This whole mess gets weirder and weirder:
Attorney Mark Mayfield was found dead of an apparent self-inflicted gunshot wound Friday at his Ridgeland home.
Mayfield, vice chairman of the Mississippi Tea Party, and is one of the three men charged with conspiring with Clayton Kelly to photograph U.S. Sen. Thad Cochran’s bedridden wife in her nursing home and create a political video against Cochran.
DAILY LEDES: Madison County conservative activist remembers Mayfield
Ridgeland Police Department responded to Mayfield’s home to investigate the shooting.
Wonder how long before the nutters go all Vince Foster on Cochran?
? Martin
Won’t happen. White male conservatives don’t get that treatment.
aangus
“Wonder how long before the nutters go all Vince Foster on Cochran?”
Already started, I’m sure.
1Edit. Well, Martin and I have set the limits for this discussion, have fun filling in the middle ground. : )
catclub
can I just refer to my post in the previous thread – which was an open thread.
Rather than rile up FYWP.
Skippy-san
Let the conspiracy theories begin!
Mnemosyne
@? Martin:
The MSM won’t do it, but it sounds like some of Mayfield’s Tea Party buddies are already claiming it was a conspiracy.
catclub
@aangus: There are people saying that a)Cochran is done and b)I ain’t voting for him.
But I have my doubts there are enough to actually throw the vote in November. We live in hope.
I guess I will put up signs to “Write in McDaniel”
C.V. Danes
Not to sound cold-hearted, but isn’t this just the free market at work?
MattF
Given Soonergrunt’s report of a body-double representing an OK district, it looks like the weird is in full bloom. I just want to know– why a body-double and not an alien? And was anyone abducted and ‘probed’?
D58826
Only vaguely OT, but since its June Obama can’t be waging war on Christmas, so this will have to do until then
It must be exhausting to be a true murkin patriot
Paul in KY
It’s obvious Hillary had it done. Only logical conclusion.
CONGRATULATIONS!
Tip of the iceberg, I’m thinking. Guy doesn’t shoot himself over what, at best, would be a misdemeanor offense. Something a lot bigger and nastier going on.
NonyNony
@catclub:
How’s the Democratic candidate (Childers)? Does he have a shot in hell of leveraging “REPUBLICANS IN DISARRAY” into a GOTV for himself? Or would the conservatives have to basically destroy themselves completely before he has a shot of getting the seat?
OzarkHillbilly
I blame Obama.
catclub
From the article:
So he could have said: “We only do that for certain other offenders, not white lawyers.”
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@CONGRATULATIONS!: The bigger and nastier may be an undiagnosed or untreated brain disorder (often called mental illness) which got very critical after his arrest.
NonyNony
@CONGRATULATIONS!:
Disagree. Suicide is rarely a rational action – it usually points to some severe problems that aren’t clear until everyone puts their individual pieces together after the fact to try to make some sense about why their friend/family member did it. Sometimes there are even diagnosed medical issues that only a handful of people even know about since mental illness is such a taboo subject in our society.
(I’ve lived through this a few times in my life now – my heart goes out to his family because it’s a really, really bad thing to go through.)
dmsilev
@? Martin: Of course not. It was obviously Obama’s fault, to distract from Benghazi.
catclub
@NonyNony: I assume Cochran won with over 70% of the vote last time, while spending just enough to get his name on the ballot. Ran far better than McCain, too.
So only if McDaniel runs third party will Childers ( deeply conservative Mississippi democrat) have a shot.
OTOH McDaniel had a history of gaffes ready made as a radio talk show host, plus his various visits to the Sons of Confederate Veterans. Akin, Mourdock territory. Instead, any potential money to Childers, to make it a real race, will never appear.
Snarki, child of Loki
Just wait ’till the Teabuggers find out that it was Vince Foster that actually pulled the trigger on Mayfield. The truth is out there! In Benghazi!!!
D58826
@dmsilev: No No No, you’ve lost the threat. This was done to distract from the World Cup, which was to distract from Iraq, which was done to distract from Bergdahl. AND THAT was done to distract from Benghazi!!!!!:-)
catclub
@Snarki, child of Loki: The gun he used was involved in Fast and Furious.
Roger Moore
@CONGRATULATIONS!:
Unless he were already depressed and suicidal. Somebody who was already considering suicide might be pushed over the edge by something that the rest of us would be able to brush off.
Mike in NC
Ridgeland Police Department needs to round up all the black and Hispanic people in town for questioning.
kindness
Mayfield = Vince Foster???
HILLARY DID IT!!!!111!!
Elizabelle
They’re ALWAYS the victims. From the accompanying link:
Yup. The government killed this fine Tea Partying lawyer.
It were politics that killed this man. And big government. And Thad Cochran.
It was not his own actions, and own desperate final act.
Linky: http://www.clarionledger.com/story/dailyledes/2014/06/27/mayfield-death-pat-bruce/11484789/
dmsilev
@D58826: Remind me again what Benghazi was supposed to be a distraction from. The birth certificate?
August J. Pollak
Literally two minutes.
catclub
@Roger Moore: Also, fairly sure there was felony conspiracy involved, not misdemeanor.
The only crooks Mississippi courts are likely to be soft on are/were Worldcom Executives.
Tripod
@D58826:
Fear of a black planet.
Elizabelle
@dmsilev:
The fact that a Democrat was elected to the White House.
Twice.
mdblanche
@? Martin: But Cochran isn’t a conservative. He gedolchstossed conservatives in the back by getting all the liberals and the blacks to vote for him. No doubt they feel a man capable of that is capable of anything.
catclub
@Elizabelle:
Ever see “The Tall Guy” with Jeff Goldblum? He plays in a musical version of the Elephant Man.
Lyric on his death: “Somewhere, up in heaven, there’s an angel with big ears.”
Elizabelle
@catclub:
Nope, not yet.
The NYTimes opened their story to reader comments. That should be interesting. (At least the Times moderates, so it won’t be the sh*tfest you’d see elsewhere.)
NCSteve
It’s Mississippi. It’s extremist right wing Klan-symp politics in Mississippi. It’s a guy who was actually caught committing a crime related to the political campaign of an extremist right wing Klan-symp neo-Confederate nutbatter in Mississfuckingsippi.
I really don’t think it’s over the top to question whether it is, in fact, suicide at this point. Because, unlike Vince Foster, there were people who actually had real motives here.
