, yes; unlike the Boy Scouts, we pay adults who can pass a background check to enforce safety basics in the wild, which is why you never see a headline ‘Girl Scout Campout Ends in Tragedy’ but the BSA kill a handful to a dozen kids every damn summer under the supervision of volunteers with no training requirements. Pro tip: Mother Nature bats last.
If you like getting dirty teaching girls to be self-sufficient and respectful users of our great nation’s natural resources…it’s priceless. In actual cash, no.
piratedan7
and if these folks were black and armed, would we still be here a month later, with only one fatality?
gene108
@sigaba:
What do professional Girl Scouts do?
I thought Girl Scouting was a volunteer organization…
sigaba
@Felonius Monk:
I predict Fry is the Cylon.
Adam L Silverman
@srv: He’s been ready to surrender at least three previous times. Including right after they were the last four left. He was going to turn himself in, as he was the only one of the four with an outstanding warrant. Every time his wife has convinced him and the others to continue holding out.
Anoniminous
Right Wingers can’t do a Popular Insurgency for toffee. If they’d read their Mao and Guevara they’d would have known trapping yourself in the middle of nowhere, hundreds of miles from support and potential support is dumb.
sigaba
@gene108: One of them works for fundraising and development, one of them designs and runs arts programs….
Adam L Silverman
@PhoenixRising: I’m looking for a career change. Do they make the uniforms in Men’s XXL?
NotMax
Aberrant asswipes make Al and Peg Bundy look amiable and well-adjusted.
redshirt
So, how many divisions of professional Girl Scouts do we have? 3 at least, I hope.
Omnes Omnibus
@piratedan7: No, of course not. But that doesn’t make shooting these assholes right if a peaceful solution is possible.
redshirt
@sigaba:
I got that reference.
Adam L Silverman
@redshirt: Its why I always buy cookies. They are the only uniformed service we have left if everything else fails.
sigaba
@redshirt: Girl Scouts use regimental doctrine.
ThresherK (GPad)
We had an electrics outage for a couple hours. Looks like I missed a lot! But it’s not like any of it was surprising, is the surprise.
Elie
@Adam L Silverman:
Hmmmm — she might have a different agenda from which his survival may not be a desirable outcome for her? Just saying. Interesting that this has happened more than once..
Adam L Silverman
@sigaba: @redshirt: This has all happened before and it will happen again…
Anoniminous
@redshirt:
Girl Scouts don’t need divisions. They have skills in guerrilla and urban warfare.
Omnes Omnibus
@Adam L Silverman: Next time, you’ll buy the cookies.
@Anoniminous: Darn you to heck!
lgerard
They are piss poor revolutionaries, bragging about the sacrifices they are making, but afraid to go to jail and worrying about their snacks.
Thoreau, Gandhi, King, and even Hitler went to jail willing for their causes.
Not these babies
CaseyL
Fox News “was busy whoring for a corrupt government.”
Love it.
Redshift
To paraphrase A Fish Called Wanda,:
“Apes don’t read the Constitution!”
“Yes, they do, they just don’t understand it!”
redshirt
@Elie: Sounds like a juicy novel. Two revolutionary lovers fight the SYSTEM! Yet even darker secrets are revealed….
Frank Wilhoit
@Omnes Omnibus: The 12-hour threshold is not, of course, in the text of any law; it is a placeholder for a common-sense threshold of promptness. Some allowance has to be made for the difficulty of transportation in remote areas. In a built-up area, 12 hours would be far too long.
The point is that the obligation “to take care that the laws be faithfully executed” flows down from the President to the entire Executive Branch, including DOJ/FBI. In this case, the FBI, by allowing this situation to drag on as long as it has, have fallen very far short of that standard; so far as to call themselves into complete ridicule. They have demonstrated a “depraved indifference”, in the precise meaning of that legal term-of-art, to the lives, property, and well-being of every citizen of the United States who depends upon them for protection.
This kind of incident is going to be repeated, worse each time, as long as the perpetrators believe the authorities will respond with a 24- or 41-day shrug.
Mike J
@Adam L Silverman:
Isn’t that tautology true of any uniformed service?
sigaba
@Adam L Silverman: The Refuge is New Caprica and Ammon is Colonel Tighe, Sheriff Palmer is Baltar (but it’s sort of an is-he-or-isn’t-he thing).
