(NSFW – language)
Via the Washington Post:
… Jefferies says… the real reason gun owners want guns is just because they like them. That’s okay, but it doesn’t mean that guns should be legal, he says. Some people like taking drugs or driving at 100 miles an hour, and can be perfectly safe and responsible while doing so, but other irresponsible people have ruined those things for them…
***********
Apart from our national fetishisms, what’s on the agenda for the afternoon?
Corner Stone
Recently picked up some new camera gear. Would like to try some things out but it’s really overcast, humid and freakin blah* here.
So may just end up working some more. Yay me!
*Not the Rih Santorum kind
Omnes Omnibus
Did a 22 mile ride earlier. It is beautiful today in the People’s Republic of Madison. Looking forward to the start of Poldark on Masterpiece tonight. Otherwise just relaxing. Need to call my dad later.
Steeplejack (tablet)
Saw that Jefferies piece last week. Very good.
Pogonip
Happy Father’s Day!
shell
Always enjoy listening to Selected Shorts on Sunday, but gave it a pass today. The first story, by Calvino, about the moon, just droned on forever. And the second one was Bradbury’s ‘All Summer In A Day.’ I always hated that story…hated it cause it’s so effective. I wanna kick those kids.
Germy Shoemangler
Waiting for Marc Maron’s podcast interview with Obama.
raven
Germy Shoemangler
@raven: His plan was never to leave that church? Good. Glad he was thwarted.
Put him in prison and let him experience what Kalief Browder went through.
lurker dean
so chuckles’ programming after charleston is a piece on gun violence, featuring only black shooters. unreal.
http://www.rawstory.com/2015/06/wtf-nbcs-chuck-todd-airs-color-blind-segment-with-all-black-shooters-to-address-charleston-massacre/
Esme's Mom
@Corner Stone: What kind of gear? I’m looking to move on finally from my historical Nikon of the D70 era. Any suggestions?
raven
@Germy Shoemangler: That’s what I’m thinking.
Howard Beale IV
Wife of Israel’s interior minister tweets, and deletes, racist joke about President Obama
Can we please stop sending these people $3 billion a year and use that within our own country?
raven
@Corner Stone: The camera sees light in a different way than they eye, blaze away.
geg6
Boss’s kid graduated high school, so headed to their place for the party today. Hope the pretty much guaranteed rain holds off until we get home. He’s got a tent, but we’ve had so much rain that it will be a swamp in the yard if we get a drop more.
Corner Stone
@raven: I had a specific setup I wanted to test for learning/comparison purposes. I have plenty of stock footage on grey days recently.
I still may give her a go but it is one big bag of used sweatpants out there right now.
D58826
I think it is time to rename the GOP presidential clown car to the ‘weasel wagon’ with apologies to the four footed kind. With the exception of Jeb none of the weasels will make the simple statement that its time for the stars and bars to come down from the flag pole in SC and move to a museum. They all rattle on that it isn’t something that the President can change and it is up to the people of S. Carolina. to have a ‘conversation’ about it. It is true that the President can’t order ther flag taken down but a president has a certain moral authority in this country to speak on such issues. In addition the question isn’t really about what Pres. Mike Huckabee would do, it is what Mike Huckabee the human being would do. By refusing to make a simple statement these candidates are showing a complete lack of moral leadership (and what else is new about that). As far as the needed ‘conversation’ how much of a conversation do you need before you recognize that in 2015 the flag is a symbol of hate and violence. Lindsey Graham goes on about southern heritage. I had the same argument with the southern members of my family. My question then and now is that in 400 years of southern history this is the only thing you can come up with to represent southern heritage? Isn’t there something that both whites and non-whites in S. Carolina can rally around? If the flag is the best they can come up with then the south and all it stands for really is a moral black hole.
raven
@Corner Stone: Got it.
Steve from Antioch
If only we had an assault weapons ban or a ban on are capacity magazines …
raven
@Steve from Antioch: Or a ban on YOU, fuck face.
Corner Stone
@Esme’s Mom: I’m in the Canon family. Picked up a prime 300MM F4 not too long ago and been using it around local parks and water fountains in man made ponds, down at the nearby golf course, that kind of thing. Wanted to try my 2X II extender with that and a tripod at a place not too far from here but it takes a lot more light to get results from what I want to try.
