10
Mar
Some Non-Whining
Looks like we need an open thread. Here’s something you might want to consider:
Publishers can do whatever they want. If you don’t like it, don’t send them nasty emails or browse their sites with ad-blockers: just don’t support them. Don’t read their content, don’t link to them, and don’t talk about them. Since money’s not usually involved, vote with your attention and read elsewhere.
(via DF)
Zifnab
Worth noting, I think.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03.....rmark.html
...
So there’s case 2,032,102 for your difference between the House and the Senate.
Alex S.
I might be late, but have you seen this:
http://www.theatlantic.com/pol.....les/37309/
Just one sentence: “He called them Massa Massages”.
Folderol and Ephemera
@Alex S.:
. . . “Snorkel“?
General Egali Tarian Stuck
I want to whine about having a non whining thread. I’ve never been part of the “we should stop the whining” crowd but should go ahead and whine. Well, I lied, but it was said with lub and affection for all whiners who just want Obama to do better.
Guster
I’m probably also late, but wondering if people have already talked about this: http://mydd.com/2010/3/10/the-.....hcr-debate
Grayson’s bill to amend title XVIII of the Social Security Act to provide for an option for any citizen or permanent resident of the United States to buy into Medicare.
mcc
Doesn’t seem like useful advice to me. With the exception of the night of the 2008 elections I haven’t willingly watched television news in like… maybe seven years? Doesn’t seem to have lessened its profitability or societal impact any.
Napoleon
@Alex S.:
You beat me to it.
Guster
Trying again. Hope this isn’t a duplicate post. But I was wondering if people have already talked about this: http://mydd.com/2010/3/10/the-.....hcr-debate
Grayson’s bill to amend title XVIII of the Social Security Act to provide for an option for any citizen or permanent resident of the United States to buy into Medicare.
Third Eye Open
I predict that this will get settled out of court, for lots, and lots of ducats…
On another note…anyone around here have some good connections in the ground/surface/municipal water supply fields? Apparently my internship was revoked because I have a family member who works for the South Florida Water Management District, now I have to get an internship in the next 8 weeks or risk extending my college stay another year…
licensed to kill time
I just want some red red wine to make me forget the red red whine.
kay
“As health care reform enters its do-or-die stage in Congress, union leaders on Tuesday began threatening that they will work to ‘take out’ Democratic lawmakers who vote against the bill [...] ”
BTD told me labor was going to sink health care.
I’m just not getting that feeling from them.
Maybe it’s because they’re so subtle, and, really, their…. wishes are unknowable, and subject to many different interpretations.
freelancer
This is going to kill DougJ’s
hobbyrate of posting.NickM
Since it’s an open thread, I wanted to follow up on a posting of about a month ago about one of my cats. I got some great advice here. Unfortunately, none of it seemed to work :)
I wrote that I had a cat that was peeing on all the beds in my house constantly, and suddenly, starting about 2 or 3 weeks earlier. The cat who was doing it was the younger of two cats; the older was in decline, I thought.
I took both cats to the vet for a complete checkup. Both cats were doing just fine. Part of the older cat’s problem, it turns out, is that she needed more brushing, which I did, and she looks 100% better. The vet recommended trying pheromone sprays to get the younger cat not to pee on our beds. It didn’t work. Then he recommended isolating her in a bathroom for a couple of weeks to try to break her of the peeing habit. He said it usually works. She’s going to be coming out of confinement in a couple of days.
Thanks for all of the advice, which in spite of my snark above was good and helpful – it was important to see if there was a medical reason (in either cat) that was causing the problem. We’ll see on Saturday whether the vet’s idea worked.
Alex S.
@Folderol and Ephemera:
Hehe, ok, one word beats one sentence.
Max
@kay: Did BTD send you a link to an Obama “Chill the Fuck Out” photo like Glenzilla posted the other night.