Adam L Silverman
@Omnes Omnibus: I already said I always buy the cookies.
Adam L Silverman
@Mike J: Too a point. We never deploy the Girl Scouts, so they really are the last resort. And they never have budgetary issues to impact their acquisitions process.
FlyingToaster
@Adam L Silverman: It’s time to add “All along the Watchtower” to the playlist.
Omnes Omnibus
@Frank Wilhoit: Got it. They didn’t do things the way you would have. Me, I will be happy if it ends relatively bloodlessly and the people involved get prosecuted.
Steve in the ATL
So they’re saying they will surrender at the checkpoint tomorrow morning while carrying American flags. I’m confused–do they or do they not acknowledge the US government?
PhoenixRising
@Adam L Silverman: We never have budgetary issues because…you all buy the cookies.
Just saying. It’s a plot.
Cheryl Rofer
Okay, y’all, it’s my bedtime. Here’s a summary of things as I see them.
Sounds like the FBI is going to wait until morning and Michele Fiore’s arrival. I saw a tweet questioning whether Franklin Graham is actually going to come. Bundy? Eh.
I would not be at all surprised if Fiore and Seim are getting some advice from the FBI. Seim started out with the cray-cray, and now he’s helping to calm the Final Four down. Nobody’s going to say that in public any time soon, though. He and Michele have been handing it off to each other. She seems to be offline at the moment.
We haven’t heard from David Fry for a while, and Sandy is sounding relatively calm.
There are at least five trucks, a helicopter, and an ambulance.
Let’s hope that they all walk out arm in arm with Michele, no guns.
AnotherBruce
At this point, is there anyone that doesn’t believe that Les Zaitz doesn’t deserve a Pulitzer prize? His reporting on this slimy mess has been outstanding.
Omnes Omnibus
@Adam L Silverman: Just reinforcing that excellent decision.
Roger Moore
@Adam L Silverman:
Isn’t is Schrodinger’s Cat who’s supposed to say that?
Adam L Silverman
@Steve in the ATL: By telling the FBI they’ll be the ones carrying the American flags they think the FBI won’t confuse them with anyone else trying to surrender tomorrow morning.
Adam L Silverman
@PhoenixRising: I once argued that I’d do the baking for USAWC to have a bake sale to make up for what DOD clawed back because of the sequester. The comptroller was not amused. In his defense, he doesn’t have a sense of humor.
sigaba
@Adam L Silverman: They want the photo op. Also the US flag is emphatically not a flag of surrender.
Adam L Silverman
@AnotherBruce: He’s been great. As has several of his colleagues and the folks at OPB.
Steve in the ATL
@Adam L Silverman: Ha! Fair point–the illegitimate flag will have to do if you can’t scrounge up a red carnation and don’t want to be confused with other half-witted, meth-addled, hillbillies stumbling out of a closed bird sanctuary in the middle of winter.
Adam L Silverman
@Roger Moore: Maybe yes, maybe no.
Omnes Omnibus
Completely OT: The yellow 356 convertible is the nicest car in Bullitt.
Cheryl Rofer
Sean Anderson says they will turn themselves in tomorrow morning to Fiore and Graham. Came through before I shut the stream off.
CaseyL
Fiore says a whole convoy of elected officials are going to join them at Melheur tomorrow morning when they turn themselves in. I sure as hell hope she’s lying.
Roger Moore
@Steve in the ATL:
They recognize the country and the constitution (or at least some bizarrely twisted version of it) but not the government. Don’t be surprised if the flags they’re carrying are upside down.
Mike J
Will the flag have fringe on?
TOP123
@Gin & Tonic: what, refer to an actual historic example in which people’s rights where arbitrarily and without notice shockingly infringed with horrifying consequences?
Maybe the NKVD just made prisoners pee outside the Lubyanka with no bathrooms? Did they just withhold snacks in Kalyma?
Frank Wilhoit
@Omnes Omnibus: You are less safe because of the way this has been mishandled. So are a few hundred million others. The job is to keep them (and you) safe. The job is sometimes messy. The job just got a lot harder and it is going to keep getting harder — until/unless the job starts to be done instead of being shirked, and that enough times to set an expectation.