Or I’m probably just not good enough with it yet to get what I want under less than ideal circumstances. It might be a learning experience either way but it’s miserable enough to make me ponder.
I have plenty of work to do, in any event, so who knows.
Mnemosyne (tablet)
@Steve from Antioch:
I realize that you’re a sociopath and don’t understand why normal people are upset that nine people were murdered in cold blood, but can’t you go back to 4Chan and gloat with your sociopath buddies there about it rather than annoying everyone else?
WereBear
@D58826: Faulkner wrote most of his oeuvre on this very subject. They can’t be shamed into changing, because they have none.
We have to do it for them.
raven
@Corner Stone: Whoo, that’s a lot of lens!
TheMightyTrowel
@Omnes Omnibus: i thought the first half of poldark was great. Wasn’t so jazzed about the second half. Too much melodrama and not enough mining for my tastes but ymmv
Germy Shoemangler
I linked to this before, but I’ll link to it again:
Reverse Racism
Funny and deep young comedian.
D58826
@TheMightyTrowel: My wife used to say that Robin Ellis from the 1970’s series could put his shoes under her bed ANY time
Germy Shoemangler
@D58826: I watched most of the original series because I had a painful crush on Angharad Rees.
scav
@Howard Beale IV: That sweetheart could very well be speaking for both the political and media elite of her country. Charming ally of the nation we’ve got there. And now she’s going for the ‘silly little ol’ me, wait til the big strong man comes home and tidies up my little woopsie and gives me what for!” faint at sn appology.
NotMax
Afternoon? Time Zone-ist.
Not even 9 in the a.m.
Popped awake way too early, at 8 and am currently in a quasi-zombie state, waiting for coffee to kick in.
Broke down recently and in a concession to Father Time had an eye exam and ordered my first ever pair of reading glasses. Had been noticing more frequent problems when confronted with tiny print. Picking them up on Monday.
Corner Stone
@lurker dean: Holy Jeebus Cracker, Betty’s Jazz musician brother.
That segment on Meet the Press by Chuckles was absolutely, mind blowingly, straight out of the ass of clueless white cracker idiots.
Good sweet babby christ.
Schlemazel
@Germy Shoemangler:
This guy will be protected by the Aryan Brotherhood if he is ever in the general population. But if there is ever a slip up he can add ‘shanked” to his CV. I am vehemently opposed to prison violence and really can’t bring myself to wish it upon him . . . but . . . I sure wouldn’t mind in this one case.
I also hope he is not given the death penalty as I think it would be the easy way out for him. The thought of him rotting for 60-70 years behind bars is much more satisfying, particularly since he will have to sleep with one eye open ever night of those years. (but if they keep him in segregation (oh gawd, the irony!) that might be even worse. &0 years of never having anyone but the occasional guard to talk to.
Schlemazel
@D58826:
But wouldn’t he bother you two if you were trying to sleep & he came in to get his shoes?
Plus, wouldn’t he have to have a key to your place?
Mandalay
Another Republican profile in cowardice:
He wants to be president but he’s too scared to give his opinion on the Confederate flag.
D58826
@Schlemazel: why ask practical questions that only get in the way of true lust
Omnes Omnibus
@TheMightyTrowel: Of course, the archeologist wants more digs.
Schlemazel
@D58826:
yeah, it just stuck me as funny.
Steve from Antioch
@Mnemosyne (tablet):
Isn’t it just so inspirational that folks have been able to soldier on through their grief so they can beat on their favorite drums: – racism, drug use, gun control, the confederate flag, etc.
But perhaps you should try some soothing tea so you won’t be so upset …
Mandalay
@Mandalay: And another Republican presidential candidate hides behind mommy’s apron…
There is a price to pay for a Republican supporting or rejecting the Confederate flag, but the cost of ducking the question is even worse.
Corner Stone
@Steve from Antioch:
Nine black people were murdered in a church by a white guy with a self professed motive to do something about black people. If not him, who? If not now, when? If not there, where?
I agree with you that I do see a lot of attempts at drum beating. Fox News went forward beating their drum on a war against Christians. Rick Perry went forward beating his drum trying to blame it on drugs. The NRA went forward beating their drums blaming the church Pastor for not stashing guns in every KJV Bible in the pews.