Apparently, we’re all stupid over here, so I’m sure you are reading that wrong. It can’t possibly mean what you think it means.
O-bot. :)
SiubhanDuinne
@Alex S.:
Maybe it’s just me, but I love that Massa’s former campaign manager is named Dickert.
Mnemosyne
Have I mentioned lately that I love Kathleen Sebelius? Here’s what she said in a speech today to America’s Health Insurance Plans, the largest association of health insurers:
SGEW
Also, re: “tickling” and whatnot, has anyone else read Marc “Did I Mention That I’m a Professional Wrestling Aficionado?” Ambinder’s latest?
Um, yeah.
Tax Analyst
@licensed to kill time:
Well, don’t let it go to your head, OK?
Also – If whining is outlawed only outlaws will whine.
No, wait…that doesn’t work.
Nevermind (he whined).
BR
Just called my representative’s office again.
I found that a good strategy is to say, after telling them to pass the damn bill, something like “I know the Republicans have turned on their phone banks and are calling you screaming about socialism and other nonsense. Just know that those folks don’t really even think there’s anything wrong with the health care system in the first place – I don’t know how they manage to deny reality, but I don’t think it’s worth paying any attention to.”
Basically by acknowledging that the staffer is getting tons of “socialism! death panels! firebags!” phone calls it puts them at ease.
Folderol and Ephemera
@Tax Analyst:
In Soviet Ballon-Juice, thread whines about you!
Max
Okay, I admit I’m an Obot, but does it seem like the Administration is ramping up and about to drop the hammer on a lot of issues.
Me thinks the GOP peaked too soon.
The delta between tactics and strategy.
Alex S.
@SiubhanDuinne:
It’s not just you ;-)
Cacti
@SiubhanDuinne:
Speaking of Massa, who will become the new “progressive” martyr of the Obama hating left now that it’s come out that their would-be hero is an unhinged man-groper.
Rhoda
Bob Lonsberry has a post corroborating the Green Atlantic story.
Mike Kay
@kay: Ahhh, what you missing is Labor is playing 11th dimensional chess.
this always makes me laugh.
Delia
Before I leave to do my little community volunteer stint for the afternoon, here’s a little song for all the whiners.
bemused
@NickM:
Hope the isolation works but I am puzzled how keeping a cat in the bathroom for a couple of weeks does the trick. Did the vet explain? I’m curious.
tofubo
OT
http://www.theatlantic.com/pol.....lly/37116/
only good can come from holy joe and senator eh?!
licensed to kill time
@SiubhanDuinne:
“What’s so funny about Biggert Dickert ? ”
“Wait til Biggert Dickert hears about this!”
kay
@Max:
I didn’t participate in that one. I did read parts of it. My favorite part is where GG challenged Elie (I believe) to prove her claim that she had never liked him. She was supposed to produce posts. If she couldn’t, then chances are she only dislikes him now because he sometimes opposes Obama.
I thought that was amazing. I don’t know where to start with that. I do not know if she was able to unearth the evidence of her dislike for GG that predates Obama.
twiffer
wait, if we don’t like something, we should ignore it? instead of complaining that our way is the right and only way things should be done?
that’s un-american man. makes too much fucking sense and is easy, to boot.
cleek
i whine to let the universe know that i still have things i need to fix before it turns me into rotting meat. it’s my way of saying “a little more time, please?”
GregB
Rest assured there are millions of Americans who are outraged about tickle masssages and pictures of gays kissing each other and yawn at the prospect of the US military and clandestine services forcing humans to drink so much water that they begin to vomit and die.
It’s the way of our rotten world.
freelancer
via Wonkette, The paper of record informs us that Hispanics in Austin are eating tacos, for breakfast.
Cthulu devour us all.
David in NY
I was annoyed reading the earlier post about the House delaying its HCR vote past March 18—the fish is gonna be stinking not long after that …
But then it occurred to me that the only reason for the delay must be that they don’t have the votes. So I just called Scott Murphy (NY-20) my congressman and told him (again) my views.