ShadeTail
@dmsilev:
No, from the fact that Mitt Romney was, at the time, cruising to an easy win in the 2012 election. Remember, the polls were skewed.
mdblanche
@Snarki, child of Loki: But where do the reverse vampires fit into all this?
Mr. Longform
@catclub:
which has the funniest sex scene ever w/ Goldblum and early Emma Thompson!
Elizabelle
WaPost:
A veritable stool of conservatism. (TM)
Maybe he saw what was coming with climate change. A la North Carolina (no scientific studies of our beaches here; t’aint right).
drkrick
Taking pictures of an opponent’s ill wife in a nursing home, on the other hand, is just politics as usual. These people and their entitlement.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
@Elizabelle:
Well, it kinda was politics that killed him. If not for politics, he wouldn’t have thought it was a good idea to participate in a felony to score points against a political opponent.
catclub
@Mr. Longform: agreed
D58826
@dmsilev: Benghazi was a distraction from the IRS, which was a distraction from fast and furious which was a distraction from the birth certificate which was a distraction from the n-clang in the white house! knew I missed one in there somewhere
Elizabelle
@drkrick:
I know. Back asswards.
MomSense
Wow, did anyone read the press release from Timothy Ray Murray, human, born in Oklahoma?!
I think this dude’s been drinking the fracking fluid.
Culture of Truth
But if you go full Vince Foster, one his close friends killed him to shut him up.
Elizabelle
@Mr. Longform:
@catclub:
Well now that’s sounding more appealing.
Jeff Goldblum has been good in anything I’ve ever seen him in. Even as the crazy scientist in some cats vs. dogs movie. (Which my young nephew rated as the “best movie ever” at the time.)
aimai
@NonyNony: I disagree–social shame is a very strong factor in some suicides. A person who is a lawyer, who has a public position, and who suddenly (as they see it) is about to lose their public and respected position and face scrutiny and embarrassment is quite likely to take their own life.
Culture of Truth
It’s gettin so a man can’t even committ a crime anymore without bein criticized. Politics has gone too far I tell ya.
scav
Loons, especially differently balenced loons, living in bubbles probably develop entirely unrealistic expectations of how they will be greeted as liberators when they make their mad dash to execute political PR master coups à la Candid Camera or shoot up BLM officers and expect to spawn the inevitable mass-revolution to follow. Case two usually includes suicide as a part of the dramatic moment. This guy might have just figured out the expected ticker-tape end game wasn’t coming and there would be consequences in the non-bubble landscape. And went for the next similarly thought-out step. In a movement increasingly peopled, planned and executed by unstable loons in bubbles, why are we expecting rational responses?
Culture of Truth
Oh well never mind then
atlas shrugged
Comrade Dread
I think that there is what’s known as a dog air raid siren.
D58826
@Elizabelle: Funny how the tea party types didn’t mind slandering Bergdahl.
Morzer
@Elizabelle:
A lawyer and a teabagger? That’s a combination that really dials up the despicable.
Citizen_X
@drkrick:
How DARE they arrest him for committing a crime!
gbear
@D58826: Where do I sign up for the war on suburbs? This is something I can get behind.
Ninedragonspot
@mdblanche: a quick check of Google seems to indicate that you are the first person ever to use the word “gedolchstossed”. Since the internet is not mine to award, I instead bestow upon you mad props.
susie
You asked how long it will be before the Vince Foster stuff starts. Here you go, from World Net Daily.
Christian1897 • an hour ago
The “suicide” of one of the leaders of the tea party in Mississippi reminds me of the Clinton era when so many people opposed to Clinton, or trying to investigate Clinton, mysteriously jumped from windows or otherwise committed “suicide”. Lets face it folks, the leadership in Washington DC is Communist and Communists believe that “the end justifies the means” and will do anything no matter how evil, immoral, or amoral, to further their Communist agenda. And that includes murder.
This “suicide” needs to be investigated from top to bottom. When you are dealing with Communists you are dealing with murderers. They have murdered millions upon millions people in every nation they have ever controlled so the murder of one person means nothing to them. This also reminds me of the death recently of newsmen who were about to publish certain information on Obama.
The battle in Mississippi against A RINO Senator may explain the “suicide”. The election there was full of filthy dirty tricks by the left wing against the tea party candidate. Stand up patriots of Mississippi and see to it that this “suicide” is truly investigated because this is just like something the Communists would do to eliminate an opponent. The more power the Communists get, the more this kind of thing will happen.
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Citizen_X
@scav:
Good point, but unfortunately the crushing shame you describe hasn’t applied to the original author of that last phrase.
gbear
@Elizabelle: If you pick the ‘Reader’s Choice’ for comments at the NYT, almost all of the stupid comments are filtered out and they become very readable.
raven
@susie: Who cares? Every kind of fucking nutbag writes shit in the “comments” section. Fuck em.
scav
@Citizen_X: They’re not loons: they’re manipulative sociopathic vultures, only without the redeeming qualities of the feathered ones.
max
@dmsilev: Remind me again what Benghazi was supposed to be a distraction from. The birth certificate?
This is just a distraction from the vote-stealing conspiracy by the GOP establishment and the Democrats, which was a distraction from Hillary’s book tour which was a distraction from the Feds stealing Bundy’s cows which was a distraction from BENGHAZI! which was a distraction from Romney winning, which was a distraction from the bad economy which was a distraction from Obama unconstitutionally signing a debt limit increase which John Boehner helped pass to sell out the base, which was a distraction from gutting all that money going to the darkies, which was a distraction from DEATH PANELS! which was a distraction from TARP, which was a distraction to divert attention from the fact that John McCain won, which was a distraction from the fact that McCain is a MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE who was only in the race to HELP OBAMA WIN because Obama was originally conceived in BENGHAZI by a communist traitor and a black Kenyan in a plot to distract the American people from RONALDUS MAGNUS preventing the IMMINENT SOVIET TAKEOVER which was imminent because FDR sold out the Real Americans by fighting their true friend, Adolf Hitler, because FDR destroyed capitalism (which FDR succeeded at because the Germans were driven out of BENGHAZI! in 1942!).
I think that’s it, anyways. Close enough.
max
[‘
SixThree degrees of BENGHAZI!’]Mike in NC
@Morzer:
Temporarily Max McGee (soon enough to be Andy K again)
Peaked wingnut?
Elizabelle
@gbear:
Yes. I love that feature. It’s like sitting in the “no smoking” section.
Although sometimes a little rarified.