Pew pew pew!
John Revolta
@Mandalay: You know who else used to live in the Arkansas Governor’s mansion and won’t give an opinion on the Confederate flag?
Corner Stone
@John Revolta: Hitler? I’m going with Hitler.
Or were you looking for Hitlary?
Either way, I denounce Stalin. But not broccoli of which I haven’t had any in a while.
Shakezula
I did some gardening this a.m. and as a result refuse to go outside again until the sun is below the yardarm. The only fun part was the informal preying mantis census that occurs when I disturb their hunting grounds. I saw 9 of the critters, all about half grown.
Iowa Old Lady
@John Revolta: Hillary Clinton, 2007:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/19/AR2007021900655.html
Not exactly what you’re talking about, but tougher than the Clowns.
Mandalay
@John Revolta:
Well Hillary Clinton was against it eight years ago:
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2015/06/figures-hillary-clinton-supported-and-celebrated-confederate-flag-day-in-arkansas/
Your point?
Ruckus
@Esme’s Mom:
I picked up a Nikon 5300 and it is very nice. Used to use Nikon film and then digital at work, 10 yrs ago. The digital was the latest in late 2002 but the 5300 beats the pants off of it. By miles. If you have reasonably late Nikon lenses then Nikon. If you need lenses as well anything 5400 (5300 replacement) or higher in Nikon or the comparably priced Canon is just amazing. For a bit less money the 3000 series Nikon works great, with a few less frills.
Mnemosyne (tablet)
@Steve from Antioch:
Really? That’s it? That’s all you’ve got?
Man, we need some new trolls. The only thing our current crop can do is spout tired buzzwords. At least Rick Perry managed to claim it was an “accident.” Now there’s some hardcore trolling you can aspire to!
Ruckus
@Mnemosyne (tablet):
Clean up in aisle steve from anitoch!
Doug R
@John Revolta: Repeating a line he first delivered during a visit to Selma, Ala., this month, Mr. Clinton said, ”As long as the waving symbol of one American’s pride is the shameful symbol of another American’s pain, we have bridges to cross in this country and we better get across them.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2000/03/30/us/clinton-enters-confederate-flag-debate.html
Elizabelle
@Germy Shoemangler: Even more: let him spill about his influences and associates. Way more helpful.
RSA
@Mandalay:
Unless it has to do with gay rights or abortion or disaster relief, of course. Could these guys pander any more transparently ?
Corner Stone
@John Revolta: I thought you were going for the Huckster, actually. I was just having some fun with the Hitlary angle.
John Revolta
@Iowa Old Lady: @Mandalay: I hardly need to say that 2007 is a long long time ago in politics. Why the current silence?
Look, I’m supporting Hillary for Prez, if only because I think she’s a clear winner and we really need to keep the White House. (And besides, she went to my hi skool!) But come on. If we’re gonna pour this sauce on the Repub geese, our gander needs to get some also too.
D58826
@Mandalay:
If the cowards would just say those words, the story would be over. Anyone with the IQ above a doorknob, heck even the doorknob, knows that the President can’t order the flag taken down but if the Goopers won’t stand up to their base on this then why should we believe they will stand up to Putin?
Ruckus
@Iowa Old Lady:
Seeing as how it is one nation, and we had a major discussion about this 150 yrs ago, which the side wanting to get out lost, maybe it’s time that we just rallied around actually being one nation. Some say it’s too big for that and I call bullshit. Some say the experiment has failed and I call bullshit on that. Some are trying to destroy what we are supposed to be as a country and I say bullshit to that. Selfish, greedy, racist assholes are what is ruining this country, not people of color, not immigrants (a friend just took the oath a few days ago, along with 971 of his new fellow citizens), not people trying to make life better for everyone. There is hope that we can do better.
John Revolta
@Doug R: I like Bill pretty well, but that there is some pretty mean mealymouth mixin’ o’ the metaphors.
Iowa Old Lady
@John Revolta: I too would like to hear her speak about this now. But it probably took more courage in 2007, and that she’s held that belief this long is a sign that it’s what she really thinks.
p.a.
“But let me tell you my opinions on
womens’God’s uteri that he has placed in women…”Germy Shoemangler
This blogger disagrees:
Enough with the flag already
I honestly don’t understand what she’s trying to say. She thinks the hate symbol flying proudly over government buildings is a trivial thing?