If you haven’t done it, now’s the time. I saw references to Pelosi being about 10 votes short (though I gather she’ll claim to have them tonight on Charlie Rose). Not sure if anybody knows, but that would be bad if we’re that far away. Picked up Dale Kildee, MI, a buddy of Stupak’s, today, which is a good sign, but still need more …
NickM
@bemused: The vet seemed to think that isolating this cat from the other cat in the house might change the dynamic between the two, which was probably contributing to the problem. I was thinking that it would also force her to use her own litterbox for a couple of weeks, imprinting her back on using it.
BombIranForChrist
Regarding the original post, I think this website does a disservice by linking to Politico posts.
Here is a common pronouncement from Balloon Juice:
1. Politico just wants clicks!
2. Click on this link to see proof of this!
Stop it!
That is all.
cleek
Kucinich!
Corner Stone
@kay:
Not speaking for BTD but that was before the proposal that I believe Obama made to raise the excise tax to 27% or so?
That seemed to have appeased a large section of the labor leaders. Which BTD highlighted after Obama floated it.
Could be wrong but I think you’re off base with that comment.
IndyLib
@Mnemosyne:
This was my favorite Sebelius quote from her slap upside the head to the insurance lobbyists –
Ana Gama
@Max:
THIS!
Cacti
@tofubo:
Where have you gone Posse Comitatus Act?
Mike Kay
@David in NY:
It doesn’t matter. If there’s no public option, then I don’t care if up to 40,000 people die every year because of lack of coverage. Undertakers have to make a living too.
bemused
@NickM:
Makes sense when there is more than one cat. Some cats can get finicky sharing litter boxes. Wishing you success. Cat pee smells are hideous.
Corner Stone
@freelancer:
Now I want breakfast tacos too. Dammit.
Napoleon
@David in NY:
Somewhere else today I say attributed to an unnamed senior staffer in a leadership office, or someone similar, say they were “a couple” short.
Tom Hilton
I was prepared to disagree until I read the thing and saw he was talking about pissing and moaning about formatting. In which case, yeah.
But pissing and moaning about political shit in the news media actually works—look at how the wingnuts have worked the refs. Kind of too bad that we aren’t better at it.
Cacti
@cleek:
I dunno.
Even Kos is turning on Kucinich.
Josie
NickM – I can relate to your cat problem. Sometimes cats just pee wherever they wish and there is nothing to be done about it, short of caging them. I had a persian kitty, a beautiful little thing, who took it upon herself at around age 7 to anoint the carpets in the living room and dining room. I tried everything – vets visits, change of cat box, change of litter, cleaning the litter box constantly, an expensive automatic cleaning litter box, etc. She continued to pee happily on both carpets until I could no longer clean them and had to throw them out. I finally found a large rectangular cage, where she spent a lot of time in her declining years. Until her last days, every time she got a chance, she peed somewhere she wasn’t supposed to. I hope you have better luck with your kitty. Let us know how it works out.
Mike Kay
@cleek: Interestingly, Ralph Nader is no where to be found in this debate.
Of course he didn’t say anything during the lead up to the iraqi invasion.
He never does. He always sits out none presidential election years.
David in NY
@Napoleon:
Not sure anybody knows a real number on HCR in the House, because of a number of reps who are not telling. Two would not be bad. Murphy, whom I called, is not telling. I expect him to come around in a crunch, but who knows?
freelancer
@Corner Stone:
Mebbeh jeffreyw will make some for you.
Corner Stone
@Tom Hilton:
People talk a lot about working the refs, and how the wingnuts are so good at it.
What isn’t mentioned as much is that the wingnuts actually own the refs. So that eases the “make them respond to what our needs are” part a hell of a lot easier.
Loneoak
I’m on week 3 of a Kaplan Daily and Politico cleanse. Other than Ezra Klein, I haven’t visited either site and my disposition is substantially more sunny than it used to be.