In the meanwhile, get used to a lot of domestic terrorism.
redshirt
@Mike J: Silver non-Sovereign fringe, unfortunately.
Adam L Silverman
@Cheryl Rofer: @CaseyL: I would be very surprised if the FBI lets these folks anywhere near the hold outs. The last thing they want is to legitimize a bunch of state legislators and Cliven Bundy who all believe this stuff and enable these folks in their behavior.
redshirt
@srv: You’ve made me laugh in this thread. Thanks for that, friend. :)
lgerard
Why do all the “patriots” pronounce tyranny “tie-ran- e”?
Omnes Omnibus
@Frank Wilhoit: I disagree. If these guys go to jail, this is a win.
SoupCatcher
@efgoldman: I’m cookie manager this year for my daughter’s Brownie troop. Which means I’m dithering right now trying to decide if I want to get more cookies for this weekend’s booth sales or go with the inventory I have sitting in the front room. Deadline to get my order in for Friday pick-up is in 2.5 hours.
Only four and a half weeks to go…
Mary G
The Bundy Ranch Facebook page that calls on America to WAKE UP and go to Oregon has 1,455 likes. I doubt that the massive wave of patriots they’re counting on to show up is going to materialize. Most of the comments I read are along the lines of “you morons need to go to jail.”
Cheryl Rofer
@Adam L Silverman: [Yeah, I can’t let this go.] It’s a hard call. You don’t want Fiore and Graham where they might get shot. But if it facilitates a peaceful surrender, might be worth it. The legitimation will last until they slap the handcuffs on.
Also, as I said (although perhaps not clearly, I’m getting sleepy), I wouldn’t be surprised if Fiore and Seim had some contact with the FBI, or being used by them. I’ve also wondered that about Grant County Sheriff Glenn Palmer.
Now I really am going to log off.
Steve in the ATL
@Mary G: I will be waking up and going to office tomorrow. Does that count as a win for Bundy?
redshirt
The truth is out there,
I suspect.
Omnes Omnibus
@Cheryl Rofer:
We have heard that before.
Steve in the ATL
@Cheryl Rofer:
Speak for yourself
Roger Moore
@lgerard:
I want to know why a bunch of such supposedly moral and upstanding individuals are so interested in dildos and trannies.
Steeplejack
@Adam L Silverman:
From his website:
Just lost the crucial III Percent Pedant support.
Adam L Silverman
@Omnes Omnibus: I’m going for ice cream!
Omnes Omnibus
@Adam L Silverman: Could you get me some butter pecan?
@Roger Moore: “Live free or die!”
Adam L Silverman
@Cheryl Rofer: Palmer is being investigated by the Oregon State Sheriffs’ Association. He’s got a challenger in his bid for reelection and a local resident of his county took out a full page add in the local paper decrying him and calling for his investigation. He’s in a lot of trouble.
scav
If they come out bearing US flags with 50 stars, it’s a sign of their impurity. True patriots do not recognize Hawaii as anything but a hotbed breeding ground of foreign communist islamicist faux presidents.
Adam L Silverman
@Omnes Omnibus: I’ve got Chocolate Extreme and Cappuccino Blitz. I would’ve bought Moose Tracks, but there’s Moose Tracks, Chocolate Moose Tracks, Fudge Moose Tracks, Mint Moose Tracks, and a frozen yoghurt Moose Tracks. I just couldn’t handle that many choices. So then I thought Otter Paws. Otter Paws, Chocolate Otter Paws, Fudge Otter Paws… Bear Claws – regular Bear Claws or Chocolate Bear Claws. It was just too much pressure.
Omnes Omnibus
@efgoldman: The troll is never your friend.
Omnes Omnibus
@Adam L Silverman: This is one of the reasons I opt for something simple like butter pecan. Or vanilla with some cognac over it.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
Why haven’t the Feds been blasting loud music at these fools 24/7?
redshirt
@efgoldman: srv is a friend of the blog, as I understand it. I’ll leave it to Cole to defend.