Mandalay
@John Revolta:
Your original post was about what the Clintons were doing in 1992, but now you’re saying that 2007 is a long time ago?
Regardless, I agree with you that her current reticence is very disappointing, and posted similar comments here a couple of days ago.
Tenar Darell
@lurker dean: @Corner Stone:
You know I read that, and all I could think was that if he and his producers wanted him to inhale his foot forever and ever, it just might have been easier to cut it off and then eat it.
JCT
@Esme’s Mom: The D70/70s series Nikons are pretty legendary. The upgrade decision depends on what lenses you have now (and if you want to keep using them) and how much you plan to shoot.
If I recall correctly the D70/70s came with a fine kit lens. If you decide you want to keep shooting with it then you should just go for one of the super DX series cameras. 3000/5000/7000. If you can afford the 5000 series try to go with that, the middle is usually the sweet spot for Nikon cameras, often a real step up from the 3000 and the 7000 more for an enthusiast shooter. If you look around (B&H photo is a good place to compare) you might find a previous version 5200/7100 I think – and save some $$. Differences tend to be incremental. Also take a look to see if the bundled kit lenses suit you. If not, or they are redundant with what you have, you can just buy the body and pick out a better lens. If you think you might want to go top of the DX line, the 7100 body is a good deal and a fantastic camera, commonly used as the FX backup for pros.
B&H has a sale going on at present.
FX is a different deal – the 610 is super and there might be some deals. Much more $$
Have fun!
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
This from a newspaper in Sumter SC, a place I was once stationed in, witnessed a Klang march in, and volunteered for Korea to get away from: http://theitem.com/stories/time-to-end-confederate-flag-discussion,249223
Amazing.
Mandalay
@D58826:
Exactly so, especially since Huckabee and Santorum present themselves as moral leaders, and their ducking this issue is unconscionable. But if they want to drag it out, and get shredded in the media, that’s fine by me.
It’s ironic that Mitt Romney is showing everyone – including Democrats – how to lead:
Good for him. I haven’t yet seen any major politician dare to go after him for those words, and if they do I think their political career would be over.
scav
@Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant): Golly indeed. Thanks.
Botsplainer
@Corner Stone:
Back when I did film and could run a darkroom, I used to play with a 200 mm lens and a 2X extender. Never could solve the light/speed problem enough to turn out anything that wasn’t an overly grainy piece of shit due to having to go with 400 or worse.
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
Also, FYWP.
Major Major Major Major
Christ on a cracker, how did I end up clicking a link to some sort of racist libertarian (but I repeat myself) blog? Which one of you assholes posted that on another thread?
I’m gonna watch Election.
Poopyman
Temps in the 90s I can usually handle, but these dewpoints in the high 70s make it really sucky out there. It’s gonna be a long summer, which really sucks given that it follows a long winter and a 5-day-long spring.
I’ve decided that the Republikud candidates are getting too numerous for a clown car. They shall now be called a Clownado.
Mandalay
@Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant): Thanks for that – it is the best discussion on Charleston that I have read.
Botsplainer
@Schlemazel:
He’ll be very unlikely to ever get to be in general population. He’ll be segregated and live in relative isolation if he gets the DP.
Of course, if he gets a lesser penalty, even as an AB pet he can count on being an AB girlfriend, given his youth and slight build.
John Revolta
@Mandalay: My crack about the Arkansas Gov’s mansion was just a wiseass bridge to compare current candidates for President. Not really what the OP was about.
But now I want some goose.
D58826
@Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant): excellent piece of writting
Poopyman
@Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant): Wow. I didn’t see comments at that site, but then again, I probably don’t really wanna see the comments that that no doubt would gather.
AxelFoley
@Steve from Antioch:
Or if only I could put my foot in your ass.
Omnes Omnibus
@Mandalay:
Source. Yep, HRC is staying silent while the Mittster leads.