RareSanity
@susie:
Wow, that took some extreme acrobatics of logic to find a way to blame Obama for the suicide of a Tea Party leader, in a state that’s basically a wasteland for the Democratic Party…but there you have it.
ETA: Didn’t know that it came from a comment on an article…I don’t wanna start nutpicking, but that’s still some impressive reaching.
raven
@RareSanity: Some weird stuff with Recardo.
RareSanity
@raven:
Being the cynic I am, I rarely hear a news story that just disturbs me, but when I heard about that one…
It just sounds like something out of a movie…
Elizabelle
@susie:
Projection, thy name is Christian 1897.
This attorney committed suicide over the ordeal he brought upon himself by allegedly participating in a political dirty trick. He was arrested, lost clients, and fell into despair.
Because he was charged with conspiring to photograph a nursing home patient who suffered from dementia.
And, if memory serves, wasn’t the point behind photographing Thad Cochran’s wife with dementia the chance to attack him for possibly stepping out on his marriage with a staffer or associate?
Belafon
@D58826: Missing links! I bet you believe in evolution!
? Martin
@mdblanche: That is a good point. If Cochran could treat blacks as something other than election thieves, then indeed he’s capable of anything.
raven
@RareSanity: Yea, strange days.
SatanicPanic
@Elizabelle: I guess it would be kind of embarrassing to be arrested for that, but most of us would have considered that before breaking into a nursing home
Patricia Kayden
@Elizabelle: So hold on. Mayfield committed a crime (or what could be considered a crime) by sneaking into a hospital room and photographing Cochran’s dying wife without her (or her family’s) permission. But somehow, he is the victim? Not Cochran or Cochran’s wife, but Mayfield?
Got it.
Xantar
@Culture of Truth:
Extra demerits for using “literally” incorrectly.
Yes, I know it has become common in some circles for the word to be a mere signifier of emphasis, but it’s wrong, damnit!
SpotWeld
The real countdown is how long until G. Gordon Liddy is on Fox stating how if he were called into to do the job, this is exactly how he would have made it look.
NotMax
@raven
Been meaning to ask if you’ve seen or heard or become aware of any particular special or local preparations or pushback for the first day of the ‘walk like a mercenary’ law kicking in on July 1?
Patrick
@susie:
So Boehner, Reid and Obama are all Communists? Wow! The definition of the word Communist sure has changed since I went to school…
Patricia Kayden
@dmsilev: Ha! We don’t know anymore. It’s all got way too confusing.
Glocksman
I’ve considered suicide in the past, to the point of staring down the barrel of a loaded .357 Magnum because of a multitude of issues that included alcoholism, debt, depression, and loneliness.
I lowered that gun because the counseling I’d had reminded me that suicide in the end is the ultimate act of selfishness and merely says ‘fuck you’ to those you love and who love you.
I still struggle with alcohol every day and my illness is one of the reasons I no longer own a firearm other than a .22 rifle that holds sentimental value from my childhood.
For Mr. Mayfield’s sake, I hope that the Christian religion is wrong and he doesn’t automatically wind up in hell for that act.
He may or may not deserve to end up there because of other things he’s done, but I can understand the combination of circumstances that leads one to believe that a permanent solution to temporary problems is the answer you’re looking for.
srv
@susie: I personally consider it a failing of Obama that he doesn’t provoke more wingnuts jumping out of windows.
If Hillary had been elected, we’d have had a lot less trouble.
Plus, her black helicopters are silent now.
? Martin
@MomSense: I used to play that game with my daughter. I asserted that she was a robot I built in my spare time and challenged her to prove me wrong. It was fun when she was 7. She finally figured out that the game was rigged and that it was on me to prove that she was a robot.
But we may be bumping into a new phenomenon here.
We’re creating a market for people that accuse others of being a robot, and for the people that write about them.
raven
@Glocksman: I thought that was just catholics?
Glocksman
@raven:
I was brought up as a Catholic.
Other Christian beliefs I really have no knowledge about.
Elizabelle
@Glocksman:
Compassionate comment.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
O/T, but this will not end well. That’s not a neighborhood you want to start a ruckus in. It’s quite divided, and historically, some of the city’s more volatile “finest” were assigned to District 3. That may have changed now; when I was in the business, the bigger divide was the lower class Appalachians who resented that the middle class west side Catholic folks looked down on them. Now it’s more diverse, so it’s altogether possible that the higher strung police are placed elsewhere.
Patricia Kayden
@Culture of Truth: You should have clarified that things have gotten so bad that a WHITE man cannot commit a little bitty crime without all this fussiness. Black and Brown men have been getting clobbered by the justice system forever.
NotMax
@srv
Except for that time every month when they raise such a racket…
/alternate would winguttery
PhoenixRising
@max:
That’s all we need, including the misuse of English. [Pro tip: ‘Anyway’ is agreed to be a word.] Perfect. You nailed it.
NotMax
@NotMax
alternate world
(Darn you, no edit.)
Patricia Kayden
@susie: “This also reminds me of the death recently of newsmen who were about to publish certain information on Obama.”
Which “newsmen” are we talking about? And what was the “certain information”?
The plot thickens.
Amir Khalid
@mdblanche:
Nein, nein, nein. Das Wort “gedolchstossed” gibt es nicht. Man sagt: Er hat den Konservativen die Rücken mit einem Dolch gestoßen.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@susie: So Obama and Hilary were helping their buds in the Mississippi GOP, awesome.
Elizabelle
WaPost reader comment by MET9:
Glocksman
@Amir Khalid:
Heh.
Even this hick gets the reference.
What’s next, the Goering quote about culture and reaching for his Browning?
Roger Moore
@Patricia Kayden:
They’re always the victim. Even when they’re winning, they’re the victim by not having a larger margin of victory.
RareSanity
@raven:
It’s pretty common across all Christian dominations.
I don’t quite know the bible verses offhand, but the philosophy behind it, which I wish more “Christians” (mostly the conservative ones) would follow, is that a man (meaning mankind) has no right to decide to take a life, even if it is one’s own.
Life is a gift from God, it is not for a man to decide when that gift should be taken away.
catclub
@Patricia Kayden: Mayfield was never in the room. But he apparently encouraged the guy who was in the room. Plus not really breaking in, more likely walking into a room in a nursing home where he was not invited to be.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@SpotWeld:
If Liddy had been the assassin, he would have shot himself in the head and Mayfield would still be alive.
Iowa Old Lady
In the meantime, McDaniel is claiming his people have found more then 1000 invalid voters so far.
