If Rand Paul were still practicing medicine he’d be malpracticing medicine:
In an interview with Fox News radio host John Gibson last week, Rand Paul argued that a ban on people traveling from west African “ought to be considered.”
“It’s not like AIDS,” he explained. “AIDS is difficult to transmit. You’re not going to go into a cocktail party and have someone cough and get AIDS. If you are in a cocktail party with someone with Ebola and they cough, you are at risk for getting Ebola.”
The Kentucky senator said that a “temporary hiatus on flights” was “only reasonable.”
Rand is so full of shit that even his daddy thinks he’s full of shit:
Ron Paul, who is a medical doctor, pointed out that an estimated 3,000 to 49,000 people died every year from influenza, but no one was considering a travel ban to stop the flu from spreading.
“So right now, I would say a travel ban is politically motivated more than something done for medical purposes,” he concluded.
What’s more, he’s so full of shit that even the credulous both-sides-do-it factchecking hack Glenn Kessler thinks he’s full of shit.
Also, too: what’s “libertarian” about restricting the precious autonomy of people who want to travel in and out of Africa?
burnspbesq
In a perfectly market-driven world, there would be no transaction costs or other impediments to paying Africans not to come here.
Sen. Paul is simply assuming the existence of that perfectly market-driven world with no transaction costs.
Or sumpin’ sumpin.’
Elizabelle
I wonder if Rand Paul will go to that “White Privilege Conference” in Louisville next March. Author of “Waking Up White” will be there.
They kinda had to put in those last 2 points, but suspect conference will be of interest to said groups.
The Other Chuck
He was of course, corrected immediately by the diligent fact-checkers of the press. Right?
Oh sorry, been dropping acid lately. Makes things more sane.
Bobby Thomson
It’s a lot more like AIDS than it is like the flu. All the people in the US to contract the disease picked it up in Africa or are health care workers. It spread very rapidly in Liberia. It hasn’t spread at all here.
The problem is that most reporters are too ignorant to know how ignorant Baby Doc’s statement was and too stupid to correct their ignorance.
Joel
Where’s the fucking reporting on this?
Patricia Kayden
Do you think someone like Rand Paul wouldn’t take the opportunity to promote banning Africans from traveling abroad? Some doctor! You would think that he’d try to be a little objective and professional, but no. Fear mongering right up there with the best of them.
piratedan
yeah, but he’s pro-cannibis, so he’s cool…..
Hal
Steve Kornacki and guests this past weekend insisted Obama had to restrict travel for purely political reasons. It just has to happen because there was a poll that said people overwhelmingly support a ban. I like his show but media creates narratives, then reports on the fallout. Try harder to educate people on their erroneous assumptions once in a damn while.
Elizabelle
I worry a bit about the golden 21-day window, because I think it’s statistically possible to see some outlier cases beyond that.
Although we are told the patient is not contagious unless ill enough to show symptoms, and recently quarantined people are not going to be cavalier about a subsequent decline in health.
The hysteria is becoming the story, though.
nellcote
I might support a travel ban if they start with Texas.
Belafon
@Elizabelle: How long would you make it?
Bobby Thomson
@Hal: A lot of people in Salem, Massachusetts insisted on draconian measures against witchcraft, too. Actually, that’s an unfair analogy. Unfair to the witch hangers.
Belafon
@nellcote: If it includes the provision “Ted Cruz and Rick Perry are not allowed back in the state” I’ll go along with it.
John M. Burt
The other day, someone called angrily for a travel ban. I told him that his opinion was clearly a strong one, which I supposed must mean he had rejected the arguments against it, and could therefore describe them . . . ?
skerry
I am so fucking tired of hearing about ebola.