OzarkHillbilly
@Botsplainer: the biggest problem with extenders has always been that they have to be matched to the telephoto lens to get results that are even in the ballpark of acceptable. Best bet has always been, “Spend the money for a real lens.” Back in the day I had a 400 mm I dearly loved. Took great photos.
raven
@Esme’s Mom: I bought my Canon T31 from K&H. They sell used stuff with a really nice rating system and money back guarantee. Worth a look.
gwangung
@John Revolta: Frankly, this is a bit more substantive and less symbolic:
http://www.occupydemocrats.com/watch-hillary-clinton-we-cant-hide-from-white-privilege-and-structural-racism/
raven
@AxelFoley: You’d have to stand in line.
raven
@Germy Shoemangler: She’s trying to say that it won’t matter if they take the flag down because of all the other shit that is happening. You may not agree but it’s not that hard to understand.
D58826
@Mandalay: I guess my problem with what Hillary may or may not have said about the flag over the past few days is we get into a shouting match over did she say certain words. Obama was criticized after the Benghazi attack for using the word ‘terrorism’ rather than ‘terrorist attack’. But when you listen to the entire statement it is obvious that he is talking about a terrorist attack. Whether she has actually used the word ‘flag’ seems less important than talking about the racial divide in this country. Faux news uses this magic word approach to generate a controversy where there isn’t one.
Mandalay
@Mandalay: And now the mayor of Charleston is speaking out about the Confederate Flag:
Even Jeb Bush finally got the idea:
But still silence from Clinton on the flag issue.
gogol's wife
@Corner Stone:
Good one. I’m too mad to answer him.
Esme's Mom
Wow, thanks all for the camera info!!!
gwangung
@Mandalay: Knock it off.
Roger Moore
@Ruckus:
It would probably also be worth considering something like Micro Four-Thirds if you want something a little bit smaller and lighter than a DSLR kit. I have a D800 that I dearly love for its picture quality, but the camera plus lenses that can do it justice winds up being quite a weight. A 5000-series would obviously be less, but it would still be heavier than a comparable MFT kit.
Mandalay
@D58826:
Seriously? You think that the Confederate flag flying on government property in South Carolina is not an important issue after nine black people were massacred by a white racist?
Baud
@Mandalay: Your shit is weak. Do you think you are persuading anyone who doesn’t already hate Hillary?
Corner Stone
@Mandalay:
Are you being willfully obtuse, as usual, or have you really not seen the multiple refernces to what Hillary has said on this issue? For years and also recently in CA at the Mayors’ Conference?
MattF
@NotMax: Speaking as someone who noticed his vision was deteriorating a few years ago and has just gone through 18 months of eye surgery– get a second opinion.
CarolDuhart2
@raven: Those who say that taking the flag down means nothing ignore what seeing that flag does to the people who see that everyday.
Symbols matter-which is why churches are covered in symbolism, why flags are flown. Symbols that are all around us unmolested say plenty about our collective values.
Corner Stone
@D58826:
“We” do not. Obsessed individuals either outright ignore the obvious, or then say, “Yeah, but”.
It’s a mug’s game to waller down there.
WereBear
@raven: This scenario often ends with the shooter committing suicide. It’s as though they want to kill themselves, but can’t without this “grand gesture” that drives them to it.
bystander
@lurker dean: Luckily, Rawstory referred to “NBC’s Churck Todd”. Typo? You decide.
Churck meanwhile is issuing an “I’m sorry you’re too stupid to understand what I was doing.” Meet the Press’s facebook page is not pretty.
raven
@CarolDuhart2: Well, apparently THEY are wrong and you are right.
Corner Stone
@OzarkHillbilly:
I’m sure this is one of the true examples of “get what you pay for”, but the used 300MM F4 I picked up was a pretty penny and going either to 400MM anything below F5.6 or 300MM below F4 is a professional grade class $$$.
Ruckus
@Roger Moore:
True. But the original commenter was used to a D70. A 5300-5400 is a better camera, very slightly smaller and lighter. I figured someone used to a D70 probably isn’t going to want much less.
@Esme’s Mom:
One thing to keep in mind is that the 7100, while a bit more $ than the 5400 is more like what you are used to in the D70, control and operation wise. The 5000 series will do the same things, but the adjustments are on menus rather than having control switches.
A site that I like for reviews
Yatsuno
@Mnemosyne (tablet): I keep saying we need a troll upgrade. But JC must be keeping Steve and Thurston in the sushi grade ahi or something.