Nellcote
Sounds a little like sticking your head in the sand. I appreciate the filters like DougJ or the morning Pundit Roundup on GOS to keep me aware of the latest wingnut meme.
Corner Stone
@freelancer:
I’ve previously offered him a series of Hot Massa Tickles for food services rendered but he wasn’t having any.
I’m a pretty good cook myself and could whip some up with a little chorizo, eggs and taters but I’m just lazy today.
Plus I’m having sushi later so, meh.
Bill E Pilgrim
@Cacti:
Turning?
Some people here really do just make it up as you go along, don’t you.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/.....pen-thread
David in NY
@Loneoak: So even if the tactic doesn’t do any good, it’s a cure for whining?
OK.
Mike Kay
@Loneoak: I left WaPo in 2002 when they became invasion cheerleaders. And I never liked politico, once it was announced that it would be run by the very same WaPo invasion cheerleaders.
Max
@David in NY: I called Barbara Lee and the staff said she prefers the House bill and hasn’t come out as a yes or no.
She is the head of the Congressional Black Caucus and I suspect she’s a yes, but won’t say because they don’t want to give up leverage. I can’t see her tanking HCR, and I voiced my opinion to the staff member that answered the phone.
I’m going to have to find out who my new reps will be in Vancouver, Wa.
ALERT - Obama Town Hall on now.
Corner Stone
@Loneoak:
What comes outta you when you do this ritual cleanse?
SiubhanDuinne
@Alex S.:
;-)
@Cacti:
Kucinich, I would hope.
@licensed to kill time:
LOL. Spewed cold coffee right out of my ears.
ETA: Yes, what Cleek said at #36 (won’t link as I believe that annoys the FYWP genies).
mcc
@Cacti: See also:
Sanders then goes on to outline an incrementalist strategy he believes could lead to single payer.
It’s interesting that it seems pretty clear that the actual elected progressive leaders don’t seem to see any conflict between being a strong, principled advocate for progressive principles while still acknowledging the realities of the legislative process we work within and being pragmatic when it’s what you have to do to move the ball along. It’s been frustrating to feel like the unelected opinionmakers ostensibly on the progressive side, instead of learning something from this, often are just concluding all those elected leaders (Sanders, Woolsey, soon Grijalva if his comments last week are any indicator) aren’t really progressives at all.
Nellcote
@Nellcote:
And I don’t have a problem with giving credits without links to such as Politico or WaPoo. It’s not that hard to find the article if I really need to.
Da Bomb
@kay: Maybe Rahm was hiding the posts…
RAHHHHHHMMMMMMMMM
!
David in NY
@Max:
Yeah, I’m hoping there won’t be many Kucinich’s there. Hell, at this point I’d take anything. But there may also be some, “You first! No, you first. No, I insist … ” going on between the House and Senate as to reconciliation and the various fixes of the Nebraska sell-out, etc.
Corner Stone
@David in NY:
A lot of them are playing coy because they’re hoping to bargain a little toward the end.
If you’re the 200th Yes vote you don’t get as much as the 210th Yes vote.
Midnight Marauder
@Max:
Honestly, I’ve never seen a group empty their clip so early and in such a slipshod fashion. And now that the pendulum is swinging back the other way, suddenly there is more interest in delving into just how worthless Republican “solutions” are:
Yeah, good luck defending that during midterms.
Cacti
Damn.
Corey Haim died.
Why didn’t anyone tell me?
mcc
So did anyone else get the OFA email today?
With a link to http://my.barackobama.com/DayOne
I’m really happy to see something like this finally starting.
Perry Como
Someone on Hardball just said, “slap in the face.” I’m getting stabby…
Cacti
@Bill E Pilgrim:
My apologies to Kos.
Mike Kay
@Cacti:
he wrote a suicide note saying life isn’t worth wild without a public option.