Get a flu shot. Vaccinate your kids. Put into place and enforce background checks on all gun purchases. Then talk to me about ebola.
lamh36
Speaking of Ebola and medical malpractice…So my friend who’s lives in DFW and who used to work at Presby D tells me that Presby is running on 15 to 50 percent staff on hand all other are gone…. No patients want to go there… Thinking of lay off ppl!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I snarked at Tulsi Gabbard for saying we need to double the quarantine period, but apparently a very credible doctor is making that case, and he admits to talking about a very small group, but as the talking heads on MSNBC are pointing out now, and as the case of the Duncan family suggests, people are most contagious in the late stages of the disease. I guess it depends on how strict a quarantine would be. What does that entail in this day and age?
ETA: Politico’s Glenn Thrush, who no longer wears his affecta-dora on TeeVee, says Obama has no real legislative agenda to deal with Ebola. Sam Stein points out that he also has no legislature, but I’d be more interested in hearing what legislation is supposed to do in the short term. A sense of the Senate resolution telling ebola to stop being contagious?
gene108
@Joel:
I do believe scaring the crap out of people regarding Ebola is a ratings winner.
By saying the media should not get people panicked over Ebola means you hate the fact they can make more money from advertisers, i.e. you hate capitalism.
Therefore you hate America!
Gin & Tonic
@nellcote: I’d ban them for this, from ABC-13 Eyewitness News in Houston, on their Web site:
Unless he was writing about the derivation of the name “Goliath birdeater”, he is an entomologist, not an etymologist.
Gin & Tonic
@lamh36: The free market at work!
scav
@Joel: Speaking of Free, Nigeria’s been declared clear by WHO through it’s own efforts although clearly they need to keep their vigilance up (another comment about it here). And they managed that while still juggling with the Boko Haram and the missing girls et al. Can we possibly fly in some of their experts about managing multiple things at once? To back up our Kenyan?
JPL
@skerry: I think that’s what important. Wouldn’t it be informative if the news would talk about getting a flu. The number of people that die a year from the flu is preventable. Wouldn’t it be nice if pigs could fly?
Mike in NC
@Elizabelle:
There are already a bunch of those: CPAC, Values Voters Summit, Palin Family BBQ, etc.
JPL
@Mike in NC: At least at the Palin gatherings, there’s alcohol.
Felanius Kootea
@lamh36: Not surprised that no patients want to go to that hospital.
Howard Beale IV
@lamh36: An ounce of image is worth a pond of performance. Texas Presby is living that axiom right now.
Trollhattan
Maybe li’l Aqua Buddha has been inhaling at the gun range.
And you thought all you needed to do to stay safe on the job was stop giving Uzis to ten-year-olds.
Loneoak
Autonomy of movement must be part of that 2/5 of liberty that people with African ancestry lack.
Cacti
Reminds me of when Bill Frist, MD (cardiology) could diagnose the extent of Terri Schiavo’s cerebral trauma based on Mom and Dad’s home videos.
Elizabelle
@Belafon:
And that is the issue. I have no idea; one has to be practical as well.
I worry, though, that President Obama and the administration might encounter another “You can keep your current healthcare plan” moment if they trumpet the 21-days, and it turns out that some cases manifest later.
Main thing is having those potentially exposed monitor their temperatures at least twice daily, for longer than 21 days if necessary. They will be a motivated group.
scav
@Howard Beale IV: Their performance was a few shillings short of a pound at best, although they certainly threw a few bob toward the hashtag PR crew as a make-weight after the virus left the ER.
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
Unfortunately, I can’t really blame the patients — the hospital screwed up multiple times, so even I would think twice about going there. If they can’t handle something with known protocols like ebola, how are they going to protect me from something like MRSA?
Add in the nurse assistant in El Paso who was working in the neonatal unit with active tuberculosis and it’s been a bad couple of months for Texas hospitals.
Belafon
@Elizabelle: Imagine if, sometime in the next couple of weeks, one of the people on the list contracts the flu.
Mnemosyne
@Elizabelle:
I kind of wonder about those reports of cases post-21 days, though. Are they absolutely, 100 percent sure that those people could not have been infected after the quarantine ended? Even the doctor reporting it seems to be saying that they are outlier cases.