I don’t suppose he thinks they voted for him.
max
@PhoenixRising: [Pro tip: ‘Anyway’ is agreed to be a word.]
Heh. I like ‘anyways’ and also ‘I done did that already’ and ‘I’m fixin’ to do that’. Total mangling of the Queen’s English of course, but the Queen ain’t around to complain.
That’s all we need, including the misuse of English. Perfect. You nailed it.
I left out the exclamation point of the middle BENGHAZI!. But thanks! I suppose reading the Dallas Morning News Op-Ed pages for 30 years plus various ancient (and not ancient) right-wingers has its rewards.
max
[‘OK. Reward. Singular.’]
Glocksman
@RareSanity:
Exactly.
While I’m enough of a lapsed Catholic to the point my opposition to the death penalty is practical instead of moral and don’t oppose abortion, I do respect the members of Catholic orders who are consistent in opposing both abortion and the death penalty.
Those who oppose abortion while favoring the death penalty and immoral wars on the other hand….
Amir Khalid
@Glocksman:
I got the reference too, naturally. I was just being a Grammatiknazi.
Roger Moore
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
Now Thad Cochran owes Obama and Hillary big time, so he’ll do whatever they tell him. Obama is an evil mastermind, except when he’s being too dumb to walk and chew gum at the same time.
Morzer
@mdblanche:
He took them to Galt’s Dolch.
Glocksman
@Amir Khalid:
I like it.
I hope you don’t mind if I use that word in the future.
Anyway, I was just showing off my erudition about Hitler and his rise to power.
Please continue.
catclub
@Iowa Old Lady:
It should be absurdly easy to do, if one has the records from both elections. When you signed on June 3 in they write ‘voted’ by your name in either the Democratic or GOP list. IN PRINCIPLE, they should check on June 24th that you did not sign in on the Democratic list on June 3. But if they did not do this, there could be many who voted wrongly.
I noticed in reports on June 24 that a guy was turned away because he had voted on June 3 in the Democratic primary. People who vote are the most likely to get to vote again.
…. oh, I see your point. If the ballot is secret, no one know who that person voted for, so which of the total tally is marked out. I think if there enough cases like this to come to the difference between Cochran’s and McDaniel’s total votes, he has reasonable doubt to take it to court, without actually knowing.
RareSanity
@Glocksman:
Exactly.
If there were more consistency in the whole “right to life” crowd, then I could actually accept it as a valid philosophy.
However, since the are holes in their logic big enough to drive a tank through, I can safely ignore most of their ramblings.
David Koch
This is Obama’s fault.
He obviously killed himself over telephone metadata
MikeJ
It’s soon going to look like the SS v the SA.
Bill Arnold
@Elizabelle:
You’re forgetting the armadas of out-of-state buses full of dead non-white voters.
David Koch
@catclub: it’s a scam. they have to put out bait in order to lure
supporterssuckers into sending in part of their evil government check cuz hiring staff and lawyers to play make-believe Matlock costs other people's money.scav
What we clearly need is a zone, a protected zone around these accused people, shielding them from unwanted personal attention and others meddling in their private lives. All this hounding and public accusations and questioning of motives!? How dare people? People are innocent until proven guilty and should be protected, although not apparently when performing actually entirely legal actions you just happen to personally disapprove of. Then you get in their grill and hound them. In packs.
Anoniminous
@Amir Khalid:
The Soccer God speaks German!
All is explained.
Amir Khalid
I’ve been following this story since it was first mentioned here; every time I think it can’t get any crazier, it does. I’m starting to suspect this whole thing is being orchestrated by Mel Brooks.
mdblanche
@Amir Khalid: Um, if you say so. I’m pretty sure your German is a lot better than mine.
MattR
@David Koch:
I know you’re snarking but that reminds me of a question I wanted to ask those who know more about the law than I. Was the recent SCOTUS decision regarding warantless searches of cell phones any kind of indication that they would rule NSA collection of email metadata was unconsitutional? If a cell phone search is significantly more intrusive search than looking through someone’s briefcase, is it a stretch that they would rule that collecting email metadata is similarly more intrusive than viewing that type of data for calls from a landline phone?
raven
@RareSanity: Huh, well I don’t know shit a bout soccer OR christian stuff. They gave us a pass when it was charlie I guess.
Trollhattan
@Mike in NC:
I was shocked to hear there was gambling going on in that establishment.
Villago Delenda Est
Um, no.
It is not possible to be a teabagger and to be “a good man” at the same time. These are inherent contradictions. Teabaggers are racist scum. All of them.
WereBear
And to think we haven’t hit peak wingnut yet. Because, you know. Mississippi.
divF
@Elizabelle:
“Earth Girls Are Easy”: Jeff Goldblum, Geena Davis, Damon Wayons Jim Carrey – Science-Fiction Farce in 80’s West LA.
Patrick
@scav:
I don’t get the concern for the first amendment. These “Christian” protesters are still allowed to write a letter to the editor and what have you. But at the point where their free speech feels like intimidation and threat, it doesn’t have anything to do with free speech anymore. It’s getting to the yelling fire in a packed house argument.
Elizabelle
This was a suicide FAIL in that you don’t want to leave people laughing at reactions to your demise.
(Truly, it is better to surround yourself with saner and better people in life, but then one would not be at such risk for suicide.) That said:
From WaPost reader comments thread:
D58826
@Belafon: Well I’m not sure about evolution but we do seem to be witnessing de-evolution among the right wing
Glocksman
@mdblanche:
Mine as well.
I remember a bit from the 2 years I learned in high school, but the phrases that stood out in my mind are the political.
Luckily for me, my German teacher didn’t faint straight away when I asked her about the accuracy of certain terms from the Order of the Death’s Head and told me that the translator was British, and that some terms didn’t translate directly into US English.
Hence ‘Browning’ instead of pistol, to cite one example.
WereBear
@D58826: They are not men they are Devo.
Baud
@MattR:
I don’t see a legal connection. One can speculate about the effects of changing attitudes given modern technology and non-white presidents.
Morzer
@WereBear:
I think we could use the fine old English word “cudlips” here.
WereBear
@Morzer: Truly.
The end game of Authoritarian thrall; collapse of the world they merely thought they knew.
Ash Can
@Glocksman: The Catholic Church no longer takes a hard line on suicide. The teaching is that if the person is incapable of thinking clearly and understanding the wrong he or she is doing by taking his/her own life — which is pretty much a given in the case of suicide — then there’s no condemnation.