MikeJ
@Perry Como: Can under the bus be far behind?
Mike Kay
@mcc: thanks for the link.
mcc
@Cacti: I think anyone who’s been upset with Kos over the last few months would also be happy to read some of the things he said in his other post from today.
Makewi
@mcc:
Ha. Because the problem all along has been the Obama hasn’t given enough speeches, or talked about it to the press enough. Double Ha, because that document about the presidents plan is almost entirely lies and half truths.
Mike Kay
@mcc: unfortunately, he let his friendship with Hamsher affect him for months, to the point were he allowed her paid shills to push anti-obama propaganda for months that alienated a large portion of his readers (down 20% year over year).
Randy P
@NickM: We have a cat we’ve had since she was a kitten who categorically refuses to use a litterbox. We’re not sure why, except that she fell out of one when she was really little so maybe she’s afraid of them. For years we had an issue with her using plastic bags or anything flat on the floor (magazines, newspaper, mail that was being sorted…). We still don’t trust her and try to avoid any of those tempting targets. But the problem has largely gone away since I installed the cat door. Now she does whatever cats do in the great outdoors.
Yeah, I know. I’m probably being a bad neighbor and it’s somebody’s garden. I don’t want to hear it. My house doesn’t smell like cat pee. Is that Republican of me?
Luthe
@Third Eye Open: Where do you live? I’m currently working for a land use department in the Danbury, CT area and can connect you to some people.
kay
@Corner Stone:
I don’t think it was before the proposal, Cornerstone. I think it was after.
I don’t think that was his point. His point was labor won’t trust the Senate with the sidecar, because the sidecar will be needed to change the excise rates when the House adopts the senate bill.
It’s too broad a statement anyway. “Labor” isn’t monolithic. The SEIU is composed of younger and poorer service workers, and it’s actually growing. That’s different than the UAW or public employee unions.
Max
@Randy P: My neighbors are like you, letting their cats roam and I can’t stand it.
I’ve had to tell Max the Wheaten to “drop the kitty” more times than I care to, but he’s a dog who hates cats and they come in his yard to poop. The next cat he goes after, I might let Max take it out, just to prove a point.
Don’t blame me (metaphorically) when my dog kills your cat.
Third Eye Open
@Luthe: I am in Florida, but I have already come to the conclusion that I will have to relocate for the summer.
i can be reached at constantlyconsuming at JUNO dot com
I would appreciate any help getting started in the right direction.
Violet
@Randy P:
Don’t know if it makes you a Republican, but it does make you an inconsiderate neighbor. My yard, vegetable and flower garden is used by neighborhood cats for this very purpose and it’s beyond annoying. I’ll be walking out in my yard, smell cat poop, and have to look all over to find it before I step in it. Sometimes I step in it first. Yuck.
I’ve had cat people tell me that cats don’t poop indiscriminately all over the yard. Yes they do. I’ve watched them do it. I don’t own a cat, so it’s certainly not my cat. It’s the thoughtless neighbors’ cats who go running all over the neighborhood.
Animal control has come out before. They will come out again if called. I like cats just fine. But not cats that poop in my yard.
Skepticat
@NickM: My vet prescribed Elavil for my cat when he was doing that. A day or so later I realized that the litter boxes—and I have multiples—just weren’t clean enough for his fastidious self; thus, I never gave him the meds. (Now that I don’t have health insurance I’m keeping them for myself!) There’s a litter called “Attract” that’s supposed to help. Then just as everything seemed under control, I caught chemo kitty anointing an oriental carpet yesterday.
Good luck with your felines. We’ll be interested in knowing whether the vet’s idea works.
Corner Stone
@kay: Again, not speaking for BTD, but this is one of the things I was thinking about:
Excise tax fix
Could be interpreted a lot of ways I guess.