D58826
@Mandalay: Yes it is an important issue but also just part of the larger issue of tyhe racial divide in tis country. Take the flag down and the haters will just have one more thing to hate on. We have to reduce the size of the pool of haters abd those who egg them on like Faux news. It’s we just sometimes get hung up on whither the politican said the proper words in the proper sequence.
To flip it over to the GOP, Rick Perry called the murders an ‘accident’ and he has been lambasted for it. His spokesperson later said he meant to say ‘incident’, which is still a rather weak word to describe what happened. Now give that English is not Rick Perry’s native language maybe he did get his tongue wrapped around his eye teeth. What is more important isn’t ‘accident vs incident’ it is Perry’s entire record and that is woefully lacking on this issue.
Faux news was upset because it took Obama 32 hours to comment on the underwear bomber but they were fine with it taking Bush 60 hours to comment on the shoe bomber. I’m not sure wither either time scale proves a whole heck of a lot about the political world;d view of the two men but it certain allowed Hannity and company to rant and rave about Obama. I don’t remember a lot of ranting over the length of time it took Bush to respond.
That is the point I was trying to make.
Corner Stone
@Mandalay:
Just leaving out your unhealthy obsession with HRC, do you honestly, for no fucking around, think that Romney is out front leading “Democrats” on this issue?
Major Major Major Major
@Botsplainer: only after they give him his new haircut.
That said, prison rape still isn’t funny. Not that you were making a joke but it’s just one of my pet causes so I figured I’d remind everyone.
ruemara
@Esme’s Mom: I just swapped out my beloved Sony a58 for a Nikon D5200 (sync capability, higher MP and Nikon lenses). You can pick up a kit for under $700. Not really loving the Nikkor 20M prime I borrowed, but with the 55-200mm (which I also don’t quite love) it works well. I’d swing for a 55mm and a 70-300mm with this. I loved that combo. Here’s the stuff I shot with the new kit and it does look good. Ok, now I have to go get cleaned up and purtificated. Never been on a red carpet, so I hope I don’t trip on my skirt. I already did that at a ball last weekend. I normally wear pants.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Major Major Major Major: I’, certain (to the extent I can be with someone I’ve not met) Botsplainer was making an observation and that you’re correct he wasn’t making a joke. But it’s always worth reminding people that rape is never funny, and prison rape jokes are just as creepy as any other rape “jokes.”
Redshift
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): And if those things were to happen to him in prison, it’s still just another way that our system is fucked up, not some kind of “justice.”
CarolDuhart2
@raven: I am right. Notice that after World War II, the Germans were banned from using Nazi symbols. Symbols are a form of non-verbal speech,and evil symbols are a form of non-verbal hate speech. Those who its directed too feel intimidated and those who share those views feel justified in feeling that there are others who share those views.
The swastika ban worked to tamp down neo-Nazi and warmongering tendencies, allowing Germans to finally cleanse themselves of the hatred and move on. Germany is far more humane and civilized now-and Jews are even moving back to places like Nuremberg and Berlin.
Unfortunately, there was nothing similar done after the Civil War here, and we see the result a century later.
You would be hardpressed to find a swastika cup, license plate, or flag flying over a house. Even though there’s no ban on any of these things here. The message got sent a long time ago that those things-and the attitudes with them, are unacceptable. And the Nazis killed relatively few Americans compared to the Confederates.
Its time to do the same with all of the Confederate stuff.
raven
I think someone needs to gush at me about what a good decision it was NOT to be a father. That is all.
raven
@CarolDuhart2: Thanks for the lecture.
Tree With Water
Here’s an example of why I tuned out cable news even after finally being able to afford it. The corporate garbage was as as glaringly obvious to me back then, but I recall being more- let’s say, “adroit”. An obscenity occurred on Meet The Press today that speaks volumes about power in America. Chuck Todd and that whole outfit is a goddamn disgrace, and that fact that he, they, and it feed at the trough of the public airwaves should, by god, be revisited.
“..Following the tragic deaths of nine black church-goers in Charleston at the hands of an alleged white supremacist, NBC host Chuck Todd featured a segment with only black murderers who were regretful of using guns…”
The full article is posted at Crooks & Liars.com.