Roger Moore
It’s libertarian in the true spirit of IGMFY libertarianism.
Elizabelle
@Belafon:
It will be more interesting to the media than covering gun deaths or austerity economics’ failings.
Howard Beale IV
@scav: Whoever the Infection Disease director was at Texas Presby, their career trajectory should be changing – and not necessarily for the better. But then again, Texas is perhaps the worst state to be in when it comes to succeeding in winning malpractice cases.
Cacti
Also too, Nigeria has been declared Ebola-free with no new cases in 42 days.
Total infections were contained at 19 with 8 deaths.
Kind of a big deal as Nigeria is the most populous country in Africa, and 7th most populous in the world.
Elizabelle
@Belafon:
You are in Texas, if memory serves. What are you and your friends/community saying about this? What’s the best — or most egregious — reporting you are seeing on Ebola Comes to Dallas?
PS: was sorting through some old WaPost clippings from last year, and found an item about the April 2013 West, Texas fertilizer plant explosion — killed 15 people, most of them emergency responders, and could have leveled a school or nursing home.
Remember that one? It seems to be down a memory hole. Bidness rules. Don’t need no stinking zoning or public safety measures.
On other side of clipping, GOP Congress shrieking about Hillary Clinton’s possible complicity in those four Benghazi deaths.
SatanicPanic
@Roger Moore: that and Libertarianism being all about freedom for white men
Marc
I’m shocked that a self-accredited ophthalmologist doesn’t know the first thing about virology.
scav
@Cacti: Yours made it through FYWP! I was impressed they’d managed that while also juggling with Boko Haram and the missing girls (not over yet but progressing). Go Super Eagles!
jl
Yean, if an Ebola patient is sick enough to have run an extremely high fever for days, sick as a dog with bloody vomiting and diarrhea, massively dehydrated and so weak that has trouble walking, then you better be really scared that he or she could walk into a elevator with you and cough in your general direction, or get in an airplane seat next to you and breath on you. You may well get infected, but what is likelihood that person walking around, or that you would get infected from the sneeze versus all the other stuff that is going on?
it is not like somebody coming down with flu or measles, and just starting to feel unusually tired and doesn’t know is coming down with anything, walk through a room and cough or smear some little patch of something with something that touched his or her nose and get some people in the room sick.
But, if you are willing to say anything for some short term gain… what the hell, spout BS
Rand Paul knows enough to know that by now. So he is vile political opportunist and panic monger.
This comment is a retread of one I made on the lamh36 Q&A announcement thread yesterday, but I think it bears repeating.
schrodinger's cat
@Cacti: I spoke to my SIL in India yesterday, she is an MD pathologist in Bombay and works for a reputed lab there. She did not seem freaked out at all. She said that her lab was currently seeing a lot of cases of Dengue Fever, a mosquito borne illness and Ebola was not on their radar at all.
Elizabelle
RE West, Texas: from the Wiki link:
Did we hear much when report came out? It had a lot of deaths and drama. Happened in Texas.
NYTimes article: actually, 14 dead, 10 of them firefighters/emergency responders.
brettvk
@Trollhattan: This may explain the demonstrated mental status of ammosexuals.
Omnes Omnibus
@Loneoak: We all have African ancestry if you trace it back far enough.
sharl
OT, but does anyone wise in the ways of IT vulnerability/security issues know how seriously to take the SSL 3.0 Protocol Vulnerability and POODLE Attack?
Things like this tend to always be a big deal where I work, and provisional corrective measures have been issued to us by the sysadmin folks. [FYI, how it gets handled depends on the browser(s) you’re using.]
If I read that linked CERT notice correctly, it’s not such an easy vulnerability for a ne’er-do-well to implement, although the possible consequences of a successful attack look to be potentially severe, based on what’s in the IMPACT section at that link.