Adam L Silverman
Well it seems like things are starting to wind down on the live stream. They are convinced that the FBI is standing down, which just means the guy is probably going to stop ordering them to surrender peacefully. And the occupiers seem to have moved inside according to Sandy Anderson. And I’m turning the thing off because they finally connected with Victoria Sharp and I don’t want to listen to her sing.
Villago Delenda Est
@Adam L Silverman: All you really need is Jamocha Almond Fudge.
Well, and some marionberry once and a while.
CaseyL
OK, the singing is too much. I’m headed for bed.
‘Night, all!
Very curious about what’ll be on the news tomorrow.
lgerard
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again):
More painful to make them talk to Fiore on the phone for hours
Omnes Omnibus
@redshirt: srv has been here forever. srv has a fantastic recollection of blog events. srv is still a troll. srv is a pure troll whose goal is simply trollery.
Roger Moore
@Omnes Omnibus:
The computer is your friend, isn’t it citizen.
Joel
@Omnes Omnibus: He’s DougJ, right?
I miss objective scrutator.
SiubhanDuinne, Annoying Scoundrel
@Steve in the ATL:
I was in a place that had a TV tuned to CNN (no audio), and they mostly seemed to have Mayor noun-verb-9/11 Giuliani on complaining about Beyoncé at the Super Bowl.
You missed nothing, IOW.
redshirt
@Omnes Omnibus: Trolls srv their purposes in internet eco-spheres. Like a fungus that degrades and recycles.
Omnes Omnibus
@Joel: I doubt that srv is DougJ, but I may be wrong. There is a theory that we are all DougJ.
Adam L Silverman
@efgoldman: I love peppermint stick.
SoupCatcher
@efgoldman:
That’s impressive!
We’re only a quarter of the way through this year’s sale and our service unit cookie coordinator has already starting sending out tautly-worded e-mails on the need to follow directions for reordering. The cookie cupboard is a shipping container sitting in a parking lot and more than eighty percent of the people showing up to pick up orders last weekend had placed their order past the deadline. Some of them from their car while sitting in the parking lot.
Steve in the ATL
I’ll sign off by repeating my comment that sovereign citizens must be the stupidest fucking people in the country.
Adam L Silverman
And they’re praying again.
Omnes Omnibus
@Adam L Silverman: It is only good in one of my mother’s Christmas desserts. With the little pieces of peppermint. Yum.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Adam L Silverman:
Did you leave yet? I could go for a pint of Graeter’s Black Raspberry Chocolate Chip. Stuff’s the bomb- probably the single food that got me through my first couple weeks of chemo.
Steve in the ATL
@Adam L Silverman: Allahu Akbar!
Omnes Omnibus
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): Oh, shit. You just took me back to living in Columbus and going to the original Graeter’s.
Redshift
@Frank Wilhoit: Right, because domestic terrorism has never happened in response to a forceful, “messy,” end to an armed standoff. Unless you count the worst one in American history and various others.
But since we already have past data for your preferred approach, peaceful resolution this time will provide a good test of whether you’re right.
redshirt
@efgoldman: Same. Why people expose themselves to hate media, I have no idea.
Adam L Silverman
This is the whackjob hosting the live stream:
https://www.wenatcheeworld.com/news/2015/jun/24/gavin-seim-guilty-in-courtroom-disruption/
Adam L Silverman
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): Never had it. I think they sell that brand at Publix. I’m not a big fan of raspberry though.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Omnes Omnibus:
My mom’s got a friend who survived leukemia, so she overnighted me a six-pack of Graeter’s as soon as my mom told her about my diagnosis. Hadn’t had it before. Turns out that Meijer carries it in Michigan now, so when I’ve got the hankerin’…
redshirt
We have visual confirmation of a Tbogg Unit directly ahead.
Adam L Silverman
And the live stream is over.
Omnes Omnibus
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): Your diagnosis? I have obviously missed something.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Adam L Silverman:
I didn’t see it at Publix when I was in FL when I was down a few weeks ago, but I wasn’t looking to hard. Mom would have eaten it if I didn’t shovel it down quick, then she’d blame me for her weight gain. Every flavor they’ve got is magnificent, though. Hell, I even liked the peach stuff, and I don’t care for peach ice cream. They do small batches for quality’s sake.