Belafon
@MattR: Not real sure, but I don’t really see this ruling directly impacting the other decision. Assuming that all they are collecting is phone numbers, those are not “inside the phone.” The original bases for this is that law enforcement has had the right for years to collect this stuff for landlines.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@MattF: Late to the thread, but why would body double necessarily exclude alien?
Belafon
From Jonah Goldberg: Warren Can Beat Hillary in 2016.
All I can say is “not if she doesn’t run.”
Morzer
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
Afternoon, Omnes. Little Boots was looking for you the other night. Seemed quite agitated by your absence.
David Koch
post shoulda been titled “Mississippi Burning”
Trollhattan
@Morzer:
Say that thrice before a darkened mirror, and I’m outtahere.
kc
@CONGRATULATIONS!:
He was facing a felony conspiracy charge, according to the article.
Trollhattan
@Morzer:
I believe that’s the only needed phrase.
scav
@Patrick: all I can think is the 2nd amendment absolutists want some of the other amendments to start racking up a body count so they feel they have cover. That or my pre-existing creepy feeling that they’re pushing absolute freedom of speech as the front edge of the absolute and unfettered freedom of money=speech, especially ¥£€$=politicalspeech goal.
Trollhattan
@gbear:
We only declared war (wowah) on coal, the suburbs were just collateral damage.
NotMax
@Morzer
Must have been a day with a ‘y’ in it.
Morzer
@NotMax:
@Trollhattan:
Is there a backstory of which I wot not? A passionate affair fallen to ash? An ancient friendship broken by a difference as to which team will win the world cup?
David Koch
@Mike in NC:
/fixed
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@MattR:
I think that a valid (not necessarily winning) argument to that can be made. I would even agree with it.
Amir Khalid
@Morzer:
I suspect that “quite agitated” is pretty much Caligula’s normal state. If there’s a story behind his obsession with Omnes, as far as I know he hasn’t shared it.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Morzer: That happens a lot. It is one of the burdens I bear.
David Koch
This kinda sounds like Jess Smith’s “suicide” during Teapot Dome
Morzer
@Amir Khalid:
It made for a somewhat unusual opening to that comment thread.
So, how many goals are Chile going to wax the Brazilians by?
Morzer
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
Dare I ask how it all began?
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Amir Khalid: @Morzer: I really don’t know the source of it, except that it first appeared, to the best of my knowledge, in a late night music thread.
ETA: Caligula also evinces the same behavior on occasion toward JGC and DougJ – I am not sure how, as a non-FPer , I “make the grade.”
Baud
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
What are your other burdens?
NotMax
@Amir Khalid
Right, in both cases.
Amir Khalid
@Morzer:
I never decide such things so far in advance.
Southern Beale
I just read this story where an Oklahoma Republican candidate for Congress who was primarying a longstanding incumbent has said he thinks his opponent is a body double.
On his website:
What. The. Fuck.
This guy is nuttier than a squirrel’s nest.
Baud
@Morzer:
Heh. Initially read that as “holes.”
Morzer
@Baud:
*cough* *blush*
Our household has evolved a new gastronomical term. We now refer to pasta al dente as “chiellini”.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Baud: Amongst my burdens are such things as stunningly good looks, abundant charm, and an inner tube on the rear tire of my bicycle that needs to be replaced before I ride tomorrow.
ETA: On the plus side, I chose not pay an extra $25 for a lunch at the state bar convention where I could watch a point/counterpoint between Karl Rove and Robert Gibbs. No way I was voluntarily putting money in Rove’s greasy hands.
Morzer
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
If you only had a holocaust cloak and a wheelbarrow, you’d be all set.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Morzer: A wheelbarrow! I knew I shouldn’t have covered the damned albino with it.
shelley
@Southern Beale:
How soon before he starts going on about our ‘precious bodily fluids.’
Morzer
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
I wouldn’t pay much to hear Robert Gibbs’ views either. How depressing our Obama alumni seem.
What is to be done?
Morzer
McDaniel has apparently issued a brief statement :
I can only wonder how he would describe the sort of despicable sleaze who would voluntarily be part of sneaking into an old folks’ home to take pictures of a political opponent’s bedridden wife for political advantage.
Villago Delenda Est
@Patrick: It’s always projection with these creatures.
Always.
Villago Delenda Est
@Southern Beale:
Or, as my late father (who was born and raised in the Ozarks of Arkansas) used to say, “nuttier than a tree full of young squirrels.”
Morzer
@Villago Delenda Est:
“Movie theater” is the collective noun for teabaggers.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Morzer:
I know! I know! As “a fine Christian man who was always respectful and kind ….”
WaterGirl
@aimai: Completely agree. I said the same thing on an earlier thread, only you said it better and with fewer words. (Nothing unusual about that!)
Morzer
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
These people really are ROUS*es aren’t they?
*Ratfuckers Of Unusual Squirreliness
Botsplainer
Regrettably, this sounds like just a routine lawyer suicide. Tea Party and political involvement was a symptom of professional and personal failure.
It’s become all the rage among middle aged lawyers without a lot to show for their careers. State Bars aren’t real helpful, the market to garner clientele brutal, the judges generally heedless of personal pressures, and the clients cheap and resentful all too frequently.
Dude’s last economic lifeline snapped, and with it, him.
Villago Delenda Est
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
This is followed by the voice of Rod Serling announcing that you have, indeed, crossed over into the Teabagger Zone.
satby
@Glocksman: It’s not really Catholic doctrine any more, the concept now is that a soul in torment from mental illness was not responsible.
And thanks for sharing Glocksman, that was brave as well as compassionate.
Villago Delenda Est
@Botsplainer: Well, not so routine in that he was a prominent political figure in his community and was involved in a despicable scandal involving someone who any normal political figure would deem out of bounds.
The desperation of McDaniel and his henchmen is floating through the air so that even I, on the west coast, against the prevailing winds, can smell it.
satby
@satby: won’t let me edit. I wanted to say thanks Glocksman, sharing that was brave as well as compassionate.
WaterGirl
@Glocksman: I’m glad you’re still here!