It’s always some damn thing…
Elizabelle
OT, kind of, from thinking about West, Texas, and Republican Senators saying the darnedest things:
So, does Joni Ernst, GOP Senate candidate in Iowa, really want to do away with the EPA and the Department of Education? It’s routine campaign fodder for wingnuts.
PolitiFact looked into it and — yuppers!
Rand Paul. Jim Inhofe, who put a hold on releasing funds for fighting Ebola in Africa recently (since lifted). Too many others to name.
Joni Ernst has a not-zero chance of joining them.
Republicans have much weirder and more ignorant Senators and Senate candidates than do Democrats.
Wonder why.
Roger Moore
@schrodinger’s cat:
I think a big reason it’s so easy to sell Americans fear of random crap like Ebola and ISIL is because many people don’t have enough real worries. Our brains are wired to be afraid of stuff, and in the absence of genuine danger, we’ll latch on to anything that comes along.
Cacti
@schrodinger’s cat:
I’ve heard Ebola called the Kim Kardashian of African diseases, in terms being more sizzle than steak. It’s tragic that 4,000 people have died from it, but relatively speaking, that’s a drop in the bucket of the 500,000 Africans who die from malaria each year, or the 600,000 who die from diarrhea and enteric diseases from contaminated water.
lurker dean
meanwhile in south jersey, a rwandan family is basically being forced to keep their kids out of school because of ebola. no, neither the kids nor the parents have it. in fact, there is no ebola in rwanda, which is 2600 miles away from the closest ebola case in africa. smh.
http://tinyurl.com/ldbxaw3
schrodinger's cat
@Roger Moore: There is also an industry that makes money off of the manufactured anxiety. The right wing media in particular and also their MSM brethren on cable TV.
schrodinger's cat
@Elizabelle: The media hacks don’t care, I guess, because they don’t live in Iowa.
Anoniminous
The latest media PANICS! have been a couple of damp squibs. First ISIS or IS of whatever-it-is got stopped by a ragtag mob of Kurdish militia in Kobani or Kobane or ʿAyn al-ʿArab or whatever-it-is. Second, Ebola seems determined to not rampage through the US.
All very depressing for our illustriousness Infotainment companies.
sharl
@Elizabelle: The topic of chemical safety always gets under my skin.
Although I was already pretty certain about the Bush Administration not really being serious about genuine national security stuff, their behavior on chemical safety and security issues totally confirmed their cold cynicism (also too).
StringOnAStick
The MSM has got to be quite simply rolling in it right now; between Ebola and campaign ads, the cash is flying towards them like a tornado at Dorothy. I can barely stand to try to get a look at the evening weather report – too much Ebola and nasty campaign ads.
Trollhattan
@lurker dean:
The members of Toto are now on the no-fly list on account of their song, “Africa.”
scav
@lurker dean: Oh, this is more than the trifecta for the Nasty-‘Mercans. Justification! and Cover! for their innate hatred of immigrants and the differently-melanined, while proudly flaunting their bone-idle ignorance of science, medicine and geography as “common sense” and working out a little anti-government bias while calling for czars and international quarentines.
Luthe
@lurker dean: It’s south Jersey. Color me un-fucking-surprised.
Corner Stone
@Trollhattan: “I bless the Ebola down in Africa.”
Cole Approved Quarantine ™
g
Well, if you are at a cocktail party and someone projectile vomits on your, you may be at risk of getting Ebloa. What kind of cocktail parties does Senator Paul go to?
Jebediah, RBG
@Gin & Tonic:
Well, the spider is called a “birdeater” (yikes!) Maybe Naskrecki saw a bird, and then saw that the spider et him. He studied the occurrence, so he is now an et-him-ologist. So you see it was just a spelling error.
Corner Stone
@Trollhattan: Have we quarantined Angelina Jolie yet? Didn’t she do that Lara Croft: Cradle of Life movie that one time?