Fern
@Skepticat: That attract stuff worked great when one of my cats was peeing on the couch. Also I used to use one of those litter boxes with a lid and a door, and pet store lady said it gets too smelly under there, and the cat was likely protesting the litter box conditions. Also changed to a litter that was a little softer on their little paws – and all has been well.
mclaren
Good thinking. Let’s extend that kind of reasoning:
Gooooood thinking. Let’s carry that demented reasoning a little further:
Ah, yes. The libertarian version of democracy. Eat it, bitches, we own you. And if you don’t like it, go to some other country.
Gooooooooood thinking.
Smedley
@Corner Stone:
Por Que No??
mclaren
Kathleen Sibelius belongs the same category as Barack Obama—wonderfully insightful inspiring people who say all the right things, and accurately diagnose our current problems…and then do absolutely nothing to solve those problems.
Just the other day, Obama accurately pointed out that concentration of market share among insurance cartels is one of the biggest problems with American health care…yet his health bill does nothing, absolutely nothing, to address the problem.
Likewise, when Kathleen Sibelius laments:
The current health care bill does nothing, absolutely nothing, to solve the problem of current market segmentation, because the proposed insurance exchanges are so small (only 3 million people nationwide) that they will have less bargaining power than large employers, and thus the insurance premiums from exchanges will cost more than the already grossly unaffordable insurance premiums people must pay when they get insurance through work. And, yes, today’s insurance premiums are unaffordable, but most people don’t realize this because employers currently shoulder the primary burden of paying for employee health insurance. But that won’t continue for very long with 67% annual rate hikes, as we’re seeing now in California (that’s not 6.7%, that’s sixty-seven percent in one year). Five years or so of those kinds of skyrocketing insurance premium hikes, and most employers will find themselves forced to drop employee insurance entirely just so they can stay in business.
When Sibelius accurately asks “How much pressure can be put on the remaining customers before the business model collapses of its own weight?” she neglects to mention that the current HCR bills (house or Senate, take your pick) do nothing, absolutely nothing, to control costs because they absolutely nothing to break up the collusive corrupt doctor-hospital-insurance-medical devicemaker monopolies and cartels that are driving American health care costs up at a rate of double digits per annum.
I’m getting tired to listening to people like Obama and Sibelius accurately diagnose all the problems but do nothing to solve the problems.
You get the sense that Obama and company think they’ve solved a major social problem just by making an eloquent speech that says all the right things. No, you actually need to f*cking do something to solve the goddamn problem, not just make speeches.
Obama and Sibelius are treating the American people like three-year-olds. Obama and Sibelius think if they just make soothing noises but don’t solve the actual problems, no one will notice and we’ll all applaud and re-elect the sonsofbitches.
Smoke-and-mirrors bullshit like a HCR bill that bans recission but permits insurers to dump people for fraud, where fraud gets defined as baving an illness but not telling the insurance company (Guess what? The instant you’re diagnosed with a sickness you didn’t know you had, you’re guilty of fraud!) doesn’t solve these problems with American health. Cons and scams like expanding medicaid, when the states are slashing medicaid reimbursements right and left and most doctors and hospitals won’t accept medicaid patients in the first place because medicaid already pays too little, aren’t going to solve America’s health care problems. These con games permit the current health care system to sail right on with its grossly unsustainable practices and costs, just under another name,
using different language rather than “recission” and “banning patients for pre-existing conditions.”
These kinds of scams and con games insult our intelligence. It’s the equivalent of holding a woman down and raping her and telling her it’s not rape, it’s just non-consensual sex, so don’t worry about it. That’s contemptible.
We need actual health care reform, not speeches, and not con games and verbal calisthenics where recission is permitted but just not called recission. And here’s a warning: one way or another, we will get health care reform. Either people in Washington will fix the system, or it will collapse and there will be chaos and travail, and at that point, we’ll get reform because there won’t be any other choice.
Corner Stone
@Smedley: Porque no? Porque tuvi sushi anoche.
Hoy, quiero los tacos!