MattR
Had to run out for a while so a belated thanks to all for the responses. I don’t necessarily expect intellectual consistency from members of the court, but my understanding of the decision is that they ruled that looking into a cell phone is an unconstitutional invasion while looking into a briefcase or bookbag was still acceptable because of the sheer quantity of information about the person’s life that is stored on the phone and can be gained by looking through it. If that is the case, then there also seems to be a similar difference in degree between the pen register being considered in the 60’s and the amount of information that can gained by collecting the metadata for everyone’s email, text and cell phone call. I don’t know where the courts would draw the line or how national security concerns might enter the picture when it comes to the NSA’s actions, but it seems like SCOTUS has at least acknowledged a need to rethink the 4th Amendment in light of recent technological changes. (I believe there was another semi-recent case where they ruled putting a GPS tracker on a car consituted a search and required a warrant)
Helen
@raven: I LOVE reading “fucking nutbags” in the comments. I always read comments at wingnut sites. All those wingnut tears make me hap hap happy!!
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@MattR: That is the line I would take if I were counsel for a plaintiff challenging warrantless metadata collection and use.
ETA: Others reasonably can and probably will differ.
Ash Can
@Elizabelle:
Actually, I agree. How is a piece of masonry supposed to be able to fork over any cash at all?
WaterGirl
@Morzer: Let me guess… that was on a day ending in a “Y”?
Edit: I swear I did not see the NotMax comment before I wrote this.
WereBear
Cripes. Had no idea it was an epidemic.
Has a bit of personal resonance for me, since back in the day, I was pressured to go into journalism or law, testing well on both and told by authoritative sources that they were solid professions that weren’t going anywhere.
Very ironic thinking now.
Baud
@MattR:
Makes sense. The Supreme Court isn’t bound by its own precedent, despite what they say.
WereBear
@Glocksman: Glad you turned the situation around. Good you had that counseling!
WaterGirl
@Baud: I had no idea until this week that you are likely an attorney. How did I miss that? Are you on the BJ registered attorney’s list along with others like burnspbesq and Omnes, and I just missed it?
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@WereBear: I just came back from my state bar convention. At these things, it always gets mentioned the lawyers have the highest rate of depression of any profession and have double the national rate of alcohol and substance abuse. People who go into law tend to be ambitious achievers who are not accustomed to failing. Also, the profession tends to encourage people to push themselves and ignore their own health (both physical and mental). Pulling all-nighters while eating out of the vending machine in order to get ready for trial or finish a deal is seen as dedication by senior partners in firms. That culture gets absorbed. As a result, quite a few lawyers spend a lot of time at the end of the physical, mental, and emotional tethers. The practice of law as it currently works is very miserable for many lawyers.
WaterGirl
Booman is on a roll:
Roger Moore
@MattR:
It’s not just about the quantity but also about the purpose of the search. The rule is that the police are allowed to check somebody who’s been arrested to make sure he isn’t carry anything that would cause problems (weapons or escape tools) and to protect any potential evidence that he might destroy. They have apparently stretched that a bit to let the police look through the contents of some things they have found (i.e. flipping through a book) but decided that once a cell phone has been identified as a phone it is no longer a potential weapon or escape device and there’s no justification for looking through it. I personally think they should extend that basic idea to other things found on the person (e.g. you can’t read papers once they’ve been identified as papers rather than weapons) but it’s really a completely different argument from the one about phone metadata.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Roger Moore:
I completely agree with this. I do think the fact that far more information is contained in metadata than in pin registries should change the argument, but then I am looking for arguments to make on that side rather than dispassionately analyzing.
Glocksman
@satby:
Not brave at all.
Part of the recovery process is admitting to others that you have a problem with alcohol.
If I were brave I would have admitted it before now, but the suicide drama of Mr. Mayfield just hit too close to home for me.
I wouldn’t dream of doing what he was implicated in, but suicide is rarely the answer to life’s problems.
Helen
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Also, lawyers must see just the dregs of the dregs. People come to you for a reason; they have been wronged. Or they have been the victim of a crime. There’s not a long walk to “all humanity sucks” if that’s all you see.
Really who calls a lawyer when they’re happy and satisfied?
Corner Stone
@Roger Moore:
If SCOTUS determined authority can not look at your phone after you’re in custody to see who you’ve called , then what’s the rational argument to say authority has the right to look at who you’ve called when they have no idea who you even are?
Helen
@Patrick: I’ll bet a million bucks that that person has no clue who “the leadership” is. He/she has no clue how our government works, and cannot, under penalty of death, name his or her congressperson.
Baud
@WaterGirl:
That’s like comparing John Marshall and Oliver Wendell Holmes to Lionel Hutz.
David Koch
@Roger Moore: As usual, they’re illogical. If you arrest someone and find a notebook or address book or wallet in the person’s pocket you can go through it, but if you find a phone, you can’t. Now they’ll want to distinguish it by saying a phone stores more information, but that’s a disquisition without a difference.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Helen: Not all lawyers are litigators. Also, a lot of litigation is just business disputes – what does this contract clause really mean, etc. IMO, it is the culture and lifestyle that are the difficult part – especially at large firms and their off-shoot boutique practices.
SiubhanDuinne
@WaterGirl:
What? What?
How do I miss all the interesting stories?
/off to consult the old Google machine
MattR
@Roger Moore:
I understand what you are saying and appreciate the historical context. But since they did not want to extend that basic idea to those other things, the decision had to offer a rationale for why that protection applies to cell phones but not other items like physical papers. I could see how some future judge could use that decision and apply that same standard to determine that collecting email and/or cell phone metadata without a warrant is unconstitutional (kind of like how the logic behind overturning DOMA was used in state level same sex marriage cases).
WaterGirl
@SiubhanDuinne: I know! I had to google this one:
“Virginia Republicans bribed a Democratic senator into resigning his seat with promise of a job, cell phone, and a car. ”
I knew about the promise of the job and the judgeship for the daughter, but I had completely missed the cell phone and the car.
SiubhanDuinne
@WaterGirl:
Oh, I missed cell phone and car too!
Oddly, these schemes rarely work out quite the way their perpetrators/putative beneficiaries anticipate.
Strange, that.
WaterGirl
@Baud: Come on now, I only said they were both on the BJ attorney’s list.
Helen
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Yeah now that you mention it; When the whole “Obama said that business owners didn’t build their business” crap erupted and we were trying to convince them (HA, I kid; you can’t convince them) that he was talking about infrastructure, some entity (the ABA?) said that 60% of court cases are one business suing another business and who’s gonna pay for that?
Botsplainer
@WereBear:
The lawyer suicide plague has become the subject of much ineffectual handwringing by state bars happy to heap responsibility that jacks up workload, cranking out high numbers of new lawyers annually, offering insufficient support to licensees, and failing to encourage the bench to assist in maintaining work/life balance in a profession that provides few material rewards at the consumer end while being devilishly stressful.