Burn her!! Ummm, I mean Cole Approved Quarantine ™ her!!
I, for one, will volunteer to bring her supplies and self-quarantine with her, as needed.
What about all those guys who made the movie Zulu? Should we also track down all their descendants and Cole Approved Quarantine ™ them as well?
It’s the only way to be safe.
Elizabelle
@StringOnAStick:
You named it.
I wonder if we will see public financing of campaigns, and the end to the permanent campaign, during our lifetimes.
It’s appalling how much money flows to political campaigns and consultants now. It’s enriching them, diverting money from better social uses, and killing our democracy.
Campaigns, for the most part, sell negativity and drive cynicism.
Elizabelle
@Corner Stone:
Ms. Jolie gave birth in Africa, too. Namibia, to be precise, which is not known to have an Ebola problem. But we have to be vigilant!
Geography is not most people’s strong point.
MomSense
@Joel:
Ebola was the only story scary enough to move ‘ISIS is coming to kill you in your bed while you sleep’ off the top slot. We’ll skip over any good news and go right to the next manufactured mediapocalypse.
In my own personal good news, I just put 3 pounds of root vegetables in the oven with lots of garlic, lemon EVOO and S&P. Wish I could share with all of you how good it smells in my kitchen right now.
Howard Beale IV
@Elizabelle: Speaking of serial killers, it appears there were 7 murders this weekend in Chicago’s rough-and-tumble next door neighbor, Hammond/Garry IN-all by one dude.
Baud
@Elizabelle:
I wouldn’t be surprised if Brazil were closer to West Africa than Namibia.
JPL
@Elizabelle: This is the biggest understatement of the day…
Geography is not most people’s strong point.
A friend went to South Africa this summer and someone asked me if she was concerned about ebola. Never mind that she was home in mid July but she was 3,000 miles away.
gene108
@lurker dean:
What can I say, the people of Maple Shade, NJ are hardworking salt of the Earth people…you know…MORANS!
Roger Moore
@Cacti:
I think this is probably part of our general difficulty in accurately judging relative risk. Ebola is exceptionally scary because a large fraction of the people who get it die horribly. Those two things- the high mortality rate and the gruesomeness of the deaths- are especially scary, so they make us overestimate how dangerous it is.
d58826
According to Calgary Ted, the reason the Senate has blocked the Surgeon-General nomination is because the nominee is a political activist not a medical professional. Now Cruz is lying thru his teeth and he knows it. Of course the talking head on the Sunday talk show never pointed that out.
It is not an original observation but this is one more example of the GOP’s political terrorism. Whither the Democrats hang on to the Senate in 2014 or regain control in 2016, the GOP will always be able to block anything a democratic president proposes. And why should they change their stripes at this point, as they have been amply rewarded at the ballot box for their terrorism. I even question the ‘optimism’ that the House might flip after the 2020 census. The Goopers are so entrenched in enough state legislatures that they will simply gerrymander their way to continued control.As long as the majority of the electorate either votes against their interests or don’t vote at all, nothing will change.
The Other Chuck
@sharl: POODLE is a pretty serious threat in that it makes SSLv3 pretty much completely broken, but it’s less a threat to browsers than to other user-agents using https that are likely to allow protocol downgrades (bad) or even top out at SSLv3 (basically totally broken). Think firmware updates on a router. It’s not as bad as Heartbleed or even CRIME/BEAST because the attacker has to execute a man-in-the-middle attack, which means they already have to have broken into the target network some degree.
You can check if a server is vulnerable to POODLE (and other things) with a cert checker here: https://ssltools.websecurity.symantec.com/checker/views/certCheck.jsp
(note that if a server supports SSLv3, they may likely have patched it to not support gratuitous protocol downgrades, making them POODLE-invulnerable except against really ancient browsers like IE6)
Elizabelle
@Roger Moore:
It’s why some people are afraid to fly, but will drive around in rat-trap cars.