Aleta
@raven: “what a good decision it was NOT to be a father”
Well done.
raven
@Aleta: :)
raven
Picture of Nepal Buddha With Swastika Symbols Side — Nepal Buddha with Swastika and Symbol Closeup Side Face
gogol's wife
@CarolDuhart2:
I agree with you. Of course it’s not the only thing that needs to happen, but it needs to happen.
Germy Shoemangler
@CarolDuhart2: Well said.
Steve from Antioch
@Corner Stone:
Exactly right. I’ve lost count of the number of posts I have seen in other pages about the shooters (supposed) drug use and how that links him with various other mass shooters.
But as tp your first point if 20 or 30 white school children isn’t enough to move the debate on gun control, this sure isn’t going to move the needle on gun control. (Which, to be clear, is fine with me because gun control is mainly about making people feel good, not accomplishing anything.)
The Thin Black Duke
@CarolDuhart2: Amen. And thank you.
Botsplainer
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q):
You’re absolutely correct. My point was on the brutality of the AB, even for its heroes.
raven
@CarolDuhart2:
And just exactly how do you propose to do that, shame these motherfuckers? Make the symbols illegal?
CarolDuhart2
@raven: I know that the swastika was stolen from ancient peoples-the Nazis were thieves as well.
But the ban may ironically have saved these historic uses. Since the Nazi symbolism was banned and stigmatized, those could be appreciated in their innocent purity.
The Confederate flag has no such innocent meanings-it was vile from the beginning and now. Best eliminate it altogether.
CarolDuhart2
@raven: At least take it off buildings that the public pays for. Make the sales unpopular, unprofitable, and the display unwelcome. Nobody has to pass a law about this-plenty of ignorant stuff goes away simply because its considered declasse’ or crass.
raven
@CarolDuhart2: Taking them out of public display on government property is exactly what should be done. The author of the article that started this contends that would be a symbolic move and that she wants more tangible effort. My comment was that I understood what she was saying. They took it off of the Georgia flag (sort of) 14 years ago and not much else has changed for the better. That was my point.
WereBear
The flag has become an issue. It’s simple and direct and South Carolina defending it says something. Something not good.
It’s a start.
Corner Stone
@Steve from Antioch: I don’t remember mentioning Newtown. Beyond being another mass murder using guns I’m not sure how it ties into my comment at all.
My comment was not about gun control in the slightest. It was about a hate filled white guy murdering 9 people in a church because they were black.
People on the right, including R presidential candidates, wanted to make this about any and everything other than a racist hate crime, and act of domestic terrorism.
Howard Beale IV
@raven: Unfortunately, unlike the Israeli BDS process, it’s tough to do that to SC, short of not buying products whose core manufacturing is done with companies HQ’ed in SC – BMW is really the only company you could put heat on.
CarolDuhart2
It’s not an either-or here. Tangible effort could mean not only demonstrating, but joining those organizations who are already fighting the battle-NAACP, Color of Change. If these organization had 10 million members, change would happen a whole lot quicker and a whole lot easier.
But removing those symbols matter-not only do #BlackLivesMatter, but also #BlackMentalHealth matters as well. Why keep them up? Jews don’t have to look at every car to see if they are sporting a Nazi symbol. Why should we have to suffer for someone else’s twisted “heritage”?
raven
@Howard Beale IV: The Nazi flag is not illegal in Israel according to the wiki.
Corner Stone
@Tenar Darell:
I’m still just like…WTeverlovingF?
What’s it called when you’re gobsmacked to an order of magnitude that is light years beyond peak wingnut reality?
Who, I say who, could have ever in their right minds put together a segment on violent crime and thought having all black males was a good thing? And no one raised their hand in production and said, “Hey, so I was thinking…”
Steve from Antioch
@Corner Stone:
You’re right, you didn’t mention it but I assumed you were taking about gun control because you were responding to me and because that is the subject of the thread’s starting post.
In any event, you’re certainly correct that some people on the right, including R presidential candidates, are trying to make it about religion or drug use or (my favorite) anti-Americanism since there was that one picture of the shooter posing with a burning US flag.
Villago Delenda Est
There’s a lot to be said for that Jim Jeffries clip, but one of the things that stood out for me is how effortlessly he switches to an American accent as opposed to his own regular Aussie one when it’s appropriate. The musket bit at the end was a scream.
GHayduke (formerly lojasmo)
@Mnemosyne (tablet):
4chan is too sophistocated for him. He sticks to Reddit, I’m sure.