Adam L Silverman
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): I think its above the good gelato in the freezer case, which is to the left of the Ben and Jerrys. The cartoon and logo look familiar.
lgerard
Asking for Franklin Graham to negotiate for them just shows how out of touch they are.
Should have asked for Beyonce
redshirt
@lgerard: I’d have asked for MC Hammer. Cuz I know he’s available.
Omnes Omnibus
@lgerard: I am not sure Beyonce *would have showed.
*Sorry but the song, the video, and fact that she performed it at the Super Bowl is pure amazeballs.
West of the Cascades
As an Oregonian, I am so fucking sick of this Refuge situation and the assholes who are still holed up there. It’s driven some deep fissures into the Oregon environmental community about how much, and how forcefully, we can preach about the underlying depredations that livestock ranchers cause on the public lands and the Refuge in particular. At this point, if the remaining four surrender peacefully, great. If they are teargassed until they expend their ammunition and are arrested, great. If they decide to kill themselves, or go out in a blazing firefight with the feds, great. But it has to end tomorrow. And then the feds need to go full-bore at this movement, including arresting Cliven Bundy, its mythical hero, and prosecute these scum as fully as possible.
sukabi
@beltane: wouldn’t have any effect. He’s just as delusional as they are…
benw
@redshirt: also, you could beg, “Please, Hammer, don’t hurt us!”
redshirt
@benw: Can’t touch this berniebro.
patrick II
@Omnes Omnibus:
That’s some wicked trolling.
Adam L Silverman
I’m too bed. Good night all.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Omnes Omnibus:
I’ve only brought it up once here, and in passing. This time last year I stopped hanging out here because work was killing me. My second job site was outside, late at night, all that friggin’g snowy mess to deal with. March rolled around and I gave myself an umbilical hernia. Put off going to the doctor until May. Emergancy room referred me to a surgeon who spotted bile in my abdominal cavity and what looked like liver damage- that was June. He referred me to a grastro-enterologist who I saw in the middle of July (in the meantime I was wasting away, jaundiced, didn’t know wtf was going on). Gastro-enterologist diagnosed liver damage right away, sent me for blood work and a CT scan. Nothing popped up through the blood work, but the CT scan picked up huge tumor in my liver. Biopsy found that it’s intrahepatic cholangiocarcinoma- a bile duct cancer. The tumor is in my bile ducts inside my liver.
Started chemo right away, and we’ve gotten significant shrinkage in the tumor. Had to switch off the original regimen (which was so effective) just a few weeks ago because I was losing some hearing, getting tinnitus and breaking out in hives as soon as the Cisplatin infusion would begin.
I’d be lying if I told you that kicking this thing’s ass is going to be easy. There’s no known cure for it. But I’m up for the fight, and, who knows, maybe I’ll be the guy that gene therapy cures of this rare cancer. Either way. I’m lmao through the whole thing. Life’s just fucking crazy. :D
Adam L Silverman
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): We’ll keep good thoughts on this end.
Omnes Omnibus
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): You have my good thoughts. I can’t do prayers, but you got what I can do. And fuck cancer.
ETA: The world needs Packer fans who understand the importance of Max.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Adam L Silverman:
Thanks, Adam. I plan on being here for as long as possible. I’ve always enjoyed this place, even when Cole was a wingnut.
Steeplejack
Music for a standoff: Steely Dan, “Don’t Take Me Alive.”
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Omnes Omnibus:
I don’t do prayers, either. This is much more awesome.
And thank you. :) Hopefully I’ll be here a year from now breaking down the Packers’ 14th NFL Championship with you.
redshirt
Hopefully all Americans can watch it on Red Zone.
As of now, every other country in the world gets a better NFL package then America.
Omnes Omnibus
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): Damn right.
There are people here who care and are interested in how you are doing. Please keep us posted as much as you are comfortable doing. In any case, you have all the good thoughts I can offer.
Aleta
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): A colleague has fought intrahepatic cholangiocarcinoma for 6-7 years now, lots of treatment but remaining as chair of her department. Will be thinking of you, 100% positively. Take care.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
I’m comfortable with it, same way I’ve been comfortable with discussing my alcoholism over the years (almost 11 years!). I think it’s the best way to remove the stigma. Had to explain to the 4-year old grand-niece tonight why I couldn’t roughhouse with her- and she plays rough and tough- because of the pump I’m wearing until Friday. Now we didn’t get to the bit about the mortal coil shuffle, but we’ll get her comfortable with that before my number’s up.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Aleta:
Thanks, Aleta!