Baud
@WaterGirl:
I guess that’s better than being on an attorney’s BJ list.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Baud: Wouldn’t that depend upon the attorney?
WaterGirl
@SiubhanDuinne: Do we think these republicans have ever heard the word “decorum”? Or understand the concept, even if they don’t know the word for it? Un-fucking-believable!
CONGRATULATIONS!
@Glocksman: Never met one. Including my wife. Can you point out where I might find one of these mythic creatures?
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@WaterGirl: To them, decorum means wearing a tie.
Baud
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
Only if that attorney is you, Omnes. /Little Boots
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Baud: ::shudder::
Glocksman
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
Heh.
I can think of a few local attorneys that if they offered such a ‘settlement’, I’d accept in a heartbeat.
Though it wouldn’t do much for the public image as lawyers as ‘legalized whores’. :)
Baud
@Glocksman:
Best consent order evah.
Botsplainer
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
Not to mention all too many judges who really don’t give a fuck about our lives.
Case in point – Wednesday night, I had to take my wife to the ER; she suffered a frightening headache following removal of her ovary, and I was concerned about an infection or an aneurism, as she was light, sound and touch sensitive. Didn’t get home until 1:30 am.
Next morning, I had a needless 8 am hearing on a summer visitation request completely consistent with every order. Despite me apologizing in advance for any fog (and why), he insisted on being a dick, not only did he violate his own disclosure order on prehearing document production on material directly relevant to the reason for the other side’s objection, he was coy about it before shittily telling my guy he’s right but unreasonably rigid.
He and I are going to have private words next week.
Helen
@CONGRATULATIONS!: I have to say – and I will be calm here because last time I spoke of this here I went crazy and more than one person told me I needed to calm down – those people exist.
My sister is a practicing Catholic. In 2011 her son, Alex was murdered. The murderer could have gotten the death penalty; he was WAY eligible. And there was no doubt. Alex was missing, and the killer with NO evidence against him, confessed and led the police to Alex’s body. When it came to the trial phase my sister was asked by the prosecution “we can pursue the death penalty at trial or we can get him to agree to life in prison without possibility of parole.” My sister requested the latter. She did not want her son’s killer to die at the hands of the State.
And one more thing. My sister is a die hard Republican and Alex, lovely as he was and regardless of how much he loved his Aunt Helen, was a teabagger.
So those people do exist.
WaterGirl
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): To them, decorum means wearing a tie with their
white sheetwhite shirt.WereBear
@Botsplainer: I hope she’s doing better now.
I appreciate the insights shared here on the profession; I know someone pressuring their kid into law school, and the young person has zero interest. Parents are fixated for some reason…
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
PIRATE MOVIES! Specifically, the Jackie Cooper/Wallace Beery Treasure Island.
Roger Moore
@David Koch:
I think a big part of it is that the doctrines start out with a reasonable idea that gets stretched bit by bit until it reaches an obviously illogical conclusion. It’s helped along the way by judges who are more focused on the case at hand than the precedent they’re setting and will only change their mind when something is obviously way out of whack.
In this case, it obviously makes sense to let police look through an arrestee’s pockets to look for weapons. Well, what happens if you turn up evidence of another crime, like drugs? You were doing a legitimate search and turned up something unexpected, and the rules already say you’re still allowed to keep evidence in that case. So the drugs are still legitimate evidence. Then somebody says that if you can take advantage of evidence of drugs, you should also be able to look through their reading material if you find it on their person. That probably shouldn’t have been allowed, but tough on crime judges let it go through because they didn’t want to mess up a case and the guy was guilty anyway. Next thing you know, they’re asking to be able to rifle through somebody’s entire life on their cell phone, and only that is going too far for the more conservative judges.
WereBear
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Can’t watch Wallace Beery at all anymore. Much less with Jackie Cooper!
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@WereBear: But it’s Treasure Island.
WaterGirl
@Helen: If someone had murdered my nephew I would be simultaneously enraged and inconsolable. I am so sorry, Helen.
GregB
We just need to meet the people who want to assassinate the president, stone gays, electrocute immigrants and believe that their rivals are replicants half way.
It will make David Brooks, Cokie Roberts and Ron Fournier happy.
SiubhanDuinne
@WaterGirl:
Or even know how to spell it it?
David Koch
@MattR: the problem is the Court has repeatedly ruled that there is no reasonable expectation of privacy on information you have “knowingly exposed” to a third party, such as bank and phone records. It’s kind of like mail. You have a reasonable expectation of privacy to the contents inside a letter, but not to the metadata you knowingly exposed on outside of the envelope (addresses, postmarks).
Now if they overturn those decision that would be fine. but what they usually do is keep the prior ruling and come up with something new that is inconsistent. Also too, they have a history of not applying rationales from one body of searches law to a different but similar body of search law.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@SiubhanDuinne: I. T.
Corner Stone
@WereBear:
They are fools.
Baud
@David Koch:
This exactly.
Corner Stone
@GregB:
I thought you were talking about AQ right until that last one.
Violet
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
Same with surgeons. They boast about not having taken a vacation for seventeen years–that kind of thing. The hours are brutal. I know quite a fed medical students who loved their surgery rotations but decided the lifestyle of a surgeon was too demanding and the culture–especially for women–was not at all conducive to having any kind of life outside of work.
Keep that in mind if you or a loved one needs surgery. The surgeon works in an environment that encourages pushing oneself and not taking breaks.
SiubhanDuinne
@WereBear:
Why?
Why?
(Not being snarky or mean; seriously curious.)
SiubhanDuinne
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
Heh. You funny man.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Helen: I know that one! Nobody. Unless you want to call estate planning to minimize intergenerational transfer taxation happy. Which I guess it is, because it takes a metric shit ton of money to make it worth the bother (read expense) of having a good estate lawyer do that. It’s always been malpractice for me to do anything beyond say “tax” so I’ve never been consulted on that basis.
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Exactly – it’s the big firm grind that is really hard on so many. I always knew I wasn’t temperamentally suited for that environment, so I avoided it. Many days I miss being in court, but I don’t have the stamina to go back to being in court every day.
Poopyman
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): There is no other version.
Re:LB. I thought it was a she, and was waiting for whatever the BJ version of “Play ‘Misty’ for Me” is to be posted.
WereBear
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): I know, and it’s a fine movie. Chemistry.