WaterGirl
@Villago Delenda Est: I think he may just be the smartest, funniest, most talented comedian i have ever seen.
You are so right about the accent, but it’s even more than that. He perfectly captures each person he is mocking with the tone of his voice and the look on his face. He is clearly a watcher of people.
WaterGirl
@Villago Delenda Est: I missed the edit window.
I though his portrayal of the Australian government & the people’s response after their massacre and then the US government and response after the massacre of the school children was absolutely perfect.
dogwood
@Corner Stone:
The last time I watched MTP was sometime in 2005. I’m doing the crossword and listening to a panel consisting of Dick Luger, Chuck Hagel, and Barack Obama discuss some overseas trip they had taken together as part of efforts concerning loose nukes. Nothing controversial or antagonistic about the exchange. At the end of the segment, out of nowhere, Russert turns to Obama and asks him to respond to some nasty quote about W that Harry Belafonte had released. I’m a middle aged white woman and that embarrassed me enough that I never watched the show again. But what Chuck Todd did today was simply beyond the realm of anything that is remotely decent. I hope the family and friends of the victims in Charleston don’t see this at least for awhile. And it’s not even that they showed it today. There are thousands upon thousands of white guys in prison for gun violence. They couldn’t find even ONE to interview? Disgusting.
Randy P
Isn’t South Carolina a Stand Your Ground state? Roof already stated in his post-murder declaration how he felt threatened by the existence of African-Americans. Seems to me he’s got a good defense in both the letter and the spirit of what SYG laws are all about.
Mnemosyne (tablet)
@bystander:
I told my spouse and he said, Of course all of the prisoners featured in the story were black — they probably couldn’t find a white guy who was willing to admit his use of a gun was anything but proper and completely justified.
Steve
I have guns at my house. If anybody tries to come and take them I will resist
weaselone
@Steve: Now isn’t that precious.
Does that also apply to your incandescent bulbs?
CarolDuhart2
@Steve: Nobody is going to take your guns. Nobody has the time or cares enough. But that’s not what you are really afraid of. It’s that people are telling the truth about guns and the damage they do to people and how they would like to live in a world with far fewer.
I read somewhere that gun ownership is at its lowest in U.S history, but those who do are stockpiling them. People just aren’t as afraid as they used to of anything and sales are dropping.
Tree With Water
@Steve: I have a 4 foot radius peace sign that’s coated green nailed atop an 18 foot tall tree stump in my yard.
Betty Cracker
Since this is an open thread, two random observations:
1) The PGA should hire a goon squad to patrol tournament crowds and punch anyone who screams “GET IN THE HOLE!!!!” after the ball is struck right in the stones.
2) Why are so many wingnut trolls named “Steve”? Coincidence, or Cole’s cat having some fun with us?
Omnes Omnibus
@Betty Cracker: I blame the cat.
fuckwit
Let’s see is Steve from Portland, and Bob from Antioch?
What’s next, Ted from Alabama?
Maybe the Rovians have lerned from the Putinians.
fuckwit
@raven: That takes courage and foresight, and insight, and wisdom, and perserverance, and vigilance. Excellent decision; I commend you.
fuckwit
@CarolDuhart2: Naw, that’s not true. I’m coming for his guns. Booga booga! Gonna take em away. And his tiny little pee pee too.
Seriously, I understand the usefulness of guns, especially for things like hunting. I understand the aesthetic appeal of them (like fighter planes, fast cars, industrial machinery, fast computers, waterfalls, big waves, elegant algorithms, large jungle cats, thunderstorms, tornadoes, etc, powerful things can be COOL). What I don’t understand is the fetishism, the terror of losing them, the pathetic clinging to them (with cold, dead fingers) like a comfort blanket. That’s the part I find paranoid and dangerous.
Paul in KY
@ruemara: I generally use a Nikon Coolpix S9500. Has a nice zoom on it. Good for getting nice photos at concerts.
Paul in KY
@raven: I can imagine, though, that if you started flying or displaying a Nazi banner in Israel, the settlers might pause from their Arab-bashing to have a go at you.
Paul in KY
@WaterGirl: That massacre in Australia (the one where the murdering POS killed 40 odd people) was the equivalent of someone over here murdering 1,000 people.