Roger Moore
@Anoniminous:
That would be “a ragtag mob of Kurdish militia backed by American airpower”, to be precise. I’m guessing that the American airpower had a lot to do with it.
Elizabelle
@Howard Beale IV: Seven that we know about, I think. Gruesome.
Corner Stone
@Roger Moore: I think ISIS is kinda sorta like the Bacardi Family. Fate threw a lot at them.
Because True Passion ™ can’t be tamed.
JPL
@Howard Beale IV: @Elizabelle: I might have missed it, but the local news in GA didn’t mention it as far as I know. Most of the broadcast was about Ebola.
sharl
@The Other Chuck: Thanks much for that explanation! Very helpful.
Howard Beale IV
@JPL: I’m sorta an ex-pat Chicagoan (lived there for 12 years) so I keep watch on things back there. That drowned out any shootings that occurred.
Cervantes
@Elizabelle:
You will not — and I don’t think it even depends on precisely how far into the future you mean by “during our lifetimes.”
Howard Beale IV
@Cervantes: Sorta like wishing for mandatory voting like they have in Australia. Hell, I’d rather have Congress be replaced with a Parliamentarian system with votes of no confidence-just think how quickly all of that money spent on campaigning would get drained.
Felanius Kootea
@Cacti: A friend of mine who just returned to Boston from a one week visit to Nigeria got a nice memo from her workplace asking her not to come to work for three weeks because of Ebola. They will pay for her three weeks off, so she is looking forward to enjoying her extra vacation time.
Felanius Kootea
@lurker dean: Ironically, from the comments on that piece, travelers to Rwanda have to state whether or not they’ve been to the US in the last 21 days because of the cases in Texas.
Cervantes
Has Rand Paul pointed out yet that “Ebola” is an anagram of “Obama”?
Tree With Water
This remark exemplifies a republican drama queen hitting on all 8 cylinders, yet it still only serves as a typical example of what republican candidates must nowadays bring to the rhetorical table in order to suck at the tits of assorted billionaires. The utterly shameless need only apply.
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE KELLY (R-PENNSYLVANIA): Oh, you don’t have to worry about this, you don’t have to worry about this. Really? Well, the government needs to stop acting as if it’s absurd for people to fear a virus that liquefies their internal organs,
Howard Beale IV
@Felanius Kootea: We’ll have to watch places like South Africa and see if it grabs a foothold there-so far, it appears they’ve dodged a very big bullet, especially with the air transit they support from Johanesburg (AF/BA/CP/DL/EY/KL/LH/SQ/VS)
Cacti
@Felanius Kootea:
What a windfall for your friend.
Howard Beale IV
@Tree With Water:
Quotes like this whizbang proffers make flaming gays look straight.
Felanius Kootea
@Cacti: She was furious initially but later saw the bright side of it.
Renie
TIme magazine has Rand Paul on the cover as The Most Interesting Politician. Wonder what their definition of ‘interesting’ is.
chopper
@lurker dean:
Oh Jesus Christ in a chicken basket. Seriously?
Felanius Kootea
@Renie: Hypocritical?
Tree With Water
@Howard Beale IV: I tend to associate the term drama queen with a friend’s daughter back when she was 3 or 4 years old. Her mood swings were beyond impressive, I mean, they inspired awe. But her dramatics were beautiful, appropriate to a toddler. Unlike the ugly sense of the term I apply to the republican party, with their vicious, calculated rhetoric designed to scare the timid and deceive the credulous.
Howard Beale IV
@Tree With Water: My older brother, who spent decades working in the military industrial complex and who himself has witnessed some of the government’s own dirty dealing and backstabbings but just can’t quite accept liberals on their own terms tends to be one of those who love to excoriate liberals – except when they turn around and shine the mirror on conservative’s own spectacular failures-yet he has the gall to to say – ‘There’s what the left says, there’s what the right says, and there’s the truth’ – on which I shoot back – yeah – whose truth, kemosabe?