It’s funny- ironic- reading about the rarity of this cancer (20K dignoses worldwide annually, mostly in Southeast Asia, only 2K in the States) and then talking to all these people who have it orknow someone who’s got/had it.
Aleta
@Steeplejack:
Music for a surrender: Johnny Cash – Desperado with lyrics
I fear Sean’s mood will swing different in the morning, though, and that Fry is up for anything.
Omnes Omnibus
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): Yeah, not the best convo with a 4 y/o. Again, good thoughts.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Omnes Omnibus:
She got what we explained to her, though. For as tough as she is at times, she’s got a lot of empathy in her.
Omnes Omnibus
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): Kids are smarter than we think they are.
seaboogie
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): Sounds like a wild ride for you – and not an entirely pleasant one…but you seem to have good perspective.
None of us gets out of this scene alive, so please keep some quality of life in your life, and here’s a little thing for you….
As always, there is only this moment. We cannot be in the last one or the next one – just this one.
Aleta
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): Yes, believe or not, I had another nearby friend with the same diagnosis around the same time as my colleague was diagnosed. (She chose no treatment except macrobiotic diet, and spent one last winter on her boat w/family in the Caribbean.)
Steeplejack
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again):
Sending positive thoughts your way.
seaboogie
@Omnes Omnibus:
Amazeballs? Omnes? Is that a legal term? Maybe you’re having an early spring in WI too….
Omnes Omnibus
@seaboogie: Your point?
seaboogie
@Omnes Omnibus: Heh…still chuckling a bit…
I’m just thinking of the people I’ve heard use that term, and you don’t really fit that mental profile for me. ‘Twasn’t a dis, just not your usual form of commentary.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Steeplejack:
TYVM!
@Aleta:
Since I wasn’t beyond chemo at the start (though surgery is out of the question, and radiation will take more shrinkage via chemo), I went with proven medicine and a diet I can enjoy.When I turn that last corner, I’ll stick with the fatty pork chops and good bbq down the road. as long as I can choke it down. So far, I’ve gained weight, even over my preferred 150 lbs.. I’m mid 160s now and getting plump. Skinny frame and all that business. ;)
Omnes Omnibus
@seaboogie: What Beyonce did was unusual, The song and the video floored me. Fucking amazing.
seaboogie
@Omnes Omnibus: That sounds more like you. And on that rec, I’ll check it out – I don’t have the teevee and was working, so didn’t see it, but I will. Thank you.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Steeplejack: BTW, I find this the preferential Steely Dan song for this standoff.
Steeplejack
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again):
Another good choice.
AxelFoley
@Villago Delenda Est:
Yes, please.
West of the Cascades
It looks like Cliven Bundy was just arrested here in Portland!!! Hallelujah!!
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2016/feb/11/oregon-standoff-escalates-fbi-armed-occupants-malheur-wildlife-refuge-live
Link to Multnomah County Jail Website: http://www.mcso.us/PAID/Home/Booking/1364036
Booking Information
SWIS ID
795422
Name
Bundy, Cliven D
Age
74
Gender
Male
Race
White
Height
6 ft 0 in
Weight
200 lbs
Hair
Brown
Eyes
Brown
Arresting Agency
Portland FBI
Booking Date
02/10/2016 10:54 PM
Assigned Facility
MCDC
Projected Release Date
Unknown
Charges
Click on each court case number to expand the display and see the charges.
Court Case No. None
DA Case No. None
Citation No. None
USM HOLD (U Unknown)
Bail: $0
Status: Unsentenced
Mj_Oregon
Cliven Bundy has been arrested at PDX in Portland when he arrived on a flight from Vegas. He’s been booked into the Multnomah County jail. No word yet on charges except the word is they are unrelated to the four still in Malheur refuge.
sm*t cl*de
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q):
Civil disobedience! MLK Jnr!
But not going to jail, nope, that sounds boring.