Even as a child, I didn’t like Bing Crosby’s voice… and it turns out he was an abusive father. I don’t know if that has anything to do with it or not, but it makes the holidays even more tricky to negotiate!
Glocksman
@Violet:
That would explain why my Congressman is teabagger Larry Buschon.
As I tell everyone who’ll listen, he’s an excellent heart surgeon (he implanted my artificial heart valve) but a lousy Congressman.
Hard work will get you ahead, too bad that Buschon is an asshole
Helen
@WaterGirl: Thank you. One moves past it. But what I have learned (my mother died when I was 12) is that grief is not linear. You’re horrified and then you’re good for a while and then you are horrified and then you’re good and then you’re horrified and then anger appears. The trend is down, but it often rears it’s ugly head many years later when you do not expect it. The post I talked about upthread was when the father of the Sandy Hook killer opened his mouth. Too much for me to deal with. Again. Thank you.
But. Life goes on.
WereBear
@SiubhanDuinne: Jackie has said many times that working with the man was a nightmare. Per Wikipedia:
I have heard from other sources it wasn’t as mild as “disappointment” and in fact escalated to outright abusive behavior.
It doesn’t always matter, but in this case it runs so counter to his onscreen persona it really gets in my way. A sort of Woody-Allen-squickiness situation.
Roger Moore
@Helen:
There’s actually a lot of proactive legal work that’s designed to keep people out of trouble. A lot of writing contracts, wills, powers of attorney, etc. is about thinking of possible problems and heading them off before they happen. Compliance is about knowing the law so you can help people make sure they’re obeying it. Then there are branches that are about helping people negotiate complicated things that they don’t do very often so they can get what they want, like immigration and adoption.
WereBear
@WereBear: Obviously, this reaction varies… my first reaction to beholding W’s visage was instant revulsion, and I was totally baffled at the people who found him so warm and appealing.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@WereBear: I had to change the channel when he came on TV as far back as 1999.
WereBear
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Yes! It was horrifying when he “won” the election and I realized I was about to live through one of those “interesting times” in history.
And to think I turned out to be too optimistic about how bad it would get.
Baud
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
It’s when I gave up on the media.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@WereBear: Interestingly, the other person I know who reacted that was was my grandmother who was closing in on 80 at the time he was elected. Most of my extended family voted against him, but Grandma and I were the only ones who had a visceral reaction to him.
Poopyman
@WereBear: Do you remember the old bushaschimp website, pre 9/11? Those days seem so quaint, now.
WaterGirl
@Helen: Yep. I think of grief as like a river. You can’t fight the river; you just have to go where it takes you. Definitely not linear.
Helen
@Corner Stone: @Roger Moore:
Yeah but if I want to leave Corner Stone most of my money (LOTS) and my Dad $1 why the fuck do I need a lawyer? Can I just not write a note that says “Corner Stone gets my money”?
WaterGirl
@WereBear: When I was applying for jobs (decades ago) there was one position that would have been perfect for me, and they offered me the job. But I had an inexplicable negative reaction to the department head, so I did not take the job. My instincts served me well; it turns out that he was an alcoholic (as was my mom).
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Helen: Because your dad will sue and say that Corner Stone was exerting undue influence on you and, given his charm here, your dad may well be right. Having a will drafted by a lawyer makes it much more likely that your intent will be effected. A well drafted will is hard to set aside. Something you did with a DIY kit might not be. You could do your own plumbing, but will you get the result you want?
WaterGirl
@Baud: @Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): I was instantly repulsed and could not bear to hear the man speak. Definitely a visceral reaction. That was a long 8 years. I basically had to disengage.
WereBear
@Poopyman: Yes, it was one of the first online sites I got involved in!
Some good stuff there.
Helen
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Yeah well too bad for Corner Stone. I’ m spending it on me
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Helen: That obviates the need for an attorney drafted will.
Helen
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Yeah Mr. Attorney – who gets my apt?
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Helen: Do you own it? If so, and you die intestate (without a will), your statutory next of kin would inherit.
David Koch
getting back to the question of telephone metadata, I think opponents are going about it the wrong way. Instead of arguing legality, they should opposite on policy grounds.
The argument would be we don’t want the government to have this power because of the potential of abuse and it hasn’t been shown to work.
This is the argument opponents of gun control have effectively used. Whether they’re actually right is beside the point. They argue that with gun regulations comes the potential of abuse and criminals will always ignore regulations.
But this also raises another question.
As a Progressive/Obot, first class, I can say we believe in gun regulations, even gun registration, and dismiss as delusional and unfounded the arguments and fears pushed by gun nuts that government will one day confiscate their precious machine guns.
But how can that position be reconciled with the Progressive fear that the government will one day use telephone metadata in a abusive manner?
trust the government on the issue of guns, but not on meta data.
Is that logical? Can the party that believes in government really say, on one hand, fears of gun control is irrational, but on the other, fears of telephone metadata collection is legitimate?
Fort Geek
@Morzer: I thought it was “a batshit of teabaggers.”
ETA: also “A treason of Republicans”
terben
A member of the Tea Party doing the honorable thing. Who would have thought?
Ajaye
My intuition on this is that it is analagous to Watergate. An upstanding lawyer political activist type with deep connections would have no problems facing down the nursing home charge if not guilty. In fact would only serve as more evidence of how system is corrupt etc. and he could use it for more political advantage. however the entire campaign he was involved with just reeks overall. There was the still mysterious incident of McDaniel’s people accidentally getting locked in with ballots. The investigation on that seems to have been strangely handled. If this man was involved in dirty political tricks, trying to interfere with ballots, influencing the ensuing investigations…that would be more than a misdemeanor. He probably knew the nursing home incident was just the tip of the ice berg, especially if federal agencies that can’t be bought get involved. Plus, no doubt understood would be facing loss of his business and possible disbarment in future as well. And his guy did not win, so no sinecure forthcoming.
J R in WV
I agree with those who think the lawyer shot himself because the nursing home invasion, as horrific and immoral as that was, is only the tip of a very nasty iceburg of disgusting!
And the candidate who evidently feels that it is the proper thing to do to contest a lost election, he’s an un-American piece of excrement who deserves the legal problems it appears he will be spending the rest of his life dealing with.
Faux News
@Amir Khalid: Are you sure you are not Hermann Cain?
Pongo
@CONGRATULATIONS!: Totally agree. Or he could have gone ‘Goebbels’ and decided that world that rejected McDaniel was simply not a world he wanted to live in.
Or Hillary did it.