Mj_Oregon
@West of the Cascades:
You beat me to it! Tomorrow should be very interesting to anyone following this story.
Les Zaitz (@LesZaitz) from the Oregonian just tweeted that the charges stem from the 2014 standoff in Nevada. Finally?
Ruckus
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again):
Cancer is a stone bitch. Sorry that you have some. Good luck with yours. Be the first, it’s always fun to be first.
West of the Cascades
Welcome to Portland, motherfucker.
West of the Cascades
@Mj_Oregon: Finally. If true, FBI is brilliant in leading him to think he was immune and luring him to Portland.
Ruckus
@West of the Cascades:
Sounds like they arrested him at the airport, where he would find it difficult to be armed or be around anyone armed that isn’t supposed to be.
jacy
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again):
Thinking good thoughts for you. Chemo sucks in ways that are indescribable. But a good attitude goes a long way — I think that’s the real difference.
sm*t cl*de
@Omnes Omnibus:
Repeated for emphasis.
We are lucky to live in an era that has things like cisplatin and the FOLFOX regime.
Aleta
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): I’ve heard of some naturopathic doctors who treat the side effects of chemo as one is going through it, able to alleviate the nausea, etc, . while leaving the cancer treatment to the oncologists and chemo team.
Bobby Thomson
@West of the Cascades: Thanks, Obama.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@sm*t cl*de:
Off the Cisplatin and Gemzar regimen, now on my second Oxaliplatin and 5-FU treatment. Haven’t really lost my hair, only ever felt borderline queasy. Got the hearing lissues and the hives from Cisplatin, now getting mild cold sensitivity, tingling and a touch of neuropathy in the tips of my fingers and toes. I’m the smiling face of the chemo room when I’m there!
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Aleta:
Again, I’m a scientific skeptic. I know what a placebo is. ;)
sm*t cl*de
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again):
These are not recreational drugs.
I do not want to know whether Hickman-line fetishism is a thing yet.
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Ruckus:
I was hoping that I’d have something so rare that they’d have to name it for me, then I remembered that these things are almost always named after the doctors who discover them. Kind of a rip-off, if you ask me. ;)
Aleta
@Mj_Oregon: I suppose the four lone rangers might make this arrest an excuse to try out their negotiating skills again, or proof of FBI perfidy.
Aleta
@Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): I enjoy a good placebo effect whenever I get the chance.
sigaba
@West of the Cascades: Biggest HAW HAW ever.
Dwell for a moment upon the decision process:
“I have Federal Warrants! Let’s go to an airport!”
Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)
@Aleta:
It does nothing for me. It’s like recording a sporting event to which I already listened to on the radio. I know what’s coming. Call me jaded, I suppose.
Mj_Oregon
@Aleta:
My twitter feed is hinting that something is going on at the refuge right now. I’m not sure how much I can trust this guy and most of the good sources have gone silent about what’s happening out there right now. Gavin Saim’s audio feed isn’t running any longer so we have nothing live. I’m still hoping it’ll end without bloodshed but I’m not as optimistic as I was a few hours ago.
Mj_Oregon
@Aleta:
Ah. That person I referenced last was listening to a repeat of the four hour drama from earlier and was just making comment about it starting with one that said “something is happening out at the refuge right now.”
OPB and Oregonian reporters are at the roadblocks and report that all is quiet there now. Maybe the Final Four really are sleeping and don’t know Cliven’s been arrested. Apparently Jason “Joker J” Blomgren, one of Cliven’s bodyguards, was also picked up too. I’m not clear if he was in Portland or stayed behind in Nevada.
Central Planning
Holy crap. 500 comments.
Elizabelle
Maybe there won’t be a day 42 or 43. That would be nice.
tybee
TBU achieved.
raven
Glad I went to bed.
Frank Wilhoit
@Redshift: You have exactly missed my point. If Waco had been unwound in a timely and effective manner, rather than dragged out and botched, then McVeigh might have thought twice — perhaps even once. I for one have no doubt that he was emboldened by the astounding incompetence that the Federal authorities displayed at Waco.
Again, it’s not about the perpetrators; it’s not about the hostages, if any; it’s about everybody else.
Institutions that are obviously afraid to exercise their defined roles are worse than no institutions at all.